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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #135620
| From | anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.forth, comp.lang.postscript, alt.folklore.computers, comp.lang.lisp |
| Subject | Re: Postscript in 4tH |
| Followup-To | comp.lang.forth |
| Date | 2026-09-09 07:35 +0000 |
| Organization | Institut fuer Computersprachen, Technische Universitaet Wien |
| Message-ID | <2026Sep9.093521@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> (permalink) |
| References | (1 earlier) <871pb7l36f.fsf@nightsong.com> <nnd$47db062e$781955bb@280ad1e4adf8c230> <875x0gib1k.fsf@debian> <117prfv$gq7e$3@dont-email.me> <87o6e7cifh.fsf@debian> |
Cross-posted to 4 groups.
Followups directed to: comp.lang.forth
Kragen Javier Sitaker <kragen@canonical.org> writes:
>PostScript has several other key similarities to Lisp. Referencing Paul
>Graham's "What Made Lisp Different" <https://paulgraham.com/diff.html>:
Given your claim below that Forth has only #1, #3, #9, let's look at
the others:
>2. A function type. "In Lisp, functions are first class objects--
>they're a data type just like integers, strings, etc, and have a literal
>representation, can be stored in variables, can be passed as arguments,
>and so on."
Forth has execution tokens.
>4. A new concept of variables. "In Lisp, all variables are effectively
>pointers. Values are what have types, not variables, and assigning or
>binding variables means copying pointers, not what they point to."
In Forth, neither variables nor values have types that are known to
the Forth system. The way to use that is that the programmer must
know the type, and that typically means always storing the same type
into a variable.
>5. Garbage-collection.
Not built into Forth.
>6. Programs composed of expressions. Not really, but closer than any of
>the currently popular languages.
Forth is like Postscript here: Programs composed of words (operators
in Postscript), which work on values on the stack.
>7. A symbol type. Yes, PostScript distinguishes /names from strings,
Forth distinguishes name tokens from strings, but they do not play the
role they play in Lisp or Postscript; in particular, you have to
create new named words outside a colon definitions, and if you use a
named word to get a unique value, you tend to use its body address,
not it's name token.
>8. A notation for code using trees of symbols. Yes. The only
>difference is that in conventional Lisp they're binary trees, while in
>PostScript they're N-ary ordered trees.
As mentioned in <2026Sep9.084205@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>, one
might consider the indirect-threaded code representation and its
modern equivalents for inlining to be such a notation, but in Forth
many control structures become branches, whereas in Postscript the
controlled stuff is a procedure (in Forth terminology, a quotation).
>Forth hits #1, #3, and #9.
And also #2, and partially #6, #7, and #8.
Followups reduced to comp.lang.forth. Add some other groups if you
really have to.
- anton
--
M. Anton Ertl http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html
comp.lang.forth FAQs: http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/forth/faq/toc.html
New standard: https://forth-standard.org/
EuroForth 2026 CFP: http://www.euroforth.org/ef26/cfp.html
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Postscript in 4tH Hans Bezemer <the.beez.speaks@gmail.com> - 2026-09-05 19:55 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2026-09-05 15:54 -0700
Re: Postscript in 4tH albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl - 2026-09-06 11:08 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2026-09-07 09:24 -0700
Re: Postscript in 4tH albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl - 2026-09-07 23:47 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH Kragen Javier Sitaker <kragen@canonical.org> - 2026-09-08 02:09 -0300
Re: Postscript in 4tH Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-08 20:34 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH Kragen Javier Sitaker <kragen@canonical.org> - 2026-09-08 22:38 -0300
Re: Postscript in 4tH Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-09 03:05 +0000
XML in Pythong (was: Re: Postscript in 4tH) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-09-09 15:00 +0800
Re: Postscript in 4tH Kragen Javier Sitaker <kragen@canonical.org> - 2026-09-10 01:06 -0300
Re: Postscript in 4tH Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-10 07:38 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-09-10 07:39 -0700
Re: Postscript in 4tH antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-09-15 16:04 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2026-09-15 09:24 -0700
Re: Postscript in 4tH Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-09-09 15:15 +0800
Re: Postscript in 4tH Kragen Javier Sitaker <kragen@canonical.org> - 2026-09-10 01:11 -0300
Re: Postscript in 4tH anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-09 07:35 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-09 08:10 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH Hans Bezemer <the.beez.speaks@gmail.com> - 2026-09-10 17:58 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH Kragen Javier Sitaker <kragen@canonical.org> - 2026-09-10 01:44 -0300
Re: Postscript in 4tH Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2026-09-09 03:01 -0700
Re: Postscript in 4tH albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl - 2026-09-09 14:05 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-09 06:42 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-09 08:28 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-09-09 10:03 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-09 22:17 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl - 2026-09-09 14:42 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-09-09 19:17 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl - 2026-09-10 12:22 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-09 21:54 +0000
Re: Postscript in 4tH Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2026-09-09 22:14 -0700
Re: Postscript in 4tH albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl - 2026-09-10 12:30 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl - 2026-09-09 14:36 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH Hans Bezemer <the.beez.speaks@gmail.com> - 2026-09-06 14:27 +0200
Re: Postscript in 4tH Hans Bezemer <the.beez.speaks@gmail.com> - 2026-09-08 17:18 +0200
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