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Groups > comp.lang.c > #73087

Re: Firefox improvements.

From Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c, sci.crypt, sci.electronics.design
Subject Re: Firefox improvements.
Date 2015-10-16 16:31 -0500
Message-ID <d8d8ksFrifjU1@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References <263cd$561a967a$d47876e2$46985@news.ziggo.nl> <s46l1b1q5sbqff3lgitvqprbvk1mdqg4ad@4ax.com> <mveb7b$9sd$1@dont-email.me> <mvf01r$fc4$1@dont-email.me> <mvf7i9$rdj$1@dont-email.me>

Cross-posted to 3 groups.

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On 2015-10-12 02:59:16 +0000, Richard Heathfield said:

> On 12/10/15 01:51, James Kuyper wrote:
>> On 10/11/2015 02:55 PM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
>>> On 11/10/15 18:13, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 11 Oct 2015 19:03:56 +0200, "Skybuck Flying"
>>>> <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> Gave us:
>>>> 
>>>>> Oh and by the way...
>>>>> 
>>>>> The intel community website... has the most annoying password requirements
>>>>> ever !!!
>>>> 
>>>> You're a goddamned idiot, child.
>>>>> 
>>>>> It must be 8 to 15 characters..
>>>>> must contain lower and upper and a fokking digit or something and/or a
>>>>> special character ?!
>>>>> 
>>>>> wtf ?!
>>>> 
>>>> And now you show just how stupid you really are as it relates to
>>>> secure login crypto.  More folks use the site for real business purpose,
>>>> and only childish idiots like you are too stupid to know what is going
>>>> on.
>>>>> 
>>>>> This will not make it more secure at all... because people will probably put
>>>>> the special requirements at the back !
>>>> 
>>>> It doesn't matter, idiot.  It still foils brute force search hacking
>>>> better.
> 
> This is the key line that everyone seems to be ignoring, but which is 
> the line to which I was actually responding.
> 
>>> 
>>> Assume an 8-character password, with legal characters [A-Z][a-z][0-9].
>>> There are 218340105584896 such passwords, but 53459728531456 of them
>>> have no digits. Thus, even ignoring the upper/lower case rule, an
>>> adversary can eliminate almost a quarter of the search space (24.48+%).
>>> Even with 15-character passwords, around 7% of the search space can be
>>> ignored. And that's not even including the lower/upper case rule.
>>> 
>>> Could you please explain how "having fewer candidate keys to test" is
>>> harder than "having more candidate keys to test"?
>> 
>> It involves human psychology
> 
> James, the context is brute force, not a dictionary attack. So human 
> psychology doesn't come into it. What comes into it is "number of 
> permutations". Only.


That may be the context of your attempts to teach
DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno math, but it is not the appropriate
context for discussing whether these password restrictions are a good
thing or a bad thing.

A number of people here think that those who crack passwords only do

1. Brute force attack
2. Dictionary attack

But that simply isn't true. Unless the password space is particularly
small, nobody does a brute force attack. And a dictionary attack is
only the first quick phase of a real attack.

Password cracking systems typically make use of one of two kinds of
approaches

1. Generative rules of regexes followed by transformations
2. Markov models

It should be noted that in both of those they generate guesses that
are not from some dictionary, but these aren't brute force attacks
either.

So, in many cases, those systems are the threat. Brute force is not
the threat.

So the challenge is to find a way to get people to use passwords that
can stand up to such attacks. And we must do so with the
understanding that if we ask people to do things that are humanly
impossible or particularly burdensome, they won't do it.

These password restrictions are an attempt at that. A very flawed
attempt, which can often be counter-productive; but still it is an
attempt at addressing a very real problem. And whatever one tries to
do to address this problem, human psychology is going to be central
to the design.

So sure, DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno, is spectacularly wrong about the
math; but given that brute force attacks are not the actual threat
that passwords face, the conversation has moved beyond those math
problems.

Cheers,

-j

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Thread

Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-08 07:55 +0200
  Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-08 07:57 +0200
    Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-08 08:01 +0200
      Re: Firefox improvements. Robert Baer <robertbaer@localnet.com> - 2015-10-09 01:08 -0700
        Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-10 13:08 +0200
          Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-10 13:09 +0200
    Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-11 19:03 +0200
      Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-11 13:13 -0400
        Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-11 19:55 +0100
          Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-11 16:02 -0400
            Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-11 21:45 +0100
              Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-11 17:01 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2015-10-11 22:18 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-11 18:45 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-10-11 18:03 -0500
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-11 19:24 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-11 21:07 -0400
              Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 03:53 +0100
            Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 03:50 +0100
          Re: Firefox improvements. "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-10-11 17:13 -0500
            Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 03:55 +0100
            Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-16 01:08 -0500
              Re: Firefox improvements. Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-19 11:53 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-19 16:58 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-19 14:32 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-19 18:26 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-20 07:55 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-20 16:35 +0100
          Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-11 20:51 -0400
            Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-11 21:05 -0400
            Re: Firefox improvements. William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2015-10-12 01:08 +0000
            Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 03:59 +0100
              Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-11 23:08 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 04:41 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 00:16 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-12 00:37 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 05:46 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-12 00:56 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 06:18 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 02:22 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 08:44 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 02:23 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 08:47 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 03:59 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 09:14 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-12 12:08 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 08:59 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 14:25 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 12:20 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-12 16:27 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-13 11:20 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 16:01 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Geoff <geoff@invalid.invalid> - 2015-10-13 16:16 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 23:27 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-15 21:41 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-15 22:43 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-16 04:44 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-16 07:51 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-16 08:27 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-16 13:21 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2015-10-13 11:31 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2015-10-13 08:45 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 16:03 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 17:46 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 13:10 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-12 20:01 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2015-10-13 00:44 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 12:25 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2015-10-13 16:40 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 13:02 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-13 18:16 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2015-10-13 11:32 -0600
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 22:53 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 20:27 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2015-10-14 01:45 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 21:58 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-14 02:13 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 20:29 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-15 01:46 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-15 01:01 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 21:16 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-15 01:19 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 22:07 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 22:22 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 22:19 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 12:51 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-15 12:59 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 09:09 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-15 13:18 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 09:29 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 09:30 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 09:31 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-15 12:09 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-15 22:47 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 21:22 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. JW <none@dev.null> - 2015-10-16 06:14 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-15 12:09 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-15 12:07 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 16:24 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-15 22:50 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-15 12:02 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 17:12 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-15 12:50 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 18:01 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-15 20:06 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Jakob Bohm <jb-usenet@wisemo.com> - 2015-10-16 02:37 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-21 07:32 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-15 14:05 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 19:10 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-15 14:46 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-15 21:28 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-16 00:19 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 21:31 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-10-15 17:51 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2015-10-16 01:41 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2015-10-14 20:35 -0600
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-15 21:53 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 22:18 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 12:46 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-15 09:18 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2015-10-14 02:13 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2015-10-13 21:32 -0600
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 00:21 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 20:30 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 21:09 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 13:20 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 09:07 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2015-10-14 04:49 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 00:56 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-13 22:39 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-14 08:40 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2015-10-14 15:01 -0600
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 19:13 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 20:33 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 19:15 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 12:42 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 20:32 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-16 13:26 -0500
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-21 07:48 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-10-21 02:09 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-21 11:10 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-10-21 03:45 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-21 13:05 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-21 11:25 -0500
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-21 07:53 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-13 18:45 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-13 15:47 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-13 22:17 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 21:59 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 20:35 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2015-10-13 22:28 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-14 04:00 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 23:10 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-14 04:19 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 00:15 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-14 08:29 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 20:39 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 21:10 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 22:24 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 22:31 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-15 12:16 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 16:25 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-21 08:03 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-14 22:50 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-15 12:19 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-14 22:26 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 22:38 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 12:20 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-10-13 22:54 -0500
                Re: Firefox improvements. glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-14 04:24 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 20:47 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 23:01 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 20:44 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-14 21:11 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 22:26 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 18:48 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2015-10-13 13:24 -0600
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-13 22:23 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 20:36 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 22:59 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 20:35 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-14 02:16 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-10-13 18:54 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-14 04:05 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 22:52 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-14 20:49 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-10-14 23:07 -0500
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-15 07:12 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-15 12:58 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 20:49 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 12:26 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-13 03:02 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-16 12:19 -0500
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-16 17:17 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-20 22:13 -0500
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 14:13 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-12 15:04 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 12:30 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-12 16:43 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 02:29 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 08:53 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 08:50 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 14:18 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2015-10-12 16:50 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 12:12 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 17:33 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-12 16:32 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2015-10-12 21:20 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 21:43 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-13 08:03 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 07:18 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-13 07:28 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-13 10:16 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-10-13 04:35 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-13 12:57 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-13 13:29 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-13 14:41 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-13 13:53 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-13 16:24 +0200
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 16:12 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca> - 2015-10-13 16:39 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 18:51 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 22:55 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 22:47 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-13 18:13 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 19:03 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-13 22:57 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-13 22:02 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-13 22:04 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 12:15 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-12 16:37 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-12 12:46 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Brian Gladman <blindanagram@nowhere.net> - 2015-10-12 18:01 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 13:14 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-12 15:12 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-13 03:06 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2015-10-13 12:28 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 02:30 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-10-11 23:58 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 09:01 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 08:54 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-12 14:24 +0100
                Re: Firefox improvements. Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-10-12 07:07 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-12 13:02 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-12 15:24 +0000
              Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-12 00:18 -0400
              Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-16 16:31 -0500
            Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-16 15:55 -0500
              Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-16 17:33 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-17 01:32 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-17 01:12 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-17 12:53 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-17 19:32 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2015-10-17 20:29 -0700
                Re: Firefox improvements. gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2015-10-18 08:10 +0000
                Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-18 11:08 -0500
                Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-18 17:15 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-18 12:42 -0400
                Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-17 10:01 +0200
                Trusting password managers [Re: Firefox improvements.] Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-18 00:34 -0500
                Re: Trusting password managers [Re: Firefox improvements.] James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-18 11:55 -0400
                Re: Trusting password managers [Re: Firefox improvements.] DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-18 17:13 -0400
                Re: Trusting password managers [Re: Firefox improvements.] DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-19 06:47 -0400
                Re: Trusting password managers [Re: Firefox improvements.] Neon John <no@never.com> - 2015-10-18 13:25 -0400
                Re: Trusting password managers [Re: Firefox improvements.] Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-10-18 16:18 -0700
                Re: Trusting password managers [Re: Firefox improvements.] Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-19 18:37 -0500
                Re: Trusting password managers [Re: Firefox improvements.] Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-19 11:54 -0700
          Re: Firefox improvements. rpw3@rpw3.org (Rob Warnock) - 2015-10-12 05:52 +0000
            Re: Firefox improvements. DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-12 02:35 -0400
              Password crackers are not naive [Was: Firefox improvements.] Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-18 01:07 -0500
                Re: Password crackers are not naive [Was: Firefox improvements.] "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-21 08:16 +0200
                Re: Password crackers are not naive [Was: Firefox improvements.] David Malone <dwmalone@walton.maths.tcd.ie> - 2015-10-21 15:54 +0000
                Re: Password crackers are not naive [Was: Firefox improvements.] DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno <DLU1@DecadentLinuxUser.org> - 2015-10-21 11:57 -0400
                Re: Password crackers are not naive [Was: Firefox improvements.] dplatt@coop.radagast.org (Dave Platt) - 2015-10-21 11:17 -0700
          Re: Firefox improvements. Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-15 10:38 -0700
        Re: Firefox improvements. Rosario19 <Ros@invalid.invalid> - 2015-10-12 09:56 +0200
          Re: Firefox improvements. Jeffrey Goldberg <nobody@goldmark.org> - 2015-10-18 01:25 -0500
      Re: Firefox improvements. fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2015-10-14 00:32 -0700
      Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-21 08:47 +0200
      Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-21 09:17 +0200
      Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-21 09:36 +0200
  Re: Firefox improvements. bartekltg <bartekltg@gmail.com> - 2015-10-11 23:07 +0200
    Re: Firefox improvements. "Skybuck Flying" <skybuck2000@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-13 21:42 +0200

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