Groups > alt.folklore.computers > #236545

Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50)

From	Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid>
Newsgroups	alt.folklore.computers
Subject	Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50)
Date	2026-11-05 13:53 +0000
Message-ID	<eceurm-lq4.ln1@ID-313840.user.individual.net> (permalink)
References	(6 earlier) <11caqn1$36bpo$2@dont-email.me> <qg3prm-ql7.ln1@ID-313840.user.individual.net> <11cdgp6$46jl$5@dont-email.me> <fcqrrm-5o6.ln1@ID-313840.user.individual.net> <11cg8q2$12d33$1@dont-email.me>

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Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:

> On Wed, 4 Nov 2026 14:00:15 +0000, Geoff Clare wrote:
> 
>> Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 3 Nov 2026 13:17:46 +0000, Geoff Clare wrote:
>>>
>>>> Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Then why mention bash specifically in the requirements?
>>>>
>>>> Bash is not mentioned specifically in UNIX03 / SUSv3 requirements.
>>>> (It is mentioned in non-normative rationale, as is ksh.)
>>>
>>> Then why did you say “I think it needs to execute bash in order for
>>> the system to conform to UNIX03”? You were the one who mentioned bash
>>> specifically.
>>
>> I already explained that earlier in the thread ...
> 
> You mean, the part where you started talking about ksh as well?

No, before that.  From my post on Fri, 30 Oct 2026 13:26:19 +0000:

    My point was that of the shells that /bin/sh can be configured to
    execute (bash, dash and zsh), bash conforms to UNIX03 but I don't
    think dash and zsh do. So if you want conforming behaviour you have
    to stick with the default configuration (bash).

>>>> You do know that POSIX.1 and (the Base volumes of) SUS are one and
>>>> the same standard, right?
>>>
>>> If the two specs were one and the same, there would not be separate
>>> certification for both.
>>
>> They *are* one and the same ...
> 
> Well, POSIX doesn’t mention bash, so why should SUS?

POSIX.1 does mention bash, in non-normative rationale, as I said before.
It's not possible for POSIX.1 and (the Base volumes of) SUS to say
different things, as they are one and the same standard.

I just searched the PDF of IEEE Std. 1003.1-2024 for "bash" and the first
hit is on page 3868, from some text in XRAT C.2.2.4 Dollar-Single-Quotes
that explains how escape sequences in C string literals compare to their
use in $'...' in the shell:

    The \x escape sequence in C can be followed by an arbitrary number
    of hexadecimal digits. The ksh93 implementation of $'...' also
    consumes an arbitrary number of hexadecimal digits; bash consumes
    at most two hexadecimal digits in this case. This standard leaves
    the result unspecified if more than two hexadecimal digits follow \x.

The same text can be found in SUSv5 here:

https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9799919799/xrat/V4_xcu_chap01.html#tag_23_02_02_04

> I just rechecked the compliance register for UNIX v03
> 
> <https://www.opengroup.org//openbrand/register/xy.htm>
> 
> You’ll notice Apple is no longer listed ...

That's strange.  Looks like a glitch on their web site, as it's
only missing from the "umbrella" UNIX03 product standard listing;
it's still there for the individual product standards that comprise
UNIX03:

    Internationalized System Calls and Libraries Extd V3
    https://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/sd.htm

    Commands and Utilities V4
    https://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/cx.htm

    C Language V2
    https://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/lm.htm

    Internationalized Terminal Interfaces
    https://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/uu.htm

and all of those plus the UNIX03 umbrella one are listed on the page
for Apple's certifications:

https://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/apple.htm

-- 
Geoff Clare <netnews@gclare.org.uk>

Thread

Emacs Turns 50 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-29 04:56 +0000
  Re: Emacs Turns 50 Aidan Kehoe <kehoea@parhasard.net> - 2026-10-29 07:30 +0000
  bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-10-29 15:00 +0000
    Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-29 23:09 +0000
      Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-10-30 00:49 +0000
      Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-10-30 13:26 +0000
        Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-30 22:37 +0000
          Re: bash on macOS Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-31 01:06 +0000
            Re: bash on macOS Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-11-02 13:42 +0000
              Re: bash on macOS Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:11 +0000
          Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-11-02 13:28 +0000
            Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:10 +0000
              Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-11-03 13:17 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:39 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 01:02 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-11-04 14:00 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:41 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-11-05 13:53 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 19:00 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-11-06 13:59 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-06 07:43 -0700
                Re: bash on macOS scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-06 15:42 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-06 10:48 -0700
                Re: bash on macOS Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-06 18:21 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-06 18:16 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-11-06 21:52 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-07 00:35 +0000
                Portability of 'echo -n' (was: Re: bash on macOS) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 10:02 +0000
                Re: Portability of 'echo -n' antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-11-07 21:24 +0000
                Re: Portability of 'echo -n' Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-07 22:25 +0000
                Re: Portability of 'echo -n' Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-08 00:25 +0000
                Re: Portability of 'echo -n' Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-11-09 14:38 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-06 20:43 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-06 20:42 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-11-09 14:05 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-09 22:23 +0800
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-09 16:00 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-09 22:13 +0000
                Re: bash on macOS (was: Emacs Turns 50) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-10 01:21 +0000
  Re: Emacs Turns 50 rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-29 15:51 +0000
    Re: Emacs Turns 50 Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-30 12:16 +0000
      Re: Emacs Turns 50, gpl is still a bad idea John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-10-30 17:49 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50, gpl is still a bad idea Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-31 01:13 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50, gpl is still a bad idea Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-31 18:45 +0000
          macOS Tivoization (was: Re: Emacs Turns 50) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-01 01:17 +0000
            Re: macOS Tivoization (was: Re: Emacs Turns 50) Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-11-04 12:14 +0000
              Re: macOS Tivoization Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 15:12 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50, gpl is still a bad idea antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-11-01 15:06 +0000
      Re: Emacs Turns 50 Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-30 18:24 -0400
      Re: Emacs Turns 50 Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-09 22:25 +0800
        Re: Emacs Turns 50 rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-09 19:58 +0000
  Re: Emacs Turns 50 Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-30 18:20 -0400
    Re: Emacs Turns 50 Bob Eager <throwaway0008@eager.cx> - 2026-10-30 23:45 +0000
    Re: Emacs Turns 50 John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-31 15:28 +0100
    Re: Emacs Turns 50 Anssi Saari <anssi.saari@usenet.mail.kapsi.fi> - 2026-11-03 17:05 +0200
    Re: Emacs Turns 50 John McCue <jmclnx@gmail.com.invalid> - 2026-11-03 21:16 +0000
      Re: Emacs Turns 50 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:22 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50 Aidan Kehoe <kehoea@parhasard.net> - 2026-11-04 07:14 +0000
          Re: Emacs Turns 50 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 08:24 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50 John McCue <jmclnx@gmail.com.invalid> - 2026-11-06 01:27 +0000
  Re: Emacs Turns 50 Daniel <me@fuhgitabutit.com> - 2026-11-04 19:19 -0800
    Re: Emacs Turns 50 ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2026-11-05 03:21 +0000
      Re: Emacs Turns 50 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 03:33 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50 scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-05 15:04 +0000
          Re: Emacs Turns 50 scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-05 16:13 +0000
            Re: Emacs Turns 50 Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-05 09:26 -0700
              Re: Emacs Turns 50 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 19:06 +0000
              Re: Emacs Turns 50 rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-05 19:38 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 23:09 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50 antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-11-06 17:59 +0000
    Re: Emacs Turns 50 rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-05 03:26 +0000
      Re: Emacs Turns 50 Don_from_AZ <djatechNOSPAM@comcast.net.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:09 -0700
        Re: Emacs Turns 50 rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-05 06:51 +0000
          Re: Emacs Turns 50 Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-05 19:17 +0000
            Re: Emacs Turns 50 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 22:59 +0000
            Re: Emacs Turns 50 Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2026-11-06 00:12 +0100
              Re: Emacs Turns 50 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 23:24 +0000
              Re: Emacs Turns 50 "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2026-11-08 14:26 +0000
        Re: Emacs Turns 50 Daniel <me@fuhgitabutit.com> - 2026-11-05 23:26 -0800
    Re: Emacs Turns 50 Bob Eager <throwaway0008@eager.cx> - 2026-11-05 09:23 +0000

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