Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn)

Newsgroups	sci.physics
Date	2016-01-16 18:02 -0800
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Message-ID	<91c4a598-e2cd-4ca4-95d1-22a140212de6@googlegroups.com> (permalink)
Subject	Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn)
From	"Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com>

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On Saturday, January 16, 2016 at 9:14:28 AM UTC-8, James McGinn wrote:
> On Saturday, January 16, 2016 at 1:35:54 AM UTC-8, Ross A. Finlayson wrote:
> 
> 
> > Uh.  There's more drag because it's wet.
> 
> There is more drag because moist air is denser.  But that is true for dry air also, but denser dry air increases lift. In contrast, denser, moist air reduces lift.
> 
> > You are confusing lift with traction, 
> > where there is more traction when it's dry.
> 
> There is no traction involved in aerodynamics, AFAICT. I think you are confused.
> 
> > Water is a most interesting substance, and 
> > has matter of factly many, many phases, 
> > besides our usual water, ice, and steam.  
> > 
> > These are usually at extremely high and 
> > low temperature regimes, as of the super 
> > cooled water, and live steam.
> 
> You are preaching to the choir.  I can explain underlying basis of H2O anomalous behavior.  See this on this NG:
> BREAKTHROUGH: Hydrogen Bonding as The Mechanism That Neutralizes H2O Polarity
> 
> > There are many an engineering and steam-
> > fitter's handbook with quite the few many 
> > charts as to the behavior of water under 
> > temperature and pressure.
> > 
> > In the biological realm, hydrophilicity 
> > and the ubiquity of water as the universal 
> > solvent is a critical component as the 
> > medium of most molecular reactions and 
> > molecular mechanics in respiratory cycles 
> > and the structural folding mechanics of 
> > proteins.
> > 
> > The hydrogen bond as under van der Waal's 
> > is a weak agglomeration as of liquids, vis-
> > a-vis, gases, where it is a usual course 
> > that stochastic motion as imparted by the 
> > energy or heat of the particles leaves 
> > them variously set and jostled.
> 
> See my paper.  van der Waal's isn't the cause.  van der Waal's is a red herring.  I explain "mysterious" jostling.
> 
> > 
> > These bonds aren't as strong as molecular 
> > bonds
> 
> You mean hydrogen bonds, right?
> 
> > as usually define molecules and thusly 
> > their molecular or chemical properties, in 
> > terms of the chemical elements.  They are 
> > moreso simply the establishment of phase 
> > (material phase) in terms of settings of 
> > uniform media, and various aggregates, 
> > solutions, mixes, dispersions, and such.

Traction is in terms of ground effect, 
lift is in terms of aerofoils.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zwitterion ???

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resonance_(chemistry)

I am not seeing what you are explaining yet as 
novel, though I did notice you basically 
established a pair of categorizations for four 
cases (of hydrogen bonds).  What is the gist, 
what is the point?  What is the neat simple 
principle to carry on in effect?

Thread

Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-15 18:10 -0800
  Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Helmut Wabnig <hwabnig@.- --- -.dotat> - 2016-01-16 09:59 +0100
    Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 01:35 -0800
      Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 09:14 -0800
        Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-16 19:17 -0600
        Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 18:02 -0800
          Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 18:39 -0800
            Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-16 23:26 -0600
          Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 18:41 -0800
            Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-16 23:26 -0600
            Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 22:41 -0800
              Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 22:52 -0800
                Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 23:44 -0800
                Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-17 00:43 -0800
                Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-17 10:16 -0600
    Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 08:54 -0800
      Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-16 19:18 -0600
    Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 16:35 -0800
      Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-16 19:18 -0600
  Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-01-17 11:43 +1100
    Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-16 19:19 -0600
    Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 17:46 -0800
      Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-16 20:13 -0600
      Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-01-17 15:47 +1100
        Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 21:04 -0800
          Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-16 23:27 -0600
          Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-01-17 16:57 +1100
            Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 22:21 -0800
              Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-17 10:21 -0600
            Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) R Kym Horsell <kym@kymhorsell.com> - 2016-01-17 06:32 +0000
              Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-16 22:43 -0800
                Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-17 10:23 -0600
  Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-01-17 23:50 +1100
    Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-17 11:05 -0800
      Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-17 14:29 -0600
      Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-01-18 11:52 +1100
        Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) R Kym Horsell <kym@kymhorsell.com> - 2016-01-18 00:59 +0000
          Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2016-01-18 13:18 +1100
            Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Solving Tornadoes <solvingtornadoes@gmail.com> - 2016-01-17 18:39 -0800
              Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-18 00:32 -0600
              Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2016-01-18 13:17 -0600
                Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-20 10:02 -0800
                Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-20 12:58 -0600
                Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Solving Tornadoes <solvingtornadoes@gmail.com> - 2016-01-22 16:38 -0800
                Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-22 19:14 -0600
            Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) R Kym Horsell <kym@kymhorsell.com> - 2016-01-18 13:44 +0000
        Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Solving Tornadoes <solvingtornadoes@gmail.com> - 2016-01-17 17:50 -0800
          Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-18 00:34 -0600
  Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Sergio <invalid@invalid.com> - 2016-01-17 13:33 -0600
  Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Solving Tornadoes <solvingtornadoes@gmail.com> - 2016-01-25 10:14 -0800
  Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) Solving Tornadoes <solvingtornadoes@gmail.com> - 2016-01-26 14:14 -0800
    Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-28 22:29 -0800
  Re: Why Moist Air Reduces Aerodynamic Lift (by James McGinn) James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2016-01-31 22:28 -0800

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