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Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #418019 > unrolled thread
| Started by | mlwozniak@wp.pl |
|---|---|
| First post | 2017-05-04 05:59 -0700 |
| Last post | 2017-05-06 11:51 -0700 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 140 — 14 participants |
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GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 05:59 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Python <python@example.invalid> - 2017-05-04 15:03 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 06:24 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Python <python@example.invalid> - 2017-05-04 15:37 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 06:43 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 13:04 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 06:30 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 10:09 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 15:26 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 17:53 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 16:03 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 18:09 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 16:19 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 18:33 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 16:40 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 09:00 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 16:11 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 12:11 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 12:20 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 14:45 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 14:50 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 17:22 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 23:22 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 09:07 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 08:28 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 13:08 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 22:09 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 06:11 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 08:25 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 14:34 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 13:16 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 15:57 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 14:04 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 16:07 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 14:25 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-07 13:24 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-07 13:05 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-07 16:28 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-07 23:23 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-08 13:09 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 06:22 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 08:31 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 08:29 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 07:00 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 10:30 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 09:27 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 12:03 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 10:33 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 15:13 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 20:31 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 08:11 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions Python <python@example.invalid> - 2017-05-05 15:15 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 06:22 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 09:08 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions Python <python@example.invalid> - 2017-05-05 00:27 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 23:24 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Python <python@example.invalid> - 2017-05-05 11:58 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-04 21:23 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 15:21 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Bordamos Alamidade <dd@dsmdawo.ab> - 2017-05-08 13:36 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-04 14:58 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 15:25 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 17:55 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 16:07 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 09:03 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Ernest Schillaci <lgunse@nteeqea.gl> - 2017-05-04 16:31 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-04 21:21 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 15:01 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Helmut Wabnig <hwabnig@.- --- -.dotat> - 2017-05-04 22:24 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 22:35 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 14:59 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-05-05 21:04 +0100
Re: GPS and your predictions Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2017-05-05 13:27 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-05-05 23:15 +0100
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 17:22 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 00:58 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Prijzen Sörözésekre <ouwu@wueidewliiut.te> - 2017-05-05 23:09 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 01:23 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Prijzen Sörözésekre <ouwu@wueidewliiut.te> - 2017-05-05 23:35 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2017-05-05 15:44 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 00:54 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Prijzen Sörözésekre <ouwu@wueidewliiut.te> - 2017-05-05 23:05 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2017-05-08 12:25 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 10:35 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-08 20:34 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 20:35 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-09 16:45 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-09 10:25 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> - 2017-05-09 10:03 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Helmut Wabnig <hwabnig@.- --- -.dotat> - 2017-05-06 06:37 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 22:23 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 09:17 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Bordamos Alamidade <dd@dsmdawo.ab> - 2017-05-07 18:18 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions pnalsing@gmail.com - 2017-05-07 20:41 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 22:20 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 00:07 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Prijzen Sörözésekre <ouwu@wueidewliiut.te> - 2017-05-05 22:17 +0000
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 22:21 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-05-06 08:01 +0100
Re: GPS and your predictions Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 09:39 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 16:32 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions Helmut Wabnig <hwabnig@.- --- -.dotat> - 2017-05-05 10:15 +0200
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 01:52 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 09:00 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 08:15 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 13:10 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 22:14 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 06:14 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 08:34 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 14:38 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 13:30 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 16:00 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 14:12 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-07 13:25 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-07 13:09 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-07 16:31 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-07 23:28 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 08:32 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 07:13 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 10:24 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 09:21 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 12:00 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-08 10:28 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> - 2017-05-06 23:51 +0100
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 08:26 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 08:13 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 13:13 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 22:18 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 14:15 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 12:33 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 14:50 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-06 13:35 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 16:01 -0500
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-04 14:52 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2017-05-05 07:43 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 08:17 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2017-05-05 09:21 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-05-05 09:49 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2017-05-05 10:22 -0700
Re: GPS and your predictions Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2017-05-06 11:51 -0700
Page 5 of 7 — ← Prev page 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 7 Next page →
| From | Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-06 00:54 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <oeivkt$aeu$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #418307 |
Dne 06/05/2017 v 00:15 Kevin Aylward napsal(a): > > If there is a fixed 38us correction, then GR/SR is superfluous. One just > sticks in the 38 us. Dah... Any expression can be substituted by its value, being expression of GR or engineering calculations. Using the direct value does not mean it is get empirically and there is no theory behind. It does not mean the expression does not exist, nor that it does not have its predictive power. Using a particular fruit of theory, even being a single number does not mean the theory is not used. One need not to do lots of calculations, if they were done before. Using equivalent energy of 511 keV for the electron mass does not mean SR is not used. It is big difference if the boolean value "construction will collapse" is predicted by theory or if tested empirically, having no prior clue. Back to GPS, the dependence of the correction on the orbit radius is quite clear. Aside of that, there are various minor GR corrections for very precise calculations based on predictable influence of irregularities, e.g. deviations due non circular orbits, Earth gravity irregularities, influence of the Moon... -- Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer ) A wise man guards words he says, as they say about him more, than he says about the subject.
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| From | Prijzen Sörözésekre <ouwu@wueidewliiut.te> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 23:05 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <oej0f6$ak3$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #418322 |
Poutnik wrote: > Using a particular fruit of theory, even being a single number does not > mean the theory is not used. One need not to do lots of calculations, if > they were done before. !! > It is big difference if the boolean value "construction will collapse" > is predicted by theory or if tested empirically, having no prior clue. !!?
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| From | Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-08 12:25 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <cpydnVJ_uemON43EnZ2dnUU7_83NnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #418307 |
On 5/5/17 5/5/17 - 5:15 PM, Kevin Aylward wrote: > If there is a fixed 38us correction, then GR/SR is superfluous. One just sticks > in the 38 us. Dah... How silly. And how IGNORANT of the history and physics. It was physicists applying GR that informed the GPS design that the 38 us/day correction is required. Today it is physicists and engineers applying GR that calculate the many corrections to GPS clocks that are acyclical, such as the effects of orbit errors, moon, sun, Jupiter,.... People who use the GPS for centimeter accuracy need to consider such minuscule corrections; most navigation systems don't. Any engineer worth his salt knows that one is MUCH better off if one can compute corrections from first principles, rather than having to measure and react to them empirically. Tom Roberts
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| From | mlwozniak@wp.pl |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-08 10:35 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <ad14ab50-3298-4261-a117-82d15c6e0b11@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #418721 |
W dniu poniedziałek, 8 maja 2017 19:25:45 UTC+2 użytkownik tjrob137 napisał: > On 5/5/17 5/5/17 - 5:15 PM, Kevin Aylward wrote: > > If there is a fixed 38us correction, then GR/SR is superfluous. One just sticks > > in the 38 us. Dah... > > How silly. And how IGNORANT of the history and physics. > > It was physicists applying GR that informed the GPS design that the 38 us/day > correction is required. A lie. As expected from fanatic trash. Physicists "predicted" this correction (FORBIDDEN by the moronic standards of them) after it was measured on satellites.
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| From | moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-08 20:34 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <oeqknu$q54$2@pcls7.std.com> |
| In reply to | #418726 |
mlwozniak@wp.pl writes: >> On 5/5/17 5/5/17 - 5:15 PM, Kevin Aylward wrote: >> > If there is a fixed 38us correction, then GR/SR is superfluous. One just sticks >> > in the 38 us. Dah... >> How silly. And how IGNORANT of the history and physics. >> It was physicists applying GR that informed the GPS design that the 38 us/day=20 >> correction is required. >A lie. As expected from fanatic trash. >Physicists "predicted" this correction >(FORBIDDEN by the moronic standards of them) >after it was measured on satellites. Nope. There must have been an argument with NASA scientists when the first GPS satellite was designed. It included, apparently as a compromise, the ability to turn the 38 uS/day GR offset off and on. So when the satellite was launched, it ran for an extended period with the GR offset switched off, and then it was switched on. Guess what? The satellite worked correctly with the 38 uS/day GR offset on, but not when it was off. Since then, all GPS satellites included the 38 uS/day GR offset without the ability to switch it off, being totally unnecessary. And now, the nice lady in your smartphone gives you accurate directions back to the asylum, and everyone lived happily ever after.
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| From | mlwozniak@wp.pl |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-08 20:35 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <d7911f42-298f-47e2-bad5-51909c0f3b92@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #418769 |
W dniu poniedziałek, 8 maja 2017 22:34:07 UTC+2 użytkownik Michael Moroney napisał: > mlwozniak@wp.pl writes: > >> It was physicists applying GR that informed the GPS design that the 38 us/day=20 > >> correction is required. > > >A lie. As expected from fanatic trash. > >Physicists "predicted" this correction > >(FORBIDDEN by the moronic standards of them) > >after it was measured on satellites. > > Nope. There must have been an argument with NASA scientists when the > first GPS satellite was designed. Oh, things just MUST have gone the way you like. > when the satellite was launched, it ran for an extended period with the GR > offset switched off, and then it was switched on. GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic "standard". > Guess what? The satellite worked correctly with the 38 uS/day GR offset > on, but not when it was off. GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic "standard". > Since then, all GPS satellites included the 38 uS/day GR offset without > the ability to switch it off, being totally unnecessary. GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic "standard".
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| From | moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-09 16:45 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <oesrnv$mcj$4@pcls7.std.com> |
| In reply to | #418805 |
mlwozniak@wp.pl writes: >> >> It was physicists applying GR that informed the GPS design that the 38 us/day >> >> correction is required. >> >A lie. As expected from fanatic trash. >> >Physicists "predicted" this correction >> >(FORBIDDEN by the moronic standards of them) >> >after it was measured on satellites. >> Nope. There must have been an argument with NASA scientists when the >> first GPS satellite was designed. >Oh, things just MUST have gone the way you like. Discussed here: https://paulba.no/paper/Initial_results_of_GPS_satellite_1977.pdf >> when the satellite was launched, it ran for an extended period with the GR >> offset switched off, and then it was switched on. >GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic >"standard". Nope. Again, read the paper at https://paulba.no/paper/Initial_results_of_GPS_satellite_1977.pdf. >GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic >"standard". <click> >GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic >"standard". <click> >GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic >"standard". <click> Who was it who mentioned the autistic repetition of the same phrase over and over again by many kooks?
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| From | mlwozniak@wp.pl |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-09 10:25 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <153576b0-d629-4e2f-ab32-dab7112d0f36@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #418873 |
W dniu wtorek, 9 maja 2017 18:45:53 UTC+2 użytkownik Michael Moroney napisał: > mlwozniak@wp.pl writes: > > >> >> It was physicists applying GR that informed the GPS design that the 38 us/day > >> >> correction is required. > > >> >A lie. As expected from fanatic trash. > >> >Physicists "predicted" this correction > >> >(FORBIDDEN by the moronic standards of them) > >> >after it was measured on satellites. > > >> Nope. There must have been an argument with NASA scientists when the > >> first GPS satellite was designed. > > >Oh, things just MUST have gone the way you like. > > Discussed here: > https://paulba.no/paper/Initial_results_of_GPS_satellite_1977.pdf And, poor idiot? > >> when the satellite was launched, it ran for an extended period with the GR > >> offset switched off, and then it was switched on. > > >GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic > >"standard". > > Nope. Again, read the paper at > https://paulba.no/paper/Initial_results_of_GPS_satellite_1977.pdf. And, poor idiot? > >GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic > >"standard". > > <click> > > >GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic > >"standard". > > <click> > > >GR offset directly forbidden by GR moronic > >"standard". > > <click> > > Who was it who mentioned the autistic repetition of the same phrase > over and over again by many kooks? Who was it, poor idiot?
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| From | "Paul B. Andersen" <relativity@paulba.no> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-09 10:03 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <oert5e$pqu$1@news.albasani.net> |
| In reply to | #418769 |
Den 08.05.2017 22.34, skrev Michael Moroney: > mlwozniak@wp.pl writes: >> On 5/5/17 5/5/17 - 5:15 PM, Kevin Aylward wrote: >>> It was physicists applying GR that informed the GPS design that the 38 us/day=20 >>> correction is required. >> >> A lie. As expected from fanatic trash. >> Physicists "predicted" this correction >> (FORBIDDEN by the moronic standards of them) >> after it was measured on satellites. > > Nope. There must have been an argument with NASA scientists when the > first GPS satellite was designed. It included, apparently as a > compromise, the ability to turn the 38 uS/day GR offset off and on. So > when the satellite was launched, it ran for an extended period with the GR > offset switched off, and then it was switched on. > > Guess what? The satellite worked correctly with the 38 uS/day GR offset > on, but not when it was off. > > Since then, all GPS satellites included the 38 uS/day GR offset without > the ability to switch it off, being totally unnecessary. > > And now, the nice lady in your smartphone gives you accurate directions > back to the asylum, and everyone lived happily ever after. https://paulba.no/paper/Initial_results_of_GPS_satellite_1977.pdf -- Paul https://paulba.no/
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| From | Helmut Wabnig <hwabnig@.- --- -.dotat> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-06 06:37 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <klkqgc59lsr26hik97trofs65bkhjjd00a@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #418287 |
On Fri, 5 May 2017 13:27:26 -0700 (PDT), Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> wrote: >El viernes, 5 de mayo de 2017, 17:04:43 (UTC-3), Kevin Aylward escribió: >> "Poutnik" wrote in message news:oeg340$hn$1@dont-email.me... > >> >It is not empirical, but predicted one. >> >And you do need GR to say why particularly 38 us. >> >> No you don't. Look mate, I design analog asics for high performance crystal >> oscillators (www.rakon.com) >> >> We measure every single oscillator over temperature and calibrate the temp >> comp function generators to the vco to cancel the xtal temp variation. The >> temp residuals are all over the place, there is no neat little formula one >> can use. Its an arbitrary curve fit. That's the real world. >> >> Pretty much everything today is all real time calibration. Its all >> ADC->uP-DAC >> >> >> -- Kevin Aylward >> http://www.kevinaylward.co.uk/gr/index.html >> http://www.kevinaylward.co.uk/qm/index.html > >Not the GPS. The prediction of General Relativity regarding the GPS satellite >rate of clocks is as follows, based in the Schwarzschild metric >(See http://link.springer.com/article/10.12942/lrr-2003-1): > >The rate f_2 of a clock in circular orbit compared to a clock f_1 at the > surface of the Earth is, to a first order approximation: > >f_2/f_1 = (1- GM/c^2r_2 - v_2^2/2c^2) / (1- GM/c^2r_1 - v_1^2/2c^2) > >which approximates to > >f_2/f_1 = 1 + GM/c^2 (1/r_1 – 1/r_2) + (v_1^2 - v_2^2) / 2c^2 > >and the relative rate difference is: > >(f_2 - f_1) /f_1 = GM/c^2 (1/r_1 – 1/r_2) + (v_1^2 - v_2^2) / 2c^2 > >Using the following values > >Gravitational constant G = 6.67384 x 10^11 Nm^2/kg^2 >Mass of the Earth M = 5.97219 x 10^24 kg >Speed of light in vacuum c = 299792458 m/s >Sidereal day = 86164 s >Orbital period of GPS satellite = half sidereal day = 43082 s >Radius of the Earth r_1 = 6.375 x 10^6 m >Radius of GPS orbit r_2 = 26.56 x 10^6 m >Speed of ground clock v_1 = 2pi r_1/86164s = 464.87 m/s >Speed of satellite v_2 = 2pi r2/43082s = 3873.57 m/s > >f_2 - f_1) /f_1 = 4.464 x 10^-10 > >Which is equivalent to 38.46 microseconds per sidereal day. > >Ashby tells what the experimental test in 1977 brought as a result: > >"There is an interesting story about this frequency offset. At the time of >launch of the NTS-2 satellite (23 June 1977), which contained the first >Cesium atomic clock to be placed in orbit, it was recognized that orbiting >clocks would require a relativistic correction, but there was uncertainty >as to its magnitude as well as its sign. Indeed, there were >some who doubted that relativistic effects were truths that would need >to be incorporated [5]! A frequency synthesizer was built into the satellite >clock system so that after launch, if in fact the rate of the clock in its >final orbit was that predicted by general relativity, then the synthesizer >could be turned on, bringing the clock to the coordinate rate necessary for >operation. After the Cesium clock was turned on in NTS-2, it was operated >for about 20 days to measure its clock rate before turning on the synthesizer >[11]. The frequency measured during that interval was +442.5 parts in 10^12 >compared to clocks on the ground, while general relativity predicted +446.5 >parts in 10^12. The difference was well within the accuracy capabilities >of the orbiting clock. This then gave about a 1% verification of the >combined second-order Doppler and gravitational frequency shift effects >for a clock at 4.2 earth radii." > >So, GR rate difference prediction is 4.465 x 10^-10 >Tested 1977 rate difference was 4.425 x 10^-10 > >Tested rate difference agreed with GR prediction. You know nothing. GPS was already up and running before they had any of above formulas. You are not capable of doing anything useful. w.
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| From | mlwozniak@wp.pl |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 22:23 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <1ba664c0-0809-4b20-a081-8cbf2e15f3f3@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #418349 |
W dniu sobota, 6 maja 2017 06:38:08 UTC+2 użytkownik Helmut Wabnig napisał: > On Fri, 5 May 2017 13:27:26 -0700 (PDT), Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> > wrote: > You know nothing. > > GPS was already up and running before they had any of above formulas. > > You are not capable of doing anything useful. OF course he knows nothing. Of course he is not capable. He is just a poor fanatic brainwashed by insane ideology. Just like you.
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| From | Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-06 09:17 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <oejt4c$7us$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #418349 |
Dne 06/05/2017 v 06:37 Helmut Wabnig napsal(a): > On Fri, 5 May 2017 13:27:26 -0700 (PDT), Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> > wrote: > > > You know nothing. > > GPS was already up and running before they had any of above formulas. > > You are not capable of doing anything useful. So, do you say the GPS satellites were launched before the World War I ? As Schwarzschild created his metric in 1915, while he was serving as a artillery lieutenant during the German campaign against Russia. -- Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer ) A wise man guards words he says, as they say about him more, than he says about the subject.
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| From | Bordamos Alamidade <dd@dsmdawo.ab> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-07 18:18 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <oenode$1gt4$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #418363 |
Poutnik wrote: >> GPS was already up and running before they had any of above formulas. >> You are not capable of doing anything useful. > > So, do you say the GPS satellites were launched before the World War I ? > As Schwarzschild created his metric in 1915, while he was serving as a > artillery lieutenant during the German campaign against Russia. Typical reaction of a stupid troll, coming up with something completely else, unrelated to the discussions in this group. A moderator would have been kicking you out for long. If for nothing, just bewcause you are extreme stupid.
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| From | pnalsing@gmail.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-07 20:41 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <7851ab82-f92f-4d7a-85e7-caa765cc8f47@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #418572 |
On Sunday, May 7, 2017 at 11:18:26 AM UTC-7, Bordamos Alamidade wrote: > Poutnik wrote: > > >> GPS was already up and running before they had any of above formulas. > >> You are not capable of doing anything useful. > > > > So, do you say the GPS satellites were launched before the World War I ? > > As Schwarzschild created his metric in 1915, while he was serving as a > > artillery lieutenant during the German campaign against Russia. > > Typical reaction of a stupid troll, coming up with something completely > else, unrelated to the discussions in this group. A moderator would have > been kicking you out for long. If for nothing, just bewcause you are > extreme stupid. Are you a new dumbfuck here, or are you the same old dumbfuck with yet a new name?
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| From | mlwozniak@wp.pl |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 22:20 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <27fdc58c-b25b-4468-bf2c-94e99214d188@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #418287 |
W dniu piątek, 5 maja 2017 22:27:28 UTC+2 użytkownik Paparios napisał: > El viernes, 5 de mayo de 2017, 17:04:43 (UTC-3), Kevin Aylward escribió: > > "Poutnik" wrote in message news:oeg340$hn$1@dont-email.me... > > > >It is not empirical, but predicted one. > > >And you do need GR to say why particularly 38 us. > > > > No you don't. Look mate, I design analog asics for high performance crystal > > oscillators (www.rakon.com) > > > > We measure every single oscillator over temperature and calibrate the temp > > comp function generators to the vco to cancel the xtal temp variation. The > > temp residuals are all over the place, there is no neat little formula one > > can use. Its an arbitrary curve fit. That's the real world. > > > > Pretty much everything today is all real time calibration. Its all > > ADC->uP-DAC > > > > > > -- Kevin Aylward > > http://www.kevinaylward.co.uk/gr/index.html > > http://www.kevinaylward.co.uk/qm/index.html > > Not the GPS. The prediction of General Relativity regarding the GPS satellite > rate of clocks is as follows, based in the Schwarzschild metric > (See http://link.springer.com/article/10.12942/lrr-2003-1): Unfortunately, your Shit predicted also - directly - the indication of clocks, and real indications are - t'=t. Too bad for your Shit.
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| From | Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-06 00:07 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <oeiss2$2d4$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #418280 |
Dne 05/05/2017 v 22:04 Kevin Aylward napsal(a): > "Poutnik" wrote in message news:oeg340$hn$1@dont-email.me... > > >> It is not empirical, but predicted one. >> And you do need GR to say why particularly 38 us. > > No you don't. Look mate, I design analog asics for high performance > crystal oscillators (www.rakon.com) > > We measure every single oscillator over temperature and calibrate the > temp comp function generators to the vco to cancel the xtal temp > variation. The temp residuals are all over the place, there is no neat > little formula one can use. Its an arbitrary curve fit. That's the real > world. > > Pretty much everything today is all real time calibration. Its all > ADC->uP-DAC > Crystal oscillators are empirical, but not GR time dilation. -- Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer ) A wise man guards words he says, as they say about him more, than he says about the subject.
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| From | Prijzen Sörözésekre <ouwu@wueidewliiut.te> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 22:17 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <oeitmb$6k4$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #418304 |
Poutnik wrote: >> Pretty much everything today is all real time calibration. Its all >> ADC->uP-DAC > > Crystal oscillators are empirical, but not GR time dilation. You cannot consider yourself being too sexy, after saying such that. Time Dilation is more than likely MORE empirical than everything else, you may come up with. Or you dont know what that word stands for.
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| From | mlwozniak@wp.pl |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 22:21 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <c7316c5d-2385-4e5c-b4da-fc5ca8a76ad6@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #418304 |
W dniu sobota, 6 maja 2017 00:07:05 UTC+2 użytkownik Poutnik napisał: > Crystal oscillators are empirical, but not GR time dilation. GR time dilation is not empirical. A pure fantasy of a bunch of insane morons.
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| From | "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemovAT@kevinaylward.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-06 08:01 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <AqSdnVF1-O5H6ZDEnZ2dnUU7-YXNnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #418304 |
>"Poutnik" wrote in message news:oeiss2$2d4$1@dont-email.me... >Dne 05/05/2017 v 22:04 Kevin Aylward napsal(a): >> "Poutnik" wrote in message news:oeg340$hn$1@dont-email.me... > > >>> It is not empirical, but predicted one. >>> And you do need GR to say why particularly 38 us. > >> No you don't. Look mate, I design analog asics for high performance >> crystal oscillators (www.rakon.com) > >> We measure every single oscillator over temperature and calibrate the >> temp comp function generators to the vco to cancel the xtal temp >> variation. The temp residuals are all over the place, there is no neat >> little formula one can use. Its an arbitrary curve fit. That's the real >> world. > >> Pretty much everything today is all real time calibration. Its all >> ADC->uP-DAC > >Crystal oscillators are empirical, but not GR time dilation. And your point is? -- Kevin Aylward http://www.kevinaylward.co.uk/gr/index.html http://www.kevinaylward.co.uk/qm/index.html
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| From | Poutnik <poutnik4nntp@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-06 09:39 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <oejue5$bap$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #418361 |
Dne 06/05/2017 v 09:01 Kevin Aylward napsal(a): >> "Poutnik" wrote in message news:oeiss2$2d4$1@dont-email.me... > >> Crystal oscillators are empirical, but not GR time dilation. > > And your point is? Not limited to physics: Scenarios that are not sufficiently described by a theory, or with insufficient data, are adjusted via empirical feedback. Scenarios that are sufficiently described by a theory and with sufficient data are managed by a theory prediction. As it is often cheaper, simpler, faster and needed to know in advance. Optional empirical feedback is then just an independent check. -- Poutnik ( The Pilgrim, Der Wanderer ) A wise man guards words he says, as they say about him more, than he says about the subject.
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