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Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements

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  Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-10-23 16:00 +0200
    Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2018-10-23 16:40 +0200
    Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Jeremy Nicoll <jn.ml.dbn.25@letterboxes.org> - 2018-10-23 16:50 +0200
    Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2018-10-23 17:20 +0200
      Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-10-24 02:20 +0200
        Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2018-10-24 06:40 +0200
          Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-10-24 12:50 +0200
            Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2018-10-24 18:50 +0200
              Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2018-10-24 19:00 +0200
                Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2018-10-24 19:10 +0200
                Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2018-10-24 20:10 +0200
                  Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Cindy-Sue Causey <butterflybytes@gmail.com> - 2018-10-25 02:40 +0200
              Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-10-24 19:50 +0200
                Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2018-10-24 20:10 +0200
                  Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-10-24 20:40 +0200
                    Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2018-10-24 21:10 +0200
              Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Andrew Wood <andrewjameswood@ymail.com> - 2018-10-24 20:00 +0200
                Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-10-24 20:30 +0200
                  Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Andrew Wood <andrewjameswood@ymail.com> - 2018-10-25 22:20 +0200
                    Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Andrew Wood <andrewjameswood@ymail.com> - 2018-10-25 22:30 +0200
                    Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-10-25 22:40 +0200
                      Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2018-10-30 18:30 +0100
                        Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-10-30 18:40 +0100
                          Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2018-10-30 20:10 +0100
                            Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-10-30 20:30 +0100
                              Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2018-10-30 20:40 +0100
                            Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2018-10-30 20:30 +0100
                              Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2018-10-30 22:00 +0100
                                Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2018-10-31 00:20 +0100
              Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2018-10-24 20:10 +0200
                Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2018-10-24 21:20 +0200
                  Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2018-10-24 23:00 +0200
                    Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2018-10-24 23:10 +0200
    Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2018-10-23 18:00 +0200
      Re: Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements rhkramer@gmail.com - 2018-10-24 16:00 +0200

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#201543 — Advice on mailing list software -- special requirements

(Aside to Jeff: Just sending you a copy of this for your information.)

Background: I am working with a Linux SIG that used to be part of a more 
general computer group.  We plan to change the name to mention "LUG" (GLVLUG 
-- Greater Lehigh Valley Linux User Group).

I want to establish a mailing list for the group.

I want to find either:

   * a "service" that would host a mailing list for the group for free

   * or, put a (simple) mailing list application on one of my machines, behind 
a firewall (well, NAT) and not require the use of anything that (in my mind) 
takes a lot of work or more knowledge than I have atm to setup -- for example, 
I don't want it to depend on (or be) an MTA, Apache (or any other web server), 
or even a windows email client that I'm not using (I currently use kmail, and 
plan to stick with it).

I know I could do something in kmail by adding a mail list such that I could 
send out emails to a reasonable number of people, but that doesn't solve the 
problem of other people posting to the list.

I'd prefer that, whatever I find, receive / retrieve posts via POP3 (via my 
ISP) and send posts via SMTP (again, via my ISP), and I'd prefer that emails 
be stored in mbox files (but, I could live with maildir).

One of my machines is running Debian 7.11 (Wheezy), and the other is running 
Debian 8.11 (Jessie) -- I'd probably install whatever I find on the 8.11 
machine.

I looked at packages available that might meet my needs (just by searching for 
mailing list in apper and then looking at the dependencies) -- I found the 
following that might meet my needs -- I'll start by investigating courier (the 
pop version).

   * courier-pop
   * enemies-of-carlotta
   * mimmj
   * quickml
   * schleuder
   * smartlist

I'd appreciate any advice anyone can offer.

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#201546

On 2018-10-23 14:53, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> (Aside to Jeff: Just sending you a copy of this for your information.)
> 
> Background: I am working with a Linux SIG that used to be part of a 
> more
> general computer group.  We plan to change the name to mention "LUG" 
> (GLVLUG
> -- Greater Lehigh Valley Linux User Group).
> 
> I want to establish a mailing list for the group.
> 
<>


believe this is Smartlist
think people still use Mailman

mick

-- 
Key ID    4BFEBB31

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#201547

On Tue, 23 Oct 2018, at 14:53, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> (Aside to Jeff: Just sending you a copy of this for your information.)
> 
> Background: I am working with a Linux SIG that used to be part of a more 
> general computer group.  We plan to change the name to mention "LUG" (GLVLUG 
> -- Greater Lehigh Valley Linux User Group).
> 
> I want to establish a mailing list for the group.
> 
> I want to find either:
> 
>    * a "service" that would host a mailing list for the group for free

Try: https://www.freelists.org/

I've been a subscriber on several mail lists hosted by them, for years, and the
service does seem solid.  As far as I know they do not offer any sort of web-
based interface for subscribers (the login option on their website is - last time 
I looked, anyway - for the administrator(s) of specific lists.



-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

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#201548

Speaking from experience:  Running your own server is a bit of a pain - 
to setup, and to administer, and it's best done on a server with a 
static IP address, not on a desktop behind a NAT router. (Sympa is what 
I recommend for those who want to run their own, by the way.)

For simple things, I hate to recommend it, but google groups is about as 
free & easy as it gets.

Otherwise, I expect somebody in your membership might have a corporate 
machine they'd host you on.

Miles Fidelman


On 10/23/18 9:53 AM, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> (Aside to Jeff: Just sending you a copy of this for your information.)
>
> Background: I am working with a Linux SIG that used to be part of a more
> general computer group.  We plan to change the name to mention "LUG" (GLVLUG
> -- Greater Lehigh Valley Linux User Group).
>
> I want to establish a mailing list for the group.
>
> I want to find either:
>
>     * a "service" that would host a mailing list for the group for free
>
>     * or, put a (simple) mailing list application on one of my machines, behind
> a firewall (well, NAT) and not require the use of anything that (in my mind)
> takes a lot of work or more knowledge than I have atm to setup -- for example,
> I don't want it to depend on (or be) an MTA, Apache (or any other web server),
> or even a windows email client that I'm not using (I currently use kmail, and
> plan to stick with it).
>
> I know I could do something in kmail by adding a mail list such that I could
> send out emails to a reasonable number of people, but that doesn't solve the
> problem of other people posting to the list.
>
> I'd prefer that, whatever I find, receive / retrieve posts via POP3 (via my
> ISP) and send posts via SMTP (again, via my ISP), and I'd prefer that emails
> be stored in mbox files (but, I could live with maildir).
>
> One of my machines is running Debian 7.11 (Wheezy), and the other is running
> Debian 8.11 (Jessie) -- I'd probably install whatever I find on the 8.11
> machine.
>
> I looked at packages available that might meet my needs (just by searching for
> mailing list in apper and then looking at the dependencies) -- I found the
> following that might meet my needs -- I'll start by investigating courier (the
> pop version).
>
>     * courier-pop
>     * enemies-of-carlotta
>     * mimmj
>     * quickml
>     * schleuder
>     * smartlist
>
> I'd appreciate any advice anyone can offer.

-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

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#201572

On Tuesday, October 23, 2018 11:04:52 AM Miles Fidelman wrote:
> Speaking from experience:  Running your own server is a bit of a pain -
> to setup, and to administer, 

Must be my day to reply to email messages ;-)  Yes, I've tried that before.

> and it's best done on a server with a
> static IP address, not on a desktop behind a NAT router. 

My desktop has a static IP address, behind a NAT router.  (But it is an 
address in one of the private ranges (192.168.n.n)

> (Sympa is what
> I recommend for those who want to run their own, by the way.)
> 
> For simple things, I hate to recommend it, but google groups is about as
> free & easy as it gets.

I don't know why I didn't really think of that, but I guess the times I've 
been involved with groups that used it, there were things I didn't like about 
it, but I may look again.
 
> Otherwise, I expect somebody in your membership might have a corporate
> machine they'd host you on.

No, we're a small group, mostly retirees at this point (I think).  When I 
asked at the last meeting, nobody had anything to offer.

Have a good day!

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#201573

On 10/23/18 8:16 PM, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:

> On Tuesday, October 23, 2018 11:04:52 AM Miles Fidelman wrote:
>> Speaking from experience:  Running your own server is a bit of a pain -
>> to setup, and to administer,
> Must be my day to reply to email messages ;-)  Yes, I've tried that before.
>
>> and it's best done on a server with a
>> static IP address, not on a desktop behind a NAT router.
> My desktop has a static IP address, behind a NAT router.  (But it is an
> address in one of the private ranges (192.168.n.n)

Yes, but you really need a PUBLIC static IP address, or things tend to 
get hairy.  Dynamic DNS will help, but only to a point.  And, a lot of 
ISPs really don't like it if you run servers at the edge.  If you really 
want to run a server on your desktop, you need an ISP that will sell you 
both a business grade line and a static IP address.

>> (Sympa is what
>> I recommend for those who want to run their own, by the way.)
>>
>> For simple things, I hate to recommend it, but google groups is about as
>> free & easy as it gets.
> I don't know why I didn't really think of that, but I guess the times I've
> been involved with groups that used it, there were things I didn't like about
> it, but I may look again.
>   
>> Otherwise, I expect somebody in your membership might have a corporate
>> machine they'd host you on.
> No, we're a small group, mostly retirees at this point (I think).  When I
> asked at the last meeting, nobody had anything to offer.

Bummer.  But maybe another, larger, Linux user group might help you 
out?  I expect there might be somebody on this list who might volunteer 
(hint, hint).  Maybe somebody at a nearby university - I believe you 
have a few of those in the Lehigh Valley :-)

Best,

Miles

-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

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#201581

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Wednesday, October 24, 2018 12:32:15 AM Miles Fidelman wrote:
> Yes, but you really need a PUBLIC static IP address, or things tend to
> get hairy.  Dynamic DNS will help, but only to a point.  And, a lot of
> ISPs really don't like it if you run servers at the edge.  

We are currently such a small group, I don't think it will be an issue -- if 
that changes, we can change.

> Bummer.  But maybe another, larger, Linux user group might help you
> out?  I expect there might be somebody on this list who might volunteer
> (hint, hint).  Maybe somebody at a nearby university - I believe you
> have a few of those in the Lehigh Valley :-)

We've had somebody make such an offer, and we'll probably take them up on it -- 
I sort of wanted to try to set up a small mail list on one of my computers, as 
long as I didn't have to run a web server or a *nix style MTA

Thanks!

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#201595

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On 10/24/18 6:45 AM, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:

> On Wednesday, October 24, 2018 12:32:15 AM Miles Fidelman wrote:
>
> > Yes, but you really need a PUBLIC static IP address, or things tend to
>
> > get hairy.  Dynamic DNS will help, but only to a point.  And, a lot of
>
> > ISPs really don't like it if you run servers at the edge.
>
> We are currently such a small group, I don't think it will be an issue 
> -- if that changes, we can change.
>

Which - DynDNS or ISP objections?

The thing about dynamic DNS is that people cache DNS records - mail sent 
to the list WILL go to the wrong place on occasion.

Re. ISP objections - those objections sometimes take the form of active 
measures that block various kinds of traffic.

> > Bummer.  But maybe another, larger, Linux user group might help you
>
> > out?  I expect there might be somebody on this list who might volunteer
>
> > (hint, hint).  Maybe somebody at a nearby university - I believe you
>
> > have a few of those in the Lehigh Valley :-)
>
> We've had somebody make such an offer, and we'll probably take them up 
> on it -- I sort of wanted to try to set up a small mail list on one of 
> my computers, as long as I didn't have to run a web server or a *nix 
> style MTA
>
Now that is kind of hard to do.  All the mailing list servers that I've 
worked with require a rather intimate interconnection with the MTA that 
processes mail.  And that's before you "wire in" anti-spam and 
anti-virus filters.  And, you'll need a webserver for access to various 
administrative functions, and archive access.  Depending on the list 
server, you might also require a dbms.  Setting up list services can be 
an entertaining and educational exercise (also frustrating), but it's 
not simple.  (Actually, the simplest approach is using an MTA and 
managing lists in the alias file.)

Miles Fidelman

-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

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#201596

On 2018-10-24 17:47, Miles Fidelman wrote:

>> We've had somebody make such an offer, and we'll probably take them up 
>> on it -- I sort of wanted to try to set up a small mail list on one of 
>> my computers, as long as I didn't have to run a web server or a *nix 
>> style MTA
>> 
> Now that is kind of hard to do.  All the mailing list servers that
> I've worked with require a rather intimate interconnection with the
> MTA that processes mail.  And that's before you "wire in" anti-spam
> and anti-virus filters.  And, you'll need a webserver for access to
> various administrative functions, and archive access.  Depending on
> the list server, you might also require a dbms.  Setting up list
> services can be an entertaining and educational exercise (also
> frustrating), but it's not simple.  (Actually, the simplest approach
> is using an MTA and managing lists in the alias file.)
> 

It's not very PC but disqus seems to work

mick




-- 
Key ID    4BFEBB31

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#201597

On 10/24/18 12:56 PM, mick crane wrote:
> On 2018-10-24 17:47, Miles Fidelman wrote:
>
>>> We've had somebody make such an offer, and we'll probably take them 
>>> up on it -- I sort of wanted to try to set up a small mail list on 
>>> one of my computers, as long as I didn't have to run a web server or 
>>> a *nix style MTA
>>>
>> Now that is kind of hard to do.  All the mailing list servers that
>> I've worked with require a rather intimate interconnection with the
>> MTA that processes mail.  And that's before you "wire in" anti-spam
>> and anti-virus filters.  And, you'll need a webserver for access to
>> various administrative functions, and archive access.  Depending on
>> the list server, you might also require a dbms.  Setting up list
>> services can be an entertaining and educational exercise (also
>> frustrating), but it's not simple.  (Actually, the simplest approach
>> is using an MTA and managing lists in the alias file.)
>>
>
> It's not very PC but disqus seems to work
>
Ummm... Disqus is
- not a mailing list server, it's a forum
- it's a hosted service, not something one can set up on one's own 
server, much less a desktop



-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

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#201601

On Wed, 24 Oct 2018 17:56:30 +0100
mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> 
> It's not very PC but disqus seems to work
>

....sometimes.

-- 
Joe

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#201617

On 10/24/18, Joe <joe@jretrading.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 24 Oct 2018 17:56:30 +0100
> mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> It's not very PC but disqus seems to work
>
> ....sometimes.


What Joe said...

It does work on dialup...

"....sometimes."

Cindy :)
-- 
Cindy-Sue Causey
Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA

* runs with duct tape *

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#201598

Thanks for the reply! -- some comments below:

On Wednesday, October 24, 2018 12:47:10 PM Miles Fidelman wrote:
> On 10/24/18 6:45 AM, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Wednesday, October 24, 2018 12:32:15 AM Miles Fidelman wrote:
> > > Yes, but you really need a PUBLIC static IP address, or things tend to
> > > 
> > > get hairy.  Dynamic DNS will help, but only to a point.  And, a lot of
> > > 
> > > ISPs really don't like it if you run servers at the edge.
> > 
> > We are currently such a small group, I don't think it will be an issue
> > -- if that changes, we can change.
> 
> Which - DynDNS or ISP objections?

I don't think ISP objections will be an issue with the size or our group (and 
the apparent reluctance of many to post).

> The thing about dynamic DNS is that people cache DNS records - mail sent
> to the list WILL go to the wrong place on occasion.
> 
> Re. ISP objections - those objections sometimes take the form of active
> measures that block various kinds of traffic.
> 
> > > Bummer.  But maybe another, larger, Linux user group might help you
> > > 
> > > out?  I expect there might be somebody on this list who might volunteer
> > > 
> > > (hint, hint).  Maybe somebody at a nearby university - I believe you
> > > 
> > > have a few of those in the Lehigh Valley :-)
> > 
> > We've had somebody make such an offer, and we'll probably take them up
> > on it -- I sort of wanted to try to set up a small mail list on one of
> > my computers, as long as I didn't have to run a web server or a *nix
> > style MTA
> 
> Now that is kind of hard to do.  All the mailing list servers that I've
> worked with require a rather intimate interconnection with the MTA that
> processes mail.  

As stated somewhere, we're almost certainly going to accept the offer to host 
the mail list for us.

But, just for my education / edification, I didn't see mention of an MTA for 
courier-pop -- have you used it and does it require that same intimate 
connection to an MTA?

And the only dependency listed for quickml is ruby, so I'm guessing that might 
not require that intimate connection.

(And, talking to myself, I saw several others that mentioned procmail, and I 
didn't immediately consider that an MTA because I have used it in the past but 
only for its mail filtering function.  (Or am I thinking of a different 
package?))


















> And that's before you "wire in" anti-spam and
> anti-virus filters.  And, you'll need a webserver for access to various
> administrative functions, and archive access.  Depending on the list
> server, you might also require a dbms.  Setting up list services can be
> an entertaining and educational exercise (also frustrating), but it's
> not simple.  (Actually, the simplest approach is using an MTA and
> managing lists in the alias file.)

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#201600

On Wed, Oct 24, 2018 at 01:47:27PM -0400, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> > Now that is kind of hard to do.  All the mailing list servers that I've
> > worked with require a rather intimate interconnection with the MTA that
> > processes mail.  
> 
> As stated somewhere, we're almost certainly going to accept the offer to host 
> the mail list for us.
> 
> But, just for my education / edification, I didn't see mention of an MTA for 
> courier-pop -- have you used it and does it require that same intimate 
> connection to an MTA?

courier-pop is not a Mail Transfer Agent. It cannot send or receive
e-mail, it's a POP3 server.
courier-mta, as all other MTAs, supposedly requires a very specific
configuration to be suitable for a maillist.


> And the only dependency listed for quickml is ruby, so I'm guessing that might 
> not require that intimate connection.

The thing comes with the very primitive MTA indeed.
I only judge by the quick look at the sources, but this 'QuickML MTA'
seem to lack even basic sanity checks such as HELO/EHLO parsing, PTR
checks or RCPT validity check. And it may, or may not be an open relay.
In short - it gives an impression of a spammer wet dream.


> (And, talking to myself, I saw several others that mentioned procmail, and I 
> didn't immediately consider that an MTA because I have used it in the past but 
> only for its mail filtering function.  (Or am I thinking of a different 
> package?))

Likewise, procmail is not an MTA, it's a Mail Delivery Agent - MDA.
The purpose of a procmail is to classify and deliver e-mail, not to send
or receive it.

Reco

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#201604

On Wednesday, October 24, 2018 02:07:46 PM Reco wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 24, 2018 at 01:47:27PM -0400, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> > > Now that is kind of hard to do.  All the mailing list servers that I've
> > > worked with require a rather intimate interconnection with the MTA that
> > > processes mail.
> > 
> > As stated somewhere, we're almost certainly going to accept the offer to
> > host the mail list for us.
> > 
> > But, just for my education / edification, I didn't see mention of an MTA
> > for courier-pop -- have you used it and does it require that same
> > intimate connection to an MTA?
> 
> courier-pop is not a Mail Transfer Agent. It cannot send or receive
> e-mail, it's a POP3 server.
> courier-mta, as all other MTAs, supposedly requires a very specific
> configuration to be suitable for a maillist.
> 
> > And the only dependency listed for quickml is ruby, so I'm guessing that
> > might not require that intimate connection.
> 
> The thing comes with the very primitive MTA indeed.
> I only judge by the quick look at the sources, but this 'QuickML MTA'
> seem to lack even basic sanity checks such as HELO/EHLO parsing, PTR
> checks or RCPT validity check. And it may, or may not be an open relay.
> In short - it gives an impression of a spammer wet dream.
> 
> > (And, talking to myself, I saw several others that mentioned procmail,
> > and I didn't immediately consider that an MTA because I have used it in
> > the past but only for its mail filtering function.  (Or am I thinking of
> > a different package?))
> 
> Likewise, procmail is not an MTA, it's a Mail Delivery Agent - MDA.
> The purpose of a procmail is to classify and deliver e-mail, not to send
> or receive it.

Ahh, a useful clue -- so the mail lists that list procmail as a dependency 
(and no MTA) might meet my desires of being able to run a mail list without 
setting up an MTA on my own machine.

So, I may look a little at those, even though I'm about 95% certain that we're 
going to let someone else host the mail list.

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#201606

On 10/24/18 2:30 PM, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:

> Ahh, a useful clue -- so the mail lists that list procmail as a dependency
> (and no MTA) might meet my desires of being able to run a mail list without
> setting up an MTA on my own machine.
>
>
No.

Procmail is primarily a LOCAL delivery agent - generally attached to a 
local MTA.  Mail for local addresses is handed to procmail, which can do 
things like sort mail into folders, return vacation messages, and so 
forth.  You might be able to coble together some basic list services, 
but only if you have an MTA to hand outgoing mail to.



-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

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#201599

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Ok this is not Linux its Haiku based but I wrote an open source mailing 
list system called MailMistress which is on Github for situations where 
you need to run a list on a machine without a public IP or where you 
want to interface the database of subscribers to an existing system. In 
our case we have a MySQL database of society members and MailMistress 
connects to that - you just write a connector script/program.

If its of interest I can provide further details.


On 24/10/2018 17:47, Miles Fidelman wrote:
>
> On 10/24/18 6:45 AM, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday, October 24, 2018 12:32:15 AM Miles Fidelman wrote:
>>
>> > Yes, but you really need a PUBLIC static IP address, or things tend to
>>
>> > get hairy.� Dynamic DNS will help, but only to a point.� And, a lot of
>>
>> > ISPs really don't like it if you run servers at the edge.
>>
>> We are currently such a small group, I don't think it will be an 
>> issue -- if that changes, we can change.
>>
>
> Which - DynDNS or ISP objections?
>
> The thing about dynamic DNS is that people cache DNS records - mail 
> sent to the list WILL go to the wrong place on occasion.
>
> Re. ISP objections - those objections sometimes take the form of 
> active measures that block various kinds of traffic.
>
>> > Bummer.� But maybe another, larger, Linux user group might help you
>>
>> > out?� I expect there might be somebody on this list who might volunteer
>>
>> > (hint, hint).� Maybe somebody at a nearby university - I believe you
>>
>> > have a few of those in the Lehigh Valley :-)
>>
>> We've had somebody make such an offer, and we'll probably take them 
>> up on it -- I sort of wanted to try to set up a small mail list on 
>> one of my computers, as long as I didn't have to run a web server or 
>> a *nix style MTA
>>
> Now that is kind of hard to do.� All the mailing list servers that 
> I've worked with require a rather intimate interconnection with the 
> MTA that processes mail.� And that's before you "wire in" anti-spam 
> and anti-virus filters.� And, you'll need a webserver for access to 
> various administrative functions, and archive access.� Depending on 
> the list server, you might also require a dbms.� Setting up list 
> services can be an entertaining and educational exercise (also 
> frustrating), but it's not simple. (Actually, the simplest approach is 
> using an MTA and managing lists in the alias file.)
>
> Miles Fidelman
>
> -- 
> In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
> In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

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#201603

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On Wednesday, October 24, 2018 01:51:32 PM Andrew Wood wrote:
> Ok this is not Linux its Haiku based but I wrote an open source mailing
> list system called MailMistress which is on Github for situations where
> you need to run a list on a machine without a public IP or where you
> want to interface the database of subscribers to an existing system. In
> our case we have a MySQL database of society members and MailMistress
> connects to that - you just write a connector script/program.
> 
> If its of interest I can provide further details.

Thanks for the reply!

Well, it is of some interest, if only for my own edification / education.

I tried looking up Haiku, and I got a little mixed up -- Wikipedia says Haiku 
is an OS:

<quote>
Haiku is a free and open-source operating system compatible with the now 
discontinued BeOS. Its development began in 2001, and the operating system 
became self-hosting in 2008. The first alpha release was made in September 
2009, and the most recent was November 2012; development is ongoing as of 2018 
with nightly releases.More at Wikipedia 
</quote>

but then I downloaded the first .pdf / page of something named "Learning to 
Program with Haiku", Lessons by DarkWyrm, and that (very elementary) page 
seems to discuss programming in C -- I thought from the title Haiku might be a 
programming language.

Anyway, I'm a little reluctant to put you to much trouble if I don't think I 
can either learn from it or use it.

Do you have any idea how hard it might be to convert to use on Linux?  Is the 
program written in C?  Was it, by any chance, compiled with GCC?

Any idea how hard it would be to convert to, for example, use just an ASCII 
text file as the list of subscribers?

And, I guess it talks to an ISP -- POP3 in and SMTP out?

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#201640

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On 24/10/2018 19:26, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
>
> I tried looking up Haiku, and I got a little mixed up
>
Haiku is an open source reimplementation of the BeOS, its Unix like, it 
has a bash command line but also its own built in GUI (not X based).
You can find out more at www.haiku-os.org and download an ISO of the 
Beta 1 release which will run on most PC hardware or under QEMU etc.

> Do you have any idea how hard it might be to convert to use on Linux? 
> Is the program written in C? Was it, by any chance, compiled with GCC?
>
> Any idea how hard it would be to convert to, for example, use just an 
> ASCII text file as the list of subscribers?
>
> And, I guess it talks to an ISP -- POP3 in and SMTP out?
>


The BeOS/Haiku API is C++ based and that is what MailMistress is written 
in yes its compiled by GCC and has a Makefile. Due to its heavy use of 
the Be API and the fact that it relies on the Be/Haiku built in MUA it 
wouldnt be very feasible to port it to Linux.

I chose Haiku becuase the MUA is unique - it doesnt have a typcial GUI 
it simply periodically downloads mail from an IMAP/POP server into a 
folder. MailMistress gets notified when the contents of this folder is 
updated, processes the incoming message and sends it out via the Haiku 
MUA which talks SMTP to the MTA, hence it works behind NAT etc.
If you're interested in playing about with it the best thing to do would 
be to read the Readme file in the Github repository and see if it sounds 
suitable.

A text file could be used for the recipient addresses yes you would just 
need to write a program in any language you want to read the addresses 
from that text file and pass them to MailMistress as per the 
instructions in the readme - see section 5 'Authentication Program Plug 
in Dont mind assisting you with trying it out if you need help.

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#201642

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Sorry forgot link

https://github.com/bluedalmatian/mailmistress


On 25/10/2018 21:19, Andrew Wood wrote:
>
>
> On 24/10/2018 19:26, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> �
>>
>> I tried looking up Haiku, and I got a little mixed up
>>
>> �
>>
> Haiku is an open source reimplementation of the BeOS, its Unix like, 
> it has a bash command line but also its own built in GUI (not X based).
> You can find out more at www.haiku-os.org and download an ISO of the 
> Beta 1 release which will run on most PC hardware or under QEMU etc.
>
>> �
>>
>> Do you have any idea how hard it might be to convert to use on Linux? 
>> Is the program written in C? Was it, by any chance, compiled with GCC?
>>
>> �
>>
>> Any idea how hard it would be to convert to, for example, use just an 
>> ASCII text file as the list of subscribers?
>>
>> �
>>
>> And, I guess it talks to an ISP -- POP3 in and SMTP out?
>>
>> �
>>
>> �
>>
>> �
>>
>
>
> The BeOS/Haiku API is C++ based and that is what MailMistress is 
> written in yes its compiled by GCC and has a Makefile. Due to its 
> heavy use of the Be API and the fact that it relies on the Be/Haiku 
> built in MUA it wouldnt be very feasible to port it to Linux.
>
> I chose Haiku becuase the MUA is unique - it doesnt have a typcial GUI 
> it simply periodically downloads mail from an IMAP/POP server into a 
> folder. MailMistress gets notified when the contents of this folder is 
> updated, processes the incoming message and sends it out via the Haiku 
> MUA which talks SMTP to the MTA, hence it works behind NAT etc.
> If you're interested in playing about with it the best thing to do 
> would be to read the Readme file in the Github repository and see if 
> it sounds suitable.
>
> A text file could be used for the recipient addresses yes you would 
> just need to write a program in any language you want to read the 
> addresses from that text file and pass them to MailMistress as per the 
> instructions in the readme - see section 5 'Authentication Program 
> Plug in Dont mind assisting you with trying it out if you need help.

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