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The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism

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  The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2018-06-19 14:46 +0200
    Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Zprávn Udoucih <zpnvn@nwinst.ce> - 2018-06-19 17:28 +0000
      Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2018-06-19 20:10 +0200
        Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Alan Folmsbee <omnilobe@gmail.com> - 2018-06-19 14:38 -0700
          Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2018-06-20 18:44 +0200
          Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Oren Woodcock <uw@osiweoq.lp> - 2018-06-29 22:49 +0000
        Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Oren Woodcock <uw@osiweoq.lp> - 2018-06-29 22:54 +0000
          Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2018-06-30 12:04 +0200
            Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Oren Woodcock <uw@osiweoq.lp> - 2018-06-30 13:12 +0000
              Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2018-07-01 21:03 +0200
                Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2018-07-01 13:46 -0700
                  Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Thomas Heger <ttt_heg@web.de> - 2018-07-02 19:45 +0200
    Re: The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2018-07-03 09:01 -0700

#461706 — The purpose of the Antikythera mechanism

Hi Ng

recently I had an idea about the origin and the purpose of the 
Antikythera mechanism.

see - for instance - this video:

"These Ancient Relics Are So Advanced They Shouldn't Exist..."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAsWFgpvYhA

The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain 
constellation of the planets.

But who could make use of this?


The possible solution:

time travelers would need something similar.

Reason:

Supposed you were sent back in time and you arrive somewhere way back in 
the past. How would you find out, where exactly you are?

You could ask someone for the date and that person would eventually answer:
we have now the tenth day of the seventh month of the year 3456
(if he would answer at all).

But what does that mean in B.C. ????

Not that easy to find out, if you think about it. But the exact date 
would be of mayor importance for time-travelers, since the position in 
time would be important for the 'journey' back home.

If you miss the destination in the past by a few years, then returning 
would be difficult, if not impossible.

So such a traveler would need something to figure out the exact date in 
his own 'home zone' units.

Since observation of the stars and planets would be somehow possible, 
the calculation of the date would still be really difficult .

To provide some assistance to the time traveler, the authorities, that 
sent him out, could eventually have ordered to build such a machine like 
the  Antikythera mechanism.

Smartphone with an appropriate app would have been better, but possible 
those have not yet been invented.

But astronomic clocks of some sophistication were feasible (besides time 
machines, of course).

So good watchmakers from the early 20th century would be a good bet (as 
origin).

TH

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#461719

Thomas Heger wrote:

> The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain
> constellation of the planets. But who could make use of this? 
> The possible solution: time travelers would need something similar.

entirely bullcrap, what you say inhere. Have you a definition of "time", 
before you engage in "time travel"??

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#461724

Am 19.06.2018 um 19:28 schrieb Zprávn Udoucih:
> Thomas Heger wrote:
> 
>> The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain
>> constellation of the planets. But who could make use of this?
>> The possible solution: time travelers would need something similar.
> 
> entirely bullcrap, what you say inhere. Have you a definition of "time",
> before you engage in "time travel"??
> 

Actually I have.

But what has 'definition of time' to do with 'Antikythera mechanism' ?

The idea was, that some sort of time-traveler had such a machine with 
him. The purpose of the device would then be to measure the actual date 
of the local environment of arrival (in home units of the time traveler).

This would - if true - certainly justify some amount of effort, which is 
necessary to develop and build such a machine.

Other uses are not that obvious. At least I cannot think of anything 
else, which is more plausible.

The use as measuring device for time-travlers would also solve the 
riddle about the producers and the origin of their knowledge in 
astronomy and mechanical engineering.

We simply had to look for something much closer in time. Eventually 
modern times watchmakers constructed this thing in some kind of hidden 
factories (like 'black ops').

E.g. Swiss make good watches. So 'Swiss Made' would be a first possible 
assumption (but other sources are - of course - also possible, which 
would include 'aliens' or 'parallel universes').

To test this idea we only had to look, if Swiss watches occur in other 
circumstances related to time travel.


TH

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#461745

> Have you a definition of "time",
> before you engage in "time travel"??

Time is a part of gravity and time travel is impossible.
Gravity travel may be possible, but time is
the fraction of gravity that goes out where space goes into matter.

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#461861

Am 19.06.2018 um 23:38 schrieb Alan Folmsbee:
>> Have you a definition of "time",
>> before you engage in "time travel"??
> 
> Time is a part of gravity and time travel is impossible.
> Gravity travel may be possible, but time is
> the fraction of gravity that goes out where space goes into matter.
> 

'is impossible' is not easy to prove in science.

(Usually there is someone, who shows, that allegedly impossible things 
are in fact possible.)

So how would you like to prove, that time is 'part of gravity'?????

Gravity may eventually be related to time. But I would not say, that 
gravity causes time - eventually time causes gravity.

I  - personally - think about time as a local measure.

What we call 'time' is actually counting of repeated events, we find in 
nature and which we regard as occurring with natural frequency.

But how could we know, if the length of a second/ the frequency of these 
events is unchangeable?

We cannot really know, since if 'length of time units' could alter, we 
could not compare - say - shorter seconds with other seconds, since we 
always have only local seconds to compare with.

TH

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#463006

Alan Folmsbee wrote:

>> Have you a definition of "time", before you engage in "time travel"??
> 
> Time is a part of gravity and time travel is impossible.
> Gravity travel may be possible, but time is the fraction of gravity that
> goes out where space goes into matter.

It sounds like a horror movie.

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#463008

Thomas Heger wrote:

>>> The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain
>>> constellation of the planets. But who could make use of this?
>>> The possible solution: time travelers would need something similar.
>> 
>> entirely bullcrap, what you say inhere. Have you a definition of
>> "time", before you engage in "time travel"??
>
> Actually I have. But what has 'definition of time' to do with
> 'Antikythera mechanism'? The idea was, that some sort of time-traveler
> had such a machine with him.

How can you travel in time, once you don't define that time, you say are 
capable to travel through. You have to come up with a MECHANISM, not 
poetry.

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#463038

Am 30.06.2018 um 00:54 schrieb Oren Woodcock:
> Thomas Heger wrote:
> 
>>>> The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain
>>>> constellation of the planets. But who could make use of this?
>>>> The possible solution: time travelers would need something similar.
>>>
>>> entirely bullcrap, what you say inhere. Have you a definition of
>>> "time", before you engage in "time travel"??
>>
>> Actually I have. But what has 'definition of time' to do with
>> 'Antikythera mechanism'? The idea was, that some sort of time-traveler
>> had such a machine with him.
> 
> How can you travel in time, once you don't define that time, you say are
> capable to travel through. You have to come up with a MECHANISM, not
> poetry.
> 

Well, ok...

https://docs.google.com/present/view?id=dd8jz2tx_3gfzvqgd6

TH

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#463050

Thomas Heger wrote:

> Am 30.06.2018 um 00:54 schrieb Oren Woodcock:
>> Thomas Heger wrote:
>> 
>>>>> The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain
>>>>> constellation of the planets. But who could make use of this?
>>>>> The possible solution: time travelers would need something similar.
>>>>
>>>> entirely bullcrap, what you say inhere. Have you a definition of
>>>> "time", before you engage in "time travel"??
>>>
>>> Actually I have. But what has 'definition of time' to do with
>>> 'Antikythera mechanism'? The idea was, that some sort of time-traveler
>>> had such a machine with him.
>> 
>> How can you travel in time, once you don't define that time, you say
>> are capable to travel through. You have to come up with a MECHANISM,
>> not poetry.
>
> Well, ok...
> https://docs.google.com/present/view?id=dd8jz2tx_3gfzvqgd6

Woe, you decay to links. I see no mechanism.

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#463181

Am 30.06.2018 um 15:12 schrieb Oren Woodcock:

>>>
>>>>>> The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain
>>>>>> constellation of the planets. But who could make use of this?
>>>>>> The possible solution: time travelers would need something similar.
>>>>>
>>>>> entirely bullcrap, what you say inhere. Have you a definition of
>>>>> "time", before you engage in "time travel"??
>>>>
>>>> Actually I have. But what has 'definition of time' to do with
>>>> 'Antikythera mechanism'? The idea was, that some sort of time-traveler
>>>> had such a machine with him.
>>>
>>> How can you travel in time, once you don't define that time, you say
>>> are capable to travel through. You have to come up with a MECHANISM,
>>> not poetry.
>>
>> Well, ok...
>> https://docs.google.com/present/view?id=dd8jz2tx_3gfzvqgd6
> 
> Woe, you decay to links. I see no mechanism.
> 

This is a link to my 'book' about a theory, which I have developed. It 
is called 'structured spacetime'.

The model would allow many timelines, hence would allow some sort of 
timetravel (at least in principle).


'mechanism' is apparently meant in connection to 'time-machine'.

But I have not built such a device, nor planning to do so.

BTW: physics is science and engineering is not.

Building a time-machine would belong to engineering.


TH

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#463193

Thomas Heger wrote:
> 
> Am 30.06.2018 um 15:12 schrieb Oren Woodcock:
> 
> >>>
> >>>>>> The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain
> >>>>>> constellation of the planets. But who could make use of this?
> >>>>>> The possible solution: time travelers would need something similar.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> entirely bullcrap, what you say inhere. Have you a definition of
> >>>>> "time", before you engage in "time travel"??
> >>>>
> >>>> Actually I have. But what has 'definition of time' to do with
> >>>> 'Antikythera mechanism'? The idea was, that some sort of time-traveler
> >>>> had such a machine with him.
> >>>
> >>> How can you travel in time, once you don't define that time, you say
> >>> are capable to travel through. You have to come up with a MECHANISM,
> >>> not poetry.
> >>
> >> Well, ok...
> >> https://docs.google.com/present/view?id=dd8jz2tx_3gfzvqgd6
> >
> > Woe, you decay to links. I see no mechanism.
> >
> 
> This is a link to my 'book' about a theory, which I have developed. It
> is called 'structured spacetime'.
> 
> The model would allow many timelines, hence would allow some sort of
> timetravel (at least in principle).
> 
> 'mechanism' is apparently meant in connection to 'time-machine'.
> 
> But I have not built such a device, nor planning to do so.
> 
> BTW: physics is science and engineering is not.
> 
> Building a time-machine would belong to engineering.
> 
> TH


Isn't time a machine?

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#463278

Am 01.07.2018 um 22:46 schrieb The Starmaker:
>>>>> How can you travel in time, once you don't define that time, you say
>>>>> are capable to travel through. You have to come up with a MECHANISM,
>>>>> not poetry.
>>>> Well, ok...
>>>> https://docs.google.com/present/view?id=dd8jz2tx_3gfzvqgd6
>>> Woe, you decay to links. I see no mechanism.
>>>
>> This is a link to my 'book' about a theory, which I have developed. It
>> is called 'structured spacetime'.
>>
>> The model would allow many timelines, hence would allow some sort of
>> timetravel (at least in principle).
>>
>> 'mechanism' is apparently meant in connection to 'time-machine'.
>>
>> But I have not built such a device, nor planning to do so.
>>
>> BTW: physics is science and engineering is not.
>>
>> Building a time-machine would belong to engineering.
>>
>> TH
> 
> Isn't time a machine?

Well, in a way...

But usually we use the term 'machine' for man-made devices. And time is 
certainly not man-made.

TH

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#463350

On Tuesday, June 19, 2018 at 8:47:00 AM UTC-4, Thomas Heger wrote:
> Hi Ng
> 
> recently I had an idea about the origin and the purpose of the 
> Antikythera mechanism.
> 
> see - for instance - this video:
> 
> "These Ancient Relics Are So Advanced They Shouldn't Exist..."
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAsWFgpvYhA
> 
> The device has a knob, which could be turned to crank in a certain 
> constellation of the planets.
> 
> But who could make use of this?
> 
> 
> The possible solution:
> 
> time travelers would need something similar.
> 
> Reason:
> 
> Supposed you were sent back in time and you arrive somewhere way back in 
> the past. How would you find out, where exactly you are?
[]
> To provide some assistance to the time traveler, the authorities, that 
> sent him out, could eventually have ordered to build such a machine like 
> the  Antikythera mechanism.
> 
> Smartphone with an appropriate app would have been better, but possible 
> those have not yet been invented.
> 
> But astronomic clocks of some sophistication were feasible (besides time 
> machines, of course).
> 
> So good watchmakers from the early 20th century would be a good bet (as 
> origin).
> 
> TH

Unfortunately, the craft of watchmaking is slowly dying.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-08-21/time-is-running-out-for-watchmakers-apprentices/7765752

Enjoy,
Ed

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