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Re: Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug?

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On 4/16/23 09:29, David Wright wrote:
> On Sun 16 Apr 2023 at 07:19:18 (-0700), Peter Ehlert wrote:
>> On 4/9/23 08:57, David Wright wrote:
>>> On Wed 05 Apr 2023 at 07:03:41 (-0700), Peter Ehlert wrote:
>>>> Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer
>>>> Damned nice, the improvements are appreciated.
>>> I ran rc1 in my usual manner, and the only difference I noticed was
>>> the one extra question about non-free firmware, to which I replied
>>> yes. (There may well be improvements under the hood, so to speak.)
>>> Oh, and the initrd is somewhat larger, as per usual.
>>>
>>>> using the new debian-bookworm-DI-rc1-amd64-netinst.iso
>>>> Legacy install, GPT partition
>>> I assume Legacy means BIOS booting. Same here, but only one disk.
>> correct. different term, same thing. Not UEFI
>>>> graphic install, manual partitioning
>>>> Mate Desktop (others were deselected)
>>> Non-graphical here, a suitable partition existed, and only
>>> standard and SSH server software was installed.
>>>
>>>> WiFi firmware:
>>> Untested as this machine is a 2006-vintage mini-tower lacking wifi.
>>>
>>> [ snipped narrative of later network-switching ]
>>>
>>>> Boot Loader:
>>>> all disk drives were detected, however the one with the bios_grub
>>>> partition was highlighted
>>> I can't recall seeing anything other than the first item highlighted,
>>> ie "Enter device manually", at least with the non-graphical installer
>>> in expert mode. I selected the (sole) hard drive, item 2. The only
>>> remaining item was the USB stick containing the installer ISO.
>>>
>>> As expected nowadays, when the machine rebooted, the Grub menu
>>> had only two lines, both pointing to the newly installed system.
>>> (I hadn't made any attempt to counteract GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER
>>> during my installation.) So Grub was correctly installed in the
>>> MBR, and the rest of Grub occupied d400 bytes of /dev/sda1 (the
>>> 3MB BIOS boot partition on the single disk).
>>>
>>>> =============
>>>> second try, using the debian-live-bkworm-DI-rc1-amd64-mate.iso
>>>> same machine and again Legacy install, GPT partition
>>>> however I did NOT install from the live session:
>>>> I chose to go directly to install rather than the Calamares installer
>>>> then manual partitioning
>>>>
>>>> Boot Loader:
>>>> all drives were detected, however the one with the bios_grub partition
>>>> was NOT highlighted, but I did select it.
>>>> GRUB was Not properly installed, my former grub menu was still active.
>>> How did you determine that it was the previous menu. Wouldn't it look
>>> just the same?
>> I enable GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER so that the various other operating
>> systems are shown
>> if the new GRUB is properly installed I get the "new" one item only
>> GRUB display.
>> then when I boot the new OS I again enable GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER and
>> update GRUB
>>>> *** I tried a second time, same as above being super careful, same result.
>>>>
>>>> I then booted with my default system, ran grub-install /dev/sde &&
>>>> update-grub
>>>> then "new" system was on my boot menu.
>>>> then booted and it ran as expected.
> So you installed Grub on /dev/sde.
>
>>> Which method did you use to boot the "default" system (which I assume
>>> is bullseye, in a different partition on one or other of the disks),
>>> in view of the rather sparse menu from grub.cfg on the new system?
>> I boot with the "old" GRUB menu as explained above...it has Several
>> operating systems listed, my old default OS is still at the top of the
>> list.
>>>> back to the WiFi dongle, again the obscure firmware was properly installed
>>>>
>>>> Is this a Bug or a user/hardware issue?
>>> Presumably we are now back to talking about Grub.
>>>
>>> If you still have access to the bookworm system, you can check whether
>>> it claimed to have completed installing Grub successfully. You should
>>> see lines like:
>>>
>>>     grub-installer: info: Installing grub on '/dev/sda'
>>>     grub-installer: info: grub-install does not support --no-floppy
>>>     grub-installer: info: Running chroot /target grub-install  --force "/dev/sda"
>>>     grub-installer: Installing for i386-pc platform.
>>>     grub-installer: Installation finished. No error reported.
>>>     grub-installer: info: grub-install ran successfully
>>>
>>> in /var/log/installer/syslog.
>> Thanks, I did not know where to look or what to look for.
> I've tidied these lines:
>
>> ===================
>> Apr  5 12:59:44 grub-installer: info: Identified partition label for
>> /dev/sdb12: gpt
>> Apr  5 13:01:03 grub-installer: info: Installing grub on '/dev/sdb'
>> Apr  5 13:01:03 grub-installer: info: grub-install does not support
>> --no-floppy
>> Apr  5 13:01:03 grub-installer: info: Running chroot /target
>> grub-install  --force "/dev/sdb"
>> Apr  5 13:01:03 grub-installer: Installing for i386-pc platform.
>> Apr  5 13:01:13 grub-installer: grub-install: warning: this GPT
>> partition label contains no BIOS Boot Partition; embedding won't be
>> possible.
>> Apr  5 13:01:13 grub-installer: grub-install: warning: Embedding is
>> not possible.  GRUB can only be installed in this setup by using
>> blocklists.  However, blocklists are UNRELIABLE and their use is
>> discouraged..
>> Apr  5 13:01:13 grub-installer: Installation finished. No error reported.
>> Apr  5 13:01:13 grub-installer: info: grub-install ran successfully
>>
>> ====
> So that was installing Grub on /dev/sdb. I'm confused. This is a BIOS
> machine, so it boots via the MBR. Then it's meant to use blocklists?
>
> But you installed Grub on /dev/sde. Is that using blocklists? Are you
> always booting from the same MBR?
>
> Without tying all this down 100%, you have no bug IMO. It seems you
> have an extremely fragile boot implementation.
>
>> New Information:
>> in my effort to eliminate the hardware possibility I made several new
>> installs on three other machines, all with multiple drives, and only
>> one with the bios_grub partition
>>
>> at the close of the install we are presented with a "Install the GRUB
>> boot loader" window/menu
>> it asks "install the GRUB boot loader to your primary drive" with Yes
>> and No options
>>
>> * if I select No it presents a list of my physical drives...
>> choosing the one with the bios_grub partition does not work, GRUB is
>> not installed and the same fails are shown in the log.
> You're outside my comfort zone. My understanding is that you don't
> refresh the MBR, and write a blocklist. (I didn't see failure in
> the log, just a robust warning.) But I don't know where that blocklist
> is (I don't use them). It would be very easy for them to be overwritten.
> Perhaps boot-init-script would help here.
>
>> * if I select Yes it again presents the same list of my physical drives...
>> choosing the one with the bios_grub partition Does work, GRUB is
>> installed as expected
> I though you wrote earlier that that didn't work. (Nine lines after
>   "second try, using the debian-live-bkworm-DI-rc1-amd64-mate.iso"
> including blank lines.)
>
>> logically, I select NO because I have no clue which is the Primary
>> Drive and fully understand that it needs to point to the one with the
>> bios_grub partition.
> What "needs to point to"? AIUI the Primary drive is the one the BIOS
> reads the MBR from by default, ie if you haven't overridden it with
> the one-shot boot device menu (ie what Dell typically put on F12).
> So the BIOS has to point to the MBR which then points Grub at the
> BIOS Boot Partition, when there is one (or more), and that gets you
> to a Grub grub.cfg menu, and an OS.
>
> So I'm not confident where your active MBR is (sda, or sdb, or sde;
> each disk can have an MBR), and why Grub is writing blocklists
> (implying it doesn't know where the BIOS Boot Partition is).
> So I'd say the last paragraph, quoted below, still applies.
>
> There's a fair amount of information on the web, too, about
> dual-booting Grub, which might be worth perusing.
to my understanding (and experience) GRUB will not write to a GPT drive 
without a partition flagged bio_grub

I believe it does not use MBR
*
*
>
>> SO: where do I report this Bug/Anomaly?
>> I assume it should go to the debian-boot list
> I would say it's rather premature as a bug report, but more
> experienced eyes might help with what's going wrong where.
I did CC this thread to the debian-boot list.
hopefully they can parse and understand what is going on and make it 
more user friendly before Bookworm is final.
>
>>> You could install and run boot-info-script, which provides details of
>>> how the system boots, particularly where the MBR code looks for the
>>> BIOS boot partition (ie core.img). BTW do any other disks in this
>>> machine have BIOS boot partitions? (I've one on all my internal disks.)
>> thanks for that thought
>>> But as far as we're concerned, I think more information is needed,
>>> like what disks there are on the system, which disk the BIOS is
>>> reading the MBR from, the final listing from the partitioner,
>>> particularly any BIOS boot partitions, and so on. Without all that
>>> in the narrative, there's no telling whether it's a bug or not.
> Cheers,
> David.
>
David: thanks for your response and assistance.

long story short:
GRUB install fails with the debian-live-bkworm-DI-rc1-amd64-mate.iso 
installer as described I (poorly) described above.

the debian-bookworm-DI-rc1-amd64-netinst.iso does work as expected.

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Thread

Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug? Peter Ehlert <peter@sdi-baja.com> - 2023-04-05 16:30 +0200
  Re: Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2023-04-09 18:00 +0200
    Re: Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug? Peter Ehlert <pb21a@sdi-baja.com> - 2023-04-16 16:30 +0200
    Re: Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug? Peter Ehlert <peter@sdi-baja.com> - 2023-04-16 16:40 +0200
      Re: Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2023-04-16 18:40 +0200
        Re: Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug? Peter Ehlert <peter@sdi-baja.com> - 2023-04-17 18:10 +0200
          Re: Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2023-04-18 06:50 +0200
            Re: Debian Bookworm RC 1 installer- a Bug? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2023-05-08 18:20 +0200

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