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Groups > linux.debian.user > #211847 > unrolled thread

Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?

Started byRichard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net>
First post2019-07-29 12:50 +0200
Last post2019-08-03 17:40 +0200
Articles 17 on this page of 97 — 25 participants

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  Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-07-29 12:50 +0200
    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-07-29 13:00 +0200
      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-07-29 14:00 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-07-29 14:50 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2019-07-29 15:40 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2019-07-30 11:30 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2019-07-29 16:30 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-07-29 17:20 +0200
      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? john doe <johndoe65534@mail.com> - 2019-07-29 14:10 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-07-29 15:20 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2019-07-29 15:40 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-07-29 15:50 +0200
            Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2019-07-29 16:10 +0200
              Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-29 17:20 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2019-07-29 18:00 +0200
            Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2019-07-29 16:30 +0200
            Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Erik Christiansen <dvalin@internode.on.net> - 2019-07-29 16:40 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-29 16:50 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? rhkramer@gmail.com - 2019-07-30 05:00 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2019-07-29 17:30 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-07-29 21:50 +0200
            Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-29 22:00 +0200
              Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-07-29 22:10 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-29 23:10 +0200
              Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? ghe <ghe@slsware.net> - 2019-07-29 23:30 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-07-30 00:10 +0200
                  Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-30 03:50 +0200
                    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-07-30 09:00 +0200
                    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Erik Christiansen <dvalin@internode.on.net> - 2019-07-30 13:20 +0200
                      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2019-07-30 14:50 +0200
              Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Matthew Crews <mailinglists@mattcrews.com> - 2019-07-30 14:40 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org> - 2019-07-30 15:00 +0200
                  Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-30 21:20 +0200
                    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-07-30 21:30 +0200
                      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-31 00:30 +0200
                    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org> - 2019-07-30 21:50 +0200
                      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-31 00:30 +0200
                      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? "Martin McCormick" <martin.m@suddenlink.net> - 2019-08-01 14:40 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2019-07-30 15:50 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-07-30 16:20 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-30 16:30 +0200
                  3 phase power (was Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? rhkramer@gmail.com - 2019-07-30 17:40 +0200
                    Re: 3 phase power (was Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Erik Christiansen <dvalin@internode.on.net> - 2019-07-31 09:50 +0200
                      Re: 3 phase power (was Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-07-31 10:00 +0200
                    Re: 3 phase power (was Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-08-01 15:50 +0200
                      Re: 3 phase power (was Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? rhkramer@gmail.com - 2019-08-01 19:10 +0200
                        Re: 3 phase power (was Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-08-01 21:50 +0200
                          Re: 3 phase power (was Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? "James H. H. Lampert" <jamesl@touchtonecorp.com> - 2019-08-01 22:20 +0200
                        Re: 3 phase power (was Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-08-01 23:20 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2019-08-03 18:30 +0200
                  Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-08-03 20:20 +0200
                    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2019-08-03 21:00 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-29 23:00 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2019-07-29 17:30 +0200
      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2019-07-31 01:10 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-07-31 09:10 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2019-08-02 16:20 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-07-31 09:50 +0200
          Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2019-07-31 14:00 +0200
            Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-07-31 15:10 +0200
              Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-07-31 15:40 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-07-31 15:50 +0200
                  Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2019-08-01 03:20 +0200
                    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2019-08-01 04:40 +0200
                  Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2019-08-01 04:40 +0200
                    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-08-01 08:20 +0200
              Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2019-08-01 04:40 +0200
                Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-08-01 08:40 +0200
                  Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2019-08-01 08:50 +0200
                    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2019-08-01 10:00 +0200
                      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2019-08-02 05:20 +0200
                  Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2019-08-02 05:20 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2019-07-31 22:20 +0200
    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-29 17:00 +0200
    Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2019-07-29 17:20 +0200
      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-07-29 18:00 +0200
        PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-07-29 19:00 +0200
          Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-29 23:10 +0200
            Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-07-30 05:20 +0200
              Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-08-03 17:50 +0200
          Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2019-08-04 14:00 +0200
            Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2019-08-04 14:10 +0200
              Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Richard Hector <richard@walnut.gen.nz> - 2019-08-04 17:20 +0200
                Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} rhkramer@gmail.com - 2019-08-05 18:50 +0200
                  Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-08-05 22:00 +0200
                    Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2019-08-06 07:50 +0200
                      Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-08-06 15:40 +0200
                        Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2019-08-07 08:50 +0200
        Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2019-07-29 19:10 +0200
      Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-07-29 18:40 +0200
    Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-08-03 15:20 +0200
      Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Lee <ler762@gmail.com> - 2019-08-03 17:00 +0200
        Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-08-03 17:30 +0200
          Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-08-03 17:50 +0200
            Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-08-03 21:20 +0200
          Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2019-08-03 18:20 +0200
      Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?} David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-08-03 17:40 +0200

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#212236 — Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

Frommick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com>
Date2019-08-04 14:00 +0200
SubjectRe: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yrnl7-7cB-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#211880
On 2019-07-29 17:56, Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 07/29/2019 10:51 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
>> On 07/29/2019 10:10 AM, Patrick Bartek wrote:
>>> [snip]
>>> Since your machines are very close together, take a look at USB to 
>>> USB
>>> networking.
>> 
>> Did ;} One of the first things I thought of as I date back days of 
>> everyone having multiple RS-232 null modems.
>> Unfortunately the one I ended up with was extremely Windows-centric.
>> My WinXP machine recognized it with no problem. Whatever version of 
>> Debian I was running at the time did not. The cardboard backing of the 
>> bubblepak it came in was sticking out of my Misc cubbyholes.
>> 
>> It's website [https://plugable.com/products/usb-easy-tran/] claims:
>>> Linux kernels 3.0 and later support the cable as a high-speed
>>> virtual network interface, but offer no special file transfer 
>>> support.
> 
> Found cable.
> Plugged in to two Debian 9.8 machines with MATE DE.
> On both machines the Ethernet icon indicated it was attempting to 
> connect.
> Both correctly reported manufacturer and model.
> One reported missing firmware.
> 
> I have an errand to run and will do a web search for firmware when I 
> get back.
> 
> QUESTION:
> What log file(s) should I be watching for diagnostic information?

what sort of cable ?
If ethernet, machine to machine directly seem to recall you might want a 
cross over cable.
Can chop cable in two and connect the
red to green,
green to red,
red stripy to green stripy
green stripy to red stripy
....I think.

mick

-- 
Key ID    4BFEBB31

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#212237 — Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

From<tomas@tuxteam.de>
Date2019-08-04 14:10 +0200
SubjectRe: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yrnuN-7w9-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212236

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Sun, Aug 04, 2019 at 12:58:14PM +0100, mick crane wrote:

> what sort of cable ?
> If ethernet, machine to machine directly seem to recall you might
> want a cross over cable.
> Can chop cable in two and connect the
> red to green,
> green to red,
> red stripy to green stripy
> green stripy to red stripy
> ....I think.

Ethernet crossover is pretty much defunct [1].

These days (> 1998) most Ethernet hardware can sort this out
automatically (called Auto MDI-X [2]). So unless you are using
historical hardware, this is a non-issue. Still, for people
in contact with old hardware, it is a good skill to have :-)

Cheers

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethernet_crossover_cable#Automatic_crossover
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medium_Dependent_Interface#Auto_MDI-X

-- t

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#212239 — Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromRichard Hector <richard@walnut.gen.nz>
Date2019-08-04 17:20 +0200
SubjectRe: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yrqsF-Su-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212237

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On 5/08/19 12:07 AM, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
> On Sun, Aug 04, 2019 at 12:58:14PM +0100, mick crane wrote:
> 
>> what sort of cable ?
>> If ethernet, machine to machine directly seem to recall you might
>> want a cross over cable.
>> Can chop cable in two and connect the
>> red to green,
>> green to red,
>> red stripy to green stripy
>> green stripy to red stripy
>> ....I think.
> 
> Ethernet crossover is pretty much defunct [1].
> 
> These days (> 1998) most Ethernet hardware can sort this out
> automatically (called Auto MDI-X [2]). So unless you are using
> historical hardware, this is a non-issue. Still, for people
> in contact with old hardware, it is a good skill to have :-)
> 
> Cheers
> 
> [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethernet_crossover_cable#Automatic_crossover
> [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medium_Dependent_Interface#Auto_MDI-X

And if you are making a crossover, I wouldn't rely on the colours -
there's multiple correct options for those. And none of the colours is
red :-)

And as for cutting and joining - you're going to get a pretty awful
cable that way, and unreliable at speed. Better to cut one plug off and
put a new one on, but that requires a plug and crimper.

But as Tomas says, if either end is remotely recent, it's a non-issue.

Richard

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#212268 — Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

Fromrhkramer@gmail.com
Date2019-08-05 18:50 +0200
SubjectRe: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yrOlj-7i2-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212239
On Sunday, August 04, 2019 11:16:09 AM Richard Hector wrote:
> On 5/08/19 12:07 AM, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
> > On Sun, Aug 04, 2019 at 12:58:14PM +0100, mick crane wrote:
> >> what sort of cable ?
> >> If ethernet, machine to machine directly seem to recall you might
> >> want a cross over cable.
> >> Can chop cable in two and connect the
> >> red to green,
> >> green to red,
> >> red stripy to green stripy
> >> green stripy to red stripy
> >> ....I think.
> > 
> > Ethernet crossover is pretty much defunct [1].
> > 
> > These days (> 1998) most Ethernet hardware can sort this out
> > automatically (called Auto MDI-X [2]). So unless you are using
> > historical hardware, this is a non-issue. Still, for people
> > in contact with old hardware, it is a good skill to have :-)
> > 
> > Cheers
> > 
> > [1]
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethernet_crossover_cable#Automatic_crossov
> > er [2]
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medium_Dependent_Interface#Auto_MDI-X
> 
> And if you are making a crossover, I wouldn't rely on the colours -
> there's multiple correct options for those. And none of the colours is
> red :-)
> 
> And as for cutting and joining - you're going to get a pretty awful
> cable that way, and unreliable at speed. Better to cut one plug off and
> put a new one on, but that requires a plug and crimper.
> 
> But as Tomas says, if either end is remotely recent, it's a non-issue.

I'm pretty sure I know what you're saying, but it would be a little more clear 
(to me) if you said: if *the electronics* at either end is remotely recent, 
it's a non-issue.

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#212273 — Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2019-08-05 22:00 +0200
SubjectRe: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yrRjb-DH-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212268
On Mon 05 Aug 2019 at 12:43:20 (-0400), rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> On Sunday, August 04, 2019 11:16:09 AM Richard Hector wrote:
> > On 5/08/19 12:07 AM, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
> > > On Sun, Aug 04, 2019 at 12:58:14PM +0100, mick crane wrote:
> > >> what sort of cable ?
> > >> If ethernet, machine to machine directly seem to recall you might
> > >> want a cross over cable.
> > >> Can chop cable in two and connect the
> > >> red to green,
> > >> green to red,
> > >> red stripy to green stripy
> > >> green stripy to red stripy
> > >> ....I think.
> > > 
> > > Ethernet crossover is pretty much defunct [1].
> > > 
> > > These days (> 1998) most Ethernet hardware can sort this out
> > > automatically (called Auto MDI-X [2]). So unless you are using
> > > historical hardware, this is a non-issue. Still, for people
> > > in contact with old hardware, it is a good skill to have :-)
> > > 
> > > Cheers
> > > 
> > > [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethernet_crossover_cable#Automatic_crossover
> > > [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medium_Dependent_Interface#Auto_MDI-X
> > 
> > And if you are making a crossover, I wouldn't rely on the colours -
> > there's multiple correct options for those. And none of the colours is
> > red :-)
> > 
> > And as for cutting and joining - you're going to get a pretty awful
> > cable that way, and unreliable at speed. Better to cut one plug off and
> > put a new one on, but that requires a plug and crimper.
> > 
> > But as Tomas says, if either end is remotely recent, it's a non-issue.
> 
> I'm pretty sure I know what you're saying, but it would be a little more clear 
> (to me) if you said: if *the electronics* at either end is remotely recent, 
> it's a non-issue.

I think it's made clear in the tomás quotation, about 18 lines above
Richard's citation of the same. Regardless, the OP is connecting two
machines (requiring firmware) running DEs on stretch, and has an
8-port switch lying around too, so not much chance of needing to
chop up cables (unless in frustration at having to use them at all).
No progress reported yet, though, AFAICT.

Cheers,
David.

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#212289 — Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromAndrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com>
Date2019-08-06 07:50 +0200
SubjectRe: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<ys0w9-6E4-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212273

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On Lu, 05 aug 19, 14:55:11, David Wright wrote:
> 
> I think it's made clear in the tomás quotation, about 18 lines above
> Richard's citation of the same. Regardless, the OP is connecting two
> machines (requiring firmware) running DEs on stretch, and has an
> 8-port switch lying around too, so not much chance of needing to
> chop up cables (unless in frustration at having to use them at all).
> No progress reported yet, though, AFAICT.

Maybe it's just me, but it was quite clear the OP excluded ethernet and 
the cable lying around was USB-to-USB.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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#212310 — Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2019-08-06 15:40 +0200
SubjectRe: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<ys7QZ-2Na-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212289
On Tue 06 Aug 2019 at 08:44:41 (+0300), Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> On Lu, 05 aug 19, 14:55:11, David Wright wrote:
> > 
> > I think it's made clear in the tomás quotation, about 18 lines above
> > Richard's citation of the same. Regardless, the OP is connecting two
> > machines (requiring firmware) running DEs on stretch, and has an
> > 8-port switch lying around too, so not much chance of needing to
> > chop up cables (unless in frustration at having to use them at all).
> > No progress reported yet, though, AFAICT.
> 
> Maybe it's just me, but it was quite clear the OP excluded ethernet and 
> the cable lying around was USB-to-USB.

We live in hope. The OP may realise eventually that the USB-to-USB is
a dead end, a useful dead end in its day, like Kermit over RS232 which
gave me years of service in the 1980s and 1990s. It was 2013 when I
finally disposed of my 9/25-pin to 9/25-pin serial crossover cable.
It could have been very useful for the OP's Kaypro 10. Yes, they have
one of these lying around, but no room for Cat5 cables to any of their
other computers. So our hope is forlorn. Or should I say, we are a
forlorn hope.

Cheers,
David.

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#212347 — Re: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromAndrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com>
Date2019-08-07 08:50 +0200
SubjectRe: PROGRESS!! - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<ysnVM-4wv-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212310

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On Ma, 06 aug 19, 08:34:20, David Wright wrote:
> On Tue 06 Aug 2019 at 08:44:41 (+0300), Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> > On Lu, 05 aug 19, 14:55:11, David Wright wrote:
> > > 
> > > I think it's made clear in the tomás quotation, about 18 lines above
> > > Richard's citation of the same. Regardless, the OP is connecting two
> > > machines (requiring firmware) running DEs on stretch, and has an
> > > 8-port switch lying around too, so not much chance of needing to
> > > chop up cables (unless in frustration at having to use them at all).
> > > No progress reported yet, though, AFAICT.
> > 
> > Maybe it's just me, but it was quite clear the OP excluded ethernet and 
> > the cable lying around was USB-to-USB.
> 
> We live in hope. The OP may realise eventually that the USB-to-USB is
> a dead end, a useful dead end in its day, like Kermit over RS232 which
> gave me years of service in the 1980s and 1990s. It was 2013 when I
> finally disposed of my 9/25-pin to 9/25-pin serial crossover cable.
> It could have been very useful for the OP's Kaypro 10. Yes, they have
> one of these lying around, but no room for Cat5 cables to any of their
> other computers. So our hope is forlorn. Or should I say, we are a
> forlorn hope.

Regardless, it still make the entire "to crossover or not to crossover" 
pointless.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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#211881

FromPatrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com>
Date2019-07-29 19:10 +0200
Message-ID<yphjQ-15u-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#211876
On Mon, 29 Jul 2019 10:51:24 -0500
Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> wrote:

> On 07/29/2019 10:10 AM, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > [snip]
> > Since your machines are very close together, take a look at USB to USB
> > networking.  
> 
> Did ;} One of the first things I thought of as I date back days of 
> everyone having multiple RS-232 null modems.

I'm "dated", too. Serial port null-cable: Amiga to Windows PC. 

> Unfortunately the one I ended up with was extremely Windows-centric.
> My WinXP machine recognized it with no problem. Whatever version of 
> Debian I was running at the time did not. The cardboard backing of the 
> bubblepak it came in was sticking out of my Misc cubbyholes.

Well, then, you're back to wireless.  Instead of Bluetooth, USB dongle.
That's what I went with after I moved and wired Ethernet became
impractical for this box. And I'm getting speeds (I'm 30' away from
wireless router) the same as wired. 30 to 36 Mb/s down, 6 to 7 Mb/s
up.  Max from ISP 50 down, 5 up.  And this with an older n150 2.4GHz
"nano" dongle. Sells on Newegg for $5 to $8 US.

> [snip]
> > 
> > It's wired, so more secure than any type of wireless. Fast or reasonably
> > so depending on type of USB -- 2? 3?  Minimum investment.  USB cables
> > are cheap. With Ethernet, besides extra cables, you'd have to buy at
> > least a switch. And as most computers have multiple USB ports, it's
> > easy to set up.
> > 
> > B

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#211878

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2019-07-29 18:40 +0200
Message-ID<ypgQO-EE-15@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#211868
On Mon 29 Jul 2019 at 08:10:21 (-0700), Patrick Bartek wrote:
> On Mon, 29 Jul 2019 05:40:40 -0500 Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> wrote:
> 
> > Sneakernet for file transfer has become annoying.
> > Ethernet is undesirable in my environment so I am only interested is 
> > wireless.
> > I have only a few machines a max of 6' apart.
> > My usage would typically be peer-to-peer but I want to communicate 
> > between any two machines.
> > My web connectivity is via a T-Mobile WiFi Hotspot (WiFi turned off).
> > I run Debian 9.8.
> > 
> > I've just begun reading - primarily Wikipedia articles and some links 
> > from them.  My primary question is "What should I be reading?" in order 
> > to ask appropriate questions. Specificallty "What?" and "Why?" much more 
> > than "Howto?".
> > 
> > A concern is security issues. Bluetooth, being short range, may thus 
> > have an advantage. Speed is not an issue for my expected usage. (I was 
> > one of my ISP's last 6 dial-up clients ;)
> 
> Since your machines are very close together, take a look at USB to USB
> networking.
> 
> It's wired, so more secure than any type of wireless. Fast or reasonably
> so depending on type of USB -- 2? 3?  Minimum investment.  USB cables
> are cheap. With Ethernet, besides extra cables, you'd have to buy at
> least a switch. And as most computers have multiple USB ports, it's
> easy to set up.  

Wiring is an issue, so no better than ethernet in this respect.
OTOH the OP already has an ethernet switch lying unused …
That's putting aside the extra configuration complexity.

Cheers,
David.

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#212182 — Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromRichard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net>
Date2019-08-03 15:20 +0200
SubjectUseful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yr26Z-2sF-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#211847
On 07/29/2019 05:40 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> Sneakernet for file transfer has become annoying.
> Ethernet is undesirable in my environment so I am only interested is 
> wireless.
> I have only a few machines a max of 6' apart.
> My usage would typically be peer-to-peer but I want to communicate 
> between any two machines.
> My web connectivity is via a T-Mobile WiFi Hotspot (WiFi turned off).
> I run Debian 9.8.
> 
> I've just begun reading - primarily Wikipedia articles and some links 
> from them.  My primary question is "What should I be reading?" in order 
> to ask appropriate questions. Specificallty "What?" and "Why?" much more 
> than "Howto?".
> 
> A concern is security issues. Bluetooth, being short range, may thus 
> have an advantage. Speed is not an issue for my expected usage. (I was 
> one of my ISP's last 6 dial-up clients ;)
> 
> TIA

ON TOPIC references include:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_ad_hoc_network
https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/AdHoc

Bluetooth verging on moot as not all *my* machines have it.

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#212192 — Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromLee <ler762@gmail.com>
Date2019-08-03 17:00 +0200
SubjectRe: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yr3FM-3h0-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212182
On 8/3/19, Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> wrote:
> On 07/29/2019 05:40 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
>> Sneakernet for file transfer has become annoying.
>> Ethernet is undesirable in my environment so I am only interested is
>> wireless.
>> I have only a few machines a max of 6' apart.
>> My usage would typically be peer-to-peer but I want to communicate
>> between any two machines.
>> My web connectivity is via a T-Mobile WiFi Hotspot (WiFi turned off).
>> I run Debian 9.8.
>>
>> I've just begun reading - primarily Wikipedia articles and some links
>> from them.  My primary question is "What should I be reading?" in order
>> to ask appropriate questions. Specificallty "What?" and "Why?" much more
>> than "Howto?".
>>
>> A concern is security issues. Bluetooth, being short range, may thus
>> have an advantage. Speed is not an issue for my expected usage. (I was
>> one of my ISP's last 6 dial-up clients ;)
>>
>> TIA
>
> ON TOPIC references include:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_ad_hoc_network
> https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/AdHoc

Except you said security was an issue & I suspect it's going to be a
real pain making a secure ad-hoc wireless network.

Why not just buy an inexpensive wireless router?  eg
https://www.lifewire.com/best-routers-under-50-4038819
  The 6 Best Routers for Under $50 in 2019

Just make sure whatever you get supports both 2.4GHz & 5 GHz wireless channels.

Lee

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#212194 — Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromRichard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net>
Date2019-08-03 17:30 +0200
SubjectRe: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yr48N-3H3-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212192
On 08/03/2019 09:53 AM, Lee wrote:
> On 8/3/19, Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> wrote:
>> On 07/29/2019 05:40 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
>>> Sneakernet for file transfer has become annoying.
>>> Ethernet is undesirable in my environment so I am only interested is
>>> wireless.
>>> I have only a few machines a max of 6' apart.
>>> My usage would typically be peer-to-peer but I want to communicate
>>> between any two machines.
>>> My web connectivity is via a T-Mobile WiFi Hotspot (WiFi turned off).
>>> I run Debian 9.8.
>>>
>>> I've just begun reading - primarily Wikipedia articles and some links
>>> from them.  My primary question is "What should I be reading?" in order
>>> to ask appropriate questions. Specificallty "What?" and "Why?" much more
>>> than "Howto?".
>>>
>>> A concern is security issues. Bluetooth, being short range, may thus
>>> have an advantage. Speed is not an issue for my expected usage. (I was
>>> one of my ISP's last 6 dial-up clients ;)
>>>
>>> TIA
>>
>> ON TOPIC references include:
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_ad_hoc_network
>> https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/AdHoc
> 
> Except you said security was an issue & I suspect it's going to be a
> real pain making a secure ad-hoc wireless network.

For current situation WEP (though antique/limited) is adequate.

> 
> Why not just buy an inexpensive wireless router?  

That question is *NOT* on-topic!

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#212199 — Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2019-08-03 17:50 +0200
SubjectRe: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yr4sa-3NQ-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212194
On Sat 03 Aug 2019 at 10:26:34 (-0500), Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 08/03/2019 09:53 AM, Lee wrote:
> > On 8/3/19, Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> wrote:
> > > On 07/29/2019 05:40 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> > > > Sneakernet for file transfer has become annoying.
> > > > Ethernet is undesirable in my environment so I am only interested is
> > > > wireless.
> > > > I have only a few machines a max of 6' apart.
> > > > My usage would typically be peer-to-peer but I want to communicate
> > > > between any two machines.
> > > > My web connectivity is via a T-Mobile WiFi Hotspot (WiFi turned off).
> > > > I run Debian 9.8.
> > > > 
> > > > I've just begun reading - primarily Wikipedia articles and some links
> > > > from them.  My primary question is "What should I be reading?" in order
> > > > to ask appropriate questions. Specificallty "What?" and "Why?" much more
> > > > than "Howto?".
> > > > 
> > > > A concern is security issues. Bluetooth, being short range, may thus
> > > > have an advantage. Speed is not an issue for my expected usage. (I was
> > > > one of my ISP's last 6 dial-up clients ;)
> > > > 
> > > > TIA
> > > 
> > > ON TOPIC references include:
> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_ad_hoc_network
> > > https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/AdHoc
> > 
> > Except you said security was an issue & I suspect it's going to be a
> > real pain making a secure ad-hoc wireless network.
> 
> For current situation WEP (though antique/limited) is adequate.

What happened to "A concern is security issues" above?

> > Why not just buy an inexpensive wireless router?
> 
> That question is *NOT* on-topic!

You wrote 'My primary question is "What should I be reading?" in order
to ask appropriate questions.' So get on with asking questions instead
of slapping people down, which appears to be your habit here.

Cheers,
David.

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#212214 — Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2019-08-03 21:20 +0200
SubjectRe: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yr7Jn-5ZO-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212199
On Sat 03 Aug 2019 at 10:39:42 -0500, David Wright wrote:

> On Sat 03 Aug 2019 at 10:26:34 (-0500), Richard Owlett wrote:

[A lot of snipping]

> > For current situation WEP (though antique/limited) is adequate.
> 
> What happened to "A concern is security issues" above?

The OP acknowledges the deficiencies of WEP but is still prepared to
use it in spite of the excellent advice received.

The decision should be respected. He knows his situation best and has
a much better undestanding of how to foul up his system than us.

> > > Why not just buy an inexpensive wireless router?
> > 
> > That question is *NOT* on-topic!
> 
> You wrote 'My primary question is "What should I be reading?" in order
> to ask appropriate questions.' So get on with asking questions instead
> of slapping people down, which appears to be your habit here.

You are asking for the impossible. Exploration of ideas is unknown and
untaught in some parts of the world.

A router would solve the issue. But who wants to complicate their
network with such a device? Nasty, horrible things. No wonder they are
off-topic.

-- 
Brian.

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#212204 — Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromAndrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com>
Date2019-08-03 18:20 +0200
SubjectRe: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yr4Vc-4ez-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212194

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Sb, 03 aug 19, 10:26:34, Richard Owlett wrote:
> 
> For current situation WEP (though antique/limited) is adequate.
 
WEP is known to be crackable, since years ago. I'm guessing with current 
hardware it should be quite easy.

> > Why not just buy an inexpensive wireless router?
> 
> That question is *NOT* on-topic!

If one of your wireless adapters supports "master" mode and you can 
afford to have that system on all the time (or at least when you need 
the network) you can use hostapd to set it up as the wireless AP for all 
others.

Preferably this should be the system with the internet connection, so 
you can also use it as a gateway.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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#212195 — Re: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2019-08-03 17:40 +0200
SubjectRe: Useful links - was {Re: Wireless home LAN - WiFi vs Bluetooth?}
Message-ID<yr4iu-3Kp-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#212182
On Sat 03 Aug 2019 at 08:18:13 (-0500), Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 07/29/2019 05:40 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> > Sneakernet for file transfer has become annoying.
> > Ethernet is undesirable in my environment so I am only interested
> > is wireless.
> > I have only a few machines a max of 6' apart.
> > My usage would typically be peer-to-peer but I want to communicate
> > between any two machines.
> > My web connectivity is via a T-Mobile WiFi Hotspot (WiFi turned off).
> > I run Debian 9.8.
> > 
> > I've just begun reading - primarily Wikipedia articles and some
> > links from them.  My primary question is "What should I be
> > reading?" in order to ask appropriate questions. Specificallty
> > "What?" and "Why?" much more than "Howto?".
> > 
> > A concern is security issues. Bluetooth, being short range, may
> > thus have an advantage. Speed is not an issue for my expected
> > usage. (I was one of my ISP's last 6 dial-up clients ;)
> 
> ON TOPIC references include:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_ad_hoc_network
> https://wiki.debian.org/WiFi/AdHoc

Well, that blows up your security concerns. And now you've got six
times as much configuring to do. A cheap router does all that for
you, the security monitoring logs and the configuration of all
the hosts. And it's something that everyone here uses and understands.

> Bluetooth verging on moot as not all *my* machines have it.

Cheers,
David.

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