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Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips

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On Thu, 17 Oct 2013, Albert van der Horst wrote:

>> I disagree with the big $$$ assertion.  Linux started as a student
>> project, and has evolved to where it is today.  A generic Forth OS with a
>> degree of portability can be had quite reasonably, even as an open source
>> hobby-type project.
>
> This misrepresents the situation. Torvalds jumped on the GNU-train that
> was running 200 km/h and had consumed hundreds of millions of dollars in
> public funding (well spent, IMO).

True, a readily available C compiler was a pre-requisite for Linux, but a 
Forth based X-assembler for a given target fulfills that need.  In 
addition, knowledge of the boot code/initialization for the target.  That 
does not constitute a huge portion of the OS, but would cover most of the 
machine dependencies.

>
>>
>> The one thing that would simplify the portability is to use a device tree
>> to describe the target, in a manner similar to the Flattened Device Tree
>> model used by the PPC folks.  This will describe memory, registers, GPIO,
>> i2C buses and various components of the board, as well as the SoC itself
>> to produce a "bus model".  Drivers can then be developed generically.
>
> We don't have to start from nothing. There is open boot, and "all" we have
> to do is to port that to Pentium machines.

Assuming this belongs on a desktop.  Arm, PPC and MIPS would be better 
first targets ... and again, I would stress the FDT approach to describe 
the platform/architecture to the OS -- the modern PC's firmware with bus 
instantiation is complex, but is not found on embedded targets.

>>
>> Basically, one would implement basic boot code in assembler, plus the
>> primitives (Ting has suggested somewhere between 20 and 30 or so), and the
>> rest would be written in Forth.
>
> The rest... Have you looked at an obscure language like Python recently?
> No OS written in Python. Still getting an overview of what
> libraries are available is mind-boggling.

Python is a general purpose high level scripting language with a degree of 
object orientation, and decent performance.  It naturally attracts coders 
where Forth does its best to drive them away.  I'm not sure what your 
point is here, other than Python is a wildly successful scripting language 
whereas Forth is relegated to fringe status.

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Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips the_gavino_himself <visphatesjava@gmail.com> - 2013-09-27 14:52 -0700
  Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Elizabeth D Rather <erather@forth.com> - 2013-09-27 12:35 -1000
    Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-10-02 00:01 +0200
      Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-10-02 00:35 -0700
        Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-10-02 04:00 -0400
      Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-10-02 01:34 -0700
        Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-10-02 07:30 -0700
      Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-10-02 10:26 +0000
        Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Bill Richards <billrich@gmx.com> - 2013-10-02 14:41 +0000
          Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-10-02 08:25 -0700
            Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2013-10-02 23:13 -0400
        Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2013-10-25 12:46 +0200
      Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips the_gavino_himself <visphatesjava@gmail.com> - 2013-11-06 17:00 -0800
  Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2013-10-04 08:09 -0700
    Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Ed" <invalid@invalid.com> - 2013-10-05 11:45 +1000
    Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips gavino_himself <visploveslisp@gmail.com> - 2013-11-17 13:55 -0800
  Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Clyde W. Phillips Jr." <cwpjr02@gmail.com> - 2013-10-15 16:45 -0700
    Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Spam@ControlQ.com - 2013-10-16 11:20 -0400
      Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-10-17 12:03 +0000
        Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Spam@ControlQ.com - 2013-10-17 11:40 -0400
          Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-10-17 19:58 +0000
            Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Spam@ControlQ.com - 2013-10-17 17:22 -0400
              Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-10-17 11:45 -1000
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Spam@ControlQ.com - 2013-10-18 13:33 -0400
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips gavino_himself <visploveslisp@gmail.com> - 2013-11-17 14:15 -0800
            Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@nohavenotit.com> - 2013-10-18 04:02 -0400
              Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Stefan Mauerhofer <smauerhofer@androsoft.ch> - 2013-10-18 07:01 -0700
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-10-18 08:53 -1000
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips c-gschuette@neogov.net - 2013-11-07 09:24 -0800
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-11-07 07:38 -1000
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnohavenotit.cnm> - 2013-11-07 20:07 -0500
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips the_gavino_himself <visphatesjava@gmail.com> - 2013-11-16 10:00 -0800
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnohavenotit.cnm> - 2013-11-16 17:22 -0500
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-11-16 13:53 -1000
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-11-17 04:17 -0600
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-11-17 15:21 +0100
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-11-17 08:55 -1000
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-11-17 16:13 -0600
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-11-17 12:37 -1000
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@nohavenotit.com> - 2013-10-18 21:19 -0400
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips gavino_himself <visploveslisp@gmail.com> - 2013-11-17 14:28 -0800
                Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips gavino_himself <visploveslisp@gmail.com> - 2013-11-17 14:34 -0800
        Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-10-17 11:32 -1000
        Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@nohavenotit.com> - 2013-10-18 04:02 -0400
      Re: Id love to surf web with 4megs ram forth pc using forth and forth chips gavino_himself <visploveslisp@gmail.com> - 2013-11-17 14:11 -0800

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