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Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #479238 > unrolled thread

What is a field?

Started bykenseto <setoken@att.net>
First post2018-12-07 06:08 -0800
Last post2018-12-15 19:51 -0800
Articles 20 on this page of 158 — 14 participants

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Contents

  What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-07 06:08 -0800
    Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-07 16:58 +0000
      Re: What is a field? paulcardinale0@gmail.com - 2018-12-07 11:58 -0800
      Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 06:05 -0800
        Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 14:13 +0000
    Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-07 11:39 -0800
      Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 06:28 -0800
        Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 15:35 +0000
          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 10:33 -0800
            Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 10:43 -0800
            Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 19:15 +0000
        Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-08 17:52 +0000
          Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 18:21 +0000
          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 10:26 -0800
            Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-08 18:37 +0000
            Re: What is a field? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-12-08 20:18 +0100
              Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 19:56 +0000
                Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 21:51 -0800
                Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-09 08:20 -0800
                  Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 12:44 -0800
                  Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 22:20 +0000
                    Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-10 08:04 -0800
                      Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 10:31 -0800
                        Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-10 13:33 -0800
                          Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 13:53 -0800
                            Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-11 06:16 -0800
                              Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-11 14:41 +0000
                          Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 22:00 +0000
                            Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 14:13 -0800
                              Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 23:03 +0000
                                Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 15:46 -0800
                                  Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-11 01:37 +0000
                                Re: What is a field? Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog <prokaryotic.caspase.homolog@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 16:26 -0800
                                Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-11 07:32 -0800
                                  Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 13:53 +0000
                                    Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-13 07:27 -0800
                              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-11 07:27 -0800
                                Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-11 16:00 +0000
                      Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 21:56 +0000
                        Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-11 06:51 -0800
                          Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-11 18:42 +0000
                            Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-11 18:09 -0800
                              Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-11 20:18 -0800
                              Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 13:53 +0000
                                Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-13 07:21 -0800
                                  Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 18:32 +0000
                                    Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-13 13:20 -0800
                                      Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 21:46 +0000
                                  Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 10:47 -0800
                                    Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-14 05:35 +0000
                                    Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-14 15:13 -0800
                                      Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-14 15:22 -0800
                                        Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-15 14:05 -0800
                                          Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-15 23:27 -0800
                    Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 13:04 -0500
              Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:30 -0500
              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-09 08:12 -0800
                Re: What is a field? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-12-09 17:19 +0100
            Re: What is a field? Rich Carpenter <lcug@kigcohc.pa> - 2018-12-09 00:32 +0000
        Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 10:42 -0800
          Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 19:15 +0000
            Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:29 -0500
              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-10 06:18 -0800
                Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 07:26 -0800
                  Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-10 08:11 -0800
                    Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-10 17:07 +0000
                    Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 22:00 +0000
                      Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-11 07:14 -0800
                        Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-11 18:42 +0000
                          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-12 04:56 -0800
                            Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 13:53 +0000
          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-09 07:54 -0800
            Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-09 07:58 -0800
            Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 22:20 +0000
              Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 13:00 -0500
                Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 18:14 +0000
                  Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 10:59 -0500
                    Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-13 08:51 -0800
                    Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 18:32 +0000
                      Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-13 13:23 -0800
                        Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 21:46 +0000
                          Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 23:36 +0000
                            Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 20:06 -0500
                              Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-14 12:21 +0000
                          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-14 15:16 -0800
                            Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-15 02:14 +0000
                      Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 19:53 -0500
                        Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-14 12:21 +0000
                Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 10:38 -0800
    Re: What is a field? mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-12-07 12:48 -0800
      Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-07 12:51 -0800
        Re: What is a field? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 12:22 -0800
          Re: What is a field? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-12-08 22:05 +0100
            Re: What is a field? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 16:24 -0800
          Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:46 -0500
            Re: What is a field? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 22:41 -0800
              Re: What is a field? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 14:08 -0800
                Re: What is a field? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 14:44 -0800
                  Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 13:36 -0500
          Re: What is a field? JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 21:56 -0800
            Re: What is a field? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 22:54 -0800
              Re: What is a field? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:22 -0800
                Re: What is a field? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 12:35 -0800
    Re: What is a field? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-12-07 22:01 +0100
      Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 06:42 -0800
        Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 15:35 +0000
          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 10:21 -0800
            Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 19:15 +0000
              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 14:17 -0800
                Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 22:42 +0000
                  Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 14:58 -0800
                    Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-09 01:22 +0000
                    Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 13:07 +0000
              Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:26 -0500
                Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 13:07 +0000
          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 10:27 -0800
            Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 19:15 +0000
            Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:23 -0500
              Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 13:07 +0000
              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-09 14:19 -0800
                Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 22:25 +0000
                  Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-10 07:54 -0800
                    Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-10 17:15 +0000
                    Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 21:41 +0000
                  Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 13:14 -0500
                    Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 18:18 +0000
        Re: What is a field? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-12-08 20:09 +0100
          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 14:28 -0800
            Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 22:42 +0000
              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 14:56 -0800
                Re: What is a field? Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@notmail.com> - 2018-12-09 00:06 +0100
                Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 00:13 +0000
                  Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:44 -0500
                  Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-09 09:19 -0800
                    Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 22:22 +0000
                      Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-10 07:50 -0800
                        Re: What is a field? moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-12-10 17:09 +0000
                        Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 21:41 +0000
              Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:37 -0500
                Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 13:07 +0000
              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-09 08:40 -0800
                Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-09 22:22 +0000
                  Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-10 08:07 -0800
                    Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-10 21:56 +0000
                      Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-11 07:07 -0800
                        Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-11 18:42 +0000
                          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-11 18:19 -0800
                            Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-12 13:53 +0000
                              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-13 07:54 -0800
                                Re: What is a field? Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-12-13 18:32 +0000
            Re: What is a field? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-12-09 01:24 +0100
              Re: What is a field? benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-12-08 23:42 -0500
              Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-09 10:08 -0800
                Re: What is a field? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-12-09 19:36 +0100
          Re: What is a field? kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-12-08 14:43 -0800
            Re: What is a field? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-12-09 11:51 +0100
    Re: What is a field? carleto4157990662@gmail.com - 2018-12-07 13:42 -0800
    Re: What is a field? "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid_chris_thomasson@invalid.invalid> - 2018-12-15 19:51 -0800

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#479437

From"Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-08 22:54 -0800
Message-ID<f50269e7-ab63-4316-b214-cd6a33b142eb@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479434
On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 9:56:58 PM UTC-8, JanPB wrote:
> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 12:22:30 PM UTC-8, Ross A. Finlayson wrote:
> > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 12:51:33 PM UTC-8, JanPB wrote:
> > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 12:48:40 PM UTC-8, mitchr...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 6:08:50 AM UTC-8, kenseto wrote:
> > > > > According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space, something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> > > > > 
> > > > > This suggests that space is some sort of solid body--the aether?
> > > > > 
> > > > > Based on this, I developed a structured and elastic aether called the E-Matrix that fits Weinberg’s definition of the field. The E-Matrix leads to the development of a theory of everything called Model Mechanics. The main features of Mode lMechanics are as follows:
> > > > > 
> > > > > It offers realistic processes for the origin of all visible matters. 
> > > > > It explains the cell division and the consciousness processes.
> > > > > It provides a mechanism to amalgamate all the forces of nature. 
> > > > > It can be validated experimentally. 
> > > > > It gives rise to an Improved Relativity Theory (IRT). 
> > > > > It gives rise to a new theory of gravity called Doppler Theory of Gravity (DTG)
> > > > > It includes Special Theory of Relativity and General Theory of Relativity as subsets.
> > > > > It provides physical models for all the math of Quantum Mechanics.
> > > > > It postulates a new repulsive fifth force identified as the CRE force.
> > > > > It gives a physical explanation for the charge of a particle.
> > > > > It gives physical explanations all the weird results of all quantum experiments. 
> > > > > It explains the structures of atoms. 
> > > > > 
> > > > > A book on Model Mechanics is available in the following link:
> > > > > http://www.modelmechanics.org/2016ibook.pdf
> > > > 
> > > > Fields are the mathematical like.
> > > 
> > > Basically, yes. To read anything MORE into them is only justified on a
> > > case by case basis.
> > > 
> > > --
> > > Jan
> > 
> > Fields are mathematical vector spaces with usually 
> > but not necessarily continuous (i.e. smooth) 
> > gradiations in values associated with each point 
> > of the vector space.
> 
> Well, "continuous" and "smooth" are different things (although the latter
> implies the former). And fields don't have to be continuous, see e.g. the
> classical case of the E field across a surface charge.
> 
> > Eg:  "Higgs field", not a field, "Higgs classical 
> > field", a field.
> > 
> > I.e., a physics' "field" is not a mathematics' "field", 
> > (though a mathematics' field is a trivial and zero-ed 
> > out physics' field).
> > 
> > A physics' field basically reflect quantities as 
> > throughout a continuous (smooth) manifold, and 
> > for some inclusive definition of "continuous", 
> > "continuous" suffices (for smooth).
> 
> Too garbled to comment in detail...
> 
> --
> Jan

It's not much comment.

A scalar field basically defines regions by 
their connectedness.

Of course, all of physics scalar fields: are 
not having any be everywhere discontinuous, 
that exist, where most of "mathematics' scalar 
fields" are mostly everywhere discontinuous 
(the manifold defined by the scalar part), 
i.e., they're without "example in the physical 
interpretation".

You need not excuse me, this isn't particularly 
strident and not any particular claim, i.e. this 
is simple enough bread-and-butter, but then about 
Higgs as the interface of the high-energy particle 
experiment that otherwise is no different than the 
standard particles having mass themselves as their 
state as why they have mass, except in the high 
energy that they would split, the Higgs boson as 
"the last particle in the Standard Model" is also 
the first one outside.

It would seem more relevant to have that as a manner 
of speaking than "bigger and bigger bosons forever":
"the Standard Model is dead, long live the Standard Model".

It's kind of like talking about "Gravity" in "GR":
what gravity?  The standard model ("of particle physics") 
is the particle physicists', then for notions like these 
days' supergravity (a particle theory) for quantum gravity 
to be explaining what Einstein referred to as the 
"total field" or what some might call Mach-ian.


[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#479443

From"Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-08 23:22 -0800
Message-ID<80b2627d-69b6-4564-b571-18539df27eb7@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479437
On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:54:54 PM UTC-8, Ross A. Finlayson wrote:
> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 9:56:58 PM UTC-8, JanPB wrote:
> > On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 12:22:30 PM UTC-8, Ross A. Finlayson wrote:
> > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 12:51:33 PM UTC-8, JanPB wrote:
> > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 12:48:40 PM UTC-8, mitchr...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 6:08:50 AM UTC-8, kenseto wrote:
> > > > > > According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space, something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > This suggests that space is some sort of solid body--the aether?
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Based on this, I developed a structured and elastic aether called the E-Matrix that fits Weinberg’s definition of the field. The E-Matrix leads to the development of a theory of everything called Model Mechanics. The main features of Mode lMechanics are as follows:
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > It offers realistic processes for the origin of all visible matters. 
> > > > > > It explains the cell division and the consciousness processes.
> > > > > > It provides a mechanism to amalgamate all the forces of nature. 
> > > > > > It can be validated experimentally. 
> > > > > > It gives rise to an Improved Relativity Theory (IRT). 
> > > > > > It gives rise to a new theory of gravity called Doppler Theory of Gravity (DTG)
> > > > > > It includes Special Theory of Relativity and General Theory of Relativity as subsets.
> > > > > > It provides physical models for all the math of Quantum Mechanics.
> > > > > > It postulates a new repulsive fifth force identified as the CRE force.
> > > > > > It gives a physical explanation for the charge of a particle.
> > > > > > It gives physical explanations all the weird results of all quantum experiments. 
> > > > > > It explains the structures of atoms. 
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > A book on Model Mechanics is available in the following link:
> > > > > > http://www.modelmechanics.org/2016ibook.pdf
> > > > > 
> > > > > Fields are the mathematical like.
> > > > 
> > > > Basically, yes. To read anything MORE into them is only justified on a
> > > > case by case basis.
> > > > 
> > > > --
> > > > Jan
> > > 
> > > Fields are mathematical vector spaces with usually 
> > > but not necessarily continuous (i.e. smooth) 
> > > gradiations in values associated with each point 
> > > of the vector space.
> > 
> > Well, "continuous" and "smooth" are different things (although the latter
> > implies the former). And fields don't have to be continuous, see e.g. the
> > classical case of the E field across a surface charge.
> > 
> > > Eg:  "Higgs field", not a field, "Higgs classical 
> > > field", a field.
> > > 
> > > I.e., a physics' "field" is not a mathematics' "field", 
> > > (though a mathematics' field is a trivial and zero-ed 
> > > out physics' field).
> > > 
> > > A physics' field basically reflect quantities as 
> > > throughout a continuous (smooth) manifold, and 
> > > for some inclusive definition of "continuous", 
> > > "continuous" suffices (for smooth).
> > 
> > Too garbled to comment in detail...
> > 
> > --
> > Jan
> 
> It's not much comment.
> 
> A scalar field basically defines regions by 
> their connectedness.
> 
> Of course, all of physics scalar fields: are 
> not having any be everywhere discontinuous, 
> that exist, where most of "mathematics' scalar 
> fields" are mostly everywhere discontinuous 
> (the manifold defined by the scalar part), 
> i.e., they're without "example in the physical 
> interpretation".
> 
> You need not excuse me, this isn't particularly 
> strident and not any particular claim, i.e. this 
> is simple enough bread-and-butter, but then about 
> Higgs as the interface of the high-energy particle 
> experiment that otherwise is no different than the 
> standard particles having mass themselves as their 
> state as why they have mass, except in the high 
> energy that they would split, the Higgs boson as 
> "the last particle in the Standard Model" is also 
> the first one outside.
> 
> It would seem more relevant to have that as a manner 
> of speaking than "bigger and bigger bosons forever":
> "the Standard Model is dead, long live the Standard Model".
> 
> It's kind of like talking about "Gravity" in "GR":
> what gravity?  The standard model ("of particle physics") 
> is the particle physicists', then for notions like these 
> days' supergravity (a particle theory) for quantum gravity 
> to be explaining what Einstein referred to as the 
> "total field" or what some might call Mach-ian.

Here is some reading from Kevin Brown's "Reflections on Relativity", 
"The Field of All Fields": https://www.mathpages.com/rr/s4-06/4-06.htm .

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#479494

From"Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-09 12:35 -0800
Message-ID<8eceb9f3-ad07-4a1f-a611-b10b7b930c10@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479443
On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 11:42:08 PM UTC-8, Ross A. Finlayson wrote:
> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:54:54 PM UTC-8, Ross A. Finlayson wrote:
> > On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 9:56:58 PM UTC-8, JanPB wrote:
> > > On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 12:22:30 PM UTC-8, Ross A. Finlayson wrote:
> > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 12:51:33 PM UTC-8, JanPB wrote:
> > > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 12:48:40 PM UTC-8, mitchr...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 6:08:50 AM UTC-8, kenseto wrote:
> > > > > > > According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space, something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > This suggests that space is some sort of solid body--the aether?
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > Based on this, I developed a structured and elastic aether called the E-Matrix that fits Weinberg’s definition of the field. The E-Matrix leads to the development of a theory of everything called Model Mechanics. The main features of Mode lMechanics are as follows:
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > It offers realistic processes for the origin of all visible matters. 
> > > > > > > It explains the cell division and the consciousness processes.
> > > > > > > It provides a mechanism to amalgamate all the forces of nature. 
> > > > > > > It can be validated experimentally. 
> > > > > > > It gives rise to an Improved Relativity Theory (IRT). 
> > > > > > > It gives rise to a new theory of gravity called Doppler Theory of Gravity (DTG)
> > > > > > > It includes Special Theory of Relativity and General Theory of Relativity as subsets.
> > > > > > > It provides physical models for all the math of Quantum Mechanics.
> > > > > > > It postulates a new repulsive fifth force identified as the CRE force.
> > > > > > > It gives a physical explanation for the charge of a particle.
> > > > > > > It gives physical explanations all the weird results of all quantum experiments. 
> > > > > > > It explains the structures of atoms. 
> > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > A book on Model Mechanics is available in the following link:
> > > > > > > http://www.modelmechanics.org/2016ibook.pdf
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Fields are the mathematical like.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Basically, yes. To read anything MORE into them is only justified on a
> > > > > case by case basis.
> > > > > 
> > > > > --
> > > > > Jan
> > > > 
> > > > Fields are mathematical vector spaces with usually 
> > > > but not necessarily continuous (i.e. smooth) 
> > > > gradiations in values associated with each point 
> > > > of the vector space.
> > > 
> > > Well, "continuous" and "smooth" are different things (although the latter
> > > implies the former). And fields don't have to be continuous, see e.g. the
> > > classical case of the E field across a surface charge.
> > > 
> > > > Eg:  "Higgs field", not a field, "Higgs classical 
> > > > field", a field.
> > > > 
> > > > I.e., a physics' "field" is not a mathematics' "field", 
> > > > (though a mathematics' field is a trivial and zero-ed 
> > > > out physics' field).
> > > > 
> > > > A physics' field basically reflect quantities as 
> > > > throughout a continuous (smooth) manifold, and 
> > > > for some inclusive definition of "continuous", 
> > > > "continuous" suffices (for smooth).
> > > 
> > > Too garbled to comment in detail...
> > > 
> > > --
> > > Jan
> > 
> > It's not much comment.
> > 
> > A scalar field basically defines regions by 
> > their connectedness.
> > 
> > Of course, all of physics scalar fields: are 
> > not having any be everywhere discontinuous, 
> > that exist, where most of "mathematics' scalar 
> > fields" are mostly everywhere discontinuous 
> > (the manifold defined by the scalar part), 
> > i.e., they're without "example in the physical 
> > interpretation".
> > 
> > You need not excuse me, this isn't particularly 
> > strident and not any particular claim, i.e. this 
> > is simple enough bread-and-butter, but then about 
> > Higgs as the interface of the high-energy particle 
> > experiment that otherwise is no different than the 
> > standard particles having mass themselves as their 
> > state as why they have mass, except in the high 
> > energy that they would split, the Higgs boson as 
> > "the last particle in the Standard Model" is also 
> > the first one outside.
> > 
> > It would seem more relevant to have that as a manner 
> > of speaking than "bigger and bigger bosons forever":
> > "the Standard Model is dead, long live the Standard Model".
> > 
> > It's kind of like talking about "Gravity" in "GR":
> > what gravity?  The standard model ("of particle physics") 
> > is the particle physicists', then for notions like these 
> > days' supergravity (a particle theory) for quantum gravity 
> > to be explaining what Einstein referred to as the 
> > "total field" or what some might call Mach-ian.
> 
> Here is some reading from Kevin Brown's "Reflections on Relativity", 
> "The Field of All Fields": https://www.mathpages.com/rr/s4-06/4-06.htm .

One might readily find this from searching for "Einstein 
total field", Einstein's article in Science, "Considerations 
Concerning the Fundaments of Theoretical Physics", 1940
https://static1.squarespace.com/static/532a9587e4b085a89f267c62/t/551f70a3e4b085a7c1ba05a7/1428123811506/Einstein+commentary+in+Science+1940+.pdf

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#479271

FromThomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de>
Date2018-12-07 22:01 +0100
Message-ID<a8def99f-cc96-c6c3-0c12-a0c59a35aa39@PointedEars.de>
In reply to#479238
kenseto wrote:
> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space, something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.

Where and when did he write/say this?

IIRC, we have been over this here.

A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
mathematical space is assigned a value:

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>

For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]

Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
(with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
freshman physics.]

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>

There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
instead.  [dito]

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>

In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>

    [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]

[1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
    (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
    a heat source in the center of a room)
-- 
PointedEars

Twitter: @PointedEars2
Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.

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#479331

Fromkenseto <setoken@att.net>
Date2018-12-08 06:42 -0800
Message-ID<b4b4ec75-31f3-4ba9-b992-64d4101ee2c5@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479271
On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> kenseto wrote:
> > According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space, something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> 
> Where and when did he write/say this?
> 
> IIRC, we have been over this here.
> 
> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
> mathematical space is assigned a value:

So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?

> 
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
> 
> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
> 
> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
> freshman physics.]
> 
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
> 
> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
> instead.  [dito]
> 
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
> 
> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
> 
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
> 
>     [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
> 
> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>     (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>     a heat source in the center of a room)
> -- 
> PointedEars
> 
> Twitter: @PointedEars2
> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.

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#479335

FromOdd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-08 15:35 +0000
Message-ID<pugobg$1c8p$2@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479331
kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>> kenseto wrote:
>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>> 
>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>> 
>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>> 
>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
> 
> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?

Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 

> 
>> 
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>> 
>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>> 
>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>> freshman physics.]
>> 
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>> 
>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>> instead.  [dito]
>> 
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>> 
>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>> 
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>> 
>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>> 
>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>> -- 
>> PointedEars
>> 
>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
> 



-- 
Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#479356

Fromkenseto <setoken@att.net>
Date2018-12-08 10:21 -0800
Message-ID<aac77cb2-8aec-4671-8bbd-8af3998a5db9@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479335
On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> >> kenseto wrote:
> >>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
> >>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> >> 
> >> Where and when did he write/say this?
> >> 
> >> IIRC, we have been over this here.
> >> 
> >> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
> >> mathematical space is assigned a value:
> > 
> > So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
> > point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
> > case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
> > solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
> 
> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 

Yeah, in my theory, material objects react to the distorted geometries (stresses in Weinberg’s term) exist within the E-Matrix due to confinement. And the distortions in the E-matrix are due to the absolute motions of the interacting objects in the E-Matrix.
This explanation is much more simpler than the current explanation that the interacting material objects are reacting with the virtual particles pop in and out of space and that these virtual particles are financed by the Uncertainty Principle.
> 
> > 
> >> 
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
> >> 
> >> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
> >> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
> >> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
> >> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
> >> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
> >> 
> >> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
> >> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
> >> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
> >> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
> >> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
> >> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
> >> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
> >> freshman physics.]
> >> 
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
> >> 
> >> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
> >> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
> >> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
> >> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
> >> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
> >> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
> >> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
> >> instead.  [dito]
> >> 
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
> >> 
> >> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
> >> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
> >> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
> >> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
> >> 
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
> >> 
> >> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
> >> 
> >> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
> >> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
> >> a heat source in the center of a room)
> >> -- 
> >> PointedEars
> >> 
> >> Twitter: @PointedEars2
> >> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#479377

FromOdd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-08 19:15 +0000
Message-ID<puh58g$39v$3@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479356
kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>>> kenseto wrote:
>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>>>> 
>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>>>> 
>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>>>> 
>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
>>> 
>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
>> 
>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 
> 
> Yeah, in my theory, material objects react to the distorted geometries
> (stresses in Weinberg’s term) exist within the E-Matrix due to
> confinement. And the distortions in the E-matrix are due to the absolute
> motions of the interacting objects in the E-Matrix.
> This explanation is much more simpler than the current explanation that
> the interacting material objects are reacting with the virtual particles
> pop in and out of space and that these virtual particles are financed by
> the Uncertainty Principle.

What on earth makes you think that if an idea is simpler, then it’s more
correct?

>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>>>> 
>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>>>> 
>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>>>> freshman physics.]
>>>> 
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>>>> 
>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>>>> instead.  [dito]
>>>> 
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>>>> 
>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>>>> 
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>>>> 
>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>>>> 
>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>>>> -- 
>>>> PointedEars
>>>> 
>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> 



-- 
Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#479395

Fromkenseto <setoken@att.net>
Date2018-12-08 14:17 -0800
Message-ID<6c4c0f85-ac75-4159-ab0f-bd8bf28c3999@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479377
On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 2:15:32 PM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> > On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> >> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> >>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> >>>> kenseto wrote:
> >>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
> >>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> >>>> 
> >>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
> >>>> 
> >>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
> >>>> 
> >>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
> >>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
> >>> 
> >>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
> >>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
> >>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
> >>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
> >> 
> >> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 
> > 
> > Yeah, in my theory, material objects react to the distorted geometries
> > (stresses in Weinberg’s term) exist within the E-Matrix due to
> > confinement. And the distortions in the E-matrix are due to the absolute
> > motions of the interacting objects in the E-Matrix.
> > This explanation is much more simpler than the current explanation that
> > the interacting material objects are reacting with the virtual particles
> > pop in and out of space and that these virtual particles are financed by
> > the Uncertainty Principle.
> 
> What on earth makes you think that if an idea is simpler, then it’s more
> correct?

That is being expounded by Philosophers physicists throughout the centuries. You allowed the mathematicians led you into a fantasy mathematical dead end of non-existing mathematical objects  such as extra dimensions, virtual-particles, force messengers....etc. 


> 
> >> 
> >>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
> >>>> 
> >>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
> >>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
> >>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
> >>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
> >>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
> >>>> 
> >>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
> >>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
> >>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
> >>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
> >>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
> >>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
> >>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
> >>>> freshman physics.]
> >>>> 
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
> >>>> 
> >>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
> >>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
> >>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
> >>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
> >>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
> >>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
> >>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
> >>>> instead.  [dito]
> >>>> 
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
> >>>> 
> >>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
> >>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
> >>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
> >>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
> >>>> 
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
> >>>> 
> >>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
> >>>> 
> >>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
> >>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
> >>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
> >>>> -- 
> >>>> PointedEars
> >>>> 
> >>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
> >>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
> >>> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> -- 
> >> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#479398

FromOdd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-08 22:42 +0000
Message-ID<puhhc6$oa5$1@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479395
kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 2:15:32 PM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>>>>> kenseto wrote:
>>>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>>>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
>>>>> 
>>>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
>>>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
>>>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
>>>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
>>>> 
>>>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 
>>> 
>>> Yeah, in my theory, material objects react to the distorted geometries
>>> (stresses in Weinberg’s term) exist within the E-Matrix due to
>>> confinement. And the distortions in the E-matrix are due to the absolute
>>> motions of the interacting objects in the E-Matrix.
>>> This explanation is much more simpler than the current explanation that
>>> the interacting material objects are reacting with the virtual particles
>>> pop in and out of space and that these virtual particles are financed by
>>> the Uncertainty Principle.
>> 
>> What on earth makes you think that if an idea is simpler, then it’s more
>> correct?
> 
> That is being expounded by Philosophers physicists throughout the centuries. 

No it is not. Once again, you have vastly oversimplified what these
“Philosophers physicists” have actually said, to the point where it is
wrong. 

> You allowed the mathematicians led you into a fantasy mathematical dead
> end of non-existing mathematical objects  such as extra dimensions,
> virtual-particles, force messengers....etc. 
> 
> 
>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>>>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>>>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>>>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>>>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>>>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>>>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>>>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>>>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>>>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>>>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>>>>>> freshman physics.]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>>>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>>>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>>>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>>>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>>>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>>>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>>>>>> instead.  [dito]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>>>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>>>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>>>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>>>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>>>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> PointedEars
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>>>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> 



-- 
Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#479402

Fromkenseto <setoken@att.net>
Date2018-12-08 14:58 -0800
Message-ID<61342560-217e-42e0-bcba-d4706615ccca@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479398
On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 5:42:19 PM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> > On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 2:15:32 PM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> >> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> >>> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> >>>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> >>>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> >>>>>> kenseto wrote:
> >>>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
> >>>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
> >>>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
> >>>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
> >>>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
> >>>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
> >>>> 
> >>>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 
> >>> 
> >>> Yeah, in my theory, material objects react to the distorted geometries
> >>> (stresses in Weinberg’s term) exist within the E-Matrix due to
> >>> confinement. And the distortions in the E-matrix are due to the absolute
> >>> motions of the interacting objects in the E-Matrix.
> >>> This explanation is much more simpler than the current explanation that
> >>> the interacting material objects are reacting with the virtual particles
> >>> pop in and out of space and that these virtual particles are financed by
> >>> the Uncertainty Principle.
> >> 
> >> What on earth makes you think that if an idea is simpler, then it’s more
> >> correct?
> > 
> > That is being expounded by Philosophers physicists throughout the centuries. 
> 
> No it is not. Once again, you have vastly oversimplified what these
> “Philosophers physicists” have actually said, to the point where it is
> wrong. 

No Sir! It is you who is wrong. You have no idea what they said.

> 
> > You allowed the mathematicians led you into a fantasy mathematical dead
> > end of non-existing mathematical objects  such as extra dimensions,
> > virtual-particles, force messengers....etc. 
> > 
> > 
> >> 
> >>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
> >>>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
> >>>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
> >>>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
> >>>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
> >>>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
> >>>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
> >>>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
> >>>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
> >>>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
> >>>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
> >>>>>> freshman physics.]
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
> >>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
> >>>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
> >>>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
> >>>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
> >>>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
> >>>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
> >>>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
> >>>>>> instead.  [dito]
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
> >>>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
> >>>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
> >>>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
> >>>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
> >>>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
> >>>>>> -- 
> >>>>>> PointedEars
> >>>>>> 
> >>>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
> >>>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
> >>>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> -- 
> >>>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> >>> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> -- 
> >> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables

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#479415

Frommoroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney)
Date2018-12-09 01:22 +0000
Message-ID<puhqob$9r4$2@pcls7.std.com>
In reply to#479402
kenseto <setoken@att.net> writes:

>On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 5:42:19 PM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:

>> No it is not. Once again, you have vastly oversimplified what these
>> "Philosophers physicists" have actually said, to the point where it is
>> wrong.

>No Sir! It is you who is wrong. You have no idea what they said.

Your repeated assertions are not a valid argument.

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#479449

FromOdd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-09 13:07 +0000
Message-ID<puj41r$1erv$1@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479402
kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 5:42:19 PM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 2:15:32 PM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>>>> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>>>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>>>>>>> kenseto wrote:
>>>>>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>>>>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>>>>>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
>>>>>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
>>>>>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
>>>>>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Yeah, in my theory, material objects react to the distorted geometries
>>>>> (stresses in Weinberg’s term) exist within the E-Matrix due to
>>>>> confinement. And the distortions in the E-matrix are due to the absolute
>>>>> motions of the interacting objects in the E-Matrix.
>>>>> This explanation is much more simpler than the current explanation that
>>>>> the interacting material objects are reacting with the virtual particles
>>>>> pop in and out of space and that these virtual particles are financed by
>>>>> the Uncertainty Principle.
>>>> 
>>>> What on earth makes you think that if an idea is simpler, then it’s more
>>>> correct?
>>> 
>>> That is being expounded by Philosophers physicists throughout the centuries. 
>> 
>> No it is not. Once again, you have vastly oversimplified what these
>> “Philosophers physicists” have actually said, to the point where it is
>> wrong. 
> 
> No Sir! It is you who is wrong. You have no idea what they said.

William of Okkam, Newton, R.B. Lindsay, Einstein, Feynman. I know what they
said. 
“Hypotheses should not be multiplied unnecessarily.” Which one said that?

> 
>> 
>>> You allowed the mathematicians led you into a fantasy mathematical dead
>>> end of non-existing mathematical objects  such as extra dimensions,
>>> virtual-particles, force messengers....etc. 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>>>>>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>>>>>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>>>>>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>>>>>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>>>>>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>>>>>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>>>>>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>>>>>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>>>>>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>>>>>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>>>>>>>> freshman physics.]
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>>>>>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>>>>>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>>>>>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>>>>>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>>>>>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>>>>>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>>>>>>>> instead.  [dito]
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>>>>>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>>>>>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>>>>>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>>>>>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>>>>>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>> PointedEars
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>>>>>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> 
> 



-- 
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#479422

Frombenj <benj.fake@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-08 23:26 -0500
Message-ID<pui5i7$1o74$2@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479377
On 12/8/2018 2:15 PM, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>>>> kenseto wrote:
>>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>>>>>
>>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>>>>>
>>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>>>>>
>>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
>>>>
>>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
>>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
>>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
>>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
>>>
>>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects.
>>
>> Yeah, in my theory, material objects react to the distorted geometries
>> (stresses in Weinberg’s term) exist within the E-Matrix due to
>> confinement. And the distortions in the E-matrix are due to the absolute
>> motions of the interacting objects in the E-Matrix.
>> This explanation is much more simpler than the current explanation that
>> the interacting material objects are reacting with the virtual particles
>> pop in and out of space and that these virtual particles are financed by
>> the Uncertainty Principle.
> 
> What on earth makes you think that if an idea is simpler, then it’s more
> correct?

Occam's razor! Every Lib here pretending to know science always uses it 
as a hard and fast proof of all their theories.

>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>>>>>
>>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>>>>>
>>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>>>>> freshman physics.]
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>>>>>
>>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>>>>> instead.  [dito]
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>>>>>
>>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>>>>>
>>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>>>>>
>>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> PointedEars
>>>>>
>>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>>
> 
> 
> 

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#479451

FromOdd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-09 13:07 +0000
Message-ID<puj41v$1erv$3@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479422
benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 12/8/2018 2:15 PM, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>>>>> kenseto wrote:
>>>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>>>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
>>>>> 
>>>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
>>>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
>>>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
>>>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
>>>> 
>>>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects.
>>> 
>>> Yeah, in my theory, material objects react to the distorted geometries
>>> (stresses in Weinberg’s term) exist within the E-Matrix due to
>>> confinement. And the distortions in the E-matrix are due to the absolute
>>> motions of the interacting objects in the E-Matrix.
>>> This explanation is much more simpler than the current explanation that
>>> the interacting material objects are reacting with the virtual particles
>>> pop in and out of space and that these virtual particles are financed by
>>> the Uncertainty Principle.
>> 
>> What on earth makes you think that if an idea is simpler, then it’s more
>> correct?
> 
> Occam's razor! 

Which says what, exactly? Go ahead. It’s not what Ken said. 

> Every Lib here pretending to know science always uses it 
> as a hard and fast proof of all their theories.
> 
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>>>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>>>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>>>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>>>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>>>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>>>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>>>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>>>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>>>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>>>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>>>>>> freshman physics.]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>>>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>>>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>>>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>>>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>>>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>>>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>>>>>> instead.  [dito]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>>>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>>>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>>>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>>>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>>>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> PointedEars
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>>>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> 



-- 
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

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#479359

Fromkenseto <setoken@att.net>
Date2018-12-08 10:27 -0800
Message-ID<d29e668b-089e-49e9-9751-7016880fcf1e@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479335
On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> > On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> >> kenseto wrote:
> >>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
> >>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> >> 
> >> Where and when did he write/say this?
> >> 
> >> IIRC, we have been over this here.
> >> 
> >> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
> >> mathematical space is assigned a value:
> > 
> > So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
> > point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
> > case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
> > solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
> 
> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 

Nope.

> 
> > 
> >> 
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
> >> 
> >> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
> >> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
> >> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
> >> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
> >> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
> >> 
> >> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
> >> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
> >> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
> >> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
> >> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
> >> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
> >> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
> >> freshman physics.]
> >> 
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
> >> 
> >> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
> >> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
> >> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
> >> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
> >> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
> >> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
> >> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
> >> instead.  [dito]
> >> 
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
> >> 
> >> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
> >> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
> >> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
> >> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
> >> 
> >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
> >> 
> >> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
> >> 
> >> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
> >> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
> >> a heat source in the center of a room)
> >> -- 
> >> PointedEars
> >> 
> >> Twitter: @PointedEars2
> >> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables

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#479378

FromOdd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-08 19:15 +0000
Message-ID<puh58h$39v$4@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479359
kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>>> kenseto wrote:
>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>>>> 
>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>>>> 
>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>>>> 
>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
>>> 
>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
>> 
>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects. 
> 
> Nope.

If this is what you believe, then you are four hundred years behind. 

> 
>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>>>> 
>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>>>> 
>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>>>> freshman physics.]
>>>> 
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>>>> 
>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>>>> instead.  [dito]
>>>> 
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>>>> 
>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>>>> 
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>>>> 
>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>>>> 
>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>>>> -- 
>>>> PointedEars
>>>> 
>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> 
> 



-- 
Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables

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#479421

Frombenj <benj.fake@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-08 23:23 -0500
Message-ID<pui5cj$1o74$1@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479359
On 12/8/2018 1:27 PM, kenseto wrote:
> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>>> kenseto wrote:
>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>>>>
>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>>>>
>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>>>>
>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
>>>
>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
>>
>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects.
> 
> Nope.

Think about this for a second, Kenseto (something which Odd never does)

What are the basic interactions of the universe? Well, as pointed out by 
Maxwell if we regard transmission of energy as THE basic interaction of 
the universe, there are only TWO known ways that this can occur: One is 
matter-matter interactions which is to say particles of matter with 
kinetic energy smacking into other bits of matter. Hence this is clearly 
a matter-matter interaction.

The other way is the transmission of energy by waves in a medium. 
Clearly matter can be a medium, that is known. Thus all those 
interactions also can be said to be matter-matter interactions. Say a 
particle smacks into a material object causing energy waves transmitted 
throughout it.

But what if Odd is right and there exist media that are NOT material? 
What if a particle of matter smacks into something non-material like say 
a ghost or Tinkerbell? If waves of energy are propagated through that 
non-material object then Odd would be correct that material objects can 
interact with non-material things. In this case that interaction can 
still be described by a mathematical field. Of course the field is not 
some kind of actual thing as Odd believes, but it is a description of 
what might be observed.

So Who is "right" here? Well, clearly if aether is fundamentally a 
material (no matter how thin, light and fine) with mass then all 
interaction are material as you propose. And there is some evidence that 
matter does not interact with Ghosts or Tinkerbell. Yet one cannot prove 
a negative so one cannot say that matter does not interact with 
non-material objects until all laws of such interactions are known. 
Which they are not at present no matter what Odd says.



>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>>>>
>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>>>>
>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>>>> freshman physics.]
>>>>
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>>>>
>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>>>> instead.  [dito]
>>>>
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>>>>
>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>>>>
>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>>>>
>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>>>>
>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>>>> -- 
>>>> PointedEars
>>>>
>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> 

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#479450

FromOdd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Date2018-12-09 13:07 +0000
Message-ID<puj41t$1erv$2@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#479421
benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 12/8/2018 1:27 PM, kenseto wrote:
>> On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
>>>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>>>> kenseto wrote:
>>>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
>>>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
>>>>> 
>>>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
>>>>> 
>>>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
>>>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
>>>> 
>>>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
>>>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
>>>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
>>>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
>>> 
>>> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects.
>> 
>> Nope.
> 
> Think about this for a second, Kenseto (something which Odd never does)
> 
> What are the basic interactions of the universe? Well, as pointed out by 
> Maxwell if we regard transmission of energy as THE basic interaction of 
> the universe, there are only TWO known ways that this can occur: 

Wrong

 > One is 
> matter-matter interactions which is to say particles of matter with 
> kinetic energy smacking into other bits of matter. Hence this is clearly 
> a matter-matter interaction.
> 
> The other way is the transmission of energy by waves in a medium. 
> Clearly matter can be a medium, that is known. Thus all those 
> interactions also can be said to be matter-matter interactions. Say a 
> particle smacks into a material object causing energy waves transmitted 
> throughout it.
> 
> But what if Odd is right and there exist media that are NOT material? 
> What if a particle of matter smacks into something non-material like say 
> a ghost or Tinkerbell? If waves of energy are propagated through that 
> non-material object then Odd would be correct that material objects can 
> interact with non-material things. In this case that interaction can 
> still be described by a mathematical field. Of course the field is not 
> some kind of actual thing as Odd believes, but it is a description of 
> what might be observed.
> 
> So Who is "right" here? Well, clearly if aether is fundamentally a 
> material (no matter how thin, light and fine) with mass then all 
> interaction are material as you propose. And there is some evidence that 
> matter does not interact with Ghosts or Tinkerbell. Yet one cannot prove 
> a negative so one cannot say that matter does not interact with 
> non-material objects until all laws of such interactions are known. 
> Which they are not at present no matter what Odd says.
> 
> 
> 
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
>>>>> 
>>>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
>>>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
>>>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
>>>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
>>>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
>>>>> 
>>>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
>>>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
>>>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
>>>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
>>>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
>>>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
>>>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
>>>>> freshman physics.]
>>>>> 
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
>>>>> 
>>>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
>>>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
>>>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
>>>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
>>>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
>>>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
>>>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
>>>>> instead.  [dito]
>>>>> 
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
>>>>> 
>>>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
>>>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
>>>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
>>>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
>>>>> 
>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
>>>>> 
>>>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
>>>>> 
>>>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
>>>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
>>>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> PointedEars
>>>>> 
>>>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
>>>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
>> 
> 
> 



-- 
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#479499

Fromkenseto <setoken@att.net>
Date2018-12-09 14:19 -0800
Message-ID<a6ea7da8-2dd8-47d6-8830-ab08b63d6805@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#479421
On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 11:23:50 PM UTC-5, benj wrote:
> On 12/8/2018 1:27 PM, kenseto wrote:
> > On Saturday, December 8, 2018 at 10:35:16 AM UTC-5, Odd Bodkin wrote:
> >> kenseto <setoken@att.net> wrote:
> >>> On Friday, December 7, 2018 at 4:01:34 PM UTC-5, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> >>>> kenseto wrote:
> >>>>> According to Steven Weinberg: A field is a sort of stress in space,
> >>>>> something like  the various sorts of stress that are possible within a solid body.
> >>>>
> >>>> Where and when did he write/say this?
> >>>>
> >>>> IIRC, we have been over this here.
> >>>>
> >>>> A field in physics is simply an object in models where every point in a
> >>>> mathematical space is assigned a value:
> >>>
> >>> So Weinberg’s description that a field is the stress exists at every
> >>> point in a solid body is very close to the  correct description. In any
> >>> case what is mathematical space? Is it not a solid body? If it is not a
> >>> solid body how can material objects interact with the stresses exist within it?
> >>
> >> Material objects interact with more things than other material objects.
> > 
> > Nope.
> 
> Think about this for a second, Kenseto (something which Odd never does)
> 
> What are the basic interactions of the universe? Well, as pointed out by 
> Maxwell if we regard transmission of energy as THE basic interaction of 
> the universe, there are only TWO known ways that this can occur: One is 
> matter-matter interactions which is to say particles of matter with 
> kinetic energy smacking into other bits of matter. Hence this is clearly 
> a matter-matter interaction.
 
> The other way is the transmission of energy by waves in a medium. 
> Clearly matter can be a medium, that is known. Thus all those 
> interactions also can be said to be matter-matter interactions. Say a 
> particle smacks into a material object causing energy waves transmitted 
> throughout it.

In my theory: 
1.  Interacting objects  moving in the same direction in the E-Matrix, they will converge to each other... an attractive force. Although this force is EM in nature but it is much weaker than the normal EM force because objects moving in the E-Matrix in the same direction are also experiencing a repulsive effect between them. This repulsive effect between the interacting objects is due to the confinement of the same objects to the divergent structure of the E-Matrix. Therefore, the total attractive force between them is the sum of the attractive EM force less the repulsive effect between them.

2. Interacting objects moving in the opposite directions in the E-Matrix, they will diverge from each other.....a repulsive effect between them.


> 
> But what if Odd is right and there exist media that are NOT material?

Everything that has properties is material. Odd has different meaning for the word material.
 
> What if a particle of matter smacks into something non-material like say 
> a ghost or Tinkerbell? If waves of energy are propagated through that 
> non-material object then Odd would be correct that material objects can 
> interact with non-material things. In this case that interaction can 
> still be described by a mathematical field. Of course the field is not 
> some kind of actual thing as Odd believes, but it is a description of 
> what might be observed.
> 
> So Who is "right" here? Well, clearly if aether is fundamentally a 
> material (no matter how thin, light and fine) with mass then all 
> interaction are material as you propose. And there is some evidence that 
> matter does not interact with Ghosts or Tinkerbell. Yet one cannot prove 
> a negative so one cannot say that matter does not interact with 
> non-material objects until all laws of such interactions are known. 
> Which they are not at present no matter what Odd says.
> 
> 
> 
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)>
> >>>>
> >>>> For example, there can be a temperature field that describes the temperature
> >>>> in a room in every point in the room.  If it describes the temperature at a
> >>>> particular time, it is a 3-dimension scalar field (since temperature is a
> >>>> scalar quantity).  [I mention this particularly because we did calculations
> >>>> on and plots of such a field in freshman physics.[1]]
> >>>>
> >>>> Other fields that should be well-known are the electric field and the
> >>>> magnetic field.  These are vector fields (E⃗ and B⃗, respectively) because
> >>>> not only do they have a strength (which is a scalar); the field lines, along
> >>>> which a charged particle would move freely as it is accelerated by the
> >>>> forces of the fields, have a direction.  [E.g. for the electric field
> >>>> between two capacitor plates only from one particular plate to the other
> >>>> (with direct current).  Again, you do calculations on these fields in
> >>>> freshman physics.]
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor>
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_coil>
> >>>>
> >>>> There can also be a field describing the gravitational potential (V or Φ),
> >>>> force (F⃗), or acceleration (g⃗) in every point in 3-dimensional space: the
> >>>> gravitational field.   The (gravitational) potential is a scalar (no arrow
> >>>> above the symbol), so a field based on it would be a 3-dimensional scalar
> >>>> field.  Force and acceleration are both vectors (arrow above the symbol, or
> >>>> bold font; they have a magnitude and a direction), so a gravitational field
> >>>> based on either of those quantities would be a (3-dimensional) vector field
> >>>> instead.  [dito]
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_field>
> >>>>
> >>>> In general relativity, the gravitational field is a 4 (1+3 or
> >>>> 3+1)-dimensional *tensor* field, defined by the Einstein *tensor* which
> >>>> describes the curvature of spacetime corresponding to the density of energy
> >>>> and momentum.  Hence “Einstein *Field* Equations (for gravitation)”.
> >>>>
> >>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_field_equations>
> >>>>
> >>>> [Hopefully I do not have to remind you of this *again* next year.]
> >>>>
> >>>> [1] <https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+exp(-sqrt(x%5E2+%2B+y%5E2))>
> >>>> (the greater the elevation, the higher the temperature; you can imagine
> >>>> a heat source in the center of a room)
> >>>> -- 
> >>>> PointedEars
> >>>>
> >>>> Twitter: @PointedEars2
> >>>> Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -- 
> >> Odd Bodkin — Maker of fine toys, tools, tables
> >

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