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Groups > alt.comp.os.windows-11 > #35719
| From | Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | alt.comp.os.windows-11, alt.comp.os.windows-10 |
| Subject | Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] |
| Date | 2026-10-04 08:04 -0400 |
| Organization | A noiseless patient Spider |
| Message-ID | <119tfct$3sfpm$1@dont-email.me> (permalink) |
| References | <osftomx8qd.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> <MPG.452c3e11cfba3fe29896c8@news.eternal-september.org> |
Cross-posted to 2 groups.
On Sun, 10/4/2026 6:42 AM, Philip Herlihy wrote: > In article <osftomx8qd.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>, robin_listas@es.invalid > says... >> >> A friend (a teacher) has a problem with PDF files. >> >> Management sends her files in PDF format which she is supposed to edit >> and fill with names and data and send back. I asked chatgpt and Word can >> directly edit PDF files, with some limitations. I don't have word (nor >> she unless she pays it herlself), so I can't try myself. Management does >> not supply the employees with software nor laptops. Some cheek. >> >> The Libre Office method is open in LO Draw, select the text, and copy to >> a new LO Writer document. But each line is separate, text doesn't flow. >> >> I wonder if there is a better or easier method. > > Side question (having already offered suggestions): > > What's the best *paid* pdf editor? Foxit? > I tried manually analyzing the market, but not even reviews of software (pitiful reviews) list capabilities in any meaningful way. I punted and the shredder mainly relied on some other AI-prepared material to answer the question. Generally speaking, you are correct. Foxit can reflow a text paragraph, which is not a native representation inside a PDF. As far as I know, a line of text is the quanta in there. Then you have the problem of editing text, when the embedded subset font inside the document is missing letters, and that means the tool has to do something about the font tables. ATMFM (Adobe Type Manager) used to take care of that, using generic approximations of fonts, but that doesn't seem to have any obvious successor. Windows used to have some version of that. ***************************** CoPilot Question ***************************** The PDF market seems a bit hard to analyze. There seem to be PDF editors, but it is not clear what kinds of elements they can modify. Just getting a list of PDF editors is difficult, editors that actually provide editing functions (move a text string on the screen). The Wikipedia list did not seem to be that complete. What do you see as PDF editors in your list of them ? ***************************** coPilot Answer ******************************* The short answer: **a true PDF editor is one that can modify *existing* PDF objects** text objects, images, vector shapes, annotations, form fields—*without* converting the PDF to another format first. Most tools marketed as "PDF editors" are actually **annotation tools** that cannot move or change existing text. The market is confusing because vendors blur this distinction. Below is a **grounded list of actual PDF editors**-tools that can *natively* edit existing PDF content-based on the sources you saw. I also highlight what kinds of elements they can modify, because that’s the part that’s usually hidden. --- ## True PDF Editors (can modify existing text objects) These tools are confirmed by documentation or reviews to support **real content editing**, not just annotations. ### **Adobe Acrobat Pro** - Full text editing (modify, move, reflow paragraphs) - Edit images, replace images, move objects - Advanced OCR --> scanned PDFs become editable text - Form creation, redaction, accessibility tools - Most complete feature set; industry reference ( https://www.logicalrefer.com/articles/best-pdf-editor-software-2026/ ) ### **Foxit PDF Editor / Editor+** - Full text editing with explicit text reflow (rare outside Acrobat) - Object editing: move/resize text boxes, images, shapes - Strong OCR - Enterprise‑oriented performance ( https://www.brandjet.ai/blog/best-pdf-editors/ ) ### **Nitro PDF Pro / Nitro PDF Standard** - Full text editing - Strong OCR implementation (per documentation) - Business workflow features (signing, analytics) ### **ABBYY FineReader PDF** - One of the best OCR engines; converts scanned PDFs into editable text layers - Full text editing once OCR is applied - Very strong for scanned documents ### **PDF‑XChange Editor / Editor Plus** - Full text editing - Editable OCR layer (you can correct recognized text) - Very deep feature set at low cost ### **PDFelement** - Full text editing - OCR with AI features (Lumi assistant) - Broad feature coverage ( https://www.techwench.com/best-pdf-editors-2026/ ) ### **PDF Expert (Mac/iPad)** - Full text editing for digital PDFs - **No OCR** --> cannot edit scanned PDFs without external OCR ### **UPDF Pro** - Full text editing - OCR available - Lower-cost alternative ### **PDFgear (Free)** - Completely free - Full text editing + OCR (except some scan limitations) ### **Sejda (Online/Desktop)** - Can edit existing text in *digital* PDFs - **Cannot edit scanned text** (no OCR editing) --- ## Annotation‑Only Tools (cannot modify existing text) These tools are often mislabeled as “PDF editors,” but they **cannot move or change existing text objects**. They only add overlays. ### Examples: - **Smallpdf** (browser-based) – annotation + basic edits, but not full text editing - **iLovePDF** – broad toolkit, but editing is mostly annotation/overlay - **PDFescape** – browser-based form filling + annotation; no real text editing - **Preview (macOS)** – annotation + simple markup; cannot edit existing text - **PDFsam Basic** – page manipulation only (split/merge) - **Xodo** – excellent annotation, not real editing - **Canva PDF Editor** – visually rich overlays; not true PDF object editing (https://www.techwench.com/best-pdf-editors-2026/) (https://www.guideflow.com/blog/pdf-editors) (https://scanjet.app/blog/best-pdf-editor/) --- ## Why the market is confusing The key distinction—**editing vs. annotating** - is rarely made clear. As one source puts it: "A true PDF editor must be able to change content that already exists inside a PDF... plenty of apps marketed as PDF editors are annotation tools." This is why Wikipedia lists are incomplete: they mix annotation tools, converters, and true editors without distinguishing capabilities. --- ## What “real editing” actually means in PDF terms A true PDF editor can manipulate these internal PDF objects: - **Text objects**: move, delete, change font, reflow paragraphs - **Images**: replace, move, resize - **Vector graphics**: lines, shapes, fills - **Form fields**: create, modify, script - **Annotations**: edit existing ones, not just add new - **Structure tree**: tags for accessibility (rare; Acrobat does this) - **OCR text layers**: correct recognized text (PDF‑XChange, ABBYY) Most "editors" only add new objects on top of the page (annotations), which is why they cannot fix typos or move existing text. --- ## If you want to *move a text string on the screen* <=== [this is not reflow] Only the following reliably support this: - **Adobe Acrobat Pro** - **Foxit PDF Editor** - **PDF‑XChange Editor** - **PDFelement** - **Nitro PDF Pro** - **PDFgear (free)** - **UPDF Pro** - **PDF Expert** (digital PDFs only) Everything else is annotation-only. ***************************** End: coPilot Answer ******************************* Paul
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Editing PDF files "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-29 21:24 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-29 20:45 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files knuttle <keith_nuttle@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-29 17:13 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:43 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files T <T@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-29 12:49 -0700
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-30 12:21 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-30 13:20 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:44 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files T <T@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-30 12:07 -0700
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:46 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-01 18:10 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-01 13:35 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 20:34 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-02 06:07 -1100
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-02 19:49 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-02 08:24 -1100
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-02 21:59 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-02 20:11 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files T <T@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 11:46 -0700
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 21:39 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files T <T@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:18 -0700
Re: Editing PDF files PDF Files <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-29 21:05 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files Zaidy036 <Zaidy036@air.isp.spam> - 2026-09-29 18:26 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files T <T@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-29 16:51 -0700
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:48 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files T <T@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 11:47 -0700
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 21:40 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files T <T@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:19 -0700
Re: Editing PDF files "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-30 01:27 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files T <T@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-29 20:56 -0700
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:50 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 00:34 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-09-29 20:15 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-09-30 01:30 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-09-30 00:26 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 12:55 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2026-09-29 22:45 -0500
Re: Editing PDF files "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 10:23 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 13:01 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-09-30 00:23 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 13:05 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-01 18:53 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files "s|b" <me@privacy.invalid> - 2026-10-01 17:40 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-01 14:09 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-10-01 18:21 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 20:30 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-10-01 18:58 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 21:42 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files knuttle <keith_nuttle@yahoo.com> - 2026-10-01 21:35 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-02 11:56 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "s|b" <me@privacy.invalid> - 2026-10-02 16:12 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-02 19:50 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "s|b" <me@privacy.invalid> - 2026-10-02 20:57 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-02 21:34 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-02 20:19 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-10-02 17:54 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 06:53 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 07:34 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-09-30 13:58 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files knuttle <keith_nuttle@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 09:30 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 10:36 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-02 06:29 -1100
Re: Editing PDF files PDF Files <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-30 18:17 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files knuttle <keith_nuttle@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 16:07 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-01 01:59 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-10-01 06:57 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-09-30 18:26 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2026-09-30 13:25 -0500
Re: Editing PDF files Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-09-30 18:39 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 20:26 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files Philip Herlihy <nothing@invalid.com> - 2026-09-30 10:48 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 10:50 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 13:11 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-10-01 13:44 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-09-30 11:14 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 13:12 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Ammammata <ammammata@tiscali.it> - 2026-09-30 12:24 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-09-30 16:08 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 13:13 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-01 09:52 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-01 20:33 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Arkadiusz 'Black Fox' Artyszuk <asdfadsasdfa@atomicmail.io> - 2026-10-02 12:41 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-02 05:37 -1100
Re: Editing PDF files ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de (Stefan Ram) - 2026-10-06 14:54 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-06 18:14 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Philip Herlihy <nothing@invalid.com> - 2026-10-04 11:42 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-04 08:04 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-10-04 16:10 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-10-04 17:55 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-10-04 14:05 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-04 17:09 -0300
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-04 22:31 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-04 23:50 -0300
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Philip Herlihy <nothing@invalid.com> - 2026-10-04 21:21 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Philip Herlihy <nothing@invalid.com> - 2026-10-05 11:25 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] MikeS <MikeS@fred.com> - 2026-10-05 12:40 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-05 13:34 -0300
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Philip Herlihy <nothing@invalid.com> - 2026-10-06 15:35 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> - 2026-10-06 12:39 -0300
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2026-10-06 10:43 +0000
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-06 13:18 +0200
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Philip Herlihy <nothing@invalid.com> - 2026-10-06 15:31 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-10-05 12:36 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] Philip Herlihy <nothing@invalid.com> - 2026-10-06 16:05 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] "....winston" <winstonmvp@gmail.com> - 2026-10-06 11:35 -0400
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] MegaNZ <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-06 16:40 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files [Paid options?] MegaNZ <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-05 04:20 +0100
Re: Editing PDF files Brian Gregory <void-invalid-dead-dontuse@email.invalid> - 2026-10-04 17:52 +0100
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