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Groups > sci.electronics.design > #429491 > unrolled thread

current monitor

Started byJohn Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com>
First post2016-09-27 09:45 -0700
Last post2016-10-02 00:01 -0400
Articles 7 on this page of 27 — 16 participants

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  current monitor John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2016-09-27 09:45 -0700
    Re: current monitor Syd Rumpo <usenet@nononono.co.uk> - 2016-09-27 18:09 +0100
    Re: current monitor Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2016-09-27 10:17 -0700
    Re: current monitor George Herold <gherold@teachspin.com> - 2016-09-27 11:10 -0700
      Re: current monitor whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com> - 2016-09-27 11:34 -0700
        Re: current monitor rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2016-09-27 18:49 -0400
        Re: current monitor Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2016-09-28 07:39 -0700
          Re: current monitor Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2016-09-28 07:42 -0700
            Re: current monitor George Herold <gherold@teachspin.com> - 2016-09-28 09:57 -0700
              Re: current monitor Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-The-Envelope-Icon@On-My-Web-Site.com> - 2016-09-28 10:01 -0700
                Re: current monitor Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2016-09-29 12:42 -0700
    Re: current monitor papabear546@gmail.com - 2016-09-27 14:17 -0700
      Re: current monitor John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2016-09-27 16:36 -0700
    Re: current monitor Johann Klammer <klammerj@NOSPAM.a1.net> - 2016-09-28 00:38 +0200
    Re: current monitor Reinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com> - 2016-09-28 11:21 +0800
    Re: current monitor Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2016-09-28 09:52 -0700
      Re: current monitor John Larkin <jjlarkin@highlandtechnology.com> - 2016-09-28 20:44 -0700
    Re: current monitor Robert Roland <fake@ddress.no> - 2016-09-28 22:45 +0200
      Re: current monitor krw <krw@nowhere.com> - 2016-09-29 13:00 -0400
        Re: current monitor "P E Schoen" <paul@pstech-inc.com> - 2016-09-30 18:32 -0400
          Re: current monitor Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2016-09-30 18:53 -0700
            Re: current monitor Neon John <no@never.com> - 2016-10-01 10:30 -0400
              Re: current monitor Winfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu> - 2016-10-01 09:13 -0700
                Re: current monitor Klaus Kragelund <klauskvik@hotmail.com> - 2016-10-02 14:07 -0700
                  Re: current monitor klaus.kragelund@gmail.com - 2016-10-02 14:54 -0700
            Re: current monitor rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2016-10-01 10:33 -0400
              Re: current monitor "P E Schoen" <paul@pstech-inc.com> - 2016-10-02 00:01 -0400

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#430001

FromWinfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu>
Date2016-09-30 18:53 -0700
Message-ID<nsn4un02mn8@drn.newsguy.com>
In reply to#429983
P E Schoen wrote...
>
> You might also consider an analog Hall effect sensor
> you can glue to a PCB over a track. Less than a dollar:
>http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Texas-Instruments/DRV5053EAQLPGM

 An elegant idea, Paul.  But the 20kHz bandwidth
 is lacking.  A current transformer does better
 than that and is also isolated.


-- 
 Thanks,
    - Win

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#430035

FromNeon John <no@never.com>
Date2016-10-01 10:30 -0400
Message-ID<lehvub50n00a20kkjcummr09h1u7h3h858@4ax.com>
In reply to#430001
On 30 Sep 2016 18:53:27 -0700, Winfield Hill
<hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote:

> An elegant idea, Paul.  But the 20kHz bandwidth
> is lacking.  A current transformer does better
> than that and is also isolated.

I strongly suggest you take the advice of someone else in this thread
and take a look at the Allegro hall effect sensors.  Here's the one I
use in my induction heaters.

http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/allegro-microsystems-llc/ACS758ECB-200B-PFF-T/620-1323-ND/2042748

I replaced a shunt and an CT.  It allowed me to correctly high side
sense for my buck converter power controller.  with a 150kHz
bandwidth, it also showed me some stuff that the CT rolled off that
was important to the reliability of the units.

John

John DeArmond
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.tnduction.com 
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
See website for email address

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#430052

FromWinfield Hill <hill@rowland.harvard.edu>
Date2016-10-01 09:13 -0700
Message-ID<nsonat02hek@drn.newsguy.com>
In reply to#430035
Neon John wrote...
>
>On 30 Sep 2016 18:53:27 -0700, Winfield Hill
><hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote:
>
>> An elegant idea, Paul.  But the 20kHz bandwidth
>> is lacking.  A current transformer does better
>> than that and is also isolated.
>
> I strongly suggest you take the advice of someone
> else in this thread and take a look at the Allegro
> hall effect sensors.  Here's the one I use in my
> induction heaters.  allegro-microsystems  ACS758

 Thanks, John, I missed seeing that.  I like the
 serious look of the package, but I'm puzzled why
 they don't offer one with leads prebent for SMT.
 The 50A lowest FS range is an issue, with a 100mA
 DC offset.  But I guess many apps can figure out
 their own specific offset.


-- 
 Thanks,
    - Win

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#430156

FromKlaus Kragelund <klauskvik@hotmail.com>
Date2016-10-02 14:07 -0700
Message-ID<9dc71189-5d78-4552-b2f6-2cab62c1c4a0@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#430052
On Saturday, October 1, 2016 at 6:13:30 PM UTC+2, Winfield Hill wrote:
> Neon John wrote...
> >
> >On 30 Sep 2016 18:53:27 -0700, Winfield Hill
> ><hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> An elegant idea, Paul.  But the 20kHz bandwidth
> >> is lacking.  A current transformer does better
> >> than that and is also isolated.
> >
> > I strongly suggest you take the advice of someone
> > else in this thread and take a look at the Allegro
> > hall effect sensors.  Here's the one I use in my
> > induction heaters.  allegro-microsystems  ACS758
> 
>  Thanks, John, I missed seeing that.  I like the
>  serious look of the package, but I'm puzzled why
>  they don't offer one with leads prebent for SMT.
>  The 50A lowest FS range is an issue, with a 100mA
>  DC offset.  But I guess many apps can figure out
>  their own specific offset.
> 

You can get a +/- 40A part in SMD SOIC8. It has 80kHz bandwidth

ACS723:

http://www.allegromicro.com/~/media/files/datasheets/acs723-datasheet.ashx


Cheers

Klaus

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#430159

Fromklaus.kragelund@gmail.com
Date2016-10-02 14:54 -0700
Message-ID<c182f4e6-90bb-434b-a668-42d64178bd11@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#430156
On Sunday, 2 October 2016 23:08:17 UTC+2, Klaus Kragelund  wrote:
> On Saturday, October 1, 2016 at 6:13:30 PM UTC+2, Winfield Hill wrote:
> > Neon John wrote...
> > >
> > >On 30 Sep 2016 18:53:27 -0700, Winfield Hill
> > ><hill@rowland.harvard.edu> wrote:
> > >
> > >> An elegant idea, Paul.  But the 20kHz bandwidth
> > >> is lacking.  A current transformer does better
> > >> than that and is also isolated.
> > >
> > > I strongly suggest you take the advice of someone
> > > else in this thread and take a look at the Allegro
> > > hall effect sensors.  Here's the one I use in my
> > > induction heaters.  allegro-microsystems  ACS758
> > 
> >  Thanks, John, I missed seeing that.  I like the
> >  serious look of the package, but I'm puzzled why
> >  they don't offer one with leads prebent for SMT.
> >  The 50A lowest FS range is an issue, with a 100mA
> >  DC offset.  But I guess many apps can figure out
> >  their own specific offset.
> > 
Normally you would do a offset nulling of the current sensor during power-up or regulary, since it has an offset voltage for 0A anyway

Cheers

Klaus

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#430036

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2016-10-01 10:33 -0400
Message-ID<nsoheo$u7k$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#430001
On 9/30/2016 9:53 PM, Winfield Hill wrote:
> P E Schoen wrote...
>>
>> You might also consider an analog Hall effect sensor
>> you can glue to a PCB over a track. Less than a dollar:
>> http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Texas-Instruments/DRV5053EAQLPGM
>
>  An elegant idea, Paul.  But the 20kHz bandwidth
>  is lacking.  A current transformer does better
>  than that and is also isolated.

I think whether 20 kHz is limiting depends on your application. 
Transformers tend to be rather large compared to a TO-92.

-- 

Rick C

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#430132

From"P E Schoen" <paul@pstech-inc.com>
Date2016-10-02 00:01 -0400
Message-ID<nsq0qg$g0c$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#430036
"rickman"  wrote in message news:nsoheo$u7k$1@dont-email.me...

> On 9/30/2016 9:53 PM, Winfield Hill wrote:
>> P E Schoen wrote...
>>
>>> You might also consider an analog Hall effect sensor you can glue to a 
>>> PCB over a track. Less than a dollar:
>>> http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Texas-Instruments/DRV5053EAQLPGM
>
>>  An elegant idea, Paul.  But the 20kHz bandwidth is lacking.  A current 
>> transformer does better than that and is also isolated.

> I think whether 20 kHz is limiting depends on your application. 
> Transformers tend to be rather large compared to a TO-92.

Also transformers require a break in the track on the PCB.

Here's one good to 40 kHz:
http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/187/honeywell-sensing-ss39et-ss49e-ss59et-datasheet-00-947415.pdf

And another but only 10 kHz:
http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/115/AH49E-271509.pdf

These are probably the same sort of device as used in the transformer type:
http://sensing.honeywell.com/honeywell-sensing-cslt-series-product-sheet-005862-2-en.pdf

However that unit has 3 uSec typical response.

Paul

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