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Groups > sci.electronics.design > #461231 > unrolled thread
| Started by | "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2017-05-22 03:02 -0500 |
| Last post | 2017-05-31 17:53 -0400 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 140 — 18 participants |
Back to article view | Back to sci.electronics.design
Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-22 03:02 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-22 03:51 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-22 08:26 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-22 21:23 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2017-05-23 14:07 +1000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2017-05-23 12:00 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2017-05-24 08:48 +1000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-23 16:53 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-27 17:22 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-27 17:55 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-28 11:48 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 12:39 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2017-05-28 16:02 +1000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-28 07:46 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-28 11:56 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 12:43 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-22 21:18 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-23 03:36 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-23 07:31 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-23 20:02 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-23 21:07 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-24 18:50 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? George Herold <gherold@teachspin.com> - 2017-05-22 06:25 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-22 07:13 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-22 08:21 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? bitrex <bitrex@de.lete.earthlink.net> - 2017-05-23 00:07 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-22 21:22 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-25 10:40 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-25 18:03 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-25 14:41 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-26 09:07 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-26 14:24 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-26 08:38 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-26 10:08 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-26 10:19 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-26 12:15 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-26 12:29 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-26 13:41 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-26 16:21 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-26 19:05 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-26 19:09 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 09:58 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-27 06:13 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-27 05:51 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-27 12:11 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-27 10:12 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-27 13:25 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-27 12:13 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-28 07:57 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2017-05-27 21:14 +0100
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-27 19:24 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-28 07:50 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-28 04:55 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-28 17:57 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-27 19:53 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-27 20:15 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-28 08:04 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-27 21:32 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-28 04:13 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-28 06:29 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-28 06:46 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-28 07:19 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 09:18 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-28 14:19 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 09:34 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 09:44 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 09:49 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 09:59 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 10:36 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 10:58 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-28 12:07 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 13:22 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-28 13:06 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-28 12:26 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 13:19 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 13:19 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Lasse Langwadt Christensen <langwadt@fonz.dk> - 2017-05-28 13:44 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 13:49 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-28 14:05 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-28 14:10 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 16:22 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-28 19:37 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 18:41 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-29 00:36 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-29 05:22 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-29 07:50 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2017-05-30 07:44 +1000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-29 18:33 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-29 15:25 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-29 15:31 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-29 15:32 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-30 15:14 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-30 17:05 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-30 17:33 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-30 18:53 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-30 22:04 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2017-05-31 10:11 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-31 10:27 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2017-05-31 10:39 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-31 08:25 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-31 08:31 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-31 08:50 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-31 22:34 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nezumi.demon.co.uk> - 2017-05-31 15:50 +0100
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-31 22:38 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-31 08:19 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-30 21:36 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2017-05-31 16:01 +1000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-31 17:46 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-30 21:56 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-31 05:01 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-31 09:03 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-31 07:09 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-31 14:23 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-31 10:30 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-31 08:38 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-31 14:21 +0000
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2017-05-31 17:00 +0200
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-31 08:14 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-31 08:40 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-31 17:49 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2017-05-28 14:30 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2017-05-28 15:14 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 15:25 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-28 16:23 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-28 08:03 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-30 15:18 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-30 23:27 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-26 12:33 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highland_snip_technology.com> - 2017-05-26 10:14 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-27 06:10 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-27 08:11 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-28 07:53 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2017-05-28 08:06 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-28 12:13 -0400
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-27 16:38 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-31 09:37 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> - 2017-05-31 13:50 -0500
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2017-05-31 12:12 -0700
Re: Can we PLEASE stop using these shitty symbols? krw@notreal.com - 2017-05-31 17:53 -0400
Page 3 of 7 — ← Prev page 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 7 Next page →
| From | Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-26 19:09 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <itnhicl2pkq14mlmq943cvkm9ugtddsrc0@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #461937 |
On 26 May 2017 19:05:09 -0700, Winfield Hill
<hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote:
>Jim Thompson wrote...
>> Winfield Hill wrote:
>>> Jim Thompson wrote...
>>>>
>>>> I've never seen that style of symbol on a datasheet.
>>>> Examples?
>>>
>>> LP5907, rev l, section 7.2 Date: 2012
>>> OPA192, rev a, Figure 43. Date: 2013
>>> OPA192, rev e, Figure 63.
>>> OPA197, Figure 50.
>>> OPA2325, rev e, Figure 47, 49.
>>> SM72295, rev e, front page (shows external MOSFETs)
>>> LMV7235, NSC version, page 2. Date: 2001
>>> LMV7235, rev n, section 8.2 Hah, with p-channel circle
>>>
>>> That's an LDO, some opamps, an H-bridge and a
>>> comparator. Just skinning the surface.
>>
>> OK. Whatever rings your chime... non-standard
>> for the hackers >:-}
>
> Yep, TI is one massive 80-billion-dollar hacker.
> I figured you'd blame Massachusetts liberals.
> Standards evolve, Jim. Although I found a 2001
> example (earlier ones no doubt exist), most were
> within the last five years. Picking up steam
> now, maybe our book will push it a bit. Also, no
> more p-channel gate circles were seen after 2001.
How do you rationalize that "diode" representation with a
bidirectional analog switch?
...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | |
| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
Thinking outside the box... producing elegant solutions.
"It is not in doing what you like, but in liking what you do that
is the secret of happiness." -James Barrie
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-28 09:58 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <cuvliclqv4982nos6ji7ndlto36fg1gqdm@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #461937 |
On 26 May 2017 19:05:09 -0700, Winfield Hill
<hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote:
>Jim Thompson wrote...
>> Winfield Hill wrote:
>>> Jim Thompson wrote...
>>>>
>>>> I've never seen that style of symbol on a datasheet.
>>>> Examples?
>>>
>>> LP5907, rev l, section 7.2 Date: 2012
>>> OPA192, rev a, Figure 43. Date: 2013
>>> OPA192, rev e, Figure 63.
>>> OPA197, Figure 50.
>>> OPA2325, rev e, Figure 47, 49.
>>> SM72295, rev e, front page (shows external MOSFETs)
>>> LMV7235, NSC version, page 2. Date: 2001
>>> LMV7235, rev n, section 8.2 Hah, with p-channel circle
>>>
>>> That's an LDO, some opamps, an H-bridge and a
>>> comparator. Just skinning the surface.
>>
>> OK. Whatever rings your chime... non-standard
>> for the hackers >:-}
>
> Yep, TI is one massive 80-billion-dollar hacker.
TI's TINA doesn't use that symbol. That symbol likely got into a
datasheet because datasheets are typically NOT created by the
designer. I had all kinds of issues with Motorola's datasheet
department @#$%-ing up the proper representation of my designs.
> I figured you'd blame Massachusetts liberals.
Cut the crap Win, I thought you more intelligent than spewing that
kind of remark.
> Standards evolve, Jim. Although I found a 2001
> example (earlier ones no doubt exist), most were
> within the last five years. Picking up steam
> now, maybe our book will push it a bit. Also, no
> more p-channel gate circles were seen after 2001.
Why don't you use the IEEE STANDARD symbol... that's so easily
understandable ?>:-}
"Push it" all you want... the more clueless engineers out there, the
better my business.
...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | |
| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
Thinking outside the box... producing elegant solutions.
"It is not in doing what you like, but in liking what you do that
is the secret of happiness." -James Barrie
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 06:13 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <ogbmr3$ra6$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #461868 |
"Winfield Hill" <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote in message news:oga3tr01qp1@drn.newsguy.com... > Jim Thompson wrote... >> >> I've never seen that style of symbol on a datasheet. >> Examples? > > LP5907, rev l, section 7.2 Date: 2012 > OPA192, rev a, Figure 43. Date: 2013 > OPA192, rev e, Figure 63. > OPA197, Figure 50. > OPA2325, rev e, Figure 47, 49. > SM72295, rev e, front page (shows external MSOFETs) > LMV7235, NSC version, page 2. Date: 2001 > LMV7235, rev n, section 8.2 Hah, with p-channel circle > > That's an LDO, some opamps, an H-bridge and a > comparator. Just skinning the surface. Hah! LP5907 shows a diode junction going into a channel, with an antiparallel diode across it! Which one is it? Apparently it's a diode both ways! :-D Tim -- Seven Transistor Labs, LLC Electrical Engineering Consultation and Contract Design Website: http://seventransistorlabs.com
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 05:51 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <ogbsog01oru@drn.newsguy.com> |
| In reply to | #461973 |
Tim Williams wrote...
>
> Winfield Hill wrote ..
>> Jim Thompson wrote...
>>>
>>> I've never seen that style of symbol on a datasheet.
>>> Examples?
>>
>> LP5907, rev l, section 7.2 Date: 2012
>> OPA192, rev a, Figure 43. Date: 2013
>> OPA192, rev e, Figure 63.
>> OPA197, Figure 50.
>> OPA2325, rev e, Figure 47, 49.
>> SM72295, rev e, front page (shows external MSOFETs)
>> LMV7235, NSC version, page 2. Date: 2001
>> LMV7235, rev n, section 8.2 Hah, with p-channel circle
>>
>> That's an LDO, some opamps, an H-bridge and a
>> comparator. Just skinning the surface.
>
> Hah! LP5907 shows a diode junction going into a
> channel, with an antiparallel diode across it!
>
> Which one is it? Apparently it's a diode both ways! :-D
No, it's done correctly. The arrow on the FET is
for current-flow direction and tells us this is a
p-channel FET acting as the pass transistor. The
body diode is correctly shown. If the input falls
below the output, the diode will conduct. Adding a
diode like this is often recommended for other IC
regulators, so it's useful to know one is included.
--
Thanks,
- Win
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| From | rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 12:11 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <ogc8a0$gq3$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #461981 |
Winfield Hill wrote on 5/27/2017 8:51 AM: > Tim Williams wrote... >> >> Winfield Hill wrote .. >>> Jim Thompson wrote... >>>> >>>> I've never seen that style of symbol on a datasheet. >>>> Examples? >>> >>> LP5907, rev l, section 7.2 Date: 2012 >>> OPA192, rev a, Figure 43. Date: 2013 >>> OPA192, rev e, Figure 63. >>> OPA197, Figure 50. >>> OPA2325, rev e, Figure 47, 49. >>> SM72295, rev e, front page (shows external MSOFETs) >>> LMV7235, NSC version, page 2. Date: 2001 >>> LMV7235, rev n, section 8.2 Hah, with p-channel circle >>> >>> That's an LDO, some opamps, an H-bridge and a >>> comparator. Just skinning the surface. >> >> Hah! LP5907 shows a diode junction going into a >> channel, with an antiparallel diode across it! >> >> Which one is it? Apparently it's a diode both ways! :-D > > No, it's done correctly. The arrow on the FET is > for current-flow direction and tells us this is a > p-channel FET acting as the pass transistor. The > body diode is correctly shown. If the input falls > below the output, the diode will conduct. Adding a > diode like this is often recommended for other IC > regulators, so it's useful to know one is included. I've been reading this thread and I can't say I get what all the fuss is about. The symbols you are saying aren't needed have two more line segments. Why is it so important to remove them? We don't draw symbols by hand very often anymore. Where is the advantage of making the symbol very slightly more simple? -- Rick C
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| From | pcdhobbs@gmail.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 10:12 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <b9dfe944-baad-4f0f-8c11-076f562774f3@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #461996 |
>The symbols you are saying aren't needed have two more line >segments. Why is it so important to remove them? We don't draw symbols >by hand very often anymore. Whadda ya mean "we", bub? ;) When doing electronics, my primary output is paper schematics and parts lists, which Beautiful Layout Hunchback turns into PCB designs. The present wrangle is mostly among people who _do_ draw schematics by hand a lot. The Big-Endians (Win, John L, and their fellow travellers) value simplicity most, whereas the Little-Endians (JT, moi, and a faithful remnant) value accurate depiction of circuit behaviour most. >Where is the advantage of making the symbol >very slightly more simple? The BJT-ish symbols are faster to draw, so Big-Endians prefer them. Their deviation from the the correct view naturally impairs their hand-eye coordination as well as their aesthetic judgement. Cheers Comrade Snowball (whoops, wrong team) ;)
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| From | rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 13:25 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <ogccki$vrq$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #462002 |
pcdhobbs@gmail.com wrote on 5/27/2017 1:12 PM: >> The symbols you are saying aren't needed have two more line >> segments. Why is it so important to remove them? We don't draw symbols >> by hand very often anymore. > > Whadda ya mean "we", bub? ;) > > When doing electronics, my primary output is paper schematics and parts lists, which Beautiful Layout Hunchback turns into PCB designs. > > The present wrangle is mostly among people who _do_ draw schematics by hand a lot. The Big-Endians (Win, John L, and their fellow travellers) value simplicity most, whereas the Little-Endians (JT, moi, and a faithful remnant) value accurate depiction of circuit behaviour most. > >> Where is the advantage of making the symbol >> very slightly more simple? > > The BJT-ish symbols are faster to draw, so Big-Endians prefer them. Their deviation from the the correct view naturally impairs their hand-eye coordination as well as their aesthetic judgement. Actually, reading your post made me realize the difference is not two line segments, but just one. ONE LINE SEGMENT!!! It is the sort of thing that is not even worth thinking about. -- Rick C
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| From | Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 12:13 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <74jjiclbb94ugamkikov1shahjaeb71out@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #462002 |
On Sat, 27 May 2017 10:12:34 -0700 (PDT), pcdhobbs@gmail.com wrote:
>>The symbols you are saying aren't needed have two more line
>>segments. Why is it so important to remove them? We don't draw symbols
>>by hand very often anymore.
>
>Whadda ya mean "we", bub? ;)
>
>When doing electronics, my primary output is paper schematics and parts lists, which Beautiful Layout Hunchback turns into PCB designs.
>
>The present wrangle is mostly among people who _do_ draw schematics by hand a lot. The Big-Endians (Win, John L, and their fellow travellers) value simplicity most, whereas the Little-Endians (JT, moi, and a faithful remnant) value accurate depiction of circuit behaviour most.
>
>>Where is the advantage of making the symbol
>>very slightly more simple?
>
>The BJT-ish symbols are faster to draw, so Big-Endians prefer them. Their deviation from the the correct view naturally impairs their hand-eye coordination as well as their aesthetic judgement.
>
>Cheers
>
>Comrade Snowball
>
>(whoops, wrong team) ;)
Out of curiosity (>:-} I examined all the schematic entry software I
have on hand and compared symbols (Cadence Virtuoso from an Image, I
don't personally own a copy)...
<http://www.analog-innovations.com/SED/MOS_Symbol_Comparison.pdf>
Note that Cadence Virtuoso _does_ use an arrow to mark sources, but
then doesn't indicate body diode polarity :-(
(I personally despise Cadence Virtuoso, it's GUI is profoundly worse
that even that of LTspice.)
I think Win's symbol "...maybe our book will push it a bit." is a
mistake without also showing the body connection, inviting confusion
with an IGBT symbol... but, as you say, the "Big-Endians" will be
happy (which crowd is where Win's book is aimed ;-)
...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | |
| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
Thinking outside the box... producing elegant solutions.
"It is not in doing what you like, but in liking what you do that
is the secret of happiness." -James Barrie
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| From | "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-28 07:57 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <ogeh9c$ss9$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #462010 |
"Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in message news:74jjiclbb94ugamkikov1shahjaeb71out@4ax.com... > Out of curiosity (>:-} I examined all the schematic entry software I > have on hand and compared symbols (Cadence Virtuoso from an Image, I > don't personally own a copy)... > > <http://www.analog-innovations.com/SED/MOS_Symbol_Comparison.pdf> > > Note that Cadence Virtuoso _does_ use an arrow to mark sources, but > then doesn't indicate body diode polarity :-( Oh! My! God! Surely you can't get any more wrong than that! Just to add to the mix: Altium and Multisim use the "right" kind -- with substrate and source shown, and tied. Some also add the redundant antiparallel diode, but oh well. Tim -- Seven Transistor Labs, LLC Electrical Engineering Consultation and Contract Design Website: http://seventransistorlabs.com
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| From | Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 21:14 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <H6lWA.138500$lG2.9512@fx11.am4> |
| In reply to | #462002 |
On 27/05/17 18:12, pcdhobbs@gmail.com wrote: >> The symbols you are saying aren't needed have two more line >> segments. Why is it so important to remove them? We don't draw symbols >> by hand very often anymore. > > Whadda ya mean "we", bub? ;) > > When doing electronics, my primary output is paper schematics and parts lists, which Beautiful Layout Hunchback turns into PCB designs. > > The present wrangle is mostly among people who _do_ draw schematics by hand a lot. The Big-Endians (Win, John L, and their fellow travellers) value simplicity most, whereas the Little-Endians (JT, moi, and a faithful remnant) value accurate depiction of circuit behaviour most. To me, other than as an input to other tools, the principal value of a schematic is to convey meaning and understanding of a circuit's operation. If the symbols and/or arrangements on the diagram do that, then they are satisfactory. If not, they they should be revised. If the symbols and/or arrangements confuse of mislead, then they should be binned. The original symbol/diagram creators are, of course, going to think their creations are wonderful - and so they are unfit to decide whether they are satisfactory.
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| From | Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 19:24 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <ogdcdh02btc@drn.newsguy.com> |
| In reply to | #462002 |
pcdhobbs@gmail.com wrote...
>
> The BJT-ish symbols are faster to draw, so Big-Endians
> prefer them. Their deviation from the correct view
> naturally impairs their hand-eye coordination as well
> as their aesthetic judgement.
Bah, humbug. I don't believe in a single symbol, and
use the full symbol whenever it's useful. My preference
has only a little to do with being faster to draw, but
lots to do with reducing drawing clutter, so it can be
more quickly comprehended. A clear simple drawing,
without leaving out anything critical, is very useful.
--
Thanks,
- Win
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| From | Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-28 07:50 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <ogdvfr$1998$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #462036 |
On a sunny day (27 May 2017 19:24:49 -0700) it happened Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote in <ogdcdh02btc@drn.newsguy.com>: >pcdhobbs@gmail.com wrote... >> >> The BJT-ish symbols are faster to draw, so Big-Endians >> prefer them. Their deviation from the correct view >> naturally impairs their hand-eye coordination as well >> as their aesthetic judgement. > > Bah, humbug. I don't believe in a single symbol, and > use the full symbol whenever it's useful. My preference > has only a little to do with being faster to draw, but > lots to do with reducing drawing clutter, so it can be > more quickly comprehended. A clear simple drawing, > without leaving out anything critical, is very useful. There are many aspects and most paint only part of the elephant. There is more to those symbols then just the design process there is also the service process, having been repairing all sorts of high - and low end stuff for many years, you want the technician who has to repair it to be able to understand the circuit too. It is not just about inside chips, he could not care less. So the requirements are different. These days they do not supply circuit diagram anymore, not sure about service manuals, I have seen people just swap out units. What a waste (financially too), repairing at component level is well, environmentally friendly. Sometimes I hear about those pencil drawing I make, 'cannot read it' apart from people trying to read it with a Nipkow disk or similar, those are all things I draw so I can build it, and most important 10 years later repair it (hundreds of wires often, if one does break on both sides you are in trouble). So I use it to build it, and I use it to repair it, trouble shoot if there is any. For the IC designer 'to repair it' has no meaning and he can make his own symbols. Jim Thompson could have used 'D' for DMOS and not 'O' (as in inverter), but he is free as nobody else in the outside world will use his drawings. I should be using some graphics program to draw stuff, but that requires a peesee, and I have no peesee on when I am soldering, and last time I used a printer was to print a map of some place hidden in the boonies where I had to pick something up. Whiteboards are too big, paper is patient, part of the last circuit diagram got dissolved as it was under a wet coffee cup. Luckily there was enough space left: http://panteltje.com/pub/took_a_byte_IMG_6210.JPG
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-28 04:55 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <ogedru01cfn@drn.newsguy.com> |
| In reply to | #462048 |
Jan Panteltje wrote...
>
> last time I used a printer was to print a map ...
> Whiteboards are too big, paper is patient, part of the
> last circuit diagram got dissolved as it was under a
> wet coffee cup. Luckily there was enough space left:
> http://panteltje.com/pub/took_a_byte_IMG_6210.JPG
Snork! I assume you have one of the cheap all-in-one
ink-jet printers. They're nice to save scans of your
valuable pencil sketches, and print copies that you
can mistreat with solder burns, or whatever. Copies
are useful for recording measurement notes as well.
I got an HP 7525 for $125 at Costco, good features,
full duplex on printing and scanning, etc. Just be
careful with the ink usage, they make $$ back there.
--
Thanks,
- Win
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| From | Jan Panteltje <pNa0nStpealmtje@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-28 17:57 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <ogf331$10u7$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #462054 |
On a sunny day (28 May 2017 04:55:42 -0700) it happened Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote in <ogedru01cfn@drn.newsguy.com>: >Jan Panteltje wrote... >> >> last time I used a printer was to print a map ... >> Whiteboards are too big, paper is patient, part of the >> last circuit diagram got dissolved as it was under a >> wet coffee cup. Luckily there was enough space left: >> http://panteltje.com/pub/took_a_byte_IMG_6210.JPG > > Snork! I assume you have one of the cheap all-in-one > ink-jet printers. They're nice to save scans of your > valuable pencil sketches, and print copies that you > can mistreat with solder burns, or whatever. Copies > are useful for recording measurement notes as well. I have a Epson R200, I did a lot of CD printing in color (it has a flatbed flap for that). But that project ended, In those times I bought a set of bottles and an ink feed system from these guys: http://www.continuousink.com/ the bottles are still half full, enough for thousands of pages I think... It is a good printer, but gets easily clogged up. I have done PCB layouts on transparent (single sided) with it too. And then the caustic soda and etching thing ... For the small one of proto experiments I make now I just use veroboard. Works just a well or better, no stains in the kitchen, easy to change. In my job I just had the PCBs made, sometimes including layout. > I got an HP 7525 for $125 at Costco, good features, > full duplex on printing and scanning, etc. Just be > careful with the ink usage, they make $$ back there. > > >-- > Thanks, > - Win >
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| From | John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 19:53 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <ugekic1m0gu89il4dtn4d5asn8k7qm58en@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #462002 |
On Sat, 27 May 2017 10:12:34 -0700 (PDT), pcdhobbs@gmail.com wrote: >>The symbols you are saying aren't needed have two more line >>segments. Why is it so important to remove them? We don't draw symbols >>by hand very often anymore. > >Whadda ya mean "we", bub? ;) > >When doing electronics, my primary output is paper schematics and parts lists, which Beautiful Layout Hunchback turns into PCB designs. > >The present wrangle is mostly among people who _do_ draw schematics by hand a lot. The Big-Endians (Win, John L, and their fellow travellers) value simplicity most, whereas the Little-Endians (JT, moi, and a faithful remnant) value accurate depiction of circuit behaviour most. > >>Where is the advantage of making the symbol >>very slightly more simple? > >The BJT-ish symbols are faster to draw, so Big-Endians prefer them. Their deviation from the the correct view naturally impairs their hand-eye coordination as well as their aesthetic judgement. > >Cheers > >Comrade Snowball > >(whoops, wrong team) ;) It's not a matter of hand-vs-CAD drawing; all my schematics will be CAD files fairly early in the process. I like the insulated-gate-bipolar symbol because it's instantly, intuitively obvious which way the current will flow. I'm not so much interested in the semiconductor physics as feeling how the circuit works. The convention that p-type devices have their sources/emitters up, and n-types down, helps a lot. But sometimes transistors work better sideways. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
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| From | Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 20:15 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <j5gkic1oek6bsk784tsgbvi5gsti8q5s57@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #462037 |
On Sat, 27 May 2017 19:53:42 -0700, John Larkin
<jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> wrote:
>On Sat, 27 May 2017 10:12:34 -0700 (PDT), pcdhobbs@gmail.com wrote:
>
>>>The symbols you are saying aren't needed have two more line
>>>segments. Why is it so important to remove them? We don't draw symbols
>>>by hand very often anymore.
>>
>>Whadda ya mean "we", bub? ;)
>>
>>When doing electronics, my primary output is paper schematics and parts lists, which Beautiful Layout Hunchback turns into PCB designs.
>>
>>The present wrangle is mostly among people who _do_ draw schematics by hand a lot. The Big-Endians (Win, John L, and their fellow travellers) value simplicity most, whereas the Little-Endians (JT, moi, and a faithful remnant) value accurate depiction of circuit behaviour most.
>>
>>>Where is the advantage of making the symbol
>>>very slightly more simple?
>>
>>The BJT-ish symbols are faster to draw, so Big-Endians prefer them. Their deviation from the the correct view naturally impairs their hand-eye coordination as well as their aesthetic judgement.
>>
>>Cheers
>>
>>Comrade Snowball
>>
>>(whoops, wrong team) ;)
>
>It's not a matter of hand-vs-CAD drawing; all my schematics will be
>CAD files fairly early in the process.
>
>I like the insulated-gate-bipolar symbol because it's instantly,
>intuitively obvious which way the current will flow. I'm not so much
>interested in the semiconductor physics as feeling how the circuit
>works.
>
>The convention that p-type devices have their sources/emitters up, and
>n-types down, helps a lot. But sometimes transistors work better
>sideways.
Only snag... often, in analog applications, current flows both ways.
...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson | mens |
| Analog Innovations | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| STV, Queen Creek, AZ 85142 Skype: skypeanalog | |
| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
Thinking outside the box... producing elegant solutions.
"It is not in doing what you like, but in liking what you do that
is the secret of happiness." -James Barrie
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | "Tim Williams" <tiwill@seventransistorlabs.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-28 08:04 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <ogehmd$u3t$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #462040 |
"Jim Thompson" <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> wrote in message news:j5gkic1oek6bsk784tsgbvi5gsti8q5s57@4ax.com... >>The convention that p-type devices have their sources/emitters up, and >>n-types down, helps a lot. But sometimes transistors work better >>sideways. > > Only snag... often, in analog applications, current flows both ways. Like my kneejerk reaction to that LDO with the "lefty" symbol and the antiparallel diode... it's a diode both ways?!? No, wait.. oh... @*%$ Tim -- Seven Transistor Labs, LLC Electrical Engineering Consultation and Contract Design Website: http://seventransistorlabs.com
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| From | pcdhobbs@gmail.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-27 21:32 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <f3c21660-1ce9-4c0d-8509-010397e4e5c3@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #462037 |
> I like the insulated-gate-bipolar symbol because it's instantly, >intuitively obvious which way the current will flow. I'm not so much >interested in the semiconductor physics as feeling how the circuit >works. The current flows as it does because of the device physics and bias conditions, not because of a magic symbol. I and the other right-thinking Little-Endians prefer the symbols that better express the way the devices actually work, over a range of conditions wider than the Big-Endian symbol can. Cheers Phil Hobbs
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| From | Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-28 04:13 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <ogebcr0196g@drn.newsguy.com> |
| In reply to | #462041 |
pcdhobbs@gmail.com wrote...
>
> I and the other right-thinking Little-Endians prefer the symbols
> that better express the way the devices actually work, over a
> range of conditions wider than the Big-Endian symbol can.
I don't think you use many MOSFETs in your designs, certainly
not power MOSFETs. In contrast, other designs increasingly
using many power MOSFETs, so clutter and clarity is an issue.
These days it's hard to get a discrete MOSFET with an available
substrate pin, and none of the power MOSFETs have one. This
limits the value of a symbol highlighting the substrate path.
If the substrate diode comes into play, it's more useful to
actually show the diode as part of the symbol. I've seen many
cases where the full-fledged classic MOSFET symbol has been
supplemented with the diode. This may be redundant,* but it
comes about because the designer knows that many aren't always
aware of the diode aspect of the substrate part of the symbol,
and he wants to be sure diode action is not overlooked. Ahem,
would right-thinking Little-Endians eschew showing the diode?
* One other aspect, this diode is drawn in place even though
there's a chance of confusion, is this another required part?
--
Thanks,
- Win
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| From | pcdhobbs@gmail.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-28 06:29 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <d47671dd-fc6b-45f8-b0b0-cd3a666dd4a3@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #462053 |
> If the substrate diode comes into play, it's more useful to >actually show the diode as part of the symbol. I've seen many >cases where the full-fledged classic MOSFET symbol has been > supplemented with the diode. This may be redundant,* but it > comes about because the designer knows that many aren't always > aware of the diode aspect of the substrate part of the symbol, > and he wants to be sure diode action is not overlooked. Ahem, >would right-thinking Little-Endians eschew showing the diode? >* One other aspect, this diode is drawn in place even though >there's a chance of confusion, is this another required part? The symbol with the
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