Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour.

From	Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.forth
Subject	Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour.
Date	2016-03-30 00:48 -0700
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<8760w49zjy.fsf@nightsong.com> (permalink)
References	<56fa93aa$0$5868$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl> <2016Mar29.182032@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> <n9-dnSdCKI4ASWfLnZ2dnUU7-InNnZ2d@supernews.com> <ndf59p$kap$1@dont-email.me> <4b57b1ee-841e-4007-8812-0c0810620dec@googlegroups.com>

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mhx@iae.nl writes:
>> on UM/MOD, which is faster, too.  But unfortunately, that's
>> completely non-standard...
> So, it *does* matter in a measureable way: for speed....  This tells
> you why Python uses floored division

The real issue here is that division on integers isn't really a thing,
the integers don't have multiplicative integers.  The reason for signed
mod is if you write a division sign you expect the obvious identity
to work:  (-a)/b = -(a/b).  With floored division you have 7/3=2 
but (-7)/3 = -3.  If you take the view that division is ordinary
arithmetic that everyone knows about, while mod is a math or computer
thing that's more abstruse, you want (-7)/3 = -2 if you're throwing
away the fraction part.  So that means the remainder is -1.

Lisp supplies both versions, though I don't remember how to use them.

In Haskell, dividing two integers with / is a compile time type error.
The operators "div" and "mod" give floored division (so the modulus is
positive if the divisor is positive, like Python), while "quot" and
"rem" give truncated division (like C99 and later).

Thread

The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2016-03-29 14:39 +0000
  Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-03-29 16:20 +0000
    Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2016-03-29 09:16 -1000
      Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-03-30 00:06 +0000
        Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. mhx@iae.nl - 2016-03-29 22:09 -0700
          Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2016-03-29 21:37 -1000
          Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-03-30 00:48 -0700
            Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-03-30 00:48 -0700
          Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-03-30 07:59 +0000
            Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. mhx@iae.nl - 2016-03-30 10:16 -0700
              Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-03-30 23:43 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. mhx@iae.nl - 2016-03-31 06:01 -0700
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-04-01 21:36 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. mhx@iae.nl - 2016-04-01 14:57 -0700
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-04-01 21:59 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. mhx@iae.nl - 2016-04-02 00:51 -0700
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-04-01 08:25 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-04-01 21:32 +0000
                division performance (was: The problem with implementation defined ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-04-05 11:12 +0000
                Re: division performance (was: The problem with implementation defined ...) Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-04-05 20:45 +0000
                Re: division performance (was: The problem with implementation defined ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-04-06 10:03 +0000
                Re: division performance (was: The problem with implementation defined ...) Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-04-08 22:53 +0000
                Re: division performance (was: The problem with implementation defined ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-04-09 10:14 +0000
                Re: division performance (was: The problem with implementation defined ...) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-04-09 13:43 +0000
              Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-03-31 10:55 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. mhx@iae.nl - 2016-03-31 06:38 -0700
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-03-31 16:21 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-03-31 11:49 -0700
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2016-03-31 10:11 -1000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. mhx@iae.nl - 2016-04-01 03:53 -0700
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-04-01 11:44 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-04-01 21:53 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2016-04-02 11:46 -0500
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-04-02 21:43 +0000
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2016-04-03 03:17 -0500
                Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-04-01 23:54 -0700
          Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2016-03-30 12:58 +0000
          Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-03-30 22:22 +0000
        Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2016-03-30 12:55 +0000
      Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-03-30 07:44 +0000
        Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2016-03-30 13:08 +0000
          Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2016-03-30 13:43 +0000
        Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-03-30 22:06 +0000
      Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. trevor <tgritchie@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2016-03-30 13:13 +0100
        Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2016-03-30 13:56 +0000
      Re: The problem with implementation defined behaviour. Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2016-03-30 12:49 +0000

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