Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c

From	bart <bc@freeuk.com>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c
Subject	Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c
Date	2026-09-28 16:52 +0100
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<119e2f5$2fr80$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(5 earlier) <119d88u$23bo0$2@dont-email.me> <119dgg0$28if0$2@dont-email.me> <119dkku$27s5h$1@dont-email.me> <119dqk0$2cj9m$1@dont-email.me> <119dsk4$27s5h$3@dont-email.me>

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On 28/09/2026 15:12, David Brown wrote:
> On 28/09/2026 15:38, bart wrote:

>> As for limited identifier space, AFAICS that is essentially unlimited.
>>
> 
> Don't be silly.

But you brought it up!
>>> I've had my own "sin" function in C programs.  I do not remember that 
>>> any complications were involved.
>>
>> The usual approach for a custom version is to use a slightly different 
>> name. I dislike overriding or shadowing built-ins.
>>
> 
> Your "usual approach" and what you like or dislike is no indication of 
> what other people may do.  There are reasons why I would sometimes pick 
> a name that is different from the standard library name, and reasons 
> while I would sometimes pick the same name.
> 
>> (Funny how shadowing or overriding is usually perceived as bad, until 
>> you want to shadow something like 'sin' then it's a must-have!)
>>
> 
> It is not a "must-have", it is a convenience.  Of course it's possible 
> to work in a language where "sin" is a built-in function that is fixed 
> in the language.  But it usually has no benefit, and just disadvantages 
> compared to using a standard library.  That's why few languages since 
> BASIC have gone your route.

Yes, I know, most languages prefer to have things in libraries rather 
than in the core.

Some even want to have basics such as statements in libraries (Clisp was 
mentioned but this stuff is popular in esolangs).

But one example where built-in is better is with Print. Otherwise this 
presents challenges to do in user-code:

* Variable-length set of arguments

* Mixed argument types

* Optional per-item information

* Optional per-print information (eg. destination)

* Less than ideal syntax


In C, this meant several things:

* Needing to add stdio.h each time

* Having to introduce variadic functions (possibly just for this reason)

* Less type safety

* Using format codes to import type information

Other languages have their own problems in fitting those requirements to 
standard functions

Thread

official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-27 10:20 +0200
  Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-27 20:04 +0200
    Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-27 21:38 +0100
      Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-27 23:16 +0200
        Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-28 00:53 +0100
          Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-28 04:31 +0200
          Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-28 10:25 +0200
            Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-28 11:45 +0100
              Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-28 13:56 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-28 14:38 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-28 16:12 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-28 16:52 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-28 18:49 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-28 20:26 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-29 09:45 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-29 12:54 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-29 15:56 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-29 18:15 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-29 20:24 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-29 19:41 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-09-29 21:37 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 01:33 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-30 09:28 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 13:41 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-01 07:25 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-10-01 17:50 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-01 09:37 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 01:19 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-30 09:44 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-29 16:01 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 01:00 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-30 13:01 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-01 08:52 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-30 01:56 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2026-10-01 07:15 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-29 09:28 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 07:10 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-09-28 15:30 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-29 09:03 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-29 11:11 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-29 14:38 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-30 07:02 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 11:35 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-30 14:14 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 13:45 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-30 15:30 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 17:14 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-30 16:42 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 18:02 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 16:54 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-30 18:26 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 22:12 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-01 09:44 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-10-01 10:42 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-10-01 13:50 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-10-01 12:29 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-02 09:35 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-10-02 04:03 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-02 13:50 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-10-02 11:22 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2026-10-02 18:33 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-10-03 14:30 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-10-03 16:37 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-01 13:29 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-10-01 14:46 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-10-01 15:37 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-10-02 08:57 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-10-02 00:37 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 17:12 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 14:09 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-30 13:55 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-30 14:31 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 16:12 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-30 19:33 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-30 18:14 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2026-10-01 08:34 -0400
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 07:08 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-29 15:02 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-09-29 14:43 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-29 16:07 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 22:58 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 00:13 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-30 07:13 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-10-01 02:41 +0800
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 14:15 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 14:18 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 13:24 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-30 14:45 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 15:56 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-30 22:31 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-30 14:32 +0300
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-28 17:22 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-09-28 17:24 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-29 09:54 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-09-29 16:48 -0700
              Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-28 14:16 +0200
              Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2026-09-28 11:15 -0400
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-28 16:40 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-09-29 16:50 -0700
              Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 06:38 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-29 14:36 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 22:49 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-29 23:59 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-09-29 16:51 -0700
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-30 01:54 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2026-09-29 22:09 -0400
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-30 10:52 +0100
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2026-09-30 12:38 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-01 08:49 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2026-10-01 08:48 -0400
    Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-28 06:45 +0000
      Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-28 12:42 +0200
        Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 00:58 +0000
          Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-29 03:02 +0200
            Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 03:16 +0000
              Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-29 14:20 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2026-09-29 12:39 -0400
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 22:50 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 02:57 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-30 02:00 +0000
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 10:08 +0200
                Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 13:58 +0200
      Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c bart <bc@freeuk.com> - 2026-09-28 11:43 +0100
        Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-29 01:00 +0000
        Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-09-30 07:59 +0200
      Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2026-09-28 11:03 -0400
    Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c NOTE fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2026-09-28 17:50 +0200
    Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2026-09-30 12:42 -0700
  Re: official library of tiny functions lacking in c tTh <tth@none.invalid> - 2026-09-28 00:02 +0200

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