Groups > alt.folklore.computers > #234522

Re: Self-hosting and the 6502

From	cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross)
Newsgroups	alt.folklore.computers
Subject	Re: Self-hosting and the 6502
Date	2026-03-31 23:45 +0000
Organization	PANIX Public Access Internet and UNIX, NYC
Message-ID	<10qhmbe$n84$2@reader2.panix.com> (permalink)
References	<10qf16a$2t7c2$1@dont-email.me> <10qglro$3dj57$1@dont-email.me>

Show all headers | View raw

In article <10qglro$3dj57$1@dont-email.me>,
Peter Flass  <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> wrote:
>On 3/30/26 16:32, Lev wrote:
>> 
>> The segmentation approach is elegant but it's interesting
>> that it lost. Flat address spaces won commercially even
>> though they're worse for the problem. Paging won over
>> segmentation, position-independent code stayed hard until
>> relatively recently (and still isn't free on x86). Is
>> there a good account of why segmentation died? I've seen
>> hand-waving about 'complexity' but Multics ran fine.
>
>Cost. It's Betamax vs. VHS, or OS/2 vs. Windows. The best technical 
>approach loses to something worse, but cheaper.

I'm not sure I agree with that, actually.  The observation was
that logical segments could be constructed from paged virtual
memories.  Moreover, if you squint at it right, GE-645-style
segments are kind of like a two-level paging structure of the
type we see on e.g., x86 or ARM (granted; the address space was
much larger for Multics).

But if that's the case, do you need the fancy segment-aware
addressing modes?  System designers subsequent to Multics and
the 645->6180->DPS/8m lineage don't seem to think so, and I
don't think they were dummies.

	- Dan C.

Thread

Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Lev <thresh3@fastmail.com> - 2026-03-30 23:32 +0000
  Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 snipeco.2@gmail.com (Sn!pe) - 2026-03-31 00:36 +0100
    Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Lev <thresh3@fastmail.com> - 2026-03-31 03:08 +0000
      Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-03-31 07:45 -0700
        Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2026-03-31 14:56 +0000
  Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-03-30 23:38 +0000
    Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-04-01 16:50 +0000
      Re: segments, was Self-hosting and the 6502 John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-04-02 03:07 +0000
        Re: segments, was Self-hosting and the 6502 scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-04-02 16:21 +0000
          segments and architectural experimentation (was Re: segments, was Self-hosting and the 6502) Kragen Javier Sitaker <kragen@canonical.org> - 2026-09-11 08:13 -0300
            Re: segments and architectural experimentation (was Re: segments, was Self-hosting and the 6502) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-09-11 07:29 -0700
            Re: segments and architectural experimentation (was Re: segments, was Self-hosting and the 6502) john larkin <jl@glen--canyon.com> - 2026-09-11 07:55 -0700
              Re: segments and architectural experimentation (was Re: segments, was Self-hosting and the 6502) David Schultz <david.schultz@earthlink.net> - 2026-09-11 13:06 -0500
            Re: segments and architectural experimentation (was Re: segments, was Self-hosting and the 6502) someone <2a59d59e3809f827ce709d3815e3950eef4a6a93af5557a93a7fdfba71460843@example.com> - 2026-09-14 16:45 +0000
  Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-03-31 09:01 +0100
    Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> - 2026-03-31 09:49 +0000
  Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-03-31 07:31 -0700
    Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-03-31 23:45 +0000
      Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-03-31 17:15 -0700
        Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-01 01:27 +0000
          Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-03-31 19:24 -0700
            Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-01 03:01 +0000
              Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-04-01 07:26 -0700
                Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2026-04-01 15:54 +0100
                Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-01 20:35 +0000
                Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 snipeco.2@gmail.com (Sn!pe) - 2026-04-01 21:49 +0100
                Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-01 16:08 +0000
                Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-01 20:34 +0000
                Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-04-01 14:29 -0700
                Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-01 22:37 +0000
                Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-04-01 22:52 +0000
        Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-04-01 13:54 +0000
        Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 antispam@fricas.org (Waldek Hebisch) - 2026-04-01 17:31 +0000
  Re: Self-hosting and the 6502 cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) - 2026-03-31 22:23 +0000

csiph-web