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Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option

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On Sun, May 07, 2017 at 11:08:19AM -0700, hpa@zytor.com wrote:
> On May 7, 2017 10:59:16 AM PDT, Ingo Molnar <mingo@kernel.org> wrote:
> >
> >* Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> wrote:
> >
> >> One instance of the structure would exist for each time the stack
> >> pointer changes, e.g. for every function entry, push/pop, and rsp
> >> add/subtract.  The data could be assembled and sorted offline,
> >possibly
> >> derived from DWARF, or more likely, generated by objtool.  After
> >doing
> >> some rough calculations, I think the section size would be comparable
> >to
> >> the sizes of the DWARF .eh_frame sections it would replace.
> >
> >That's something I've been thinking about as well: if objtool generates
> >the 
> >unwinder data structures then the kernel is not directly exposed to
> >tooling bugs 
> >anymore.
> >
> >A fair chunk of the fragility of DWARF comes from the fact that it's
> >generated by 
> >a tool chain that we cannot fix as part of the kernel project. If GCC
> >generates 
> >crap debuginfo, and GDB happens to work with it but the kernel not,
> >we'll have to 
> >work it around in the kernel. If GCC starts bloating debuginfo in the
> >future we 
> >are screwed as well, etc.
> >
> >If objtool generates debuginfo then it's _our_ responsibility to have
> >sane 
> >unwinder info and we obviously manage its structure and size as well.
> >Win-win.
> >
> >The unwinder itself should still do sanity checks, etc. (like all good
> >debugging 
> >infrastructure code) - but the nature of the kernel's exposure to tool
> >chain 
> >details changes in a very fundamental way.
> >
> >So yes, I think this is a very good idea, assuming it works in
> >practice! ;-)
> >
> >Thanks,
> >
> >	Ingo
> 
> Can objtool verify the unwinder at each address in the kernel, or is that an AI-complete problem?

It can't verify the *unwinder*, but it can verify the data which is fed
to the unwinder (either DWARF or the structs I proposed above).  For
each function, it follows every possible code path, and it can keep
track of the stack pointer while doing so.

-- 
Josh

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[PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Jiri Slaby <jslaby@suse.cz> - 2017-05-05 14:30 +0200
  Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2017-05-05 22:00 +0200
    Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Ingo Molnar <mingo@kernel.org> - 2017-05-06 09:30 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Jiri Slaby <jslaby@suse.cz> - 2017-05-10 09:50 +0200
    Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Jiri Kosina <jikos@kernel.org> - 2017-05-06 16:30 +0200
    Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Ingo Molnar <mingo@kernel.org> - 2017-05-07 23:50 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-07 23:50 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Vojtech Pavlik <vojtech@suse.com> - 2017-05-08 10:20 +0200
          Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-08 15:20 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option hpa@zytor.com - 2017-05-08 00:10 +0200
    Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-07 23:50 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net> - 2017-05-08 07:40 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Ingo Molnar <mingo@kernel.org> - 2017-05-08 08:20 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-08 16:50 +0200
          Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option hpa@zytor.com - 2017-05-08 21:10 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Andy Lutomirski <luto@kernel.org> - 2017-05-09 02:30 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-09 03:40 +0200
          Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Andy Lutomirski <luto@kernel.org> - 2017-05-09 04:40 +0200
            Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-09 05:40 +0200
              Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option hpa@zytor.com - 2017-05-09 12:10 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-09 17:00 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option "H.J. Lu" <hjl.tools@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 18:50 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Jiri Slaby <jslaby@suse.cz> - 2017-05-10 10:20 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-10 15:10 +0200
                Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option "H.J. Lu" <hjl.tools@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 18:30 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Jiri Kosina <jikos@kernel.org> - 2017-05-09 20:50 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-09 21:30 +0200
          Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Jiri Slaby <jslaby@suse.cz> - 2017-05-10 10:40 +0200
            Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-10 15:20 +0200
    Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Jiri Slaby <jslaby@suse.cz> - 2017-05-10 09:50 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Josh Poimboeuf <jpoimboe@redhat.com> - 2017-05-10 14:50 +0200
        Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Jiri Slaby <jslaby@suse.cz> - 2017-05-10 14:50 +0200
      Re: [PATCH 7/7] DWARF: add the config option Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org> - 2017-05-10 20:20 +0200

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