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Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building

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Hi,

Quoting Simon Richter (2024-06-06 11:32:33)
> > Would it be possible to set in stone that packages are supposed to always
> > be built in an environment where LC_ALL=C.UTF-8, or, in other words, that
> > builders must set LC_ALL=C.UTF-8?
> 
> This would be the opposite of the current rule.
> 
> Setting LC_ALL=C in debian/rules is an one-liner.
> 
> If your package is not reproducible without it, then your package is
> broken. It can go in with the workaround, but the underlying problem
> should be fixed at some point.
> 
> The reproducible builds checker explicitly tests different locales to
> ensure reproducibility. Adding this requirement would require disabling this
> check, and thus hide an entire class of bugs from detection.

this is one facet of a much bigger discussion (which we've had before). You can
argue both ways, depending on how you look at this problem.

It is the question of whether we want to:

 a) debian/rules is supposed to be runnable in a wide variety of environments.
 If your package FTBFS in a one specific environment, it is the job of d/rules
 to normalize the environment to cater for the specific needs of the package.

 b) debian/rules is supposed to be run in a well-defined environment. If your
 package FTBFS in this normalized environment, then it is the job of d/rules to
 add the specific needs of the package to d/rules.

So the question is whether you either want to have d/rules normalize
heterogeneous environments (a) or whether you want d/rules to make a normalized
environment specific to the build (b). This is of course a spectrum and I think
we currently doing much more of (a).

A question that goes in a similar direction is whether every d/rules that needs
it should have to do this:

export DPKG_EXPORT_BUILDFLAGS=y
include /usr/share/dpkg/buildflags.mk

Or whether we should switch the default and require that d/rules is run in an
environment (for example as set-up by dpkg-buildpackage) where these variables
are set?

Going back to the example of LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 and reproducibility: whether or not
this "hides" problem depends on the definition of what things are allowed to
change between two builds and what constitutes these things has changed already
in the past, for example for the build path which is not *not* changed anymore
but instead recorded in the buildinfo. The same could be argued for
LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 and the environment variables already are part of the buildinfo.

So I do not think that there is an easy answer to this question.

Thanks!

cheers, josch

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Thread

Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Gioele Barabucci <gioele@svario.it> - 2024-06-06 08:20 +0200
  Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Luca Boccassi <bluca@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 11:20 +0200
  Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon Richter <sjr@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 11:50 +0200
    Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Johannes Schauer Marin Rodrigues <josch@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 12:10 +0200
      Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Johannes Schauer Marin Rodrigues <josch@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 13:00 +0200
        Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon Richter <sjr@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 13:40 +0200
        Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon McVittie <smcv@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 17:00 +0200
      Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon McVittie <smcv@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 16:40 +0200
        Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Jeremy Bícha <jeremy.bicha@canonical.com> - 2024-06-06 16:50 +0200
        Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Guillem Jover <guillem@debian.org> - 2024-06-07 14:40 +0200
          Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> - 2024-06-07 15:40 +0200
            Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Alexandre Detiste <alexandre.detiste@gmail.com> - 2024-06-07 15:50 +0200
              Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon McVittie <smcv@debian.org> - 2024-06-07 17:50 +0200
                Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon McVittie <smcv@debian.org> - 2024-06-10 17:30 +0200
                Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon Richter <sjr@debian.org> - 2024-06-11 11:30 +0200
              Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Guillem Jover <guillem@debian.org> - 2024-07-02 03:50 +0200
                Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon McVittie <smcv@debian.org> - 2024-07-02 11:00 +0200
                Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Guillem Jover <guillem@debian.org> - 2024-07-02 14:40 +0200
                Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Alexandre Detiste <alexandre.detiste@gmail.com> - 2024-07-06 13:20 +0200
                Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Guillem Jover <guillem@debian.org> - 2024-08-03 19:20 +0200
                Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon McVittie <smcv@debian.org> - 2024-08-03 20:20 +0200
                Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@debian.org> - 2025-02-23 13:50 +0100
          Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Gioele Barabucci <gioele@svario.it> - 2024-06-07 16:20 +0200
          Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Simon McVittie <smcv@debian.org> - 2024-06-07 18:30 +0200
            Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Guillem Jover <guillem@debian.org> - 2024-08-03 15:30 +0200
      Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Marco d'Itri <md@Linux.IT> - 2024-06-06 18:50 +0200
      Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Andrey Rakhmatullin <wrar@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 19:00 +0200
        Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> - 2024-06-07 10:40 +0200
    Locale sanitizer (Was: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package  building) Daniel Gröber <dxld@darkboxed.org> - 2024-06-06 14:50 +0200
      Re: Locale sanitizer (Was: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package  building) Simon McVittie <smcv@debian.org> - 2024-06-06 15:40 +0200
  Re: Mandatory LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 during package building Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2024-06-18 00:40 +0200

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