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Is the universe curved or flat?

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  Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-11 13:56 -0800
    Re: Is the universe curved or flat? David Staup <dstaup@charter.net> - 2015-12-11 16:34 -0600
    Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-11 15:16 -0800
      Re: Is the universe curved or flat? John Gogo <jfgogo22@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-11 17:10 -0800
    Re: Is the universe curved or flat? gilber34 <fafa@invalid.com> - 2015-12-11 18:40 -0600
      Re: Is the universe curved or flat? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2015-12-12 17:37 +0100
        Re: Is the universe curved or flat? Plexippus Kritikos <plexik@laertesegidio.org> - 2015-12-12 16:40 +0000
        Re: Is the universe curved or flat? gilber34 <fafa@invalid.com> - 2015-12-13 16:15 -0600
    Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-11 21:38 -0800
      Re: Is the universe curved or flat? "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2015-12-11 22:02 -0800
      Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-13 12:59 -0800
        Re: Is the universe curved or flat? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-13 15:05 -0600
          Re: Is the universe curved or flat? Jason Wyome <jasonw@hotmail.org> - 2015-12-13 21:52 +0000
          Re: Is the universe curved or flat? Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-12-13 22:54 +0100
          Re: Is the universe curved or flat? benj <none@gmail.com> - 2015-12-14 02:26 -0500
        Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-13 18:40 -0800
          Re: Is the universe curved or flat? mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2015-12-13 23:25 -0800
        Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-14 13:04 -0800
          Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-15 14:24 -0800
            Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-15 15:16 -0800
              Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-15 15:34 -0800
                Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-16 23:15 -0800
                Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-19 09:11 -0800
                  Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-19 10:20 -0800
                    Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-25 08:48 -0800
                      Re: Is the universe curved or flat? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2015-12-27 23:03 -0800
              Re: Is the universe curved or flat? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-15 18:59 -0600
            Re: Is the universe curved or flat? Sam Wormley <swormley1@gmail.com> - 2015-12-15 18:46 -0600
            Re: Is the universe curved or flat? John Gogo <jfgogo22@yahoo.com> - 2015-12-15 21:42 -0800
    Is the universe curved or flat? David Fuller <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-20 06:16 -0800
      Is the universe curved or flat? David Fuller <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2015-12-20 06:33 -0800
      Re: Is the universe curved or flat? Ezra Farrow <ezrafa@dubtechno.org> - 2015-12-20 20:02 +0000
    Re: Is the universe curved or flat? alsor@interia.pl - 2015-12-20 08:55 -0800

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#371837 — Is the universe curved or flat?

if you say both, i'll shoot myself!

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#371839

On 12/11/2015 3:56 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
>
promise?

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#371840

The Starmaker wrote:
> 
> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!



i bet you a million doallars Sam Wormley  doesn't know..he's probably 'looking it up' right now!


{that's how you get rid of terroists, you gotta keep them on the run...)

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#371852

On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 5:16:07 PM UTC-6, The Starmaker wrote:
> The Starmaker wrote:
> > 
> > if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> 
> 
> 
> i bet you a million doallars Sam Wormley  doesn't know..he's probably 'looking it up' right now!
> 
> 
> {that's how you get rid of terroists, you gotta keep them on the run...)

Flat.  There are no bending around curves when it comes to light.

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#371849

On 12/11/2015 3:56 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
>

it is flat,
until you get near the edge,
then it is curved,
I think it curves up last time I looked.

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#371898

gilber34 wrote:

> On 12/11/2015 3:56 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> 
> it is flat,

Presumably, yes.  So far, measurements show that the observable universe is 
flat.  Unfortunately, we cannot look beyond that, so we have to defer to 
what geometry, relativity, and quantum mechanics have to say about the rest.

> until you get near the edge,

There is no edge; a flat universe is implicitly infinite in size.

> then it is curved, I think it curves up last time I looked.

Sorry to break this to you, but your padded cell is _not_ the universe.

F'up2 <news:sci.physics.relativity>


PointedEars
-- 
Q: What did the nuclear physicist post on the laboratory door
   when he went camping?  
A: 'Gone fission'.
(from: WolframAlpha)

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#371899

Il giorno mercoledì Sat, 12 Dec 2015 17:37:08 +0100, Thomas 'PointedEars'
Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> ha scritto:

>> until you get near the edge,
> 
> There is no edge; a flat universe is implicitly infinite in size.

This looks like sheer cretinism, but somehow in a different way.

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#371959

On 12/12/2015 10:37 AM, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> gilber34 wrote:
>
>> On 12/11/2015 3:56 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>>> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
>>
>> it is flat,
>
> Presumably, yes.  So far, measurements show that the observable universe is
> flat.  Unfortunately, we cannot look beyond that, so we have to defer to
> what geometry, relativity, and quantum mechanics have to say about the rest.
>
>> until you get near the edge,
>
> There is no edge; a flat universe is implicitly infinite in size.
>
>> then it is curved, I think it curves up last time I looked.
>
> Sorry to break this to you, but your padded cell is _not_ the universe.

but it is my observable Universe,

the floor is flat

and it curves up at the walls.

You think you know everything.

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#371875

Sam Wormley wrote:
> 
> On 12/11/15 4:02 PM, Double-A wrote:
> > On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 1:56:08 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> >> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> >
> >
> > Flat.
> >
> > Double-A
> >
> 
>    Double-A is correct. WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
>    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.
> 


I don't understand what you are saying, is space curve or flat? It has to be either one or the other.


Is space curve or flat?

Is space 

A. curve

or

B. flat


Which is the correct answer? A or B?

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#371877

On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 9:38:04 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> Sam Wormley wrote:
> > 
> > On 12/11/15 4:02 PM, Double-A wrote:
> > > On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 1:56:08 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> > >> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> > >
> > >
> > > Flat.
> > >
> > > Double-A
> > >
> > 
> >    Double-A is correct. WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
> >    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.
> > 
> 
> 
> I don't understand what you are saying, is space curve or flat? It has to be either one or the other.
> 
> 
> Is space curve or flat?
> 
> Is space 
> 
> A. curve
> 
> or
> 
> B. flat
> 
> 
> Which is the correct answer? A or B?

It's like a mathematical infinitesimal.  

It is simply utterly fine-grained yet 
still exists.  You accept there is the 
Democritan atom and even quarks that 
make up it (then that Technicolor is 
quarks all the way down).  So, the 
curvature is flat and the flatness is 
curved, of Euclidean and here Minkowskian 
space-time, that is then Lobachevskyan 
or Riemannian or as about Connes geometry 
mostly the first two more globally and 
the Connes more of things that are very 
large.  

Basically things that are so huge and so 
fast start bringing part of space along 
with them, and your advised opinion of 
your abstract observer yourself in your 
thought experiments is one of these things, 
but only in your mind.  Keep it in your mind.

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#371952

The Starmaker wrote:
> 
> Sam Wormley wrote:
> >
> > On 12/11/15 4:02 PM, Double-A wrote:
> > > On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 1:56:08 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> > >> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> > >
> > >
> > > Flat.
> > >
> > > Double-A
> > >
> >
> >    Double-A is correct. WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
> >    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.
> >
> 
> I don't understand what you are saying, is space curve or flat? It has to be either one or the other.
> 
> Is space curve or flat?
> 
> Is space
> 
> A. curve
> 
> or
> 
> B. flat
> 
> Which is the correct answer? A or B?


Didn't Einstein say space is curved not flat???

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#371953

On 12/13/15 2:59 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> Didn't Einstein say space is curved not flat???


   Einstein's general theory of relativity says that mass warps
   spacetime. Verified with many tests.

   On the cosmic scale, WMAP nailed down the curvature of space
   to within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.

-- 

sci.physics is an unmoderated newsgroup dedicated
to the discussion of physics, news from the physics
community, and physics-related social issues.

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#371955

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Sam Wormley wrote:

> On 12/13/15 2:59 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>> Didn't Einstein say space is curved not flat???
> 
>    Einstein's general theory of relativity says that mass warps
>    spacetime. Verified with many tests.
>    On the cosmic scale, WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
>    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.

This scares me, since that number can only get smaller and smaller. Right 
after Big Bang took place, that must had been 100% curved. Hence also, at 
the time humans were created that number were say down to 60%. But still, 
imagine how much Relativity those people knew at that time. Much more than 
Einstein and the nowadays relativity promoters know.

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#371956

Użytkownik "Sam Wormley"  napisał w wiadomości grup 
dyskusyjnych:jK6dnT8RsYnjQPDLnZ2dnUU7-VGdnZ2d@giganews.com...


|   Einstein's general theory of relativity says that mass warps
|   spacetime. Verified with many tests.

And it says that going through a forest from your
point of view you're seeing you're stationary
and trees are runing around.
Verified by zilions of test.

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#371990

On 12/13/2015 04:05 PM, Sam Wormley wrote:
> On 12/13/15 2:59 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>> Didn't Einstein say space is curved not flat???
>
>
>    Einstein's general theory of relativity says that mass warps
>    spacetime. Verified with many tests.
>
>    On the cosmic scale, WMAP nailed down the curvature of space
>    to within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.

So genius. Here's an interesting Freshman problem for you. Given that 
"space" is observed to be 0.4% deviated from "flat", what is the 
smallest diameter of a hypersphere universe that can be found due to 
this measurement?

We'll wait right here for your answer.

-- 

       ___           ___           ___            ___
      /\  \         /\  \         /\__\          /\  \
     /::\  \       /::\  \       /::|  |         \:\  \
    /:/\:\  \     /:/\:\  \     /:|:|  |     ___ /::\__\
   /::\~\:\__\   /::\~\:\  \   /:/|:|  |__  /\  /:/\/__/
  /:/\:\ \:|__| /:/\:\ \:\__\ /:/ |:| /\__\ \:\/:/  /
  \:\~\:\/:/  / \:\~\:\ \/__/ \/__|:|/:/  /  \::/  /
   \:\ \::/  /   \:\ \:\__\       |:/:/  /    \/__/
    \:\/:/  /     \:\ \/__/       |::/  /
     \::/__/       \:\__\         /:/  /
      ~~            \/__/         \/__/

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#371976

The Starmaker wrote:
> 
> The Starmaker wrote:
> >
> > Sam Wormley wrote:
> > >
> > > On 12/11/15 4:02 PM, Double-A wrote:
> > > > On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 1:56:08 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> > > >> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Flat.
> > > >
> > > > Double-A
> > > >
> > >
> > >    Double-A is correct. WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
> > >    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.
> > >
> >
> > I don't understand what you are saying, is space curve or flat? It has to be either one or the other.
> >
> > Is space curve or flat?
> >
> > Is space
> >
> > A. curve
> >
> > or
> >
> > B. flat
> >
> > Which is the correct answer? A or B?
> 
> Didn't Einstein say space is curved not flat???


or is it everybody disagrees with Einstein?


I mean, Albert Einstein said: space is curved not flat.


Was he wrong?

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#371989

W dniu poniedziałek, 14 grudnia 2015 03:40:11 UTC+1 użytkownik The Starmaker napisał:
> The Starmaker wrote:
> > 
> > The Starmaker wrote:
> > >
> > > Sam Wormley wrote:
> > > >
> > > > On 12/11/15 4:02 PM, Double-A wrote:
> > > > > On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 1:56:08 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> > > > >> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Flat.
> > > > >
> > > > > Double-A
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >    Double-A is correct. WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
> > > >    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.
> > > >
> > >
> > > I don't understand what you are saying, is space curve or flat? It has to be either one or the other.
> > >
> > > Is space curve or flat?
> > >
> > > Is space
> > >
> > > A. curve
> > >
> > > or
> > >
> > > B. flat
> > >
> > > Which is the correct answer? A or B?
> > 
> > Didn't Einstein say space is curved not flat???
> 
> 
> or is it everybody disagrees with Einstein?
> 

Did Jesus Christ say:
a)love your neighbour
b)burn the dick at the stake
?
Followers of gurus of all sort always agree
with them, but rarely read, what they said,
and almost never understand, what they read.

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#372028

The Starmaker wrote:
> 
> The Starmaker wrote:
> >
> > Sam Wormley wrote:
> > >
> > > On 12/11/15 4:02 PM, Double-A wrote:
> > > > On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 1:56:08 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> > > >> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Flat.
> > > >
> > > > Double-A
> > > >
> > >
> > >    Double-A is correct. WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
> > >    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.
> > >


this wmac cmb jazz was created by a couple of radio DJ's...i don't trust those drug addicts.


there is no proof that the cmb was cause by a big bang. that's just...speculation.


it couldda been somthin else.

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#372098

The Starmaker wrote:
> 
> The Starmaker wrote:
> >
> > The Starmaker wrote:
> > >
> > > Sam Wormley wrote:
> > > >
> > > > On 12/11/15 4:02 PM, Double-A wrote:
> > > > > On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 1:56:08 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> > > > >> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Flat.
> > > > >
> > > > > Double-A
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >    Double-A is correct. WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
> > > >    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.
> > > >
> 
> this wmac cmb jazz was created by a couple of radio DJ's...i don't trust those drug addicts.
> 
> there is no proof that the cmb was cause by a big bang. that's just...speculation.
> 
> it couldda been somthin else.


For example...

this thing called WMAP or CMB...

microwave background????

We are talking about 'radio dj's'!


The background is not 'microwave'...it's RADIO waves.


That's why there is no heat...it's music, not fire.


That stuff in the backgound is just a lot of noise.

You gotta ask yourself a question...
Why am I the only one
in the world bringing this up????


Radio waves, not microwaves.


You guys gotta go back to the drawing board and start all over again...



come back when you're ready.

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#372103

The Starmaker wrote:
> 
> The Starmaker wrote:
> >
> > The Starmaker wrote:
> > >
> > > The Starmaker wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Sam Wormley wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > On 12/11/15 4:02 PM, Double-A wrote:
> > > > > > On Friday, December 11, 2015 at 1:56:08 PM UTC-8, The Starmaker wrote:
> > > > > >> if you say both, i'll shoot myself!
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Flat.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Double-A
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >    Double-A is correct. WMAP nailed down the curvature of space to
> > > > >    within 0.4% of "flat" Euclidean.
> > > > >
> >
> > this wmac cmb jazz was created by a couple of radio DJ's...i don't trust those drug addicts.
> >
> > there is no proof that the cmb was cause by a big bang. that's just...speculation.
> >
> > it couldda been somthin else.
> 
> For example...
> 
> this thing called WMAP or CMB...
> 
> microwave background????
> 
> We are talking about 'radio dj's'!
> 
> The background is not 'microwave'...it's RADIO waves.
> 
> That's why there is no heat...it's music, not fire.
> 
> That stuff in the backgound is just a lot of noise.


"While working on a new type of antenna at Bell Labs in Holmdel
Township, New Jersey, they found a source of noise in the atmosphere
that they could not explain."



Notice the word "noise"?  "noise in the atmosphere"...


noise


    1.
    a sound, especially one that is loud or unpleasant or that causes
disturbance. Like a big bang!



That music they are playing on the radio sounds like a lot of noise...


but if you smoke grass....it sounds like Pink Floyd music.

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