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File with weird permissions, impossible to delete

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  File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Pétùr <peturvilj@gmail.com> - 2018-09-11 14:00 +0200
    Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2018-09-11 14:10 +0200
      Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2018-09-11 14:20 +0200
    Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2018-09-11 14:20 +0200
    File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Martin <keine-eile@online.de> - 2018-09-11 14:30 +0200
      Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Pétùr <peturvilj@gmail.com> - 2018-09-11 14:50 +0200
        Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Martin <keine-eile@online.de> - 2018-09-11 15:10 +0200
          Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2018-09-11 17:00 +0200
            Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2018-09-11 18:20 +0200
              Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org> - 2018-09-11 19:00 +0200
        Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2018-09-11 15:30 +0200
    Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Erik Christiansen <dvalin@internode.on.net> - 2018-09-11 15:00 +0200
    Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-09-11 15:10 +0200
      Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org> - 2018-09-11 16:50 +0200
        Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Pétùr <peturvilj@gmail.com> - 2018-09-11 17:30 +0200
          Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Martin <keine-eile@online.de> - 2018-09-11 19:40 +0200
            Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Pétùr <peturvilj@gmail.com> - 2018-09-11 19:50 +0200
              Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2018-09-11 20:30 +0200
              Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2018-09-11 21:10 +0200
              Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2018-09-12 01:50 +0200
                Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Pétùr <peturvilj@gmail.com> - 2018-09-12 12:10 +0200
            Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Michael Stone <mstone@debian.org> - 2018-09-11 20:30 +0200
            Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2018-09-11 22:30 +0200
      Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2018-09-12 01:20 +0200
        Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2018-09-12 03:30 +0200
          Re: red SATA cable corruption (was: File with weird permissions,  impossible to delete) Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2018-09-12 03:40 +0200
            Re: red SATA cable corruption (was: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete) Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2018-09-12 04:40 +0200
              Re: red SATA cable corruption Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2018-09-12 05:10 +0200
                Re: red SATA cable corruption Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2018-09-12 08:10 +0200
                  Re: red SATA cable corruption Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2018-09-12 13:40 +0200
                  OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption) Marty <martyb@ix.netcom.com> - 2018-09-14 20:40 +0200
                    Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption) Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2018-09-14 22:00 +0200
                      Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption) Nicholas Geovanis <nickgeovanis@gmail.com> - 2018-09-18 21:20 +0200
                        Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption) Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2018-09-18 22:00 +0200
                          Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable  corruption) Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2018-09-18 22:10 +0200
                            Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption) Nicholas Geovanis <nickgeovanis@gmail.com> - 2018-09-18 23:20 +0200
                              Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable  corruption) Dominic Knight <dominicknight@gmx.com> - 2018-09-18 23:40 +0200
                                Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption) Nicholas Geovanis <nickgeovanis@gmail.com> - 2018-09-19 00:20 +0200
                                  Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable  corruption) Martin <keine-eile@online.de> - 2018-09-19 10:20 +0200
          Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Zenaan Harkness <zenaan@freedbms.net> - 2018-09-14 03:10 +0200
    Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Pétùr <peturvilj@gmail.com> - 2018-09-18 15:00 +0200
      Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2018-09-18 16:10 +0200
        Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete Pétùr <peturvilj@gmail.com> - 2018-09-18 16:20 +0200
          Re: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2018-09-18 17:30 +0200

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#200047

Le 12/09/2018 à 01:43, Felix Miata a écrit :
>> I deleted the file 
>> .cache/shotwell/thumbs/thumbs360/thumb0000000000000c5c.jpg
> Deleted exactly how?

`rm -vf` in root

>> without issue after chattr -i on this file.
>> However, it didn't work for the index.html file which is considered as a 
>> folder.
> Exactly how did you try?

`rm -rvf` in root

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#200004

On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 07:34:53PM +0200, Martin wrote:
>don't get crazy about FS corruption. There is no sign this is the case 
>so far.

umm, yeah, this is pretty classic. it's more likely than not that random 
bits will result in file attributes that can be interpreted but are 
completely bogus.

>One hint will be, check if your system time is ok (both, date and 
>hwclock!), may be there is a reason for this odd timestamps.

there's basically zero chance that setting the clock wrong would result 
in timestamps that are 200 and 270 years in the future on a single file.

Mike Stone

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#200013

On Tue 11 Sep 2018 at 19:34:53 (+0200), Martin wrote:
> Pétùr,
> 
> don't get crazy about FS corruption. There is no sign this is the case so far. Date and UID's are odd, but valid within ext4. Remove the immutable flag (chattr -i), you will be able to alter the files as you like.
> 
> One hint will be, check if your system time is ok (both, date and hwclock!), may be there is a reason for this odd timestamps.

Please stop posting this bad advice. Applying sticking plaster does
not help a puncture wound ± an internal hemorrhage.

Cheers,
David.

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#200014

On 12/09/2018 00:59, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 01:52:15PM +0200, Pétùr wrote:
>> I have some files, with weird permissions:
>> # ls -la
>> d-wS--S--T 2 1061270772 2605320832  4096 oct.   7  2412 index.html
> Obvious file system corruption.  Unmount, fsck, re-mount, and then
> be prepared to restore the data from your last good backup if/when
> the fsck failed to repair everything.

I would also use journalctl to look for any i/o errors on the affected 
device.

What hardware and kernel and filesystem? ext4 filesystem corruption is 
rare and usually suggests a hardware fault.

I would run a full hardware test, including CPU and RAM, and a long 
SMART test on the storage if it is capable. SMART self-tests will not 
usually detect drive data transmission errors caused by cable problems, 
but the SMART logs should list the CRC error count which can indicate 
unreliable cables or controller connectors.

I would first identify the *cause* and replace all unreliable hardware 
before bothering to restore from backup. If you have noticed some 
corruption, you likely also have some unnoticed corruption. Continuing 
to use unreliable hardware wastes your time and endangers your data.

Kind regards,

-- 
Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz>
Director
Transient Software Limited <https://transient.nz/>
New Zealand

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#200020

On Tuesday 11 September 2018 19:13:58 Ben Caradoc-Davies wrote:

> On 12/09/2018 00:59, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> > On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 01:52:15PM +0200, Pétùr wrote:
> >> I have some files, with weird permissions:
> >> # ls -la
> >> d-wS--S--T 2 1061270772 2605320832  4096 oct.   7  2412 index.html
> >
> > Obvious file system corruption.  Unmount, fsck, re-mount, and then
> > be prepared to restore the data from your last good backup if/when
> > the fsck failed to repair everything.
>
> I would also use journalctl to look for any i/o errors on the affected
> device.
>
> What hardware and kernel and filesystem? ext4 filesystem corruption is
> rare and usually suggests a hardware fault.
>
> I would run a full hardware test, including CPU and RAM, and a long
> SMART test on the storage if it is capable. SMART self-tests will not
> usually detect drive data transmission errors caused by cable
> problems, but the SMART logs should list the CRC error count which can
> indicate unreliable cables or controller connectors.
>
> I would first identify the *cause* and replace all unreliable hardware
> before bothering to restore from backup. If you have noticed some
> corruption, you likely also have some unnoticed corruption. Continuing
> to use unreliable hardware wastes your time and endangers your data.
>
> Kind regards,

I will 2nd and 3rd Bens advice. Bad cables have been the huge majority of 
such nefarious goings on. Particularly if they are bright red and 4+ 
years old, put a tail on the log, and prod the cable gently with a 
wooden pencil.  If the log blows up, bad cable, replace it with any 
color but red. Preferably a month ago...

 

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#200023 — Re: red SATA cable corruption (was: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete)

Gene Heskett composed on 2018-09-11 21:21 (UTC-0400):

> Ben Caradoc-Davies wrote:

>> I would first identify the *cause* and replace all unreliable hardware
>> before bothering to restore from backup. If you have noticed some
>> corruption, you likely also have some unnoticed corruption. Continuing
>> to use unreliable hardware wastes your time and endangers your data.

> I will 2nd and 3rd Bens advice. Bad cables have been the huge majority of 
> such nefarious goings on. Particularly if they are bright red and 4+ 
> years old, put a tail on the log, and prod the cable gently with a 
> wooden pencil.  If the log blows up, bad cable, replace it with any 
> color but red. Preferably a month ago...

IMO, red because it's red is less likely than red because red was the dominant
color of SATA1 cables, not designed for SATA2 or SATA3 speeds newer hardware is
designed to use. IOW, if the cable is red, quite likely it is speed limited,
regardless whether the red dye is exposed to its conductors.
-- 
"Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom. Whatever else you
get, get wisdom." Proverbs 4:7 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#200026 — Re: red SATA cable corruption (was: File with weird permissions, impossible to delete)

On Tuesday 11 September 2018 21:34:27 Felix Miata wrote:

> Gene Heskett composed on 2018-09-11 21:21 (UTC-0400):
> > Ben Caradoc-Davies wrote:
> >> I would first identify the *cause* and replace all unreliable
> >> hardware before bothering to restore from backup. If you have
> >> noticed some corruption, you likely also have some unnoticed
> >> corruption. Continuing to use unreliable hardware wastes your time
> >> and endangers your data.
> >
> > I will 2nd and 3rd Bens advice. Bad cables have been the huge
> > majority of such nefarious goings on. Particularly if they are
> > bright red and 4+ years old, put a tail on the log, and prod the
> > cable gently with a wooden pencil.  If the log blows up, bad cable,
> > replace it with any color but red. Preferably a month ago...
>
> IMO, red because it's red is less likely than red because red was the
> dominant color of SATA1 cables, not designed for SATA2 or SATA3 speeds
> newer hardware is designed to use. IOW, if the cable is red, quite
> likely it is speed limited, regardless whether the red dye is exposed
> to its conductors.

That red dye, if in contact with the wire, eats it up like some sort of 
acid, you can literally pour the copper out of the ends where you've cut 
it in two, onto a clean sheet of paper, as a dark brown powder that 
looks a lot like rouge.

As a C.E.T., I've been battling with the cable failures its caused since 
the J.A.Pan company took over the two way radio we here in the USA call 
Citizens band in about 1969 or 1970.  That brought with them, the first 
of the J.A.Pan made microphone coiled cables, all of which had that 
bright red, almost magenta dye in the wire they used for Push To Talk 
control.  Its average life ranged down to 6 months in some cases. Even 
the truckers who depended on folks like me to keep them on the air 
noticed and happily paid 4 or 5x the cost of the J.A.Pan cable, for an 
American made cable.

I'm a retired old fart, be 84 in 3 weeks and I've been chasing electrons 
for a living and making then do useful work since around 1949, had a 1st 
phone since 1962, and been a Journeyman C.E.T. since 1972, so don't tell 
me about red being just a sata-1 slow cable.  You can buy them today, 
with a sata-III blurb on the bag, but it still only lasts 3 to 5 years. 
Black, tan, blue just fine, and I have these other colors in my other 5 
systems, some of which are as old as sata itself, but only one non-red 
cable has failed. And when cut in two, the wires were fine, but the gold 
flash on the connectors was gone, or never existed.  Cheap cable, came 
with the last WD drive I ever bought, and the drive itself was gone in 
less than 10k spinning hours. Seagates? Spin them up and replace them 
when they are too small for the job. The last one I pulled had 77,000+ 
spinning hours on it.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#200028 — Re: red SATA cable corruption

Gene Heskett composed on 2018-09-11 22:29 (UTC-0400):

> On Tuesday 11 September 2018 21:34:27 Felix Miata wrote:

>> IMO, red because it's red is less likely than red because red was the
                                ^^^^^^^^^^^
*Less* likely, not unlikely. IOW, both happen, but red dye cancer less often
than SATA spec inadequacy.

> That red dye, if in contact with the wire, eats it up like some sort of 
> acid, you can literally pour the copper out of the ends where you've cut 
> it in two, onto a clean sheet of paper, as a dark brown powder that 
> looks a lot like rouge.

I'm quite familiar with the above language. Google has found me many copies of
it, authored by you, dating back at least 10 years.

> so don't tell 
> me about red being just a sata-1 slow cable.

I did not. Just the same, I doubt any properly constructed SATA-II or -III cable
with a red outer jacket would allow its red dye to come in contact with the
conductors (unlike SATA-I):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_ATA#/media/File:SATA3-TwinAxCable.jpg

>  You can buy them today, 

I know, and pink, blue, green, yellow, black, tan, etc. But that particular
magenta shade, I'm doubtful you'll find without trying *really* hard. If you do,
it's likely old stock.

I did buy red relatively recently, long after my first exposure to the problem,
but in spite of "them" (technically adapters, not cables) being red, because of
the difficulty finding any that are not red:

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=7637
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=7638
-- 
"Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom. Whatever else you
get, get wisdom." Proverbs 4:7 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#200032 — Re: red SATA cable corruption

On Tuesday 11 September 2018 23:01:43 Felix Miata wrote:

> Gene Heskett composed on 2018-09-11 22:29 (UTC-0400):
> > On Tuesday 11 September 2018 21:34:27 Felix Miata wrote:
> >> IMO, red because it's red is less likely than red because red was
> >> the
>
>                                 ^^^^^^^^^^^
> *Less* likely, not unlikely. IOW, both happen, but red dye cancer less
> often than SATA spec inadequacy.
>
> > That red dye, if in contact with the wire, eats it up like some sort
> > of acid, you can literally pour the copper out of the ends where
> > you've cut it in two, onto a clean sheet of paper, as a dark brown
> > powder that looks a lot like rouge.
>
> I'm quite familiar with the above language. Google has found me many
> copies of it, authored by you, dating back at least 10 years.
>
> > so don't tell
> > me about red being just a sata-1 slow cable.
>
> I did not. Just the same, I doubt any properly constructed SATA-II or
> -III cable with a red outer jacket would allow its red dye to come in
> contact with the conductors (unlike SATA-I):
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_ATA#/media/File:SATA3-TwinAxCable
>.jpg
>
> >  You can buy them today,
>
> I know, and pink, blue, green, yellow, black, tan, etc. But that
> particular magenta shade, I'm doubtful you'll find without trying
> *really* hard. If you do, it's likely old stock.
>
> I did buy red relatively recently, long after my first exposure to the
> problem, but in spite of "them" (technically adapters, not cables)
> being red, because of the difficulty finding any that are not red:
>
> https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=7637
> https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=7638

I reacted a little strongly, Felix, but this dye vs cable failure is 
something I first ran into 48 years ago when I became the afternoon 
bench tech at Norfolk Two Way Radio, run by Vi Bernstraugh in Norfolk 
NE. 1/4 of the repairs I was doing was replacing the mic cords in the 
various CB radios of the day, mostly made in Japan. Some I replaced 
several times over the years I spent working for Vi.

Going off topic...

Mornings and evenings, I was the resident engineer in charge of KXNE-TV, 
about 16 miles NE of Norfolk, a uhf channel 19 facility. The care and 
feeding of the $125,000 klystrons used as amplifiers back in the day is 
a whole new, now old field of science because the beam voltage of 20 
kilovolts not only generates soft x-rays, the electron beams velocity 
was a good fraction of C speed, making the effects of relativity in 
terms of mass * speed, one of that technologies major sources of 
distortion because it resulted in the tube being electrically longer at 
high power levels like during the NTSC synch pulses.

The real problem is related to the fact that its gain is a result of 
modulating the speed of the electrons as they flow by, resulting in a 
bunching because the faster ones caught up with the slow ones at the 
other end of the tube. You  could put 1 watt of drive in the top, and 
get 30kw out the bottom. But the 500+ megahertz drive has a symmetrical 
waveform. But relativity says the mass gain is a square law, so the beam 
speed is slowed more than the opposite push can speed it up.  So the 
delay from top to bottom increases as the instant power goes up.

The fcc calls this incidental carrier phase modulation, and  back in the 
day it caused such a synch buzz in the audio that the fcc gave us 
permission to do our audio tests with an unmodulated video carrier.

I mention this because a water pump failed and burned a hole in the 
visual tubes collector, filling it with water. We had no spare tube, so 
I hooked up a "N" tee, and fed the video drive to the aural tube, 
retuning it for video bandwidth, and we ran that way for several weeks 
while Eimac/Varian made us a new tube, and the NE legislature had to be 
called up to get a quorum to pay for it. During this time, the audio 
buzz was gone because both video and audio was being subjected to this 
relativity effect in equal amounts, cancelling it in the receivers of 
the day because they all operated on the difference. The unwanted 
modulation was still there, but there was no difference the receivers 
could detect.

This "tube" is about 5 feet long, and weighs 180 lbs. and operates in a 
focusing magnet that weighs 2200 lbs. And it takes 70 gallons a minute 
to cool the collector bucket at the bottom of it. It has now been 
replaced with a tube & technology thats more efficient. Klystrons at 
their best were only 28-30%, which meant to get 30 kw peak out of it, 
you were putting something north of 120 kw into it in DC power for the 
electron beam. With two of them in each transmitter, using 220 kwh per 
hour we were Wayne County Public Powers biggest customer by an order of 
magnitude. Its possible I may be the last on this ball of rock and 
water, that knows how to pull it out of its shipping crate, mount the 
cavities to it, set it in the dolly and hook up the cooling plumbing, 
and adjust it for full power daily use. There are adjustments that can 
destroy it in 10 milliseconds in the hands of an idiot.

That water pump then was equipt with some vacuum relays attached to its 
power feed, and if any phase was killed, so was the beam power by brute 
force. Interrupting it at the 20kv to the tubes point. A $150 breaker 
cost us around $130k USD. Expensive lesson indeed.

This of course predates debian by what, 30 years? So its definitely off 
topic. OTOH, those that have stayed with me have learned that 
relativistic effects CAN be observed by you and I if you know what you 
are observing.

And it seems they've put a white sleeve over the conductors of late, 
which may slow the migration of whatever is in that particular red dye 
to the extent it *might* last 10 years.

As another furinstance, wire wrapping wire comes in many colors, but its 
the red stuff that breaks first, not by coming unsoldered when used for 
point to point in one-off pcb projects, but 1/16" of an inch up into the 
unstripped insulation. Putz around with the other colors, and they'll 
break at the surface of the solder.

Yeah, I've some experience. And it goes back quite a ways timewise.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#200051 — Re: red SATA cable corruption

On 2018-09-12, Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:
>
> Yeah, I've some experience. And it goes back quite a ways timewise.
>

Maybe they made the cables red to warn you off them, like those brightly
colored aposematic frogs in South America (now maybe drifting ominously
north because of climate change, to eventually kill curious kids in
Minnesota).

Just thinking out loud.

-- 
“An oak is a tree. A rose is a flower. A deer is an animal. A sparrow is a
bird. Russia is our fatherland. Death is inevitable.” Russian school book.

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#200139 — OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

The Debian whippersnappers need to know their hacker history :)

I've heard the stories about getting caught on or near a tower. Supposedly you can feel it before it scrambles your 
brains. I would not seek out the experience.


On 09/12/2018 02:08 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

> 
> Yeah, I've some experience. And it goes back quite a ways timewise.
> 

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#200146 — Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

On Friday 14 September 2018 13:58:40 Marty wrote:

> The Debian whippersnappers need to know their hacker history :)
>
> I've heard the stories about getting caught on or near a tower.
> Supposedly you can feel it before it scrambles your brains. I would
> not seek out the experience.

Sufficient power to be quickly dangerous being absorbed by the body has a 
side effect of raising ones tempurature, and you are generally well 
aware of it. Maximum safe long term is 10 milliwatts per cubic cc of 
flesh. And we only had one small window looking into the transmitter 
that exceeded that since we have to rent a field meter and measure that 
every 5 years at license renewal.

The only time I was aware of the higher rf field was up in the UP, at a 
channel 8, and one of the neighbors 3/4 mile back down the hill, came up 
to visit with an implanted pacemaker, and he had to leave quickly as his 
pacemaker was going burzerk.

> On 09/12/2018 02:08 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > Yeah, I've some experience. And it goes back quite a ways timewise.

I'm generally ok. The only brain damageing event I've encountered is a 
pulmonary embolism, usually fatal, 3 years ago that seems to have 
dropped my IQ by maybe 5 points. I've since failed the mensa test.

I sure don't recommend it as a way to die, its scary as can be, not being 
able to draw a decent breath even with your lungs full to the bursting 
point. The shot worked, but the docs, with several internish people in 
tow at a time, that did come to look at a survivor, made sure that I 
knew I was one lucky guy as the odds of my living thru it were maybe 5%.  
That was about 3 years ago, and I'll be 84 in a long couple weeks. There 
is of course some rat poison to discourage a repeat in my nightly 
pill-tainer. :)

But even 15+ years retired, I find my talents at keeping stuff on the air 
are in demand. I have been told several times that people that actually 
fix transmitters are a dying breed. Some of the horror story's I've 
heard from owners while working on something make me believe it.

I'm not a "papered" engineer either, I done this sort of thing all my 
working life on an 8th grade education, getting a G.E.D. about 25 years 
ago to please the missus of 29 years come December, and who has a degree 
in music. Passed the test for a 1st phone in about 1.5 hours in 1962, 
passed the C.E.T. in just over an hour back in 1972, so I have one of 
those next to the 1st phone in my billfold.

Its been an interesting ride thats still interesting. I could do w/o the 
aches and pains of the years, but I'm the one down 4 feet in the ditch 
in my front yard patching a broken water line 2 weeks ago. And I had to 
rent a backhoe to dig the ditch. Carefully, the gas line is in the same 
ditch!.  Seems the town got hungry and decided to license backhoe etc 
operators AND institute a job permit too. But even the guys who own one 
found it too costly and time wasteing, so nobody is doing that sort of 
work inside the city limits now.

Sigh.  The town has apparently not heard of TANSTAAFL. I wonder how 
painfull that hole in their foot is.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#200282 — Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

Go In Peace.
Real radio engineering, despite everything, is a dying art/science.
Check out the Crystal Set Society, my man.
Real Men, Real Women, Real Radios.
https://www.midnightscience.net/
On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 2:57 PM Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:
>
> On Friday 14 September 2018 13:58:40 Marty wrote:
>
> > The Debian whippersnappers need to know their hacker history :)
> >
> > I've heard the stories about getting caught on or near a tower.
> > Supposedly you can feel it before it scrambles your brains. I would
> > not seek out the experience.
>
> Sufficient power to be quickly dangerous being absorbed by the body has a
> side effect of raising ones tempurature, and you are generally well
> aware of it. Maximum safe long term is 10 milliwatts per cubic cc of
> flesh. And we only had one small window looking into the transmitter
> that exceeded that since we have to rent a field meter and measure that
> every 5 years at license renewal.
>
> The only time I was aware of the higher rf field was up in the UP, at a
> channel 8, and one of the neighbors 3/4 mile back down the hill, came up
> to visit with an implanted pacemaker, and he had to leave quickly as his
> pacemaker was going burzerk.
>
> > On 09/12/2018 02:08 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > > Yeah, I've some experience. And it goes back quite a ways timewise.
>
> I'm generally ok. The only brain damageing event I've encountered is a
> pulmonary embolism, usually fatal, 3 years ago that seems to have
> dropped my IQ by maybe 5 points. I've since failed the mensa test.
>
> I sure don't recommend it as a way to die, its scary as can be, not being
> able to draw a decent breath even with your lungs full to the bursting
> point. The shot worked, but the docs, with several internish people in
> tow at a time, that did come to look at a survivor, made sure that I
> knew I was one lucky guy as the odds of my living thru it were maybe 5%.
> That was about 3 years ago, and I'll be 84 in a long couple weeks. There
> is of course some rat poison to discourage a repeat in my nightly
> pill-tainer. :)
>
> But even 15+ years retired, I find my talents at keeping stuff on the air
> are in demand. I have been told several times that people that actually
> fix transmitters are a dying breed. Some of the horror story's I've
> heard from owners while working on something make me believe it.
>
> I'm not a "papered" engineer either, I done this sort of thing all my
> working life on an 8th grade education, getting a G.E.D. about 25 years
> ago to please the missus of 29 years come December, and who has a degree
> in music. Passed the test for a 1st phone in about 1.5 hours in 1962,
> passed the C.E.T. in just over an hour back in 1972, so I have one of
> those next to the 1st phone in my billfold.
>
> Its been an interesting ride thats still interesting. I could do w/o the
> aches and pains of the years, but I'm the one down 4 feet in the ditch
> in my front yard patching a broken water line 2 weeks ago. And I had to
> rent a backhoe to dig the ditch. Carefully, the gas line is in the same
> ditch!.  Seems the town got hungry and decided to license backhoe etc
> operators AND institute a job permit too. But even the guys who own one
> found it too costly and time wasteing, so nobody is doing that sort of
> work inside the city limits now.
>
> Sigh.  The town has apparently not heard of TANSTAAFL. I wonder how
> painfull that hole in their foot is.
>
> --
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
>

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#200283 — Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

On Tuesday 18 September 2018 15:12:52 Nicholas Geovanis wrote:

> Go In Peace.
> Real radio engineering, despite everything, is a dying art/science.

Yes, its got so bad the ma & pa small town broadcaster has to call in a 
factory engineer to keep them on the air.  The days of the likes of 
Chester Simpson, Elmer Nelson, and me are about finished.

One day after I had been the CE at WDTV for about 3 years, '87 I think 
the local school sent up a couple bussloads of 8th graders, spring break 
I guess, and I got volunteered to give them the $5 tour, explaining how 
tv worked from our end. Getting to the end where I'd turned on the 
cameras and monitors in the news studio and let them all "see 
themselves" on tv, I wrapped up my speech by saying that someday I'll 
retire, and that I hoped I had several of them nipping at my heels 
wanting a pretty good job.

Blew me away, that was the best standup comedy they had heard in quite a 
while. "who would want a job like yours?"  Thats when I understood 2 
things, first that our educational system was well and truly broken if 
it wasn't making the technology of the day interesting enough, and that 
when I did retire, my replacement would need years of care and feeding 
before he would be ready to do what I'd been doing since 1964. I had him 
as an assistant for 5 or 6 years. It wasn't enough.

Now you know why my posts occasionally end with a sigh...
 
> Check out the Crystal Set Society, my man.
> Real Men, Real Women, Real Radios.
> https://www.midnightscience.net/

Chuckle.  My last crystal set was in '47.  Worked pretty good too. But 
when I took a room in Des Moines in 1951 so I'd be within walking 
distance of my job as the service tech at A.A.Schneiderhahn Co., fixing 
the zenith stuff the dealers couldn't fix for Iowa and the north half of 
Missouri, mother took the chance and cleaned out my old bedroom of 
everything but the bed & dresser.  Fairly new house I'd helped my 
stepfather build right after the war, and I'm the one who wired it, at 
13 yo.

I stopped in my old home town and visited that house in the fall of 2007, 
one my way home from saying goodbye to my oldest daughter who was dying 
of cancer, and did within a week, and my fuse box and wiring had finally 
been replaced during a remodel in 2005.

And once again, way off topic...

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#200284 — Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

On Tue 18 Sep 2018 at 15:50:45 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> On Tuesday 18 September 2018 15:12:52 Nicholas Geovanis wrote:
> 
> > Go In Peace.
> > Real radio engineering, despite everything, is a dying art/science.

[...]
 
> Now you know why my posts occasionally end with a sigh...

As do my reading of them.
  
> > Check out the Crystal Set Society, my man.
> > Real Men, Real Women, Real Radios.
> > https://www.midnightscience.net/

[...]

And once again, way off topic...

Unusual for you. :)

-- 
Brian

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#200285 — Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

Brian -
Are you British?
Reading your reply was like reading a Monty Python script. If such existed.
This is almost too embarrassing to explain to you Brian, but the
contact point would be the DIY ethic,
wouldn't it be, My Main Man Brian?
Homemade Linux, homemade radios, homemade beer: 3 peas in a pod.
We just didn't get to the beer part yet......
On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 3:02 PM Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> wrote:
>
> On Tue 18 Sep 2018 at 15:50:45 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
>
> > On Tuesday 18 September 2018 15:12:52 Nicholas Geovanis wrote:
> >
> > > Go In Peace.
> > > Real radio engineering, despite everything, is a dying art/science.
>
> [...]
>
> > Now you know why my posts occasionally end with a sigh...
>
> As do my reading of them.
>
> > > Check out the Crystal Set Society, my man.
> > > Real Men, Real Women, Real Radios.
> > > https://www.midnightscience.net/
>
> [...]
>
> And once again, way off topic...
>
> Unusual for you. :)
>
> --
> Brian
>

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#200286 — Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

On Tue, 2018-09-18 at 16:13 -0500, Nicholas Geovanis wrote:
> Brian -
> Are you British?
> Reading your reply was like reading a Monty Python script. If such
> existed.
> 
That's just normal for us Brits.
In the late sixties we were somewhat miffed to discover that our
excellent, serious, documentary on British class systems "The Flying
Circus" was considered to be comedy in other parts of the world :)

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#200287 — Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

Well it should be obvious to all that the "Upper Class Twit Of The
Year" is not confined to the British Isles. True, it's a different
variety than here, look at Trumpf. And here they have ocean liners
rather than Aston-Martins. Yet there is no genetic diversity among
them across borders.
By the way I saw an absolutely brand-spanking-new Rolls Royce here
(Chicago) over the weekend. They are incredibly ugly. A sort of cross
between the new Dodge Chargers and a llama. Why must our upper-class
rulers have no lower limit? Yours too, FYI. And it was made over
there.....
On Tue, Sep 18, 2018 at 4:36 PM Dominic Knight <dominicknight@gmx.com> wrote:
>
> On Tue, 2018-09-18 at 16:13 -0500, Nicholas Geovanis wrote:
> > Brian -
> > Are you British?
> > Reading your reply was like reading a Monty Python script. If such
> > existed.
> >
> That's just normal for us Brits.
> In the late sixties we were somewhat miffed to discover that our
> excellent, serious, documentary on British class systems "The Flying
> Circus" was considered to be comedy in other parts of the world :)
>

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#200292 — Re: OT high-power radio broadcasting (was Re: red SATA cable corruption)

[...]
> By the way I saw an absolutely brand-spanking-new Rolls Royce here
> (Chicago) over the weekend. They are incredibly ugly.
[...]

Blame BMW for that. Tut mir auch leid.
This is way off topic isn't it?

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#200107

On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 09:21:50PM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Tuesday 11 September 2018 19:13:58 Ben Caradoc-Davies wrote:
> 
> > On 12/09/2018 00:59, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> > > On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 01:52:15PM +0200, Pétùr wrote:
> > >> I have some files, with weird permissions:
> > >> # ls -la
> > >> d-wS--S--T 2 1061270772 2605320832  4096 oct.   7  2412 index.html
> > >
> > > Obvious file system corruption.  Unmount, fsck, re-mount, and then
> > > be prepared to restore the data from your last good backup if/when
> > > the fsck failed to repair everything.
> >
> > I would also use journalctl to look for any i/o errors on the affected
> > device.
> >
> > What hardware and kernel and filesystem? ext4 filesystem corruption is
> > rare and usually suggests a hardware fault.
> >
> > I would run a full hardware test, including CPU and RAM, and a long
> > SMART test on the storage if it is capable. SMART self-tests will not
> > usually detect drive data transmission errors caused by cable
> > problems, but the SMART logs should list the CRC error count which can
> > indicate unreliable cables or controller connectors.
> >
> > I would first identify the *cause* and replace all unreliable hardware
> > before bothering to restore from backup. If you have noticed some
> > corruption, you likely also have some unnoticed corruption. Continuing
> > to use unreliable hardware wastes your time and endangers your data.
> >
> > Kind regards,
> 
> I will 2nd and 3rd Bens advice. Bad cables have been the huge majority of 
> such nefarious goings on. Particularly if they are bright red and 4+ 
> years old, put a tail on the log, and prod the cable gently with a 
> wooden pencil.  If the log blows up, bad cable, replace it with any 
> color but red. Preferably a month ago...

zfs ftw (although there's still a need for a "read back every block
written, and double check its hash, before committing" which is a
requested feature hopefully soon in the works (for those who can
stomach the ACK latency involved).

zfs is still more certain than everything else available, even
without the above feature.

zfs "scrubbing" (around since dot) gives a time-delay version of this
feature, which is insufficient for the truly paranoid, or for those
struggling with intermittently bad cables.

Good luck,



Here's the feature request, subscribe (or add a heart or thumbs up to
the original post in the thread) to voice your interest:

Verify disks writes #2526
https://github.com/zfsonlinux/zfs/issues/2526

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