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Groups > alt.os.linux > #57493

Re: Debian 10 "buster" released

From "J.O. Aho" <user@example.net>
Newsgroups alt.os.linux, comp.os.linux.misc
Subject Re: Debian 10 "buster" released
Date 2019-07-08 19:32 +0200
Message-ID <gohd1cF2514U1@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References (1 earlier) <qfteh6$v2u$1@dont-email.me> <gof1o0Fh1ddU1@mid.individual.net> <nq1avf-73j.ln1@Telcontar.valinor> <gog1edFnbcuU1@mid.individual.net> <qfulqj$qjc$1@dont-email.me>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 08/07/2019 07.54, William Unruh wrote:
> On 2019-07-08, J.O. Aho <user@example.net> wrote:
>> On 07/07/2019 22.38, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>> On 07/07/2019 22.07, J.O. Aho wrote:
>>>> On 07/07/2019 20.43, AnonLinuxUser wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Systemd was designed to take care of the deficiencies in init.
>>>>
>>>> It's not an init system anymore, it does far more and those breaks the
>>>> Unix philosophy of doing just one thing and then do it really well.
>>>
>>> Per program. systemd is not a single program, it is many. Thus it does
>>> not break that philosophy :-P
>>
>> You can't replace one part of systemd with another program, this breaks
>> the next Unix philosophy.
> 
> a) That philosphy is long gone anyway. See gimp, libreoffice,

It's quite lucky for us that neither of them are needed for booting up a 
Linux kernel.


>   the kernel, or even find.

Sure there are parts that shouldn't have been incorporated into the 
kernel, but that is the best we have until Gnu/Hurd has matured so that 
we can use it.

Find do just one thing, find data in the directory tree, sore it has the 
exec option, but it calls external commands to do the things instead of 
doing it by itself.


> b) You can replace the various files in systemd with others.

The other files are libraries which the systemd does depend on, if you 
replace the library with something else, it still have to be an library 
that provides everything that systemd uses, not the same thing as 
replacing sendmail with postfix.


> Certainly
> the core of systemd is one object, but then so was the core or sysvinit.

sysvinit allowed you to change things in a simple way, you could even 
replace the whole sysvinit without breaking, now systemd requires a 
special kernel to even start.


> this appeal
> to a long gone "Unix philosophy" seems to me to be largely irrelevant.

If you would follow the Unix philosophy, you will have a lot easier to 
maintain software, as the complexity would be less which tends to lead 
to less security vulnerabilities and systemd is a good candidate to show 
why you shouldn't make things more complex.


-- 

  //Aho

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Thread

Debian 10 "buster" released "Anonymous" <anon@anon.com> - 2019-07-07 07:02 -0500
  Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> - 2019-07-07 07:27 -0700
    Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Freenet" <pieer@free.fr> - 2019-07-07 09:36 -0500
    Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> - 2019-07-07 07:50 -0700
  Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-07 12:43 -0600
    Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-07 19:53 +0100
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-07 16:45 -0600
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-08 11:50 +0100
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2019-07-08 12:53 +0000
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2019-07-08 16:17 -0400
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Jean-David Beyer <jeandavid8@verizon.net> - 2019-07-08 09:48 -0400
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 11:19 -0600
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-08 19:17 +0100
              Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 16:06 -0600
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2019-07-08 17:47 +0000
    Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "J.O. Aho" <user@example.net> - 2019-07-07 22:07 +0200
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-07 21:21 +0100
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-07 16:50 -0600
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-08 11:54 +0100
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 11:21 -0600
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-07 22:38 +0200
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "J.O. Aho" <user@example.net> - 2019-07-08 07:08 +0200
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2019-07-08 05:54 +0000
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "J.O. Aho" <user@example.net> - 2019-07-08 19:32 +0200
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-08 22:02 +0200
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-08 21:15 +0100
              Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-09 04:38 +0200
                Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-09 08:41 +0100
                Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-09 12:22 +0200
                Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-09 12:06 +0100
                Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-09 13:11 +0200
                Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-09 12:13 +0100
                Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-09 12:19 +0100
                Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-09 19:32 +0200
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Cecil Westerhof <Cecil@decebal.nl> - 2019-07-07 23:53 +0200
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-07 16:51 -0600
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Cecil Westerhof <Cecil@decebal.nl> - 2019-07-08 01:56 +0200
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 11:22 -0600
              Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Cecil Westerhof <Cecil@decebal.nl> - 2019-07-08 20:58 +0200
                Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 16:08 -0600
              Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Wildman <best_lay@yahoo.com> - 2019-07-08 14:08 -0500
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-07 16:48 -0600
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-08 11:52 +0100
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 11:27 -0600
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-08 19:19 +0100
              Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 16:11 -0600
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Anonymous" <anon@anon.com> - 2019-07-07 20:31 -0500
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-08 04:23 +0200
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2019-07-07 22:40 -0400
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 11:30 -0600
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 11:29 -0600
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-08 14:12 +0100
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Freenet" <pieer@free.fr> - 2019-07-08 09:05 -0500
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "F. Russell" <frussell@random.info> - 2019-07-08 15:02 +0000
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-08 16:13 +0100
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 11:33 -0600
    Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> - 2019-07-08 11:05 -0700
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-08 16:17 -0600
    Re: Debian 10 "buster" released William Poaster <wp@dev.null> - 2019-07-17 23:27 +0100
  Re: Debian 10 "buster" released William Poaster <wp@dev.null> - 2019-07-17 23:25 +0100
    Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-18 01:21 +0100
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released John McCue <jmccue@jmclin1.hsd1.ma.comcast.net> - 2019-07-18 01:18 +0000
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2019-07-18 13:32 -0400
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Jerry Peters <jerry@example.invalid> - 2019-07-18 19:36 +0000
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released William Poaster <wp@dev.null> - 2019-07-18 10:52 +0100
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-18 15:59 +0100
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2019-07-18 13:36 -0400
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-18 19:00 +0100
              Re: Debian 10 "buster" released "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-18 20:49 +0200
              Re: Debian 10 "buster" released Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2019-07-18 15:01 -0400
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released William Poaster <wp@dev.null> - 2019-07-18 23:10 +0100
            Re: Debian 10 "buster" released The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2019-07-19 09:08 +0100
        Re: Debian 10 "buster" released owl <owl@rooftop.invalid> - 2019-07-18 15:59 +0000
          Re: Debian 10 "buster" released William Poaster <wp@dev.null> - 2019-07-18 23:09 +0100
      Re: Debian 10 "buster" released AnonLinuxUser <Anon@Linuxusers.net> - 2019-07-18 15:47 -0600

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