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need help with sftp

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  need help with sftp Fred <fred@blakemfg.com> - 2018-08-07 19:10 +0200
    Re: need help with sftp john doe <johndoe65534@mail.com> - 2018-08-07 19:20 +0200
    Re: need help with sftp Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> - 2018-08-07 19:20 +0200
    Re: need help with sftp Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-08-07 19:30 +0200
      Re: need help with sftp Fred <fred@blakemfg.com> - 2018-08-07 21:30 +0200
        Re: need help with sftp Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-08-07 21:40 +0200
          Re: need help with sftp Fred <fred@blakemfg.com> - 2018-08-08 04:10 +0200
            Re: need help with sftp mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2018-08-08 06:50 +0200
    Re: need help with sftp John Darrah <xyllyx@gmail.com> - 2018-08-08 17:30 +0200

#198421 — need help with sftp

Hi,

On a new Sid installation I need to ftp some files to another computer 
on the network.  sftp appears to be the only ftp program available.  The 
other computers on the network do not use ssl so the ftp connection is 
refused from both directions.  One computer is using vsftp under 
Jessie.  I don't see any option that makes sftp just do plain ordinary 
ftp.  Is this hopeless?

Best regards,
Fred

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#198423

On 8/7/2018 6:53 PM, Fred wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> On a new Sid installation I need to ftp some files to another computer 
> on the network.  sftp appears to be the only ftp program available.  The 
> other computers on the network do not use ssl so the ftp connection is 
> refused from both directions.  One computer is using vsftp under 
> Jessie.  I don't see any option that makes sftp just do plain ordinary 
> ftp.  Is this hopeless?
> 

To use sftp you need to have ssh setup between the client and the server.

Basically, it will only work if both the client and server are using the 
same protocol.

What protocol(s) do you have available on the client and the server?

-- 
John Doe

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#198424

On Tue, Aug 07, 2018 at 09:53:57AM -0700, Fred wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> On a new Sid installation I need to ftp some files to another computer on
> the network.  sftp appears to be the only ftp program available.  The other
> computers on the network do not use ssl so the ftp connection is refused
> from both directions.  One computer is using vsftp under Jessie.  I don't
> see any option that makes sftp just do plain ordinary ftp.  Is this
> hopeless?
> 
sftp != ftp != ftps

sftp - "secure" ftp (i.e., implementation of FTP-like protocol, that is
not actually FTP, over SSH transport)

ftp - "traditional" file transfer protocol

ftps - FTP with SSL (very rarely used)

If the server in question is running vsftpd, then you want to use a
client like lftp or inetutils-ftp or similar.

Regards,

-Roberto

-- 
Roberto C. Sánchez

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#198425

On Tue, Aug 07, 2018 at 09:53:57AM -0700, Fred wrote:
> On a new Sid installation I need to ftp some files to another computer on
> the network.  sftp appears to be the only ftp program available.  The other
> computers on the network do not use ssl so the ftp connection is refused
> from both directions.  One computer is using vsftp under Jessie.  I don't
> see any option that makes sftp just do plain ordinary ftp.  Is this
> hopeless?

https://mywiki.wooledge.org/FtpMustDie

SFTP and FTP are completely different protocols.  They have nothing in
common except 3 letters in their names.

SFTP is implemented on the server side by sshd.  You connect with an SFTP
client (e.g. the sftp command, or an sshfs mounted file system) using
the same credentials that you would use for a regular ssh session.  SFTP
is encrypted, it can be tunnelled through a firewall, etc.

FTP has none of those features.

If you actually *need* to use FTP for some reason (legacy systems on the
network), note first that Debian does NOT install an FTP server package
by default, but it offers several of them.  You can choose one, and
install it, and then you will be able to make FTP connections to your
Debian system.  Authentication will be done using whatever your chosen
FTP server package uses.  Traffic will be unencrypted, and will fly
around in random directions depending on which mode you use, and everything
will fall apart when there are firewalls between client and server.

If you think that you need FTP because of Microsoft Windows systems,
please note that there are many user-friendly graphical SFTP clients
for Microsoft Windows.  You are probably not restricted to its built-in
FTP client.

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#198433

On 08/07/2018 10:20 AM, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 07, 2018 at 09:53:57AM -0700, Fred wrote:
>> On a new Sid installation I need to ftp some files to another computer on
>> the network.  sftp appears to be the only ftp program available.  The other
>> computers on the network do not use ssl so the ftp connection is refused
>> from both directions.  One computer is using vsftp under Jessie.  I don't
>> see any option that makes sftp just do plain ordinary ftp.  Is this
>> hopeless?
> https://mywiki.wooledge.org/FtpMustDie
>
> SFTP and FTP are completely different protocols.  They have nothing in
> common except 3 letters in their names.
>
> SFTP is implemented on the server side by sshd.  You connect with an SFTP
> client (e.g. the sftp command, or an sshfs mounted file system) using
> the same credentials that you would use for a regular ssh session.  SFTP
> is encrypted, it can be tunnelled through a firewall, etc.
>
> FTP has none of those features.
>
> If you actually *need* to use FTP for some reason (legacy systems on the
> network), note first that Debian does NOT install an FTP server package
> by default, but it offers several of them.  You can choose one, and
> install it, and then you will be able to make FTP connections to your
> Debian system.  Authentication will be done using whatever your chosen
> FTP server package uses.  Traffic will be unencrypted, and will fly
> around in random directions depending on which mode you use, and everything
> will fall apart when there are firewalls between client and server.
>
> If you think that you need FTP because of Microsoft Windows systems,
> please note that there are many user-friendly graphical SFTP clients
> for Microsoft Windows.  You are probably not restricted to its built-in
> FTP client.
>
>
Hi,
I need to ftp some files from a new Sid installation to either of two 
other computers on the network.  Neither is configured for a "secure" 
version of ftp and there is no reason to do that and Sid only has sftp.  
I would be happy to install a less secure ftp package on the Sid 
installation but will need help doing that instead.  The default sources 
list for Sid apparently needs to be changed so that packages can be 
installed.  I have not had time to research that yet.

I do not use Bill Gates' cancerous, virus-infested, scourge of the Earth 
excuse for an OS!
Best regards,
Fred

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#198434

On Tue, Aug 07, 2018 at 12:15:34PM -0700, Fred wrote:
> I need to ftp some files from a new Sid installation to either of two other
> computers on the network.  Neither is configured for a "secure" version of
> ftp and there is no reason to do that and Sid only has sftp.

If you only need an FTP client, that's easy enough.  You can use the
program "ftp" or if you want more features, you can install lftp and
use that.

The "ftp" package (which provides one of the possible /usr/bin/ftp client
programs) has standard priority, so it should be installed already.

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#198444

On 08/07/2018 12:30 PM, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 07, 2018 at 12:15:34PM -0700, Fred wrote:
>> I need to ftp some files from a new Sid installation to either of two other
>> computers on the network.  Neither is configured for a "secure" version of
>> ftp and there is no reason to do that and Sid only has sftp.
> If you only need an FTP client, that's easy enough.  You can use the
> program "ftp" or if you want more features, you can install lftp and
> use that.
>
> The "ftp" package (which provides one of the possible /usr/bin/ftp client
> programs) has standard priority, so it should be installed already.
>
>
Hi,

I am abandoning this as I found another way to transfer the files.  
Thanks for the help!

Best regards,
Fred

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#198446

On 2018-08-08 02:54, Fred wrote:
> On 08/07/2018 12:30 PM, Greg Wooledge wrote:
>> On Tue, Aug 07, 2018 at 12:15:34PM -0700, Fred wrote:
>>> I need to ftp some files from a new Sid installation to either of two 
>>> other
>>> computers on the network.  Neither is configured for a "secure" 
>>> version of
>>> ftp and there is no reason to do that and Sid only has sftp.
>> If you only need an FTP client, that's easy enough.  You can use the
>> program "ftp" or if you want more features, you can install lftp and
>> use that.
>> 
>> The "ftp" package (which provides one of the possible /usr/bin/ftp 
>> client
>> programs) has standard priority, so it should be installed already.
>> 
>> 
> Hi,
> 
> I am abandoning this as I found another way to transfer the files.
> Thanks for the help!

the easy way to share files is to setup ssh sshd with keys with a 
passphrase and use scp to move the files about or putty and Winscp on 
windows

mick



> Best regards,
> Fred

-- 
Key ID    4BFEBB31

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#198453

On Tue, Aug 07, 2018 at 10:02:57AM -0700, Fred wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> On a new Sid installation I need to ftp some files to another computer on
> the network.  sftp appears to be the only ftp program available.  The other
> computers on the network do not use ssl so the ftp connection is refused
> from both directions.  One computer is using vsftp under Jessie.  I don't
> see any option that makes sftp just do plain ordinary ftp.  Is this
> hopeless?
> 

apt install lftp

-- 
john

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