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Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work.

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  Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-04-04 16:40 +0200
    Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-04-04 17:00 +0200
      Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-04-04 17:10 +0200
        Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Charlie Kravetz <charlie@keepingdreams.com> - 2019-04-04 19:00 +0200
          Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-04-04 21:40 +0200
            Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-04-05 09:20 +0200
              Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-04-05 11:50 +0200
                Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2019-04-05 13:00 +0200
    Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-04-04 19:20 +0200
      Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-04-04 21:00 +0200
        Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-04-04 22:00 +0200
          Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-04-05 20:10 +0200
            Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. andreimpopescu@gmail.com - 2019-06-09 17:10 +0200
              Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-06-18 18:20 +0200
      Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-04-04 21:50 +0200
    Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-04-04 20:50 +0200
    Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2019-04-04 21:10 +0200
    Re: Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work. David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2019-04-04 21:10 +0200

#206960 — Getting amd64 stretch netinstall to work.

Greetings all

I am  today, going to make my 6th attempt to make the stretch netinstall 
work.

I think I have sussed the failure mode, which seems to be that by the 
time its finslly gets around to installing grub, its too far into the 
diksk for the dumb bios on this old Asus mobo to find it, so this time I 
am going to add a /boot as first partition. At 2 or 3 hundred megs.

And I'd like to do this with gparted in such a way as to skip the 
partitioning. I don't care if it formats the partitions I give it. But I 
do NOT want them futzt with. I've even had your partitioner rearrange 
the partitions/ putting a /boot partition 300G's into a 1T drive, 
although that was with a previous version.  So I'm hoping it won't do 
that ever again.

So how _exactly_ do I make the installer take what it finds, format it, 
and just get on with it?

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#206962

On Thu, Apr 04, 2019 at 10:39:19AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> I am  today, going to make my 6th attempt to make the stretch netinstall 
> work.
> 
> I think I have sussed the failure mode, which seems to be that by the 
> time its finslly gets around to installing grub, its too far into the 
> diksk for the dumb bios on this old Asus mobo to find it, so this time I 
> am going to add a /boot as first partition. At 2 or 3 hundred megs.

Are you trying to install the boot loader portion of grub to a PARTITION?
Instead of to the front of a DISK?

The boot loader part of GRUB goes in the first bytes of the disk.  That's
where the BIOS reads it from, and then executes it.

That boot loader portion then looks for its configuration file in your
Debian /boot partition, which can be anywhere on the disk.

Or at least, that's how things work in legacy BIOS.  (U)EFI is a different
story.  Since you claim this is an "old" machine and even used the word
"bios", I assume you're using legacy BIOS and MBR (not GPT) disklabels.

When you partition a disk with an MBR disklabel, you leave a small gap
at the front of the disk for the boot loader and partition table.  They
go into that unpartitioned space.

The Debian installer already handles all of this for you, even in manual
partitioning mode (which is what I always use).  I can't even guess how
you've failed this process 5 times, unless it's because you keep putting
GRUB in the wrong place.

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#206963

On Thursday 04 April 2019 10:55:23 Greg Wooledge wrote:

> On Thu, Apr 04, 2019 at 10:39:19AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > I am  today, going to make my 6th attempt to make the stretch
> > netinstall work.
> >
> > I think I have sussed the failure mode, which seems to be that by
> > the time its finslly gets around to installing grub, its too far
> > into the diksk for the dumb bios on this old Asus mobo to find it,
> > so this time I am going to add a /boot as first partition. At 2 or 3
> > hundred megs.
>
> Are you trying to install the boot loader portion of grub to a
> PARTITION? Instead of to the front of a DISK?
>
> The boot loader part of GRUB goes in the first bytes of the disk. 
> That's where the BIOS reads it from, and then executes it.
>
> That boot loader portion then looks for its configuration file in your
> Debian /boot partition, which can be anywhere on the disk.
>
> Or at least, that's how things work in legacy BIOS.  (U)EFI is a
> different story.  Since you claim this is an "old" machine and even
> used the word "bios", I assume you're using legacy BIOS and MBR (not
> GPT) disklabels.

Yes.

> When you partition a disk with an MBR disklabel, you leave a small gap
> at the front of the disk for the boot loader and partition table. 
> They go into that unpartitioned space.
>
> The Debian installer already handles all of this for you, even in
> manual partitioning mode (which is what I always use).  I can't even
> guess how you've failed this process 5 times, unless it's because you
> keep putting GRUB in the wrong place.

In the mbr, like it wants to. On the reboot if it ever touches the disk, 
the led blink is too fast to see, all I see on screen after post is a 
blinking cursor at the upper left corner. I'd give it a while to e2fsck 
the drive, but theres zero drive activity.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#206967

On Thu, 4 Apr 2019 11:09:13 -0400
Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:

>On Thursday 04 April 2019 10:55:23 Greg Wooledge wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Apr 04, 2019 at 10:39:19AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:  
>> > I am  today, going to make my 6th attempt to make the stretch
>> > netinstall work.
>> >
>> > I think I have sussed the failure mode, which seems to be that by
>> > the time its finslly gets around to installing grub, its too far
>> > into the diksk for the dumb bios on this old Asus mobo to find it,
>> > so this time I am going to add a /boot as first partition. At 2 or 3
>> > hundred megs.  

I wonder if that long delay is while it is fscking the hard drive? It
can take quite a while with a drive that big.


>>
>> Are you trying to install the boot loader portion of grub to a
>> PARTITION? Instead of to the front of a DISK?
>>
>> The boot loader part of GRUB goes in the first bytes of the disk. 
>> That's where the BIOS reads it from, and then executes it.
>>
>> That boot loader portion then looks for its configuration file in your
>> Debian /boot partition, which can be anywhere on the disk.
>>
>> Or at least, that's how things work in legacy BIOS.  (U)EFI is a
>> different story.  Since you claim this is an "old" machine and even
>> used the word "bios", I assume you're using legacy BIOS and MBR (not
>> GPT) disklabels.  
>
>Yes.
>
>> When you partition a disk with an MBR disklabel, you leave a small gap
>> at the front of the disk for the boot loader and partition table. 
>> They go into that unpartitioned space.
>>
>> The Debian installer already handles all of this for you, even in
>> manual partitioning mode (which is what I always use).  I can't even
>> guess how you've failed this process 5 times, unless it's because you
>> keep putting GRUB in the wrong place.  
>
>In the mbr, like it wants to. On the reboot if it ever touches the disk, 
>the led blink is too fast to see, all I see on screen after post is a 
>blinking cursor at the upper left corner. I'd give it a while to e2fsck 
>the drive, but theres zero drive activity.
>
>Cheers, Gene Heskett


-- 
Charlie Kravetz
Linux Registered User Number 425914
[http://linuxcounter.net/user/425914.html]
Never let anyone steal your DREAM.   [http://keepingdreams.com]

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#206988

On Thursday 04 April 2019 12:29:33 Charlie Kravetz wrote:

> On Thu, 4 Apr 2019 11:09:13 -0400
>
> Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:
> >On Thursday 04 April 2019 10:55:23 Greg Wooledge wrote:
> >> On Thu, Apr 04, 2019 at 10:39:19AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> >> > I am  today, going to make my 6th attempt to make the stretch
> >> > netinstall work.
> >> >
> >> > I think I have sussed the failure mode, which seems to be that by
> >> > the time its finslly gets around to installing grub, its too far
> >> > into the diksk for the dumb bios on this old Asus mobo to find
> >> > it, so this time I am going to add a /boot as first partition. At
> >> > 2 or 3 hundred megs.
>
> I wonder if that long delay is while it is fscking the hard drive? It
> can take quite a while with a drive that big.

My QC drive cage has activity LED's, There was none. 
>
> >> Are you trying to install the boot loader portion of grub to a
> >> PARTITION? Instead of to the front of a DISK?
> >>
That has been adequately explained  previously.

> >> The boot loader part of GRUB goes in the first bytes of the disk.
> >> That's where the BIOS reads it from, and then executes it.

Only if that first 500 megs hasn't been used for something else, in this 
case the fix was to partition 300 megs as boot so this dumbassed bios 
could find it.

> >> That boot loader portion then looks for its configuration file in
> >> your Debian /boot partition, which can be anywhere on the disk.

Not with this math crippled bios bearing a 2006 copyright. It MUST be 
wholly within the first couple hundred megabytes of the beginning of the 
disk or it can't find it, and it is the most recent bios available for 
an Asus M2N-SLI Deluxe motherboard, version 1701.

> >> Or at least, that's how things work in legacy BIOS.

> >> (U)EFI is a 
> >> different story.  Since you claim this is an "old" machine and even
> >> used the word "bios", I assume you're using legacy BIOS and MBR
> >> (not GPT) disklabels.
> >
> >Yes.
> >
> >> When you partition a disk with an MBR disklabel, you leave a small
> >> gap at the front of the disk for the boot loader and partition
> >> table. They go into that unpartitioned space.
> >>
> >> The Debian installer already handles all of this for you, even in
> >> manual partitioning mode (which is what I always use).  I can't
> >> even guess how you've failed this process 5 times, unless it's
> >> because you keep putting GRUB in the wrong place.

No. Without a /boot partition, just a directory entry, the installer is 
free to use that empty space, and the file system WILL use the available 
space for other things. This puts all the grub stuff, installed as the 
last thing the installer does, way too far into the disk for old bios's 
to find.  Your version of a "legacy" bios is a snapshot taken a month 
before UEFI became the M$ dictatorial law. I go back another 40 years 
into the '70's. I go back far enough I've dragged management into my 
office to show them how a computer should work, running os9 on a trs-80 
color computer, multiuser, multitasking, when they were still running 
dos-2.1 on their 8086 boxes on their $2600 desks.

But no one ever got fired for buying I've Been Moved boxes...

Once in a while, the old man is right.

> >In the mbr, like it wants to. On the reboot if it ever touches the
> > disk, the led blink is too fast to see, all I see on screen after
> > post is a blinking cursor at the upper left corner. I'd give it a
> > while to e2fsck the drive, but theres zero drive activity.
> >
> >Cheers, Gene Heskett


Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#207000

Gene Heskett composed on 2019-04-04 15:38 (UTC-0400):
...
> Not with this math crippled bios bearing a 2006 copyright. It MUST be 
> wholly within the first couple hundred megabytes of the beginning of the 
> disk or it can't find it, and it is the most recent bios available for 
> an Asus M2N-SLI Deluxe motherboard, version 1701....

You have my sympathy for having made that choice - it has an nForce chipset. :~(

Yours: https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/M2NSLI_Deluxe/

Check out the similarity to mine (Intel LGA775):
https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/P5B_Deluxe/

They date to the same year, 20+ BIOS versions on downloads page for mine, starting
in 2006-07, while yours has fewer total but newer "latest", beginning in 2006-08.
Your 1701 is 2009-03-02, with 2 newer "beta" versions available. I use the latest
"beta" for mine, 2009-02-11, am thinking about reverting to latest non-beta,
2007-04-04.

Mine has so many features it seems like an eternity between the time POST
completes its cleanup and Grub shows up on screen. Never have I seen any other PC
reliably take *so* long. Its master /boot partition begins @282.4MB, ends @682.5.
I need to try moving it to the front sometime when I have nothing better to do to
see if it makes a difference, if the BIOS revert doesn't help.
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is religion, not science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#207005

On Friday 05 April 2019 03:15:25 Felix Miata wrote:

> Gene Heskett composed on 2019-04-04 15:38 (UTC-0400):
> ...
>
> > Not with this math crippled bios bearing a 2006 copyright. It MUST
> > be wholly within the first couple hundred megabytes of the beginning
> > of the disk or it can't find it, and it is the most recent bios
> > available for an Asus M2N-SLI Deluxe motherboard, version 1701....
>
> You have my sympathy for having made that choice - it has an nForce
> chipset. :~(
>
And I can't recall the last time I had a problem with it. Probably when I 
was younger and dumber, running fedora 2.   But I finally got tired of 
being used for a lab rat as fedora was kept busted. Fixes for the 
problems we reported went back out to paying customers of red hat, but 
only in rare showstopper instances did they ever come back to fedora.  
So I voted with my shoes. But nforce has NOT been a problem I remember.

> Yours: https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/M2NSLI_Deluxe/
>
> Check out the similarity to mine (Intel LGA775):
> https://www.asus.com/us/Motherboards/P5B_Deluxe/
>
> They date to the same year, 20+ BIOS versions on downloads page for
> mine, starting in 2006-07, while yours has fewer total but newer
> "latest", beginning in 2006-08. Your 1701 is 2009-03-02, with 2 newer
> "beta" versions available. I use the latest "beta" for mine,
> 2009-02-11, am thinking about reverting to latest non-beta,
> 2007-04-04.
>
I see the beta's for mine, but I see no reason to change as I don't have 
a "later" cpu, this amd 9550 has Just Worked.

> Mine has so many features it seems like an eternity between the time
> POST completes its cleanup and Grub shows up on screen. Never have I
> seen any other PC reliably take *so* long. Its master /boot partition
> begins @282.4MB, ends @682.5. I need to try moving it to the front
> sometime when I have nothing better to do to see if it makes a
> difference, if the BIOS revert doesn't help.

600 something is beyond the reach of some bios, I seen the figure 504megs 
bandied about from several sources.  I settled for about 300, seems to 
work, but if the blanker time arrives, stretch crashes and I have to use 
the reset button.  Thats a genuine showstopper as this whole system runs 
24/7.

But so far, no one has commented.

Thanks Felix. 

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#207013

Hi,

Felix Miata wrote:
> > Never have I seen any other PC reliably take *so* long. Its
> > master /boot partition begins @282.4MB, ends @682.5.

Gene Heskett wrote:
> 600 something is beyond the reach of some bios, I seen the figure 504megs
> bandied about from several sources.

That would be 20 bit block addressing (log(504)/log(2) = 8.98, i.e. 504 MiB
need 29 bit. Minus the 9 for block size makes 20).
The lowest reported LBA address size was 24. I.e. 8 GiB of disk range.

If the mainboard was indeed incapable of accessing a higher block range,
then it would probably have a quite outdated BIOS with 28 bit LBA addressing
which can reach up to 128 GiB (2 exp 28 * 2 exp 9 = 137,438,953,472).

If such a limit was hit, then BIOS would not work with that block range
at all, not just slowly.

  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_block_addressing
says
  "The current 48-bit LBA scheme was introduced in 2003 with the ATA-6
   standard."
Gene's board seems to be not older than 2008.


(Once there was a size limit with the ISOLINUX boot loader which could
 fail on LBA that exceeded 16 bit. Caused by a bug with initializing
 the upper 16 bit of the processor register that held the LBA.
 To be safe, isolinux.bin had to sit in the first 32 MiB of the ISO.)


Can it be that there are cooling problems caused by the new kernel on
the main board where any thermal paste is dry now and possibly some
plastic clamps have become brittle ?
A black screen with a blinking cursor could be a failed GRUB start
after a system breakdown.


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#206968

Gene Heskett composed on 2019-04-04 10:39 (UTC-0400):

> So how _exactly_ do I make the installer take what it finds, format it, 
> and just get on with it?

First select manual partitioning (all these are the same screen):
https://www.howtoforge.com/images/debian_stretch_minimal_server/debian-9-server-img-16.png
https://debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/images/inst-partman.png
https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisks.png

Then select the disk (should resemble one of these):
https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Select-free-space-to-partition.png
https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Overview-of-disks.png
https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisksManual3.png

Choose the partition to configure (I think these are actually the same screen as
previous group, except with disk's partitions expanded):
https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_31_partitioning.png
https://blog.sleeplessbeastie.eu/assets/uploads/2013/10/debian_install-partition_disks-partitions_end.png

Here's the screen where the main business gets done, selecting mount point, format
type, mount options, volume label:
https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Swap-Partition-Details.png
https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisksBootPartitionSettings.png
https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_25_partitioning.png

Select mount point detail screen:
https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_26_partitioning.png

If I knew how to get my own screencaps from a text install on real hardware (not a
virtual machine) I would make my own web page to do what the Debian Handbook seems
can't be bothered to do. It would probably be somewhat like
https://www.pontikis.net/blog/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step
except the images would be big enough to see without having to open each in turn.
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is religion, not science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#206982

On Thu 04 Apr 2019 at 13:12:58 (-0400), Felix Miata wrote:
> Gene Heskett composed on 2019-04-04 10:39 (UTC-0400):
> 
> > So how _exactly_ do I make the installer take what it finds, format it, 
> > and just get on with it?
> 
> First select manual partitioning (all these are the same screen):
> https://www.howtoforge.com/images/debian_stretch_minimal_server/debian-9-server-img-16.png
> https://debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/images/inst-partman.png
> https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisks.png
> 
> Then select the disk (should resemble one of these):
> https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Select-free-space-to-partition.png
> https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Overview-of-disks.png
> https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisksManual3.png
> 
> Choose the partition to configure (I think these are actually the same screen as
> previous group, except with disk's partitions expanded):
> https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_31_partitioning.png
> https://blog.sleeplessbeastie.eu/assets/uploads/2013/10/debian_install-partition_disks-partitions_end.png
> 
> Here's the screen where the main business gets done, selecting mount point, format
> type, mount options, volume label:
> https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Swap-Partition-Details.png
> https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisksBootPartitionSettings.png
> https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_25_partitioning.png
> 
> Select mount point detail screen:
> https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_26_partitioning.png
> 
> If I knew how to get my own screencaps from a text install on real hardware (not a
> virtual machine) I would make my own web page to do what the Debian Handbook seems
> can't be bothered to do. It would probably be somewhat like
> https://www.pontikis.net/blog/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step
> except the images would be big enough to see without having to open each in turn.

(I haven't looked at these links yet.)

The way I've always done it is to use script (or cut and paste) while
installing over ssh. To get the first few screens, you have to go back
to the beginning (Select a Language) and repeat them.

The trickiest screens are the ones that set up the network itself.

Cheers,
David.

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#206992

On Thursday 04 April 2019 14:56:09 David Wright wrote:

> On Thu 04 Apr 2019 at 13:12:58 (-0400), Felix Miata wrote:
> > Gene Heskett composed on 2019-04-04 10:39 (UTC-0400):
> > > So how _exactly_ do I make the installer take what it finds,
> > > format it, and just get on with it?
> >
> > First select manual partitioning (all these are the same screen):
> > https://www.howtoforge.com/images/debian_stretch_minimal_server/debi
> >an-9-server-img-16.png
> > https://debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/images/inst-partman.png
> > https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisks.png
> >
> > Then select the disk (should resemble one of these):
> > https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Select-free-space
> >-to-partition.png
> > https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Overview-of-disks
> >.png https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisksManual3.png
> >
> > Choose the partition to configure (I think these are actually the
> > same screen as previous group, except with disk's partitions
> > expanded):
> > https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp
> >-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_31_partitioning.png
> > https://blog.sleeplessbeastie.eu/assets/uploads/2013/10/debian_insta
> >ll-partition_disks-partitions_end.png
> >
> > Here's the screen where the main business gets done, selecting mount
> > point, format type, mount options, volume label:
> > https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Swap-Partition-De
> >tails.png
> > https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisksBootPartitionSettings.png
> > https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp
> >-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_25_partitioning.png
> >
> > Select mount point detail screen:
> > https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp
> >-server-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_26_partitioning.png
> >
> > If I knew how to get my own screencaps from a text install on real
> > hardware (not a virtual machine) I would make my own web page to do
> > what the Debian Handbook seems can't be bothered to do. It would
> > probably be somewhat like
> > https://www.pontikis.net/blog/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-
> >step-by-step except the images would be big enough to see without
> > having to open each in turn.
>
> (I haven't looked at these links yet.)
>
> The way I've always done it is to use script (or cut and paste) while
> installing over ssh. To get the first few screens, you have to go back
> to the beginning (Select a Language) and repeat them.
>
> The trickiest screens are the ones that set up the network itself.
>
That debian finally got right, piece of cake.

> Cheers,
> David.


Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#207042

On Thu 04 Apr 2019 at 15:50:59 (-0400), Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Thursday 04 April 2019 14:56:09 David Wright wrote:
> > On Thu 04 Apr 2019 at 13:12:58 (-0400), Felix Miata wrote:
> > > Gene Heskett composed on 2019-04-04 10:39 (UTC-0400):
> > > > So how _exactly_ do I make the installer take what it finds,
> > > > format it, and just get on with it?
> > >
> > > First select manual partitioning (all these are the same screen):
> > > Then select the disk (should resemble one of these):
> > > Choose the partition to configure (I think these are actually the
> > > same screen as previous group, except with disk's partitions
> > > expanded):
> > > Here's the screen where the main business gets done, selecting mount
> > > point, format type, mount options, volume label:
> > > Select mount point detail screen:
[links snipped]
> > > If I knew how to get my own screencaps from a text install on real
> > > hardware (not a virtual machine) I would make my own web page to do
> > > what the Debian Handbook seems can't be bothered to do. It would
> > > probably be somewhat like
> > > https://www.pontikis.net/blog/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-
> > >step-by-step except the images would be big enough to see without
> > > having to open each in turn.
> >
> > (I haven't looked at these links yet.)
> >
> > The way I've always done it is to use script (or cut and paste) while
> > installing over ssh. To get the first few screens, you have to go back
> > to the beginning (Select a Language) and repeat them.
> >
> > The trickiest screens are the ones that set up the network itself.
> >
> That debian finally got right, piece of cake.

It's been working for years.

No, my point was that it's difficult to capture the Set Up Network
screens over a ssh session because the setup process itself disrupts
the network session that you're capturing screens with.

A solution might be to install over a serial link, but I don't
think you can do that with the d-i itself, only with 3rd-party
mangled versions.

(Nothing to do with snapshots on a camera or phone either, though
these are useful for making personal records of things like CMOS
screens which are also awkward/impossible to capture.)

Other random points:

I'm glad you've got your LABELs sorted. I'm not sure what you would
have expected the d-i to do with them (apart from overwrite swap's,
unless you take special care). And would you trust it?

Yes, installing grub and writing its grub.cfg comes late in the
process. If that causes it to be written too far into the disk
for the system to boot, then perhaps it's best that it happens now
and not months/years later when you're in the midst of some
precarious upgrade that shifts it out of reach.

Screen blanking: are you sure it hasn't crashed? I have one old Acer
that I haven't yet succeeded in installing stretch on. I suspect the
video card because even jessie has its problems (mainly confined to
exiting X).

Cheers,
David.

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#209776

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Vi, 05 apr 19, 13:05:56, David Wright wrote:
> 
> A solution might be to install over a serial link, but I don't
> think you can do that with the d-i itself, only with 3rd-party
> mangled versions.

Sure it can, it's how most ARM boards are installed.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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#210057

On Sun 09 Jun 2019 at 18:07:11 (+0300), andreimpopescu@gmail.com wrote:
> On Vi, 05 apr 19, 13:05:56, David Wright wrote:
> > 
> > A solution might be to install over a serial link, but I don't
> > think you can do that with the d-i itself, only with 3rd-party
> > mangled versions.
> 
> Sure it can, it's how most ARM boards are installed.

Good. Then it should be a simple matter to capture the d-i screens
while setting up the network. It's something I've never bothered
with, but Felix might be interested in doing. Looking at
https://www.pontikis.net/blog/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-step-by-step
which Felix cited, you can see that this section is missing
(between the "Network" heading and "Set Hostname and Domain".

Cheers,
David.

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#206989

On Thursday 04 April 2019 13:12:58 Felix Miata wrote:

> Gene Heskett composed on 2019-04-04 10:39 (UTC-0400):
> > So how _exactly_ do I make the installer take what it finds, format
> > it, and just get on with it?
>
> First select manual partitioning (all these are the same screen):
> https://www.howtoforge.com/images/debian_stretch_minimal_server/debian
>-9-server-img-16.png
> https://debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/images/inst-partman.png
> https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisks.png
>
> Then select the disk (should resemble one of these):
> https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Select-free-space-t
>o-partition.png
> https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Overview-of-disks.p
>ng https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisksManual3.png
>
> Choose the partition to configure (I think these are actually the same
> screen as previous group, except with disk's partitions expanded):
> https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-s
>erver-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_31_partitioning.png
> https://blog.sleeplessbeastie.eu/assets/uploads/2013/10/debian_install
>-partition_disks-partitions_end.png
>
> Here's the screen where the main business gets done, selecting mount
> point, format type, mount options, volume label:
> https://www.tecmint.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Swap-Partition-Deta
>ils.png
> https://photonsphere.org/img/PartitionDisksBootPartitionSettings.png
> https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-s
>erver-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_25_partitioning.png
>
> Select mount point detail screen:
> https://www.pontikis.net/blog/media/2013/04/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-s
>erver-setup-step-by-step/post/VBX_DEBIAN7_26_partitioning.png
>
> If I knew how to get my own screencaps from a text install on real
> hardware (not a virtual machine) I would make my own web page to do
> what the Debian Handbook seems can't be bothered to do. It would
> probably be somewhat like
> https://www.pontikis.net/blog/debian-7-wheezy-rc1-lamp-server-setup-st
>ep-by-step except the images would be big enough to see without having
> to open each in turn.

So the takeaway is that I'm not the only one with the problem. One can 
take snapshots with a digital camera, and gimp can make them printable. 
But it costs money for the camera.  Sigh...

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#206980

On Thu 04 Apr 2019 at 10:39:19 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> Greetings all
> 
> I am  today, going to make my 6th attempt to make the stretch netinstall 
> work.

My, my; as an experienced user, you really are having a hard time.

> I think I have sussed the failure mode, which seems to be that by the 
> time its finslly gets around to installing grub, its too far into the 
> diksk for the dumb bios on this old Asus mobo to find it, so this time I 
> am going to add a /boot as first partition. At 2 or 3 hundred megs.

"... its too far into the diksk ...". Eh? I think that's known as
conjecture. Sounds like nonsense anyway.
 
> And I'd like to do this with gparted in such a way as to skip the 
> partitioning. I don't care if it formats the partitions I give it. But I 
> do NOT want them futzt with. I've even had your partitioner rearrange 
> the partitions/ putting a /boot partition 300G's into a 1T drive, 
> although that was with a previous version.  So I'm hoping it won't do 
> that ever again.

You have convinced youself that the partitioner is at fault. Have you
thought of a test install using a single 20 GB partition on your disk?
It is not what you want, but it could boost your confidence.
 
> So how _exactly_ do I make the installer take what it finds, format it, 
> and just get on with it?

I cannot be bothered to think about this. 99.9% of Debian users find an
expert installation procedure works well.

-- 
Brian.

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#206984

On Thu, 4 Apr 2019 10:39:19 -0400
Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:

> Greetings all
> 
> I am  today, going to make my 6th attempt to make the stretch netinstall 
> work.

I netinstalled Stretch some months ago on this 12 year old Asrock
770DE+ system with absolutely no problems. My guess is you're doing
something wrong and making the same mistake over and over and over
again.

Are you trying to use UEFI partitioning and boot?

Does your motherboard support UEFI?  Mine doesn't.

So, have to do MBR-type partitioning and install. I have /, /home in
extended partitions and swap as a primary one (from the previous Wheezy
install which I no longer use).

B 

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#206985

On 4/4/19 7:39 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> Greetings all
> 
> I am  today, going to make my 6th attempt to make the stretch netinstall
> work.
> 
> I think I have sussed the failure mode, which seems to be that by the
> time its finslly gets around to installing grub, its too far into the
> diksk for the dumb bios on this old Asus mobo to find it, so this time I
> am going to add a /boot as first partition. At 2 or 3 hundred megs.
> 
> And I'd like to do this with gparted in such a way as to skip the
> partitioning. I don't care if it formats the partitions I give it. But I
> do NOT want them futzt with. I've even had your partitioner rearrange
> the partitions/ putting a /boot partition 300G's into a 1T drive,
> although that was with a previous version.  So I'm hoping it won't do
> that ever again.
> 
> So how _exactly_ do I make the installer take what it finds, format it,
> and just get on with it?
> 
> Cheers, Gene Heskett

Answer:  You must tell the installer _exactly_ what to do.


I always use the d-i in text mode, not GUI mode, to avoid potential 
problems with X windows.  I recommend you do the same.


The d-i defaults to the MBR partitioning scheme.  This is what I want, 
because my older computers do not know how to boot from GPT and my newer 
Wintel computers boot from both MBR and GPT (MacBook Pro only boots from 
GPT?).  Furthermore, I use small system discs (16+ GB), which do not 
require GPT.  I recommend you do the same on both accounts -- use small 
system discs and use the MBR partitioning scheme.


While I have tried d-i automatic partitioning occasionally over the 
years to see what it does, I always manually partition system discs I 
plan to keep.  I recommend you do the same.


Begin by choosing a computer, disconnecting all HDD's, SSD's, USB 
drives, SD drives, etc., and connecting the drive you want to contain 
Debian to the motherboard's first SATA port or first USB port.  Boot the 
d-i media.  At the main menu, choose "Install".  Work your way through 
the d-i pages.  When you get to the "Partitioning method" page, choose 
"manual".  The manual partitioning sub-application has many available 
choices.  Actions are in the upper area, discs and partitions are in the 
lower area.  Depending upon what you select, the sub-app will present 
you with more choices.  I learned to use this sub-app the old-fashioned 
way -- by fumbling my way through, exploring, making mistakes, fixing 
them, etc..  Understand that some actions (such as encrypting a 
partition) make one-way changes to how the sub-app operates.  If and 
when I get stuck with the sub-app, I can always push the reset or power 
buttons and start over with  fresh run of d-i.  The partitioning sub-app 
starts to make sense fairly quickly, and is faster/ easier/ less 
error-prone than using the recovery shell.  With your knowledge and 
experience, I am sure you can figure out the manual partitioning sub-app 
too.  You will then have a system disc partitioned exactly how you want it.


When you're done setting up you system disc, take an image of it.


Then connect the 2 TB disc and set it up for your bulk data and large apps.


(When you are confident with the d-i manual partitioning sub-app, you 
can do both the system disk and your data disk(s) at install time.)


David

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