EINSTEIN's category, far from the Pope.

From	Jeff-Relf.Me @.
Message-ID	<Jeff-Relf.Me@Jun.9--2.51pm.Seattle.2018> (permalink)
References	(1 earlier) <Jeff-Relf.Me@Jun.7--11.36pm.Seattle.2018> <iuxSC.158766$R51.149070@fx03.iad> <fo0qhdFbsq2U1@mid.individual.net> <fo0ttsFcl4oU1@mid.individual.net> <fo2vkbFochoU1@mid.individual.net>
Newsgroups	sci.physics, comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject	EINSTEIN's category, far from the Pope.
Organization	usenet-news.net
Date	2018-06-09 14:51 -0700

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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Scott replied ( to Mike ):
> > How do you know if you have free will ?
> 
> This is very much wrapped up in the "hard" problem of consciousness, 
> and without an appreciation of that, you can find yourself stuck in
> long-refuted 19th century determinism.

"refuted" by whom, the Pope ?

Everyone avoids the truth, to some extent;
we assert _useful_ premises, irregardless of the truth;
hence ego, online gaming and religion.

Einstein, on the other hand, loved the truth, more than most.
To his death, he kept telling us: free will is an illusion.

> One point is that the universe has already demonstrated it has non-
> deterministic processes, so there is the very real possibility that 
> consciousness is also non-deterministic.

All of history, every lesson ever, every advance, tells me ( not you ):

  Randomness is ignorance, nothing more;
  otherwise, there'd be NO TRUTH, nothing for me to aspire to.

> If you don't experience your will as being free, 
> then you belong in [ EINSTEIN's ] category [ far from the Pope ].

_Everyone_ is enslaved, there is no free will.
We simply prefer the LeastBad "option",
and we can't change what we prefer.

How and What we consume is what makes us different.

At the start, there was no entropy, just infinite eXergy/density. 
[ eXergy is a type of energy that can do physical work, force * distance ]
And, because " Time == Entropy ", there was no time on the clock then.

Eventually, this eXergy will be consumed away, replaced with entropy;
leaving us with a uniform heat bath that has all of the energy
but none of the eXergy.  Gravity is the "memory" of where the stuff was.

General Relativity's four dimensional TimeScape is static, eternal, 
perfectly causal... it is, at once, everything _and_ nothing.

Thread

Can  quantum measurement be rejected ? will <willscranton@butchersboulevard.commypanprofile> - 2018-06-06 18:07 +0000
  Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-06-06 18:14 +0000
    Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? will <willscranton@butchersboulevard.commypanprofile> - 2018-06-06 22:38 +0000
      Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? Alan Folmsbee <omnilobe@gmail.com> - 2018-06-06 17:43 -0700
        Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? will <willscranton@butchersboulevard.commypanprofile> - 2018-06-07 22:07 +0000
          Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? Alan Folmsbee <omnilobe@gmail.com> - 2018-06-07 17:12 -0700
            Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? will <willscranton@butchersboulevard.commypanprofile> - 2018-06-08 14:49 +0000
      Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-06 22:39 -0400
        Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? Libor Striz <poutnik4REMOVEnntp@CAPITALSgmail.com> - 2018-06-07 05:19 +0200
          Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-07 05:31 -0400
            Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? Libor Striz <poutnik4REMOVEnntp@CAPITALSgmail.com> - 2018-06-07 12:01 +0200
              Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-07 16:32 -0400
                Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? will <willscranton@butchersboulevard.commypanprofile> - 2018-06-07 21:58 +0000
                Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-06-08 04:12 -0700
                Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? will <willscranton@butchersboulevard.commypanprofile> - 2018-06-08 14:38 +0000
                Re: Can quantum measurement be rejected ? Libor Striz <poutnik4REMOVEnntp@CAPITALSgmail.com> - 2018-06-08 02:41 +0200
  "Quantum Mechanics" has no cause and effect, just probabilities. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-06 11:47 -0700
    Re: "Quantum Mechanics" has no cause and effect, just probabilities. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-06-06 19:00 +0000
      We assert useful premises, disregarding the truth. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-06 12:25 -0700
        Re: We assert useful premises, disregarding the truth. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-06 16:35 -0400
          Re: We assert useful premises, disregarding the truth. Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-06-06 17:52 -0700
            Re: We assert useful premises, disregarding the truth. mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-06-06 18:15 -0700
            No truth, Nothing to aspire to ? Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-06 18:21 -0700
              Re: No truth, Nothing to aspire to ? benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-06 22:47 -0400
                NO TRUTH. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-06 20:28 -0700
                Re: NO TRUTH. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-07 05:32 -0400
                Harp playing, androgynous angels in the clouds ? Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-07 11:18 -0700
                Re: Harp playing, androgynous angels in the clouds ? benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-07 16:42 -0400
                Ben Jacoby takes _pride_ in his randomness, I don't. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-07 14:15 -0700
                Re: Ben Jacoby takes _pride_ in his randomness, I don't. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-08 02:20 -0400
                Worshiping Ignorance. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-07 23:36 -0700
                Re: Worshiping Ignorance. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-08 11:42 -0400
                " I can choose to do the opposite of what I prefer " -- Ben Jacoby. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-08 10:17 -0700
                Re: Worshiping Ignorance. vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2018-06-09 01:58 +0000
                Re: Worshiping Ignorance. Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-06-08 19:55 -0700
                Re: Worshiping Ignorance. vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2018-06-09 21:37 +0000
                EINSTEIN's category, far from the Pope. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-09 14:51 -0700
                Re: EINSTEIN's category, far from the Pope. Melzzzzz <Melzzzzz@zzzzz.com> - 2018-06-09 22:01 +0000
                To a retard, _everything_ is "random". Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-09 15:11 -0700
                Re: EINSTEIN's category, far from the Pope. Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-06-09 15:13 -0700
                Re: EINSTEIN's category, far from the Pope. Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-06-10 15:52 -0700
                Re: EINSTEIN's category, far from the Pope. vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2018-06-09 22:54 +0000
                People are forever MisQuoting Einstein; I correct them. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-09 16:40 -0700
                Re: People are forever MisQuoting Einstein; I correct them. vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2018-06-10 00:15 +0000
                Putting words in Einstein's mouth. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-09 17:42 -0700
                Re: Putting words in Einstein's mouth. vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2018-06-10 00:59 +0000
                God Doesn't Play Dice, he's not an idiot; nor is he a "he". Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-09 18:28 -0700
                Re: God Doesn't Play Dice, he's not an idiot; nor is he a "he". vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2018-06-10 01:42 +0000
                Mark Twain was a determinist. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-09 20:16 -0700
                Re: Mark Twain was a determinist. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-10 12:48 -0400
                Quantum Mechanics is statistical, not complete. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-10 10:51 -0700
                Re: Quantum Mechanics is statistical, not complete. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-11 11:02 -0400
                Quantum Mechanics is statistical, not complete. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 09:20 -0700
                Re: Quantum Mechanics is statistical, not complete. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-11 17:09 -0400
                Bell's theorem is just another "I don't know". Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 14:32 -0700
                Re: Bell's theorem is just another "I don't know". Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-06-11 14:33 -0700
                No one can "prove" ThermoDynamics and/or General Relativity, 100.00000000%. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 15:00 -0700
                Re: No one can "prove" ThermoDynamics and/or General Relativity, 100.00000000%. Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-06-11 15:01 -0700
                We assert _useful_ premises ( and ThermoDynamics is _Very_ useful ). Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 15:27 -0700
                Re: Bell's theorem is just another "I don't know". benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-11 19:57 -0400
                Re: Bell's theorem is just another "I don't know". vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2018-06-12 17:11 +0000
                SuperDeterminism was useful to Einstein, and to me. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-12 12:03 -0700
                Re: SuperDeterminism was useful to Einstein, and to me. Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-06-13 09:03 -0700
                Enjoy your silly hat. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-13 14:46 -0700
                Re: Enjoy your silly hat. Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-06-14 08:20 -0700
                Sex toys/dolls. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-15 00:44 -0700
                Re: Sex toys/dolls. Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-06-15 05:49 -0700
                Re: Sex toys/dolls. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-15 11:47 -0400
                MostChristian != BestChristian Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-15 13:46 -0700
                Re: God Doesn't Play Dice, he's not an idiot; nor is he a "he". mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-06-09 19:37 -0700
                Re: God Doesn't Play Dice, he's not an idiot; nor is he a "he". benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-09 22:59 -0400
                Re: God Doesn't Play Dice, he's not an idiot; nor is he a "he". vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2018-06-10 03:51 +0000
                Re: God Doesn't Play Dice, he's not an idiot; nor is he a "he". benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-10 12:50 -0400
                Mark Twain, Einstein and Stephen Hawking are revered by nerds Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-10 11:01 -0700
                Re: Mark Twain, Einstein and Stephen Hawking are revered by nerds benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-11 11:06 -0400
                Asleep, living in a dream. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 10:04 -0700
                Re: Asleep, living in a dream. Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2018-06-11 14:22 -0500
                Re: Asleep, living in a dream. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-11 17:21 -0400
                Your house is built on sand. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 14:43 -0700
                Re: Putting words in Einstein's mouth. chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2018-06-11 07:02 -0500
                Quantum Mechanics is _not_ complete. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 09:41 -0700
                Re: Quantum Mechanics is _not_ complete. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-11 17:17 -0400
                "statistics is [sic] real" -- Ben Jacoby. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 14:39 -0700
                Re: "statistics is [sic] real" -- Ben Jacoby. Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-06-11 14:53 -0700
                When I hear the word "Quantum", I replace it with the word "BullShit". Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 15:09 -0700
                Re: "statistics is [sic] real" -- Ben Jacoby. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-11 20:00 -0400
                " I can't know "  -- Bell's Theorem. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-11 19:29 -0700
                Re: EINSTEIN's category, far from the Pope. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-09 22:28 -0400
                Re: Worshiping Ignorance. Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-06-09 14:53 -0700
                Re: Worshiping Ignorance. Steve Carroll <frelwizzen@gmail.com> - 2018-06-09 16:41 -0700
                If the truth is your enemy... Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-09 00:14 -0700
                Re: Worshiping Ignorance. Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2018-06-09 06:52 -0400
        Re: We assert useful premises, disregarding the truth. Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-06-06 21:22 +0000
          I feel rich, very rich. Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2018-06-06 14:39 -0700
      Re: "Quantum Mechanics" has no cause and effect, just probabilities. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-06 16:32 -0400
    Re: "Quantum Mechanics" has no cause and effect, just probabilities. benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2018-06-06 16:30 -0400

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