How to shoot yourself in the foot (Was: Loderunner Enemy AI better than SWI-Prolog? [Prolog Education Group])

From	Mild Shock <janburse@fastmail.fm>
Newsgroups	sci.logic, comp.lang.prolog, sci.physics
Subject	How to shoot yourself in the foot (Was: Loderunner Enemy AI better than SWI-Prolog? [Prolog Education Group])
Date	2026-08-18 16:42 +0200
Message-ID	<1161r1b$mchr$1@solani.org> (permalink)
References	<113r42n$8g50$2@solani.org> <115ajs3$6g3f$1@solani.org> <1161krd$ma79$2@solani.org> <1161pt7$mbl1$1@solani.org>

Cross-posted to 3 groups.

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Hi,

The biggest joke, is to have logic somewhere
in procedure and somewhere in declarative, and
try to see different takes on logic.

They really don't know what this mantra means:

Algorithm = Logic + Control

And cannot relate it to the ideas of declarative
reading and procedural reading. The problem is
a too lax introduction of this notions,

prematurely before the notion "logic" is
even understood. But nobody understands the
meaning of the term "logic", i.e. a set of

supposedly tautological sentences, as under-
stood by mathematical logic. There is a subtle
error again to conflate it with a "calculus",

so this website has a very misleanding title,
although they try hard to not commit the fallacy,
and have subtitles "Proof System" and "Logic Level":

Welcome to LogicProof
https://6ximik9.github.io/naturalDeduction/

The there is this moron:

There is only one “minimal logic”. The term denotes Johansson’s 
Minimalkalkül [1937] — intuitionistic logic without ex falso quodlibet — 
and nothing else. No rival system competes for the name.
https://vidal-rosset.net/rule-correspondence-F.html

Of course there are rival "Proof Systems" aka
calculi, even when the "Logic Level" is minimal
logic. It is as if Joseph Vidal-Rosset doesn't

understand basic German. You have to look behind
"Minimalkalkül" to find "Minimallogic". Right?
To identify calculus with logic, is maybe a 1930's

fallacy, but then we had model theory besides
proof theory, and people should be more educated
now. Model theory can be also expanded to

non-classical logics and even minimal logic, to
give a purely semantic reading. Ok some modern
morons think they need to invoke the word "algebraic".

Bye

Mild Shock schrieb:
> Hi,
> 
> Sometimes I think the Loderunner Enemy AI
> was way ahead of its time:
> 
> Lode Runner - Broderbund - 1983 - Apple II
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJZJepU8law
> 
> Meanwhile SWI-Prolog Prologers even don't know
> whether a Prolog text is CNF or DNF:
> 
> Sets of rules as conjunctions and/or disjunctions
> https://swi-prolog.discourse.group/t/sets-of-rules-as-conjunctions-and-or-disjunctions/9779 
> 
> 
> No Wonder that the EyeProlog "why" feature produces
> nonsense. Even a Flea circus is less crazy.
> 
> Bye
> 
> P.S.: If only there would exist something like
> universities where one can take a basic course in
> FOL, and then a world wide web, where one can
> 
> lookup clark equational theory, clark completion,
> curry howard correspondence, etc.. etc..
> 
> Mild Shock schrieb:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Obviously to generate AI Surprises,
>> you have to stand on the shoulder of
>> giants. Otherwise you will not discover
>>
>> surprises, right? Only mediocre deja vues.
>> For this purpose, and maybe otherwise
>> related, in a discussion concerning the future
>>
>> of the library, Marvin Minsky and Edward A.
>> Feigenbaum endorsed the idea for books
>> to ‘talk to each other’:
>>
>> LET DOCUMENTS TALK TO EACH OTHER
>> Z. CHEN - 1993
>> doi.org/10.1108/eb026910
>>
>> Now we have:
>>
>> THE MACHINES ARE STUDYING
>> THE HUMANS ARE SCROLLING
>> https://9gag.com/gag/a9yQ16o
>>
>> Bye
>>
>> P.S.: But who was Marvin Minsky, and would it
>> be important to use symbolic AI?
>>
>> The Perceptron Controversy
>> Yuxi Liu - 2024
>> https://yuxi.ml/essays/perceptron-controversy
>>
>> Mild Shock schrieb:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> How it started:
>>>
>>> Filming a vitamin B12 photoreceptor in action
>>> https://www.psi.ch/de/news/science-features/filming-a-vitamin-b12-photoreceptor-in-action 
>>>
>>>
>>> How its going:
>>>
>>> Elon Musk's potential FEL route could challenge EUV lithography
>>> https://www.kucoin.com/news/flash/elon-musk-s-potential-fel-route-could-challenge-euv-lithography 
>>>
>>>
>>> Who will win the Nano Atom mover race,
>>>
>>> will the USA OutChip its competitor China
>>> and its supplier Asia in the next years?
>>>
>>> Bye
>>>
>>> Mild Shock schrieb:
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> Remember when first all local AI was Python
>>>> and PyTorch APIs. And then suddently people started
>>>> using bare metal C/C++ Code. Here is the story:
>>>>
>>>> How it started:
>>>>
>>>> GPT-J or GPT-J-6B is an open-source large
>>>> language model (LLM) developed by EleutherAI
>>>> in 2021. As the name suggests, it is a
>>>> generative pre-trained transformer model
>>>> designed to produce human-like text that
>>>> continues from a prompt.
>>>> https://www.eleuther.ai/
>>>>
>>>> How it was going [Georgi Gerganov]:
>>>>
>>>> So a few days later comes out the LLaMA, I do
>>>> some calculations and I figure out “Okay, 65
>>>> billion parameters. You probably need about
>>>> 40 gigs of RAM, with 4-bit quantization. So
>>>> this can run on a MacBook. Why not do it?”
>>>>
>>>> Why I was able to do it so quickly - basically,
>>>> for all that I saw it’s pretty much GPT-J architecture
>>>> with some modifications, like some extra memorization
>>>> layers. It’s minor changes. Basically, again, the
>>>> existing code for the GPT-J, I just simply
>>>> modified it there, it happened pretty quickly.
>>>> https://changelog.com/podcast/532
>>>>
>>>> Georgi Gerganov, Bulgarian, now with Hugging
>>>> Face, ggml-cann also running on Chinese AI chips.
>>>> ggml Manifesto https://github.com/ggml-org/ggml
>>>>
>>>> Bye
>>>
>>
>

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