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Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor?

From <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org>
Newsgroups sci.electronics.design
Subject Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor?
Date 2018-10-07 07:15 +0000
Organization Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID <ppcbra$vom$1@gioia.aioe.org> (permalink)
References (4 earlier) <c18d12de-b30e-447b-936b-d34fa4bf1ac9@googlegroups.com> <pp9j7h$pb2$1@gioia.aioe.org> <e69083cc-7e60-4662-80c9-5f10c9efeb3a@googlegroups.com> <ppaktg$g5m$1@gioia.aioe.org> <f09c086c-2acd-4670-9879-352509784207@googlegroups.com>

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gnuarm wrote
>> >On Saturday, October 6, 2018 at 2:03:33 AM UTC-4, 69883925...@nospam.org
>wrote:
>> Adding an extra resistor would need one more board modification no?
>> I drive SPI clock directly from for example a PIC output,
>> the point being that to have that pullup power as you state,
>> taken from the other SPI lines and !CE would be low,
>> seems not possible to me, looking at that chip I see no big caps either.
>>
>> It is different if they have power on that thing.
>
>Big caps???  The clock line is high for half a bit time on every bit.  Why do
>you need "big" caps?  I expect the small capacitance needed could have been
>included in the one device.

So you are suggesting they are using the existing clock?
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_Peripheral_Interface

For that 'thing' to actually send data it must set clock high and then low again,
you cannot pull yourself up by the hairs.
You cannot have a circuit powered from a positive supply generated by its own output FYI.
Something to do with conserva/// or perpet...


>They may not use a resistor, they may not vampire power from the data lines.
> We don't know much about how the device worked.  I was suggesting what could
>be possible. 
>
>I don't see the resistor being a problem really.  If you modify the layout and
>the automated optical inspection configuration, it is very unlikely anyone


OK, if you can modify the board (= circuit) the all bets are off.

I would think, as a spy-master why not just monitor the databits and send on some Gigle-Hertz to a nearby listening device (car, whatever)
has been done to tap consulates with transmitters powered from microwave beams..
However on a board like this plenty of power available if you can route it.
When sci.crypt was more fun there were references to listening systems that used the RFI from computers
to decode decrypted stuff, to view what was on the screen (passwords) etc etc, just recently I did read an other paper on that.

Of course it is fun to be able to just query the data via some IP address, or have it send to the mother-land at given times
on some IP address, but then you do not wan the SPI bus, but more likely
have modified firmware in one of the processor interface chips, east-brdge . west bridge what was it, processor updates ;-).
I think that is also what US is doing.
I see my top secret invasion plans with 'snort' leaving the system all the time...
Many many years ago somebody got really pissed in sci.crypt when I pointed that out... stepped on some tones I suppose.

Anyways there a zillion ways to get at the data, and every big country is having a go at it (maybe small ones too).
It is a fun hobby, if war arrives I'd be glad to play.



>would spot your changes unless they compare the design to the original design
>files which is, I believe, how the hack was discovered.  Had the mod
>been between the board layers and top/bottom layer Gerbers where not changed,
>this likely would not have been discovered - at least not at Elemental.
> I think they said Apple discovered the hack by detecting aberrant network
>traffic which is what some here have suggested should have been noticed.

mm Apple, Steve Jobs tried selling his old stuff by saying the Macs were as powerful as what was used by the new-nuke-testing facilities in the US.
People buy that crap.

I seriously wonder if the story was true Apple's competence (was it an Apple board?) in controlling its own manufacturing.
it is more in the spirit of "let's move it all to the US and charge even more for the crap".
I have clicked my fingers to de-hypnotize those Apple buyers, but I need help,
it is stuck so deep in their brain,
lemme put it this way: DON'T YOU SEE APPLE IS DANGEROUS (click).


.

hehe


>Rick
>C.
>

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Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-10-05 09:29 +1000
  Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2018-10-05 01:14 +0100
  Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-04 19:31 -0700
  Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jan Panteltje <pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> - 2018-10-05 07:27 +0000
    Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Gene Filatov <evgeny.filatov@ieee.org> - 2018-10-05 11:12 +0300
      Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jan Panteltje <pNaOnStPeAlMtje@yahoo.com> - 2018-10-05 08:41 +0000
  Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-10-05 16:28 +0100
    Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2018-10-05 09:34 -0700
      Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2018-10-05 20:59 +0100
        Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-05 14:19 -0700
          Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2018-10-05 23:44 +0100
            Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-10-06 09:58 +1000
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Steve Wilson <no@spam.com> - 2018-10-06 00:39 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-10-06 12:50 +1000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-06 08:42 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-10-06 21:41 +1000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-06 14:59 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2018-10-06 09:10 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-06 16:44 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-06 16:46 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 19:34 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Rob <nomail@example.com> - 2018-10-06 13:46 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 05:12 -0700
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 04:36 -0700
            Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-10-06 14:50 -0400
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 19:43 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2018-10-08 13:58 -0400
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-08 20:04 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-09 07:03 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2018-10-09 12:13 +0100
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-09 22:52 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-10-10 10:06 +1100
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-10 19:06 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-10 18:43 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-11 12:16 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Gerhard Hoffmann <ghf@hoffmann-hochfrequenz.de> - 2018-10-11 14:50 +0200
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-11 13:51 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-11 08:35 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-11 15:56 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-11 13:24 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-11 21:24 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-11 20:43 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-12 07:38 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-12 08:55 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-12 16:48 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-12 10:22 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-12 16:49 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-12 16:53 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-12 10:27 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-12 23:46 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-12 17:10 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-13 02:13 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-12 22:29 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-13 09:14 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? +++ATH0 <news@ringpiece.local> - 2018-10-13 14:29 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2018-10-15 16:27 +0100
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-11 08:28 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-11 08:27 -0700
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-10-10 10:04 +1100
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? pcdhobbs@gmail.com - 2018-10-10 06:47 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-10 19:01 -0700
          Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> - 2018-10-06 06:03 +0000
            Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 05:17 -0700
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> - 2018-10-06 15:38 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 19:14 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> - 2018-10-07 07:15 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-07 08:13 -0700
          Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> - 2018-10-20 07:07 +0000
    Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2018-10-05 20:12 -0700
      Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-10-06 13:42 +1000
        Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2018-10-05 21:02 -0700
        Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? <698839253X6D445TD@nospam.org> - 2018-10-06 06:03 +0000
      Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-06 08:45 +0000
        Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2018-10-06 08:51 -0700
          Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-06 16:42 +0000
            Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Dimiter_Popoff <dp@tgi-sci.com> - 2018-10-06 19:55 +0300
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2018-10-06 19:29 +0100
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DLUNU <DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@DLU.org> - 2018-10-06 22:41 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Dimiter_Popoff <dp@tgi-sci.com> - 2018-10-07 02:07 +0300
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2018-10-07 11:56 +1100
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 20:06 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Johnny B Good <johnny-b-good@invalid.ntlworld.com> - 2018-10-07 03:46 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 22:04 -0700
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DLUNU <DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@DLU.org> - 2018-10-06 22:40 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Dimiter_Popoff <dp@tgi-sci.com> - 2018-10-07 02:05 +0300
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2018-10-07 01:36 +0100
            Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2018-10-06 20:14 -0700
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2018-10-07 08:07 +0100
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DLUNU <DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@DLU.org> - 2018-10-07 14:09 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2018-10-07 08:55 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-08 00:50 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-08 00:51 +0000
          Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-06 19:23 -0700
            Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DLUNU <DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@DLU.org> - 2018-10-07 13:52 +0000
              Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-07 08:18 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-08 00:52 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-08 00:54 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-07 22:20 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-08 08:20 +0000
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Cows are Nice <nice@cows.moo> - 2018-10-08 08:19 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2018-10-08 10:30 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com - 2018-10-08 19:57 -0700
                Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-09 06:51 +0000
      Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno@decadence.org - 2018-10-06 08:50 +0000
  Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? jurb6006@gmail.com - 2018-10-11 07:14 -0700
  Re: Supermicro server motherboards with hardware backdoor? Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2018-10-12 08:21 +0200

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