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How do we create 2D space?

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  How do we create 2D space? 7 <7@enemygadgets.com> - 2016-05-08 13:24 +0000
    How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 06:54 -0700
      Re: How do we create 2D space? 7 <7@enemygadgets.com> - 2016-05-08 14:57 +0000
        Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 16:15 +0200
          Re: How do we create 2D space? 7 <7@enemygadgets.com> - 2016-05-08 15:35 +0000
            Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 16:56 +0200
              Re: How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 08:03 -0700
                Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 17:17 +0200
                  Re: How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 08:39 -0700
              Re: How do we create 2D space? 7 <7@enemygadgets.com> - 2016-05-08 17:01 +0000
                Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 18:10 +0200
      Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 15:59 +0200
        Re: How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 07:36 -0700
          Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 16:52 +0200
    Re: How do we create 2D space? omnilobe@gmail.com - 2016-05-08 10:00 -0700
      Re: How do we create 2D space? "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 11:40 -0700
    Re: How do we create 2D space? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 12:41 -0500
      Re: How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 11:26 -0700
        Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 23:06 +0200
          Re: How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 14:24 -0700
            Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 23:35 +0200
            Re: How do we create 2D space? HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 16:54 -0700
              Re: How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 17:03 -0700
              Re: How do we create 2D space? benj <nobodyxx@gmail> - 2016-05-09 00:09 -0400
                Re: How do we create 2D space? HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 04:07 -0700
                  Re: How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 05:58 -0700
                    Re: How do we create 2D space? HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 06:18 -0700
                    Re: How do we create 2D space? Poutnik Fornntp <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 06:26 -0700
                  Re: How do we create 2D space? benj <nobodyxx@gmail> - 2016-05-09 11:51 -0400
                    Re: How do we create 2D space? HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 09:53 -0700
                      Re: How do we create 2D space? john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 10:10 -0700
                        Re: How do we create 2D space? HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2016-05-09 10:20 -0700
                          Re: How do we create 2D space? benj <nobodyxx@gmail> - 2016-05-09 14:35 -0400
                      Re: How do we create 2D space? benj <nobodyxx@gmail> - 2016-05-09 14:31 -0400
    Re: How do we create 2D space? "nuny@bid.nes" <Alien8752@gmail.com> - 2016-05-08 16:46 -0700
    Re: How do we create 2D space? Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2016-05-09 16:24 -0700

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#576452 — How do we create 2D space?

How do we create 2D space?
--------------------------

To create a genuine 2D space in 3D space
the biggest problem is how to constrain it so that it would
require infinite energy to jump out of the plane
to make it stable.


This then sheds light on 3D spaces.

To jump out of a 3D plane into another 3D plane requires infinite energy.

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#576462

There.
Is.
No.
Such.
Thing.
As.
2D.
ANYTHING!!

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#576464

john wrote:

> There.
> Is.
> No.
> Such.
> Thing.
> As.
> 2D.
> ANYTHING!!


So how do you know this and how
do you create this object that
isn't anything?

How big does a sheet of paper have
to be before it is considered infinite any way?

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#576470

Dne 08/05/2016 v 16:57 7 napsal(a):
> 
> So how do you know this and how
> do you create this object that
> isn't anything?
> 
> How big does a sheet of paper have
> to be before it is considered infinite any way?
> 
It depends what you consider infinite.

2D natural space of Earth surface is

FINITE,   as there is finite maximum distance of 2 points.
INFINITE, as you cannot reach the Earth end.

Note that early mediaval sailors
thought Atlantic ocean has an abyss edge on the far west.

-- 
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )
Knowledge makes great men humble, but small men arrogant.

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#576473

Poutnik wrote:

> Dne 08/05/2016 v 16:57 7 napsal(a):
>> 
>> So how do you know this and how
>> do you create this object that
>> isn't anything?
>> 
>> How big does a sheet of paper have
>> to be before it is considered infinite any way?
>> 
> It depends what you consider infinite.

In order for a plane to be planar and
infinite and stable, it needs to be surrounded by
a high energy barrier that prevents anything
from hopping out of it.

For a spherical 'infinite' object, parallel
lines drawn on it will always meet.
So its not infinite or planar as we scale up
the geometries, but it is stable.

So the 2D planar sheets are curious - they need infinite
energy above and below the plane to prevent anything
tunnelling into another plane, and it needs to be
infinitely big in order for it to be stable.

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#576482

Dne 08/05/2016 v 17:35 7 napsal(a):
> Poutnik wrote:

>>>
>> It depends what you consider infinite.
> 
> In order for a plane to be planar and
> infinite and stable, it needs to be surrounded by
> a high energy barrier that prevents anything
> from hopping out of it.

But spaces need not to be Euclidean,
and often are not.
> 
> For a spherical 'infinite' object, parallel
> lines drawn on it will always meet.

sure/

> So its not infinite or planar as we scale up
> the geometries, but it is stable.

Finite objects have their ends, infinite do not.
spherical 2D space does not have end.

> 
> So the 2D planar sheets are curious - they need infinite
> energy above and below the plane to prevent anything
> tunnelling into another plane, and it needs to be
> infinitely big in order for it to be stable.
> 
It has nothing to do with energy.

-- 
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )
Knowledge makes great men humble, but small men arrogant.

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#576483

You guys are so messed up
about dimensions.
Yes, 2D can be REPRESENTED.
So can 1D.
And other Ds can be manipulated by math.

Reality is made exclusively from 3D.

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#576488

Dne 08/05/2016 v 17:03 john napsal(a):
> You guys are so messed up
> about dimensions.
> Yes, 2D can be REPRESENTED.
> So can 1D.
> And other Ds can be manipulated by math.
> 
> Reality is made exclusively from 3D.
> 
No, it just means you need 3 coordinates
to describe the location, generally, and in everyday live.

But that is a trap for thinking of messed up guys,
when things are not really like in everyday life.

-- 
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )
Knowledge makes great men humble, but small men arrogant.

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#576494

Matter needs a location.
No location, no matter.
Yes, there is Time.
There is always Time.
Atoms cycle every 10^-16 seconds.
Galaxies cycle every 225 million years,
)which is about 10^15 seconds.)
Galaxies are 10^31 times bigger.
Time is relative.

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#576498

Poutnik wrote:

> Dne 08/05/2016 v 17:35 7 napsal(a):
>> Poutnik wrote:
> 
>>>>
>>> It depends what you consider infinite.
>> 
>> In order for a plane to be planar and
>> infinite and stable, it needs to be surrounded by
>> a high energy barrier that prevents anything
>> from hopping out of it.
> 
> But spaces need not to be Euclidean,
> and often are not.
>> 
>> For a spherical 'infinite' object, parallel
>> lines drawn on it will always meet.
> 
> sure/
> 
>> So its not infinite or planar as we scale up
>> the geometries, but it is stable.
> 
> Finite objects have their ends, infinite do not.
> spherical 2D space does not have end.
> 
>> 
>> So the 2D planar sheets are curious - they need infinite
>> energy above and below the plane to prevent anything
>> tunnelling into another plane, and it needs to be
>> infinitely big in order for it to be stable.
>> 
> It has nothing to do with energy.

Yes it would do, otherwise, even if simple
object gained some energy it would escape the two dimensions
allotted to it. There has to be a very large energy barrier
to prevent objects tunnelling out of the 2D space and dissipating.

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#576499

Dne 08/05/2016 v 19:01 7 napsal(a):

> Yes it would do, otherwise, even if simple
> object gained some energy it would escape the two dimensions
> allotted to it. There has to be a very large energy barrier
> to prevent objects tunnelling out of the 2D space and dissipating.
> 

Dimensions are not part of reality,
but part of our model describing it.

-- 
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )
Knowledge makes great men humble, but small men arrogant.

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#576465

Dne 08/05/2016 v 15:54 john napsal(a):
> There.
> Is.
> No.
> Such.
> Thing.
> As.
> 2D.
> ANYTHING!!
> 

Well, do the sailors need to determine
2 or 3 independent coordinates know their location ?

-- 
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )
Knowledge makes great men humble, but small men arrogant.

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#576474

Anything 2D has zero depth and
is therefore imaginary.

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#576480

Dne 08/05/2016 v 16:36 john napsal(a):
> Anything 2D has zero depth and
> is therefore imaginary.

2D object does not have depth,
therefore cannot have zero depth.

Whatever what needs N coordinates
to determine its location
is placed in N dimensional space.

-- 
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )
Knowledge makes great men humble, but small men arrogant.

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#576501

On Sunday, May 8, 2016 at 3:24:14 AM UTC-10, 7 wrote:
> How do we create 2D space?
> --------------------------
> 
> To create a genuine 2D space in 3D space
> the biggest problem is how to constrain it so that it would
> require infinite energy to jump out of the plane
> to make it stable.

We can recognize a 3D space for a gravity continuum plus 1 time dimension, and then define an Electricity Continuum that has one space dimension sent from each proton to a neutron. This leaves a 2D space making the wave function to a paired electron, plus one time-like dimension from the electron to the proton. Experiments indicate this is true. The Right Hand Rule of magnetism is because of 2D space counterflowing with a 1D magnetyme.

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#576803

On Sunday, May 8, 2016 at 10:00:32 AM UTC-7, omni...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Sunday, May 8, 2016 at 3:24:14 AM UTC-10, 7 wrote:
> > How do we create 2D space?
> > --------------------------
> > 
> > To create a genuine 2D space in 3D space
> > the biggest problem is how to constrain it so that it would
> > require infinite energy to jump out of the plane
> > to make it stable.
> 
> We can recognize a 3D space for a gravity continuum plus 1 time dimension, and then define an Electricity Continuum that has one space dimension sent from each proton to a neutron. This leaves a 2D space making the wave function to a paired electron, plus one time-like dimension from the electron to the proton. Experiments indicate this is true. The Right Hand Rule of magnetism is because of 2D space counterflowing with a 1D magnetyme.

Skating on ice,and falling flat on your face.TreBert

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#576506

On 5/8/16 8:24 AM, 7 wrote:
> To create a genuine 2D space in 3D space
> the biggest problem is how to constrain it so that it would
> require infinite energy to jump out of the plane
> to make it stable.


   The surface of a sphere is 2D with no energy required to make it so.
   Staying on the surface of the earth while walking (not jumping) is
   stable.



-- 

sci.physics is an unmoderated newsgroup dedicated
to the discussion of physics, news from the physics
community, and physics-related social issues.

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#576515

You are confused about dimensions.
And "surfaces".
Like Odd.

A "surface" is a transition zone between 
two different expressions of Space.
There is no "2D" about it.

The only "2D" is in your imagination 

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#576544

Dne 08/05/2016 v 20:26 john napsal(a):
> You are confused about dimensions.
> And "surfaces".
> Like Odd.

Or the opposite.
> 
> A "surface" is a transition zone between 
> two different expressions of Space.

Surface has no depth, ( i.e. not even zero depth ),
so it cannot be transition zone.

> There is no "2D" about it.
> The only "2D" is in your imagination 

Like 2 dimensions to describe position of the surface ?
2D = 2 dimensions.
2D = 3 dimensions.


-- 
Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer )
Knowledge makes great men humble, but small men arrogant.

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#576547

Yes, you can APPROXIMATE
a surface.
In reality there is no such thing.

A TREE LINE looks like a line from
a distance. It is not. It is trees and
clumps of trees and then all trees.
Surfaces are just like that.

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