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Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome

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  Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> - 2020-03-25 00:30 +0100
    Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Liam O'Toole <liam.p.otoole@gmail.com> - 2020-03-25 00:40 +0100
      Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> - 2020-03-25 01:10 +0100
        Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2020-03-25 03:50 +0100
          Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome rhkramer@gmail.com - 2020-03-25 12:40 +0100
            Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome rhkramer@gmail.com - 2020-03-25 12:40 +0100
            Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> - 2020-03-27 12:40 +0100
        Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Liam O'Toole <liam.p.otoole@gmail.com> - 2020-03-25 21:10 +0100
          Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> - 2020-03-27 12:40 +0100
    Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2020-03-25 10:20 +0100
      Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> - 2020-03-27 12:40 +0100
    Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2020-03-25 12:00 +0100
      Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> - 2020-03-27 12:50 +0100
        Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2020-03-27 17:30 +0100
          Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome "Anil Felipe Duggirala" <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> - 2020-04-04 19:20 +0200
      Re: Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> - 2020-03-27 12:50 +0100

#220438 — Night light, sunset and sunrise times in Gnome

hello,
I am running Gnome in Debian Buster, which comes with the Night Light
feature. I have set up night light in the Sunset/Sunrise setting. I
have also correcly set my timezone (location?). My issue is, sunset is
coming and Night Light is gettin activated way after this time. I would
like to ask how I can know where the program is getting my location's
sunset time from?  Is there a way for me to check this? 
thank you,

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#220439

On Tue, 24 Mar, 2020 at 18:24:04 -0500, Anil Felipe Duggirala wrote:
> hello,
> I am running Gnome in Debian Buster, which comes with the Night Light
> feature. I have set up night light in the Sunset/Sunrise setting. I
> have also correcly set my timezone (location?). My issue is, sunset is
> coming and Night Light is gettin activated way after this time. I would
> like to ask how I can know where the program is getting my location's
> sunset time from?  Is there a way for me to check this? 
> thank you,
> 

Are the dawn and dusk times correct in the Night Light configuration window?

I have found that Night Light is activated very gradually. You won't see
an immediate and abrupt change at the relevant times.

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#220442

On Tue, 2020-03-24 at 23:31 +0000, Liam O'Toole wrote:
> Are the dawn and dusk times correct in the Night Light configuration
> window?
> 
There are two options. Manual or Sunset/Sunrise in Night light
settings. If I choose Sunset/Sunrise, I believe, the system is supposed
to get the Sunset/Sunrise times from some server online, based on some
location (I pressume this location is that of my time zone, however, I
belive one time zone can have different locations with different Sunset
times). That is why I am asking if there is some way I can know how the
program is getting its Sunset/Sunrise times. Or if maybe I have to
activate the Location service for this to work (if that is the case,
there should be some warning about this).

I do remember that Redshift used to require that you set a location in
order to have the automatic sunset/sunrise times working.

> I have found that Night Light is activated very gradually. You won't
> see
> an immediate and abrupt change at the relevant times.
> 

I am aware of the gradual change. The issue is that the change is
starting to happen a bit (about an hour) later than it should.

thank you..

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#220445

On Tue 24 Mar 2020 at 19:05:32 (-0500), Anil Felipe Duggirala wrote:
> On Tue, 2020-03-24 at 23:31 +0000, Liam O'Toole wrote:
> > Are the dawn and dusk times correct in the Night Light configuration
> > window?
> > 
> There are two options. Manual or Sunset/Sunrise in Night light
> settings. If I choose Sunset/Sunrise, I believe, the system is supposed
> to get the Sunset/Sunrise times from some server online, based on some
> location (I pressume this location is that of my time zone, however, I
> belive one time zone can have different locations with different Sunset
> times). That is why I am asking if there is some way I can know how the
> program is getting its Sunset/Sunrise times. Or if maybe I have to
> activate the Location service for this to work (if that is the case,
> there should be some warning about this).

Yes, what matters is the Location and the time in UTC. The timezone
would only be relevant if the computer had access only to Local Time,
in order to answer the question "Which Local Time?"

You don't need a server to calculate sunrise/sunset, just some equations.
https://www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/grad/solcalc/solareqns.PDF

One other factor that's not included in that calculation is the length
of twilight but, not knowing how long NightLight takes to adjust,
I don't know whether that's relevant. It might be if you flip from one
colour temperature to another at high latitudes, where twilight can
really last in summer—up to all night.

(I didn't see references to Dawn/Dusk in the images of NightLight online.)

> I do remember that Redshift used to require that you set a location in
> order to have the automatic sunset/sunrise times working.
> 
> > I have found that Night Light is activated very gradually. You won't
> > see
> > an immediate and abrupt change at the relevant times.
> 
> I am aware of the gradual change. The issue is that the change is
> starting to happen a bit (about an hour) later than it should.

Cheers,
David.

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#220471

On Tuesday, March 24, 2020 10:43:31 PM David Wright wrote:
> On Tue 24 Mar 2020 at 19:05:32 (-0500), Anil Felipe Duggirala wrote:
> > On Tue, 2020-03-24 at 23:31 +0000, Liam O'Toole wrote:
> > I do remember that Redshift used to require that you set a location in
> > order to have the automatic sunset/sunrise times working.
> > 
> > > I have found that Night Light is activated very gradually. You won't
> > > see
> > > an immediate and abrupt change at the relevant times.
> > 
> > I am aware of the gradual change. The issue is that the change is
> > starting to happen a bit (about an hour) later than it should.

IIUC, the program under discussion tries to predict the exact time of sunrise 
and sunset in your current location?

Just to amplify the importance of location (I'm sure most people on this list 
already know this), a time zone is about 1000 miles wide (east / west) at the 
equator and maybe up to even 50 degrees latitude (north or south), and that 
represents 60 minutes of time (and about 15 degrees of rotation of the earth).

Thus, an inaccuracy of ~17 (16 2/3) miles in your east/west location means an 
inaccuracy of 1 minute in time.

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#220472

On Wednesday, March 25, 2020 07:37:04 AM rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> Thus, an inaccuracy of ~17 (16 2/3) miles in your east/west location means
> an inaccuracy of 1 minute in time.

Oh, and if you're not familiar with things like twilight and false dawn, you 
should look into those....

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#220551

On Wed, 2020-03-25 at 07:37 -0400, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, March 24, 2020 10:43:31 PM David Wright wrote:
> > On Tue 24 Mar 2020 at 19:05:32 (-0500), Anil Felipe Duggirala
> wrote:
> > > On Tue, 2020-03-24 at 23:31 +0000, Liam O'Toole wrote:
> > > I do remember that Redshift used to require that you set a
> location in
> > > order to have the automatic sunset/sunrise times working.
> > > 
> > > > I have found that Night Light is activated very gradually. You
> won't
> > > > see
> > > > an immediate and abrupt change at the relevant times.
> > > 
> > > I am aware of the gradual change. The issue is that the change is
> > > starting to happen a bit (about an hour) later than it should.
> 
> IIUC, the program under discussion tries to predict the exact time of
> sunrise 
> and sunset in your current location?
> 
That is exactly what I am trying to establish. I am asking if anyone
knows how this program is deciding when to change display temperature.
Does anyone know?

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#220491

On Tue, 24 Mar, 2020 at 19:05:32 -0500, Anil Felipe Duggirala wrote:
> On Tue, 2020-03-24 at 23:31 +0000, Liam O'Toole wrote:
> > Are the dawn and dusk times correct in the Night Light configuration
> > window?
> > 
> There are two options. Manual or Sunset/Sunrise in Night light
> settings. If I choose Sunset/Sunrise, I believe, the system is supposed
> to get the Sunset/Sunrise times from some server online, based on some
> location (I pressume this location is that of my time zone, however, I
> belive one time zone can have different locations with different Sunset
> times). That is why I am asking if there is some way I can know how the
> program is getting its Sunset/Sunrise times. Or if maybe I have to
> activate the Location service for this to work (if that is the case,
> there should be some warning about this).
> 
> I do remember that Redshift used to require that you set a location in
> order to have the automatic sunset/sunrise times working.

[...]

Indeed. But, but when you select Sunset to Sunrise, are the times of
dawn and dusk correct or are they not?

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#220550

On Wed, 2020-03-25 at 20:05 +0000, Liam O'Toole wrote:
> On Tue, 24 Mar, 2020 at 19:05:32 -0500, Anil Felipe Duggirala wrote:
> > On Tue, 2020-03-24 at 23:31 +0000, Liam O'Toole wrote:
> > > Are the dawn and dusk times correct in the Night Light
> > > configuration
> > > window?
> > > 
> > There are two options. Manual or Sunset/Sunrise in Night light
> > settings. If I choose Sunset/Sunrise, I believe, the system is
> > supposed
> > to get the Sunset/Sunrise times from some server online, based on
> > some
> > location (I pressume this location is that of my time zone,
> > however, I
> > belive one time zone can have different locations with different
> > Sunset
> > times). That is why I am asking if there is some way I can know how
> > the
> > program is getting its Sunset/Sunrise times. Or if maybe I have to
> > activate the Location service for this to work (if that is the
> > case,
> > there should be some warning about this).
> > 
> > I do remember that Redshift used to require that you set a location
> > in
> > order to have the automatic sunset/sunrise times working.
> 
> [...]
> 
> Indeed. But, but when you select Sunset to Sunrise, are the times of
> dawn and dusk correct or are they not?
> 
No times are displayed in the settings when selecting Sunset/Sunrise.
That is precisely what I would like to know. I believe this Gnome Night
Light is based on Redshift, but its hard to get info on Gnome programs.
So I need to know what is wrong, my location, my clock, or the
calculation of Sunset/Sunrise.
thank you,

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#220459

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Ma, 24 mar 20, 18:24:04, Anil Felipe Duggirala wrote:
> hello,
> I am running Gnome in Debian Buster, which comes with the Night Light
> feature. I have set up night light in the Sunset/Sunrise setting. I
> have also correcly set my timezone (location?). My issue is, sunset is
> coming and Night Light is gettin activated way after this time. I would
> like to ask how I can know where the program is getting my location's
> sunset time from?  Is there a way for me to check this? 
> thank you,

One way to determine your location would be from some GeoIP database, 
based on your public IP.

If your ISP is allocating IPs as mine does this might (sometimes) be 
wildly inaccurate.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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#220553

On Wed, 2020-03-25 at 11:13 +0200, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> On Ma, 24 mar 20, 18:24:04, Anil Felipe Duggirala wrote:
> > hello,
> > I am running Gnome in Debian Buster, which comes with the Night
> > Light
> > feature. I have set up night light in the Sunset/Sunrise setting. I
> > have also correcly set my timezone (location?). My issue is, sunset
> > is
> > coming and Night Light is gettin activated way after this time. I
> > would
> > like to ask how I can know where the program is getting my
> > location's
> > sunset time from?  Is there a way for me to check this? 
> > thank you,
> 
> One way to determine your location would be from some GeoIP
> database, 
> based on your public IP.
> 
> If your ISP is allocating IPs as mine does this might (sometimes) be 
> wildly inaccurate.
> 
I imagine there are various ways of determining location. I am asking
if anyone knows how the Night Light app is doing it.
thank you,

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#220467

On 2020-03-24, Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> wrote:
> hello,
> I am running Gnome in Debian Buster, which comes with the Night Light
> feature. I have set up night light in the Sunset/Sunrise setting. I
> have also correcly set my timezone (location?). My issue is, sunset is

You might check if

 /org/gnome/settings-daemon/plugins/color/night-light-last-coordinates

are accurate (latitude/longitude).

After reading for some minutes I remain uncertain whether it is
necessary to toggle on Location Services in Gnome's Privacy Settings for
the feature to work correctly.

> coming and Night Light is gettin activated way after this time. I would
> like to ask how I can know where the program is getting my location's
> sunset time from?  Is there a way for me to check this? 
> thank you,
>
>


-- 
"When we encounter computer output that looks like what we produce by thinking,
we are liable to credit the computer with thought... By that rule of inference,
there would have to be an orchestra somewhere inside your CD player and a farm
in your refrigerator."  --David Halpern

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#220554

On Wed, 2020-03-25 at 10:53 +0000, Curt wrote:
> On 2020-03-24, Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm>
> wrote:
> > hello,
> > I am running Gnome in Debian Buster, which comes with the Night
> > Light
> > feature. I have set up night light in the Sunset/Sunrise setting. I
> > have also correcly set my timezone (location?). My issue is, sunset
> > is
> 
> You might check if
> 
>  /org/gnome/settings-daemon/plugins/color/night-light-last-
> coordinates
> 
> are accurate (latitude/longitude).
> 
> After reading for some minutes I remain uncertain whether it is
> necessary to toggle on Location Services in Gnome's Privacy Settings
> for
> the feature to work correctly.
> 
Thanks Curt, 
I cannot access /org/.... I cannot find this folder or file. What am I
doing wrong. Is this just a regular file that supposed to be on my
system?

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#220568

On 2020-03-27, Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> wrote:
>> 
> Thanks Curt, 
> I cannot access /org/.... I cannot find this folder or file. What am I
> doing wrong. Is this just a regular file that supposed to be on my
> system?
>
Yeah, sorry, that might have been something of a wild goose chase I sent
you on. I'm reading that that key value can be accessed with gsettings?

 gsettings get org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.color night-light-last-coordinates 

Apparently, if you replace 'get' by 'set' you can, well, set those
coordinates as well.

There's also something called 'dconf-editor' that provides a GUI for
manipulating those values or keys.

Good luck.

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#220891

On Fri, Mar 27, 2020, at 11:28 AM, Curt wrote:
> On 2020-03-27, Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm> wrote:
> >> 
> > Thanks Curt, 
> > I cannot access /org/.... I cannot find this folder or file. What am I
> > doing wrong. Is this just a regular file that supposed to be on my
> > system?
> >
> Yeah, sorry, that might have been something of a wild goose chase I sent
> you on. I'm reading that that key value can be accessed with gsettings?
> 
>  gsettings get org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.color 
> night-light-last-coordinates 
> 
> Apparently, if you replace 'get' by 'set' you can, well, set those
> coordinates as well.
> 
> There's also something called 'dconf-editor' that provides a GUI for
> manipulating those values or keys.
> 
> Good luck.

Thank you Curt, that answers my original question and solves all of my issues. Now my Night Light is working at the right times and I did not have to turn on Location Services. The dconf-editor is also really nice to know about.
thanks again.

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#220555

On Wed, 2020-03-25 at 10:53 +0000, Curt wrote:
> On 2020-03-24, Anil Felipe Duggirala <anilduggirala@fastmail.fm>
> wrote:
> > hello,
> > I am running Gnome in Debian Buster, which comes with the Night
> > Light
> > feature. I have set up night light in the Sunset/Sunrise setting. I
> > have also correcly set my timezone (location?). My issue is, sunset
> > is
> 
> After reading for some minutes I remain uncertain whether it is
> necessary to toggle on Location Services in Gnome's Privacy Settings
> for
> the feature to work correctly.
> 
And this is my main question. If the Location Services need to be
toggled on. I imagine most of the people on this list are not using
Gnome.

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