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raining bullets

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  raining bullets RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2015-10-30 16:50 -0700
    Re: raining bullets R Kym Horsell <kym@kymhorsell.com> - 2015-10-31 00:10 +0000
    Re: raining bullets Fabian Russell <root@localhost.localdomain> - 2015-10-31 00:38 +0000
    Re: raining bullets jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com - 2015-10-31 00:40 +0000
      Re: raining bullets Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 20:13 -0500
        Re: raining bullets benj <nobody@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 21:39 -0400
        Re: raining bullets jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com - 2015-10-31 02:19 +0000
          Re: raining bullets Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 21:39 -0500
            Re: raining bullets jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com - 2015-10-31 03:38 +0000
    Re: raining bullets "reber g=emc^2" <herbertglazier0@gmail.com> - 2015-10-31 13:02 -0700
      Re: raining bullets Double-A <double-a3@hush.com> - 2015-11-01 13:46 -0800

#529291 — raining bullets

In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate 
it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.

But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.  
Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?  
Assume .38 Special, if it matters.


--
Rich

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#529294

RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:
> In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate 
> it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
> But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.  
> Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?  
> Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
> --
> Rich


A simplified version is:
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/airfri2.html#c3

It depends critically on the angle. The 2nd safest is to fire
straight up so the falling bullet will actually reach terminal velocity
on the way down.
Obviously if you fire up at e.g. 45 deg angle you can hurt someone at the 
other end.

The difficult part is falling bullets aren't very good approximations of
spheres. They don't fall nose or tail down, but tumble end over end at
high speed and can be subject to a lot more drag than a same 
size/weight sphere.

To simplify the calculations, get rid of the 38 and use a scatter gun instead.

-- 
That's awkward: Temperatures near record high 
	for first "cold-weather" Super Bowl
SportingNews.com
2 Feb 2014
The National Weather Service said that temperatures for Sunday's NFL
title game at MetLife Stadium between the Denver Broncos and Seattle
Seahawks were 10 to 15 degrees above normal, and just nine degrees
below the record high of 62 set in 1973.

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#529299

On Fri, 30 Oct 2015 16:50:32 -0700, RichD wrote:

> at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?  
>.

A more common example would be bird shit (or, more accurately,
dinosaur shit).

Being in mass between a raindrop and hailstone or golfball, I would
guess a terminal velocity of 25 mph, but perhaps up to 40 mph.

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#529301

RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:
> In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate 
> it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
> 
> But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.  
> Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?  
> Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
> 
> --
> Rich

There are several things that matter.

It takes little thought to realize that bullets do not come down
at the same speed they went up.

The muzzle velocity of most handguns is just under 1.000 ft/sec and most
rifles around 2,300 ft/sec. Supersonic is 1,100 ft/sec. 

Once a bullet reaches apogee, it's vertical velocity is zero and the
only thing accerlating it is gravity, which means bullets, like everything
else, have a terminal velocity on the way down that is a function of
the drag and mass.

Bullets are spin stabilized so as to not tumble in flight.

If fired straight up, they are guaranteed to tumble on the way down.

At some angle less than straight up, they will not tumble and will
retain a lot velocity.

If they tumble, they have much greater drag.

Experiments have shown that the typical range of terminal velocities for
bullets is around 300 to 700 ft/sec.

After WWI, the US Army got concerned about the troops shooting into
the air at those new fangled airplanes and worried that the troops
might wind up shooting themselves in the process.

So in the 1920's a young junior officer named Hatcher, later General
Hatcher, was sent to a remote beach with troops, guns, and equipment.

They built a steel canopy for cover and built mounts to fire a variety
of guns, including rifles and machine guns straight up into the air.

After a little testing the exercise became a game to see if the troops
could catch the bullets in their helmets.

If you can find the whole story it is an interesting read.

I would not suggest anyone, well maybe one person, trying this at
home as a bullet at even 300 ft/sec would be a hell of a thump on
the head.



-- 
Jim Pennino

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#529308

On 10/30/15 7:40 PM, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
> RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate
>> it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
>>
>> But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.
>> Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?
>> Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
>>
>> --
>> Rich
>
> There are several things that matter.
>
> It takes little thought to realize that bullets do not come down
> at the same speed they went up.
>
> The muzzle velocity of most handguns is just under 1.000 ft/sec and most
> rifles around 2,300 ft/sec. Supersonic is 1,100 ft/sec.
>
> Once a bullet reaches apogee, it's vertical velocity is zero and the
> only thing accerlating it is gravity, which means bullets, like everything
> else, have a terminal velocity on the way down that is a function of
> the drag and mass.
>
> Bullets are spin stabilized so as to not tumble in flight.
>
> If fired straight up, they are guaranteed to tumble on the way down.
>
> At some angle less than straight up, they will not tumble and will
> retain a lot velocity.
>
> If they tumble, they have much greater drag.
>
> Experiments have shown that the typical range of terminal velocities for
> bullets is around 300 to 700 ft/sec.
>
> After WWI, the US Army got concerned about the troops shooting into
> the air at those new fangled airplanes and worried that the troops
> might wind up shooting themselves in the process.
>
> So in the 1920's a young junior officer named Hatcher, later General
> Hatcher, was sent to a remote beach with troops, guns, and equipment.
>
> They built a steel canopy for cover and built mounts to fire a variety
> of guns, including rifles and machine guns straight up into the air.
>
> After a little testing the exercise became a game to see if the troops
> could catch the bullets in their helmets.
>
> If you can find the whole story it is an interesting read.
>
> I would not suggest anyone, well maybe one person, trying this at
> home as a bullet at even 300 ft/sec would be a hell of a thump on
> the head.
>
>
>


   Gentlemanly response from the jimp. Good.





-- 

sci.physics is an unmoderated newsgroup dedicated
to the discussion of physics, news from the physics
community, and physics-related social issues.

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#529322

On 10/30/2015 09:13 PM, Sam Wormley wrote:
> On 10/30/15 7:40 PM, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>> RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate
>>> it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
>>>
>>> But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.
>>> Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?
>>> Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Rich
>>
>> There are several things that matter.
>>
>> It takes little thought to realize that bullets do not come down
>> at the same speed they went up.
>>
>> The muzzle velocity of most handguns is just under 1.000 ft/sec and most
>> rifles around 2,300 ft/sec. Supersonic is 1,100 ft/sec.
>>
>> Once a bullet reaches apogee, it's vertical velocity is zero and the
>> only thing accerlating it is gravity, which means bullets, like
>> everything
>> else, have a terminal velocity on the way down that is a function of
>> the drag and mass.
>>
>> Bullets are spin stabilized so as to not tumble in flight.
>>
>> If fired straight up, they are guaranteed to tumble on the way down.
>>
>> At some angle less than straight up, they will not tumble and will
>> retain a lot velocity.
>>
>> If they tumble, they have much greater drag.
>>
>> Experiments have shown that the typical range of terminal velocities for
>> bullets is around 300 to 700 ft/sec.
>>
>> After WWI, the US Army got concerned about the troops shooting into
>> the air at those new fangled airplanes and worried that the troops
>> might wind up shooting themselves in the process.
>>
>> So in the 1920's a young junior officer named Hatcher, later General
>> Hatcher, was sent to a remote beach with troops, guns, and equipment.
>>
>> They built a steel canopy for cover and built mounts to fire a variety
>> of guns, including rifles and machine guns straight up into the air.
>>
>> After a little testing the exercise became a game to see if the troops
>> could catch the bullets in their helmets.
>>
>> If you can find the whole story it is an interesting read.
>>
>> I would not suggest anyone, well maybe one person, trying this at
>> home as a bullet at even 300 ft/sec would be a hell of a thump on
>> the head.

>    Gentlemanly response from the jimp. Good.

People get shot all the time in the Middle East where it's common 
practice to fire rifles in the air to celebrate this or that! They seem 
to think that once the bullets go up they disappear!

Sam did you ever consider moving closer to Syria to help Obama with his 
leftist policies?

-- 
         ___           ___           ___            ___
        /\  \         /\  \         /\__\          /\  \
       /::\  \       /::\  \       /::|  |         \:\  \
      /:/\:\  \     /:/\:\  \     /:|:|  |     ___ /::\__\
     /::\~\:\__\   /::\~\:\  \   /:/|:|  |__  /\  /:/\/__/
    /:/\:\ \:|__| /:/\:\ \:\__\ /:/ |:| /\__\ \:\/:/  /
    \:\~\:\/:/  / \:\~\:\ \/__/ \/__|:|/:/  /  \::/  /
     \:\ \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\       |:/:/  /    \/__/
      \:\/:/  /     \:\ \/__/       |::/  /
       \_:/__/       \:\__\         /:/  /
                      \/__/         \/__/

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#529346

Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 10/30/15 7:40 PM, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>> RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate
>>> it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
>>>
>>> But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.
>>> Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?
>>> Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Rich
>>
>> There are several things that matter.
>>
>> It takes little thought to realize that bullets do not come down
>> at the same speed they went up.
>>
>> The muzzle velocity of most handguns is just under 1.000 ft/sec and most
>> rifles around 2,300 ft/sec. Supersonic is 1,100 ft/sec.
>>
>> Once a bullet reaches apogee, it's vertical velocity is zero and the
>> only thing accerlating it is gravity, which means bullets, like everything
>> else, have a terminal velocity on the way down that is a function of
>> the drag and mass.
>>
>> Bullets are spin stabilized so as to not tumble in flight.
>>
>> If fired straight up, they are guaranteed to tumble on the way down.
>>
>> At some angle less than straight up, they will not tumble and will
>> retain a lot velocity.
>>
>> If they tumble, they have much greater drag.
>>
>> Experiments have shown that the typical range of terminal velocities for
>> bullets is around 300 to 700 ft/sec.
>>
>> After WWI, the US Army got concerned about the troops shooting into
>> the air at those new fangled airplanes and worried that the troops
>> might wind up shooting themselves in the process.
>>
>> So in the 1920's a young junior officer named Hatcher, later General
>> Hatcher, was sent to a remote beach with troops, guns, and equipment.
>>
>> They built a steel canopy for cover and built mounts to fire a variety
>> of guns, including rifles and machine guns straight up into the air.
>>
>> After a little testing the exercise became a game to see if the troops
>> could catch the bullets in their helmets.
>>
>> If you can find the whole story it is an interesting read.
>>
>> I would not suggest anyone, well maybe one person, trying this at
>> home as a bullet at even 300 ft/sec would be a hell of a thump on
>> the head.
>>
>>
>>
> 
> 
>   Gentlemanly response from the jimp. Good.

Have you ever wondered why you are the only person who thinks I am
angry with them, spamming piece of shit?

-- 
Jim Pennino

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#529356

On 10/30/15 9:19 PM, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
> Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 10/30/15 7:40 PM, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>>> RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate
>>>> it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
>>>>
>>>> But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.
>>>> Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?
>>>> Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Rich
>>>
>>> There are several things that matter.
>>>
>>> It takes little thought to realize that bullets do not come down
>>> at the same speed they went up.
>>>
>>> The muzzle velocity of most handguns is just under 1.000 ft/sec and most
>>> rifles around 2,300 ft/sec. Supersonic is 1,100 ft/sec.
>>>
>>> Once a bullet reaches apogee, it's vertical velocity is zero and the
>>> only thing accerlating it is gravity, which means bullets, like everything
>>> else, have a terminal velocity on the way down that is a function of
>>> the drag and mass.
>>>
>>> Bullets are spin stabilized so as to not tumble in flight.
>>>
>>> If fired straight up, they are guaranteed to tumble on the way down.
>>>
>>> At some angle less than straight up, they will not tumble and will
>>> retain a lot velocity.
>>>
>>> If they tumble, they have much greater drag.
>>>
>>> Experiments have shown that the typical range of terminal velocities for
>>> bullets is around 300 to 700 ft/sec.
>>>
>>> After WWI, the US Army got concerned about the troops shooting into
>>> the air at those new fangled airplanes and worried that the troops
>>> might wind up shooting themselves in the process.
>>>
>>> So in the 1920's a young junior officer named Hatcher, later General
>>> Hatcher, was sent to a remote beach with troops, guns, and equipment.
>>>
>>> They built a steel canopy for cover and built mounts to fire a variety
>>> of guns, including rifles and machine guns straight up into the air.
>>>
>>> After a little testing the exercise became a game to see if the troops
>>> could catch the bullets in their helmets.
>>>
>>> If you can find the whole story it is an interesting read.
>>>
>>> I would not suggest anyone, well maybe one person, trying this at
>>> home as a bullet at even 300 ft/sec would be a hell of a thump on
>>> the head.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>    Gentlemanly response from the jimp. Good.
>
> Have you ever wondered why you are the only person who thinks I am
> angry with them, spamming piece of shit?
>

   Oops, you blew it, jimp! Inappropriate language.

   Name callers like jimp, can greatly benefit from these anger
   management classes.
 > http://yellowpages.com/rancho-cucamonga-ca/anger-management-classes


-- 

sci.physics is an unmoderated newsgroup dedicated
to the discussion of physics, news from the physics
community, and physics-related social issues.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#529378

Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 10/30/15 9:19 PM, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>> Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 10/30/15 7:40 PM, jimp@specsol.spam.sux.com wrote:
>>>> RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>> In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate
>>>>> it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
>>>>>
>>>>> But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.
>>>>> Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?
>>>>> Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Rich
>>>>
>>>> There are several things that matter.
>>>>
>>>> It takes little thought to realize that bullets do not come down
>>>> at the same speed they went up.
>>>>
>>>> The muzzle velocity of most handguns is just under 1.000 ft/sec and most
>>>> rifles around 2,300 ft/sec. Supersonic is 1,100 ft/sec.
>>>>
>>>> Once a bullet reaches apogee, it's vertical velocity is zero and the
>>>> only thing accerlating it is gravity, which means bullets, like everything
>>>> else, have a terminal velocity on the way down that is a function of
>>>> the drag and mass.
>>>>
>>>> Bullets are spin stabilized so as to not tumble in flight.
>>>>
>>>> If fired straight up, they are guaranteed to tumble on the way down.
>>>>
>>>> At some angle less than straight up, they will not tumble and will
>>>> retain a lot velocity.
>>>>
>>>> If they tumble, they have much greater drag.
>>>>
>>>> Experiments have shown that the typical range of terminal velocities for
>>>> bullets is around 300 to 700 ft/sec.
>>>>
>>>> After WWI, the US Army got concerned about the troops shooting into
>>>> the air at those new fangled airplanes and worried that the troops
>>>> might wind up shooting themselves in the process.
>>>>
>>>> So in the 1920's a young junior officer named Hatcher, later General
>>>> Hatcher, was sent to a remote beach with troops, guns, and equipment.
>>>>
>>>> They built a steel canopy for cover and built mounts to fire a variety
>>>> of guns, including rifles and machine guns straight up into the air.
>>>>
>>>> After a little testing the exercise became a game to see if the troops
>>>> could catch the bullets in their helmets.
>>>>
>>>> If you can find the whole story it is an interesting read.
>>>>
>>>> I would not suggest anyone, well maybe one person, trying this at
>>>> home as a bullet at even 300 ft/sec would be a hell of a thump on
>>>> the head.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>    Gentlemanly response from the jimp. Good.
>>
>> Have you ever wondered why you are the only person who thinks I am
>> angry with them, spamming piece of shit?
>>
> 
>   Oops, you blew it, jimp!

Nope, I called a spamming shit head a spamming shit head; right on
the money with that one.


-- 
Jim Pennino

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#529495

On Friday, October 30, 2015 at 4:50:36 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote:
> In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate 
> it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
> 
> But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.  
> Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?  
> Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
> 
> 
> --
> Rich

Hit by bullet from gun kills Bullet falling from 5,000 feet can hurt.TreBert

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#529780

On Saturday, October 31, 2015 at 1:03:02 PM UTC-7, reber g=emc^2 wrote:
> On Friday, October 30, 2015 at 4:50:36 PM UTC-7, RichD wrote:
> > In Physics 101, they teach that a bullet falls at the same rate 
> > it rises, it's gravity etc.  Hence laws against firing into the sky.
> > 
> > But in the real world, there's air resistance, in both directions.  
> > Question:  at what speed does a bullet actually hit the earth?  
> > Assume .38 Special, if it matters.
> > 
> > 
> > --
> > Rich
> 
> Hit by bullet from gun kills Bullet falling from 5,000 feet can hurt.TreBert


I once fired a bullet from a 22 riffle straight up and waited to see how long it took to come down.  When it did, I could hear it dropping through the leaves of nearby trees.  Don't remember anymore how long it took.  I can't believe I was so reckless when I was young!

Double-A

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