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Is it possible to install Debian in such a case.

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  Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 10:50 +0200
    Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Jonas Smedegaard <jonas@jones.dk> - 2019-05-10 11:00 +0200
      Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 11:10 +0200
        Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-05-10 11:30 +0200
          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 11:50 +0200
        Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-05-10 11:40 +0200
          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 12:00 +0200
            Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-05-10 14:20 +0200
              Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 16:20 +0200
            Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2019-05-10 15:30 +0200
        Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Jonas Smedegaard <jonas@jones.dk> - 2019-05-10 11:50 +0200
          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2019-05-10 12:10 +0200
            Tinker team (Was: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case.) Jonas Smedegaard <jonas@jones.dk> - 2019-05-11 01:10 +0200
              Re: Tinker team (Was: Is it possible to install Debian in such a  case.) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2019-05-11 09:10 +0200
                Re: Tinker team (Was: Is it possible to install Debian in such a  case.) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2019-05-11 10:00 +0200
                Re: Tinker team (Was: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case.) Jonas Smedegaard <jonas@jones.dk> - 2019-05-11 10:00 +0200
          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 12:10 +0200
    Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-05-10 12:40 +0200
      Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2019-05-10 13:00 +0200
        Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-05-10 13:40 +0200
          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2019-05-10 13:50 +0200
            Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-05-10 16:00 +0200
              Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 16:20 +0200
                Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-05-10 16:30 +0200
                  Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 16:40 +0200
                    Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-05-10 17:00 +0200
                      Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 17:10 +0200
                        Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2019-05-10 17:30 +0200
                          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 18:00 +0200
                            Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-05-10 20:10 +0200
              Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-05-10 17:40 +0200
                Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-05-10 18:10 +0200
                  Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-05-10 20:40 +0200
                    Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2019-05-10 22:20 +0200
                      Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-05-21 16:50 +0200
    Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2019-05-10 14:50 +0200
      Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 16:30 +0200
        Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2019-05-11 08:30 +0200
          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-11 14:00 +0200
            Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2019-05-11 15:00 +0200
            Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-05-11 15:20 +0200
              Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-11 22:30 +0200
                Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-05-12 13:00 +0200
    Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 17:00 +0200
      Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2019-05-10 17:10 +0200
        Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 17:20 +0200
        Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-05-10 17:30 +0200
          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-10 17:40 +0200
          Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2019-05-10 20:30 +0200
            Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-05-11 17:50 +0200
              Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-05-11 19:30 +0200
                Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-05-11 19:50 +0200
                  Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2019-05-11 20:30 +0200
                Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2019-05-11 21:50 +0200
                  Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2019-05-11 23:10 +0200
    Re: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case. An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> - 2019-05-13 00:20 +0200

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#208496 — Is it possible to install Debian in such a case.

Hi, List

Image the following case

What I Have.
a USB stick with
1.  a portable GRUB (either UEFI or legacy)
2.  a install ISO, such as debian-9.9.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso (mayb would e
a LiveCD make life easier?)

What we want.Have Debian installed (could assume that we could do
whatever we could, such as re-partitation the whole harddisk)


The Answer to this question is most probably yes, but how.


The work around is to boot with  vmliunz and initrd.gz from
http://ftp.debian.org/debian/dists/stretch/main/installer-amd64/current/images/hd-media/
the cost is very small as these two file size total is less than 20M


I wonder if there is a way to finish install only in GRUB, without
initrd involved







-- 
Liu An

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#208497

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Quoting An Liu (2019-05-10 10:48:46)
> Hi, List
> 
> Image the following case
> 
> What I Have.
> a USB stick with
> 1.  a portable GRUB (either UEFI or legacy)
> 2.  a install ISO, such as debian-9.9.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso (mayb would e
> a LiveCD make life easier?)
> 
> What we want.Have Debian installed (could assume that we could do
> whatever we could, such as re-partitation the whole harddisk)
> 
> 
> The Answer to this question is most probably yes, but how.
> 
> 
> The work around is to boot with  vmliunz and initrd.gz from
> http://ftp.debian.org/debian/dists/stretch/main/installer-amd64/current/images/hd-media/
> the cost is very small as these two file size total is less than 20M
> 
> 
> I wonder if there is a way to finish install only in GRUB, without
> initrd involved

Sorry, I don't understand: what do you want different from running 
debian-installer?


 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#208499

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> Sorry, I don't understand: what do you want different from running
> debian-installer?
>

In short，just for fun

longer answer，

1. want to know what a installation process (e.g. bootable iso) actually do
for us 。
2.Find some clues if the automation setup fails，what we could do next







>
>  - Jonas
>
> --
>  * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
>  * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/
>
>  [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private
>
-- 
Liu An

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#208500

On Fri 10 May 2019 at 11:09:25 +0200, An Liu wrote:

> > Sorry, I don't understand: what do you want different from running
> > debian-installer?
> >
> 
> In short，just for fun
> 
> longer answer，
> 
> 1. want to know what a installation process (e.g. bootable iso) actually do
> for us 。
> 2.Find some clues if the automation setup fails，what we could do next

Adapt

https://wiki.debian.org/Installation+Archive+USBStick?highlight=%28shared%2Fask_device%3Dmanual%29

to your needs?

-- 
Brian.

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#208502

Hi Brain

> Adapt
>
> https://wiki.debian.org/Installation+Archive+USBStick?highlight=%28shared%2Fask_device%3Dmanual%29
>
> to your needs?

Yes, the section 'Using GRUB's Loopback Facility' should have
something I'm after.
Thank you

-- 
Liu An

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#208501

On Fri, 10 May 2019 11:09:25 +0200
An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Sorry, I don't understand: what do you want different from running
> > debian-installer?
> >  
> 
> In short，just for fun
> 
> longer answer，
> 
> 1. want to know what a installation process (e.g. bootable iso)
> actually do for us 。
> 2.Find some clues if the automation setup fails，what we could do next
> 

The current (and presumably all future) stable installation images will
install either in legacy mode or UEFI. Just transfer the image to the
stick (the whole stick, not a partition of it) and it should Just Work.

Transfer can be done in Linux by cat, dd, cp or presumably other
methods. There is also a Windows utility (win32diskimager) which will
copy images to USB sticks.

https://www.debian.org/releases/jessie/amd64/ch04s03.html.en

There are too many types of failure possible to give a quick guide.
Almost always, you will see some kind of error message about a failure.
But failure on common modern types of computer are not frequent, in my
experience. I have a modern netbook, no legacy BIOS option, UEFI only,
Windows 10 already installed. As long as I had enough drive space
free, there was no problem with copying to USB stick and installing,
with an option for the Win10 boot manager in the grub menu afterwards.

-- 
Joe

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#208504

Hi, Joe

Thank you
> The current (and presumably all future) stable installation images will
> install either in legacy mode or UEFI. Just transfer the image to the
> stick (the whole stick, not a partition of it) and it should Just Work.
'Should just Work' is not what i care in this question, so far debian installer
 works quite for me without any issue

> Transfer can be done in Linux by cat, dd, cp or presumably other
> methods. There is also a Windows utility (win32diskimager) which will
> copy images to USB sticks.
Yes, i use dd or cp to create install media for formal case, because it's the
recommended way which tested quite well.

Actually the question could extend in several ways, such as

1. Could I install debian from chroot enviroment while i'm in another
linux dist
(such as CentOS, SUSE,  RHEL ...), or vice versa.
2. Could I boot A LiveCD without burn it to some media

These are not typically problems bother me, but something interesting
to play with,  LOL

-- 
Liu An

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#208511

On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 03:52:34AM -0600, An Liu wrote:
> 1. Could I install debian from chroot enviroment while i'm in another
> linux dist
> (such as CentOS, SUSE,  RHEL ...), or vice versa.

https://www.debian.org/releases/stretch/amd64/apds03.html.en

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#208517

Hi, Greg,
It really helps, thank you

On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 6:13 AM Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> wrote:
>
> On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 03:52:34AM -0600, An Liu wrote:
> > 1. Could I install debian from chroot enviroment while i'm in another
> > linux dist
> > (such as CentOS, SUSE,  RHEL ...), or vice versa.
>
> https://www.debian.org/releases/stretch/amd64/apds03.html.en
>


-- 
Liu An

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#208513

On 2019-05-10, An Liu <sourceonly@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Actually the question could extend in several ways, such as
>
> 1. Could I install debian from chroot enviroment while i'm in another
> linux dist

Once I ran the netinstall iso with qemu/kvm and installed onto a usb thumb
drive I'd taken care to preliminarily insert into a usb port on my
desktop machine (otherwise the connection is rarely made).

A recipe of this sort (where sdb represents the aforementioned thumb drive)
worked for me (it was a few years back):

 kvm -m 512 -hda /dev/sdb -boot d -cdrom your_netinst.iso 

Might be perpendicular to whatever you're asking, but it seems rather
open-ended whatever you're asking, so I said to myself can't hurt.

> (such as CentOS, SUSE,  RHEL ...), or vice versa.
> 2. Could I boot A LiveCD without burn it to some media
>
> These are not typically problems bother me, but something interesting
> to play with,  LOL
>


-- 
Mrs Hessler, the teacher, considered me her employee, and I played along with
this to keep the frown off that somewhat shapeless face she had crowned with an
inappropriate platinum pixie. I regularly fed her made-up news items from
imaginary newspapers, and she always bought it. ‘Drone Strike on a Strip Club’,
for example. -- Thomas McGuane, https://granta.com/grandma-and-me/

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#208503

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Quoting An Liu (2019-05-10 11:09:25)
> > Sorry, I don't understand: what do you want different from running
> > debian-installer?
> >
> 
> In short，just for fun
> 
> longer answer，
> 
> 1. want to know what a installation process (e.g. bootable iso) actually do
> for us 。
> 2.Find some clues if the automation setup fails，what we could do next

Ah, ok.  Then you probably want to play with debootstrap (or one of the 
many wrapper tools around that, or alternatives to it like multistrap or 
mmdebstrap), add compare the result of that with a debian-installer 
installation to understand what you are missing (e.g. a boot loader and 
various tweaks to files below /etc).


It sounds like perhaps you would be interested in joining the Tinker 
team: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianTinker

So far the "team" consist of only me, working on a set of routines to 
replicate what debian-installer does, without debian-installer: 
https://salsa.debian.org/tinker-team/box/

I have worked on that for ~9 years now. targeting a few ARM boxes and an 
ARM-based laptop, but intend to extend to cover also amd64 and i386 
devices, just haven't taken the time for that yet.

Please consider joining the tinker-team mailinglist (listed at the wiki 
page referenced above) and let's discuss further there.

...or if you just want working code, then buy one of the supported 
Olimex devices and grab working images at https://box.redpill.dk/ :-)


 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#208505

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On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 11:45:06AM +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote:

[...]

> It sounds like perhaps you would be interested in joining the Tinker 
> team: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianTinker

Sorry to irrupt from the side, but... why didn't I know of that?
Thanks for the link, and for keeping up the "team" :-)

Cheers
-- tomás

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#208551 — Tinker team (Was: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case.)

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Quoting tomas@tuxteam.de (2019-05-10 12:01:33)
> On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 11:45:06AM +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
> > It sounds like perhaps you would be interested in joining the Tinker 
> > team: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianTinker
> 
> Sorry to irrupt from the side, but... why didn't I know of that? 
> Thanks for the link, and for keeping up the "team" :-)

Because I am bad at promoting my projects :-/

The Tinker project was born during a journey through India by my partner 
and I: https://couchdesign.dk/india/

We were meeting Linux hackers all over India with a special interest in 
learning about desktop and distribution customizations - what was 
adapted and why. In Kerala we met Cherry, a NetBSD developer and 
electronics hacker who contrary to most others we met had little 
interest in specific looks and behaviour of a graphical desktop but 
instead asked into the options and quality of tinker tools available in 
Debian.

I am no expert on electronics hacking myself, but want to help support 
different customization needs, so I formed the tinker project and 
drafted what I imagine could attract tinkeres - people wanting a system 
for tinkering with other systems or with the main system itself.

DebianTinker uses Boxer, a tool I am developing to help do Debian Pure 
(and dirty) Blends: Track package relationships and tweaks, more 
streamlined than doing it by hand but more flexible than making and 
using metapackages.

Boxer is used to develop these Debian Blends:

  * DebianParl - a system for individual parlamentarians,
    deployed as a pilot project in the European Parliament
    https://wiki.debian.org/DebianParl
  * DebianDesign - a system for various kinds of visual designers
    https://Design
  * DebianTinker - a system for hardware and software tinkeres
    https://wiki.debian.org/DebianTinker
  * SolidBox - a system for non-technical use of semantic web service
    https://solidbox.org/


Thanks for the interest. :-)

 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#208556 — Re: Tinker team (Was: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case.)

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On Sat, May 11, 2019 at 01:05:59AM +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote:

[...]

Thanks for the very interesting synopsis.

> Thanks for the interest. :-)

Now you /really/ raised my interest. Following links...

Cheers
-- t

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#208557 — Re: Tinker team (Was: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case.)

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On Sat, May 11, 2019 at 09:55:24AM +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote:

[...]

> Please do ask me anything.  I am lousy at properly documenting things 

Thanks for your kind invitation :)

Cheers
-- t

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#208558 — Re: Tinker team (Was: Is it possible to install Debian in such a case.)

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Quoting tomas@tuxteam.de (2019-05-11 09:02:39)
> On Sat, May 11, 2019 at 01:05:59AM +0200, Jonas Smedegaard wrote:
> Thanks for the very interesting synopsis.
> 
> > Thanks for the interest. :-)
> 
> Now you /really/ raised my interest. Following links...

Great.

Please do ask me anything.  I am lousy at properly documenting things 
:-/


 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#208506

Hi, Jonas

> Ah, ok.  Then you probably want to play with debootstrap (or one of the
> many wrapper tools around that, or alternatives to it like multistrap or
> mmdebstrap), add compare the result of that with a debian-installer
> installation to understand what you are missing (e.g. a boot loader and
> various tweaks to files below /etc).
>
>
> It sounds like perhaps you would be interested in joining the Tinker
> team: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianTinker
Sound interesting, I'll look into that :), thank you.

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#208507

On 05/10/2019 03:48 AM, An Liu wrote:
> Hi, List
> 
> Image the following case
> 
> What I Have.
> a USB stick with
> 1.  a portable GRUB (either UEFI or legacy)
> 2.  a install ISO, such as debian-9.9.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso (mayb would e
> a LiveCD make life easier?)
> 
> What we want.Have Debian installed (could assume that we could do
> whatever we could, such as re-partitation the whole harddisk)> 
> 
> The Answer to this question is most probably yes, but how.> 
> 
> The work around is to boot with  vmliunz and initrd.gz from
> http://ftp.debian.org/debian/dists/stretch/main/installer-amd64/current/images/hd-media/
> the cost is very small as these two file size total is less than 20M> 
> 
> I wonder if there is a way to finish install only in GRUB, without
> initrd involved

Missing background? Unstated goals?

1. Why is grub mentioned at all?
    If debian-9.9.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso has been properly placed on USB
    drive, that is all that is *ALL* that is required to install to:
    A. machine's hard-drive.
    B. a second USB drive. [be careful to place grub on correct drive]

2. Why are vmliunz and initrd.gz mentioned?

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#208508

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On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 05:29:48AM -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 05/10/2019 03:48 AM, An Liu wrote:
> >Hi, List
> >
> >Image the following case
> >
> >What I Have.
> >a USB stick with

[...]

> Missing background? Unstated goals?

I've got the feeling that I don't understand your question completely.

> 1. Why is grub mentioned at all?
>    If debian-9.9.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso has been properly placed on USB
>    drive [...]

Well, there's a boot loader in that (AFAIK it's not GRUB, but it's
a while ago I last looked). As I understood An Liu, the idea was
to understand how all that pieces fit together, so asking for the
boot loader seems relevant.

>    A. machine's hard-drive.
>    B. a second USB drive. [be careful to place grub on correct drive]
> 
> 2. Why are vmliunz and initrd.gz mentioned?

Those come directly "after" the boot loader (so they are part of the
boot /and/ of the installation process, too).

Cheers
-- tomás

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#208509

On 05/10/2019 05:52 AM, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
> On Fri, May 10, 2019 at 05:29:48AM -0500, Richard Owlett wrote:
>> On 05/10/2019 03:48 AM, An Liu wrote:
>>> Hi, List
>>>
>>> Image the following case
>>>
>>> What I Have.
>>> a USB stick with
> 
> [...]
> 
>> Missing background? Unstated goals?
> 
> I've got the feeling that I don't understand your question completely.

That is essentially my comment to the OP.

> 
>> 1. Why is grub mentioned at all?
>>     If debian-9.9.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso has been properly placed on USB
>>     drive [...]
> 
> Well, there's a boot loader in that (AFAIK it's not GRUB, but it's
> a while ago I last looked). As I understood An Liu, the idea was
> to understand how all that pieces fit together, so asking for the
> boot loader seems relevant.
> 

That's one of a number of possible guesses of OP's intent.
I've asked questions others have thought vague though I thought were 
quite explicit. People read through lenses of their personal experience 
and assumptions.


>>     A. machine's hard-drive.
>>     B. a second USB drive. [be careful to place grub on correct drive]

That was cautionary, primarily to future newbies who might need an 
explicit statement of what is obvious to the experienced.

>>
>> 2. Why are vmliunz and initrd.gz mentioned?
> 
> Those come directly "after" the boot loader (so they are part of the
> boot /and/ of the installation process, too).
> 
> Cheers
> -- tomás
> 

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