Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]
Groups > linux.debian.user > #178929 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Adrian O'Dell <crimsonmane@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2017-03-16 16:30 +0100 |
| Last post | 2017-03-21 16:00 +0100 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 118 — 23 participants |
Back to article view | Back to linux.debian.user
This discussion starts older than the indexed window; earlier articles aren't shown. The article labeled Started by
below is the oldest one visible, not the original post.
Re: Suggested edit Adrian O'Dell <crimsonmane@gmail.com> - 2017-03-16 16:30 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-16 17:10 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-17 15:30 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-17 16:40 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-17 17:10 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-17 18:00 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2017-03-17 18:40 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-17 18:50 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-17 19:00 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-20 11:00 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-17 18:10 +0100
Re: Suggested edit Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2017-03-17 18:50 +0100
installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-20 10:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-20 21:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-03-20 21:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-20 22:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 01:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-21 01:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 03:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-21 04:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 11:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 16:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2017-03-21 16:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-21 18:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 19:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-21 19:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Darac Marjal <mailinglist@darac.org.uk> - 2017-03-22 10:20 +0100
Re: cell phone .sigs (was: installer defaults for desktops) Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2017-03-22 10:50 +0100
Re: cell phone .sigs (was: installer defaults for desktops) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2017-03-22 11:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) cbannister@slingshot.co.nz - 2017-04-01 18:50 +0200
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 19:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-21 20:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 21:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2017-03-21 19:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-21 20:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2017-03-21 20:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-21 21:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-03-22 00:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-22 02:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2017-03-22 04:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2017-03-22 13:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-22 13:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2017-03-22 13:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> - 2017-03-24 07:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-24 11:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> - 2017-03-24 17:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2017-03-24 18:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Mart van de Wege <mvdwege@gmail.com> - 2017-03-23 11:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2017-03-23 13:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-23 13:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-03-23 22:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 11:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2017-03-24 13:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 16:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 16:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2017-03-24 19:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-25 10:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-24 11:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-03-22 17:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-21 20:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-21 20:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-21 16:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-03-21 17:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-23 17:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-23 18:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-23 18:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-23 19:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-23 19:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-23 19:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-23 19:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-23 23:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-23 23:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-24 00:20 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 00:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-24 01:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-03-24 02:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-24 05:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Dejan Jocic <jodejka@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 08:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-24 19:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-03-24 20:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-24 02:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-24 03:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-03-24 15:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-24 19:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-24 21:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-03-24 23:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-25 00:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-25 02:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-03-25 03:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-03-24 13:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-03-24 15:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 16:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2017-03-24 19:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> - 2017-03-24 20:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2017-03-24 20:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-23 19:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) songbird <songbird@anthive.com> - 2017-03-23 19:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> - 2017-03-24 11:30 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Fred <fred@blakemfg.com> - 2017-03-23 20:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-23 17:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 00:50 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-03-21 01:40 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 03:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-03-21 11:40 +0100
[TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-03-22 15:10 +0100
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-22 15:30 +0100
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-03-22 16:00 +0100
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-22 16:40 +0100
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-03-22 18:30 +0100
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-22 18:50 +0100
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2017-03-23 17:50 +0100
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) cbannister@slingshot.co.nz - 2017-04-01 20:10 +0200
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-04-01 20:50 +0200
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Cindy-Sue Causey <butterflybytes@gmail.com> - 2017-04-01 22:30 +0200
Re: [TEST RUNS] Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-04-01 23:10 +0200
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Liam O'Toole <liam.p.otoole@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 12:10 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2017-03-21 13:00 +0100
Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-21 16:00 +0100
Page 5 of 6 — ← Prev page 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 Next page →
| From | Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 02:30 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <tomdc-2rZ-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179221 |
Catherine Gramze wrote: > >I am suggesting, not "demanding" that the netinst installer refuse to >continue when it is not going to be able to successfully complete the >installation due to no network connection. This does not prevent >anybody from backing out of the installer after the reboot to get a >base system only should they so desire. It simply helps the new user >get what they want, a working system with a graphical desktop. Catherine, I'm curious - when was the last time you installed Debian using d-i? I've now seen you several times write (like above) about "backing out of the installer after the reboot". Are you talking about a second stage of d-i after it's installed the base system? -- Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com < liw> everything I know about UK hotels I learned from "Fawlty Towers"
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 03:40 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toniV-38G-5@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179229 |
> On Mar 23, 2017, at 9:22 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote: > > Catherine, I'm curious - when was the last time you installed Debian > using d-i? I've now seen you several times write (like above) about > "backing out of the installer after the reboot". Are you talking about > a second stage of d-i after it's installed the base system? > My last Debian netinst installation was January 11, 2017. Very early in the installation the installer looks for a network card to configure. If you have a NIC that will not function without non-free firmware this step fails, and the installer says it failed, but the installer still allows you to continue with the installation, installing all the base system files. Then it tells you the base system is installed, and it needs to reboot. It ejects the media and reboots into the installer. You can choose to quit at this point by choosing "back"rather than "continue" possibly more than once being needed. That is what I mean by "backing out" to deliberately get a base system install only. So, yes, I am talking about the second stage after it has installed the base system. If some beginner continued on past the reboot without a configured NIC they are given a list of mirrors, but will be unable to select and connect to one successfully. The installation fails at this point, being unable to continue, stuck in an infinite loop of failed mirror selection. They have a Debian base system installation now, their old OS overwritten, and no network capability to get the information they need to fix the problem. And that assumes they are even capable of working with the command line to to fix it - and most beginners are not. My argument is that the failure to configure a NIC in the first stage of the installer should be a fatal, show-stopping error with appropriate messaging to the user that no NIC is configured and non-free firmware is required. This would prevent many failed installations, while not preventing advanced users from quitting the installer after the base system is installed. Cathy
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 15:50 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toyHo-2WH-7@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179230 |
On Thu 23 Mar 2017 at 22:23:42 -0400, Catherine Gramze wrote: > > On Mar 23, 2017, at 9:22 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote: > > > > Catherine, I'm curious - when was the last time you installed Debian > > using d-i? I've now seen you several times write (like above) about > > "backing out of the installer after the reboot". Are you talking about > > a second stage of d-i after it's installed the base system? > > > My last Debian netinst installation was January 11, 2017. > > Very early in the installation the installer looks for a network card > to configure. If you have a NIC that will not function without > non-free firmware this step fails, and the installer says it failed, > but the installer still allows you to continue with the installation, > installing all the base system files. Prior to configuring the network you will have been informed about missing firmware. If you do not supply it and choose to move on, the network configuration is (in my experience with USB WiFi adapters) most likely to fail. Anyway, you are told the firmware is needed so the choice to continue or not is yours. If a working network is important to you, you would stop and do something to rectify the situation. If it is not important or you intend to sort it out after the first boot or you want to chance your arm, you carry on. The probable outcome is that a network mirror cannot be chosen and only files supplied by the image can be installed. Your concern is inexperienced newcomers and your argument is, I believe, for d-i to issue a fatal error and not allow any further steps to be taken on the road to installation. That's in spite of an earlier message about firmware being required. This seems superfluous and over the top. Note also that network configuration can fail for reasons other than missing firmware. > Then it tells you the base system is installed, and it needs to > reboot. It ejects the media and reboots into the installer. You can I have *never* seen d-i of itself requesting a reboot after the base system is installed when the network is not set up. Are we using the same installer? > choose to quit at this point by choosing "back"rather than "continue" > possibly more than once being needed. That is what I mean by "backing > out" to deliberately get a base system install only. So, yes, I am > talking about the second stage after it has installed the base system. It moves on to configuring the package manager and installing software. The installer knows there is no network so the only choice of software is "standard system utilities". By now the newcomer might begin to twig that not having the network wasn't the best of stategies. > If some beginner continued on past the reboot without a configured NIC > they are given a list of mirrors, but will be unable to select and > connect to one successfully. The installation fails at this point, > being unable to continue, stuck in an infinite loop of failed mirror > selection. They have a Debian base system installation now, their old > OS overwritten, and no network capability to get the information they > need to fix the problem. And that assumes they are even capable of > working with the command line to to fix it - and most beginners are > not. No mirror list is offered; the installer knows better than to do that when there is no network. Are we using the same installer? > My argument is that the failure to configure a NIC in the first stage > of the installer should be a fatal, show-stopping error with > appropriate messaging to the user that no NIC is configured and > non-free firmware is required. This would prevent many failed > installations, while not preventing advanced users from quitting the > installer after the base system is installed. A fatal error is a fatal error. No one can move past it. Don't misunderstand me. There is a messiness to the firmware situation but it is not solved by preventing d-i doing its job. The install might not be exactly what some wanted but it is not a failure. The system will be fully functioning and open to enhancement. A triumph for the installer you might say. ;) -- Brian.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 19:40 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toChY-5vt-7@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179230 |
Catherine Gramze wrote:>
>> On Mar 23, 2017, at 9:22 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote:
>>
>> Catherine, I'm curious - when was the last time you installed Debian
>> using d-i? I've now seen you several times write (like above) about
>> "backing out of the installer after the reboot". Are you talking about
>> a second stage of d-i after it's installed the base system?
>>
>My last Debian netinst installation was January 11, 2017.
>
>Very early in the installation the installer looks for a network card
>to configure. If you have a NIC that will not function without
>non-free firmware this step fails, and the installer says it failed,
>but the installer still allows you to continue with the installation,
>installing all the base system files.
OK, yes.
>Then it tells you the base system is installed, and it needs to
>reboot. It ejects the media and reboots into the installer. You can
>choose to quit at this point by choosing "back"rather than "continue"
>possibly more than once being needed. That is what I mean by "backing
>out" to deliberately get a base system install only. So, yes, I am
>talking about the second stage after it has installed the base
>system.
Ummm, this is the bit where I don't see what you're seeing: "reboots
into the installer". And I've been developing and testing d-i for a
number of years. We *used* to have the two-reboot setup:
1. boot the installer from media to do basic setup
2. boot into that new basic system to continue selecting and
installing new packages
but that went away years ago. At the end of the single installer run,
it should be finished. Do you mean "reboots into the newly installed
system" instead, maybe?
--
Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com
< liw> everything I know about UK hotels I learned from "Fawlty Towers"
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 21:10 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toDH3-6EU-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179271 |
Sent from my iPad > On Mar 24, 2017, at 2:30 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote: > > but that went away years ago. At the end of the single installer run, > it should be finished. Do you mean "reboots into the newly installed > system" instead, maybe? > Yes, it boots into that bare bones system before it has you select a mirror. Cathy
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 23:10 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toFzc-83Q-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179282 |
On Fri 24 Mar 2017 at 15:44:15 (-0400), Catherine Gramze wrote:
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On Mar 24, 2017, at 2:30 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote:
> >
> > but that went away years ago. At the end of the single installer run,
> > it should be finished. Do you mean "reboots into the newly installed
> > system" instead, maybe?
> >
> Yes, it boots into that bare bones system before it has you select a mirror.
Here's the netinst installation menu after Advanced/Expert options
have been chosen. The asterisks are mine, and show what's probably
the most typical path from start to finish (in order).
At which step is the reboot?
┌─────────┤ [?] Debian installer main menu ├─────────┐
│ │
│ Choose the next step in the install process: │
│ │
│ * Choose language │
│ * Configure the keyboard │
│ * Detect and mount CD-ROM │
│ * Load installer components from CD │
│ * Detect network hardware │
│ * Configure the network │
│ * Set up users and passwords │
│ * Configure the clock │
│ * Detect disks │
│ * Partition disks │
│ * Install the base system │
│ * Configure the package manager │
│ * Select and install software │
│ * Install the GRUB boot loader on a hard disk │
│ Install the LILO boot loader on a hard disk │
│ Continue without boot loader │
│ * Finish the installation │
│ Change debconf priority │
│ Check the CD-ROM(s) integrity │
│ Save debug logs │
│ Execute a shell │
│ Eject a CD from the drive │
│ Abort the installation │
│ │
└────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘
Cheers,
David.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-25 00:10 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toGvf-ij-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179288 |
> On Mar 24, 2017, at 6:05 PM, David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> wrote: > >> On Fri 24 Mar 2017 at 15:44:15 (-0400), Catherine Gramze wrote: >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On Mar 24, 2017, at 2:30 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote: >>> >>> but that went away years ago. At the end of the single installer run, >>> it should be finished. Do you mean "reboots into the newly installed >>> system" instead, maybe? >>> >> Yes, it boots into that bare bones system before it has you select a mirror. > > Here's the netinst installation menu after Advanced/Expert options > have been chosen. The asterisks are mine, and show what's probably > the most typical path from start to finish (in order). > At which step is the reboot? > Between "Install the base system" and "Configure package manager." It boots to the installed base system after ejecting the netinst cd/dvd. You can miss it if you are not watching. Cathy
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-25 02:50 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toJ05-1WW-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179291 |
Catherine Gramze wrote: > On Mar 24, 2017, at 6:05 PM, David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> wrote: >> Here's the netinst installation menu after Advanced/Expert options >> have been chosen. The asterisks are mine, and show what's probably >> the most typical path from start to finish (in order). >> At which step is the reboot? >> >Between "Install the base system" and "Configure package manager." It >boots to the installed base system after ejecting the netinst >cd/dvd. You can miss it if you are not watching. There are really no reboots at that point in the installer! The installer runs through multiple steps directly in order: ... Partition disks Install the base system Configure the package manager Select and install software ... -- Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com < liw> everything I know about UK hotels I learned from "Fawlty Towers"
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-25 03:50 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toJWa-2BW-5@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179291 |
On Fri 24 Mar 2017 at 18:46:43 (-0400), Catherine Gramze wrote:
>
> > On Mar 24, 2017, at 6:05 PM, David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> >> On Fri 24 Mar 2017 at 15:44:15 (-0400), Catherine Gramze wrote:
> >> Sent from my iPad
> >>
> >>> On Mar 24, 2017, at 2:30 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> but that went away years ago. At the end of the single installer run,
> >>> it should be finished. Do you mean "reboots into the newly installed
> >>> system" instead, maybe?
> >>>
> >> Yes, it boots into that bare bones system before it has you select a mirror.
> >
> > Here's the netinst installation menu after Advanced/Expert options
> > have been chosen. The asterisks are mine, and show what's probably
> > the most typical path from start to finish (in order).
> > At which step is the reboot?
> >
> Between "Install the base system" and "Configure package manager." It boots to the installed base system after ejecting the netinst cd/dvd. You can miss it if you are not watching.
I think you must be running a different installer. Or are you saying
that the installation kernel can reboot without disturbing the
processes that are running?
I've just installed a machine with 260046848 Jan 16 05:01 debian-8.7.1-amd64-netinst.iso
whose SHA512 is 534795785d2706e64e3a4dff9648fd0302a1272c668a99a81ba3a984695986ac814d8193c5335bd13dce0592fc470eebe9fc4a6c9991f87a6686329a667ac30d
You've already seen its menu. Here are some process lists taken during
installation. Obviously I used the ssh installation method with a
fully configured NIC; therefore you can see _two_ ssh daemons, one
(4927) running the installation itself, and one (4998) running the
shell with which I ran ps.
It's quite clear that these two processes are running from start to
finish with no rebooting. A staggering number of processes run in
the meantime. BTW I left in the Task Selection menu as it first
appears, for reference.
Sorry the post is so long…
-- Set up users and passwords prompt (first command with ssh):
BusyBox v1.22.1 (Debian 1:1.22.0-9+deb8u1) built-in shell (ash)
Enter 'help' for a list of built-in commands.
~ # ps
PID USER VSZ STAT COMMAND
1 root 4072 S /bin/busybox init
…
194 root 48848 S debconf -o d-i /usr/bin/main-menu
200 root 10220 S /usr/bin/main-menu
4884 root 19608 S /usr/sbin/sshd
4927 root 23820 S sshd: installer@pts/1
4928 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
4936 root 49992 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
4942 root 10684 S main-menu
4996 root 0 SW [kworker/0:2]
4997 root 0 SW [kworker/0:0]
4998 root 23820 R sshd: installer@pts/2
4999 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
5007 root 49860 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
5013 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure di-utils-shell
5014 root 4544 S {di-utils-shell.} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/di-util
5015 root 4544 S {start-shell} /bin/sh /bin/start-shell di-utils-shel
5016 root 4540 S sh -c /bin/sh
5017 root 4544 S /bin/sh
5018 root 4544 R ps
~ #
-- Kernel version prompt:
…
194 root 48848 S debconf -o d-i /usr/bin/main-menu
200 root 10220 S /usr/bin/main-menu
4884 root 19608 S /usr/sbin/sshd
4927 root 23820 S sshd: installer@pts/1
4928 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
4936 root 53380 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
4942 root 10688 S main-menu
4998 root 23820 R sshd: installer@pts/2
4999 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
5007 root 49860 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
5013 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure di-utils-shell
5014 root 4544 S {di-utils-shell.} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/di-util
5015 root 4544 S {start-shell} /bin/sh /bin/start-shell di-utils-shel
5016 root 4540 S sh -c /bin/sh
5017 root 4544 S /bin/sh
…
9355 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure bootstrap-base
9356 root 4544 S {bootstrap-base.} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/bootstr
16890 root 0 SW [kauditd]
25120 root 0 SW [kworker/u8:1]
26303 root 4544 R ps
~ #
-- Configure the package manager prompt:
…
200 root 10220 S /usr/bin/main-menu
448 root 4544 R ps
4884 root 19608 S /usr/sbin/sshd
4927 root 23820 S sshd: installer@pts/1
4928 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
4936 root 53480 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
4942 root 10684 S main-menu
4998 root 23820 R sshd: installer@pts/2
4999 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
5007 root 49860 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
5013 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure di-utils-shell
5014 root 4544 S {di-utils-shell.} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/di-util
5015 root 4544 S {start-shell} /bin/sh /bin/start-shell di-utils-shel
5016 root 4540 S sh -c /bin/sh
5017 root 4544 S /bin/sh
…
~ #
-- Select and install software prompt:
…
194 root 48848 S debconf -o d-i /usr/bin/main-menu
200 root 10220 S /usr/bin/main-menu
449 root 0 SW [kworker/0:1]
597 root 0 SW [kworker/0:0]
1579 root 4544 R ps
4884 root 19608 S /usr/sbin/sshd
4927 root 23820 S sshd: installer@pts/1
4928 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
4936 root 53656 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
4942 root 10684 S main-menu
4998 root 23820 R sshd: installer@pts/2
4999 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
5007 root 49860 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
5013 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure di-utils-shell
5014 root 4544 S {di-utils-shell.} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/di-util
5015 root 4544 S {start-shell} /bin/sh /bin/start-shell di-utils-shel
5016 root 4540 S sh -c /bin/sh
5017 root 4544 S /bin/sh
…
~ #
-- PopCon prompt:
…
194 root 48848 S debconf -o d-i /usr/bin/main-menu
200 root 10220 S /usr/bin/main-menu
597 root 0 SW [kworker/0:0]
1580 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure pkgsel
1581 root 4544 S {pkgsel.postinst} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/pkgsel.
4884 root 19608 S /usr/sbin/sshd
4927 root 23820 S sshd: installer@pts/1
4928 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
4936 root 53760 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
4942 root 10688 S main-menu
4998 root 23820 R sshd: installer@pts/2
4999 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
5007 root 49860 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
5013 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure di-utils-shell
5014 root 4544 S {di-utils-shell.} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/di-util
5015 root 4544 S {start-shell} /bin/sh /bin/start-shell di-utils-shel
5016 root 4540 S sh -c /bin/sh
5017 root 4544 S /bin/sh
…
6764 root 6320 S log-output -t pkgsel /usr/lib/pre-pkgsel.d/90popcon
6765 root 4540 S {90popcon} /bin/sh /usr/lib/pre-pkgsel.d/90popcon
6766 root 4544 S {apt-install} /bin/sh /bin/apt-install --no-recommen
6767 root 4540 S {in-target} /bin/sh /bin/in-target sh -c debconf-apt
6817 root 6320 S log-output -t in-target chroot /target sh -c debconf
6818 root 4336 S sh -c debconf-apt-progress --no-progress --logstderr
6819 root 61400 S {frontend} /usr/bin/perl -w /usr/share/debconf/front
6821 root 29200 S {debconf-apt-pro} /usr/bin/perl -w /usr/bin/debconf-
6822 root 61568 S apt-get -o APT::Status-Fd=4 -o APT::Keep-Fds::=5 -o
6827 root 28268 S /usr/lib/apt/methods/cdrom
6828 root 0 Z [dpkg]
6829 root 4336 S /bin/sh -c /usr/sbin/dpkg-preconfigure --apt || true
6830 root 62848 S {dpkg-preconfigu} /usr/bin/perl -w /usr/sbin/dpkg-pr
6832 root 0 Z [dpkg-preconfigu]
6839 root 4336 S {popularity-cont} /bin/sh /tmp/popularity-contest.co
6840 root 0 SW [kworker/0:1]
6841 root 4544 R ps
…
~ #
--
┌──────────────────────────────────────┤ [!] Software selection ├───────────────────────────────────────┐
│ │
│ At the moment, only the core of the system is installed. To tune the system to your needs, you can │
│ choose to install one or more of the following predefined collections of software. │
│ │
│ Choose software to install: │
│ │
│ [*] Debian desktop environment │
│ [ ] ... GNOME │
│ [ ] ... Xfce │
│ [ ] ... KDE │
│ [ ] ... Cinnamon │
│ [ ] ... MATE │
│ [ ] ... LXDE │
│ [ ] web server │
│ [*] print server │
│ [ ] SSH server │
│ [*] standard system utilities │
│ │
│ <Go Back> <Continue> │
│ │
└───────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘
-- Install GRUB prompt:
…
194 root 48848 S debconf -o d-i /usr/bin/main-menu
200 root 10220 S /usr/bin/main-menu
4884 root 19608 S /usr/sbin/sshd
4927 root 23820 S sshd: installer@pts/1
4928 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
4936 root 56100 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
4942 root 10684 S main-menu
4998 root 23820 R sshd: installer@pts/2
4999 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
5007 root 49860 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
5013 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure di-utils-shell
5014 root 4544 S {di-utils-shell.} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/di-util
5015 root 4544 S {start-shell} /bin/sh /bin/start-shell di-utils-shel
5016 root 4540 S sh -c /bin/sh
5017 root 4544 S /bin/sh
…
25598 root 4544 R ps
~ #
-- Finish the installation:
…
194 root 48848 S debconf -o d-i /usr/bin/main-menu
200 root 10220 S /usr/bin/main-menu
4884 root 19608 S /usr/sbin/sshd
4927 root 23820 S sshd: installer@pts/1
4928 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
4936 root 56100 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
4942 root 10684 S main-menu
4998 root 23820 R sshd: installer@pts/2
4999 root 4540 S {debian-installe} /bin/sh /sbin/debian-installer /bi
5007 root 49860 S debconf -o d-i /bin/network-console-menu
5013 root 6460 S udpkg --configure --force-configure di-utils-shell
5014 root 4544 S {di-utils-shell.} /bin/sh /var/lib/dpkg/info/di-util
5015 root 4544 S {start-shell} /bin/sh /bin/start-shell di-utils-shel
5016 root 4540 S sh -c /bin/sh
5017 root 4544 S /bin/sh
…
30103 root 4544 R ps
~ #
Cheers,
David.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 13:10 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <towcy-1kb-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179221 |
On 03/23/2017 05:18 PM, Catherine Gramze wrote:
> [ *SNIP* ]
> A complete Debian dvd set does NOT solve the unrecognized network
> problem; only the unofficial iso downloads that include the non-free
> firmware do. The same issue was present the last time I used a
> complete 12 dvd set, which was years ago. We need to do all we can,
> within the limits of the Debian commitment to FOSS, to make Debian
> easier to install, not harder. If anybody must be inconvenienced,
> make it theusers best equipped to work around it.
>
I suspect that statement is factually incorrect.
I've been using *ONLY* multi-DVD sets to install Debian [since Squeeze].
Who would want to install something the size of Debian via dial-up?
My machines had recognized hardware, but nothing to connect to.
Also my latest Jessie was on a new {to me ;} Lenovo T510. Its WiFi chip
set is not supported and I'm give the option to obtain the non-free
driver required or to proceed without. By analogy I would assume the
same logic is in the network discovery process. Especially since I can
opt out of the network discovery process by pressing "Enter" a half
dozen times which then asks I wish to proceed without network access.
I may download the netinst *image* [ CD v. DVD is specious, only way to
do it is a netinst flash drive ;]. It might be just the ticket for some
of my minimalist experiments.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 15:00 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toxV0-2ms-7@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179245 |
On 03/24/2017 07:07 AM, Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 03/23/2017 05:18 PM, Catherine Gramze wrote:
>> [ *SNIP* ]
>> A complete Debian dvd set does NOT solve the unrecognized network
>> problem; only the unofficial iso downloads that include the non-free
>> firmware do. The same issue was present the last time I used a
>> complete 12 dvd set, which was years ago. We need to do all we can,
>> within the limits of the Debian commitment to FOSS, to make Debian
>> easier to install, not harder. If anybody must be inconvenienced,
>> make it theusers best equipped to work around it.
>>
>
> I suspect that statement is factually incorrect.
> I've been using *ONLY* multi-DVD sets to install Debian [since Squeeze].
> Who would want to install something the size of Debian via dial-up?
> My machines had recognized hardware, but nothing to connect to.
> Also my latest Jessie was on a new {to me ;} Lenovo T510. Its WiFi chip
> set is not supported and I'm give the option to obtain the non-free
> driver required or to proceed without. By analogy I would assume the
> same logic is in the network discovery process. Especially since I can
> opt out of the network discovery process by pressing "Enter" a half
> dozen times which then asks I wish to proceed without network access.
>
> I may download the netinst *image* [ CD v. DVD is specious, only way
> to do it is a netinst flash drive ;]. It might be just the ticket for
> some of my minimalist experiments.
I just downloaded the netinst image and placed on a flash drive.
I ran it with my internet access disabled by unplugging it to simulate
no suitable NIC. I saw no problem with how the lack of a functional
internet connection was handled.
Some small text only might make it feel more newbie friendly.
1. Add a link on debian.org in the box with the link to download
netinst. Have it lead to a short page describing the netinst pkg.
2. Modify the text displayed when the lack of internet connection is
found to explicitly state that proceeding will give a system with
command line interface and no a GUI.
That installer does produce a system very suitable for my minimalist
experiments. When I order my next multi-DVD set, I'll add it to the order.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 16:00 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toyR3-34l-15@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179245 |
On Friday 24 March 2017 12:07:59 Richard Owlett wrote: > It might be just the ticket for some > of my minimalist experiments. ;-) It would. The other minimalist install media have mostly gone by the board. I have just checked, and amazingly LNX-BBC (Linux Bootable Business Card) and DSL (Damn Small Linux) seem still to be alive and kicking. And to need a CD or a USB stick. Not all old computers will boot from a USB stick, Richard. Lisi
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Curt <curty@free.fr> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 19:10 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toBOV-5jj-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179208 |
On 2017-03-23, Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> wrote: > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Mar 23, 2017, at 2:03 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote: >> >> Please calm down, why the aggression? :-( > > Lisi is incensed with my suggestion that the netinst installer should refuse to continue if no network c Cathy I'd just wish you'd wrap your lines in accordance to rule number 87 of the "Debian Etiquette Guidelines," by I.M. Sikothis. -- "It might be a vision--of a shell, of a wheelbarrow, of a fairy kingdom on the far side of the hedge; or it might be the glory of speed; no one knew." --Mrs. Ramsay, speculating on why her little daughter might be dashing about, in "To the Lighthouse," by Virginia Woolf.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 20:10 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toCL0-5Yy-19@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179267 |
Sent from my iPad > On Mar 24, 2017, at 2:08 PM, Curt <curty@free.fr> wrote: > > I'd just wish you'd wrap your lines in accordance to rule number 87 of the > "Debian Etiquette Guidelines," by I.M. Sikothis. Thank you for mentioning this. I was not aware that my iPad does not wrap lines appropriately for everybody. I am using hard returns to wrap this to fit your display. Let me know if this creates odd wrapping issues for other people. There is unfortunately no way to manually adjust the automatic line wrap. Cathy
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Curt <curty@free.fr> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 20:40 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toDe2-6aU-17@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179273 |
On 2017-03-24, Catherine Gramze <rhiamom@mac.com> wrote: > > > > > Sent from my iPad >> On Mar 24, 2017, at 2:08 PM, Curt <curty@free.fr> wrote: >> >> I'd just wish you'd wrap your lines in accordance to rule number 87 of the >> "Debian Etiquette Guidelines," by I.M. Sikothis. > > Thank you for mentioning this. I was not aware that my iPad does not wrap > lines appropriately for everybody. I am using hard returns to wrap this to fit > your display. Let me know if this creates odd wrapping issues for other people. > There is unfortunately no way to manually adjust the automatic line wrap. Wonderfully reactive and readable. Thanks. > Cathy > -- "It might be a vision--of a shell, of a wheelbarrow, of a fairy kingdom on the far side of the hedge; or it might be the glory of speed; no one knew." --Mrs. Ramsay, speculating on why her little daughter might be dashing about, in "To the Lighthouse," by Virginia Woolf.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-23 19:00 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <tofbH-5C2-5@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179203 |
Catherine Gramze wrote: >> On Mar 23, 2017, at 12:38 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote: >> >> Sorry, what? There's no such animal as a netinst dvd... The netinst is >> a minimal-ish (small) CD-sized image that just contains the installer >> and the (very limited) base system. The DVDs we make are much more >> complete. > >When you burn the netinst iso to a dvd, because you can't buy blank >cds anymore in any local stores, you have a netinst dvd. I can't >remember the last time I saw a cd in the wild. Ah, thanks for explaining what you meant. I was a little confused. :-) -- Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com < liw> everything I know about UK hotels I learned from "Fawlty Towers"
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | songbird <songbird@anthive.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-23 19:50 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <tofY6-6kc-31@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179203 |
Catherine Gramze wrote: ... > When you burn the netinst iso to a dvd, because you can't buy blank cds anymore in any local stores, you have a netinst dvd. I can't remember the last time I saw a cd in the wild. i just saw piles of them available at Best Buy. plus i'd be very surprised if you could not find them available on-line. have you actually looked? songbird
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Jonathan Dowland <jmtd@debian.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-24 11:30 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <touDL-64-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179210 |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 02:33:00PM -0400, songbird wrote: > Catherine Gramze wrote: > ... > > When you burn the netinst iso to a dvd, because you can't buy blank cds anymore in any local stores, you have a netinst dvd. I can't remember the last time I saw a cd in the wild. > > i just saw piles of them available at Best Buy. > > plus i'd be very surprised if you could not find > them available on-line. have you actually looked? ...this is getting further and further from any sort of point, all in the name of being "correct on the Internet". *Why bother* buying CD-rs if you don't need them? -- ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀ ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Jonathan Dowland ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ ⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀ Please do not CC me, I am subscribed to the list.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Fred <fred@blakemfg.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-23 20:10 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <toghs-6GO-31@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179203 |
On 03/23/2017 09:48 AM, Catherine Gramze wrote: >> On Mar 23, 2017, at 12:38 PM, Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> wrote: >> >> Catherine Gramze wrote: >>>> On Mar 20, 2017, at 10:02 PM, Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Particularly where you have encountered it where it takes you past the point >>>> of no retreat before you discover that you need a network driver, so that you >>>> have wiped your old install and cannot continue to install your new one. >>>> >>> How about the last time I installed Debian using a netinst dvd? >> Sorry, what? There's no such animal as a netinst dvd... The netinst is >> a minimal-ish (small) CD-sized image that just contains the installer >> and the (very limited) base system. The DVDs we make are much more >> complete. > When you burn the netinst iso to a dvd, because you can't buy blank cds anymore in any local stores, you have a netinst dvd. I can't remember the last time I saw a cd in the wild. > Walmart sells them. Until recently (like maybe 6 months) they still sold blank VHS tapes. Best regards, Fred
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-03-23 17:40 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: installer defaults for desktops (was Re: Suggested edit) |
| Message-ID | <todWi-4QN-15@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #179058 |
rhiamom@mac.com wrote: >> >> If run from Jessie's DVD 1 of 13, if Desktop is selected but >> without a specific D.E. selected, you get Gnome. >> >You only get Gnome if you have first selected a mirror. Ummm, I've done this lots of times - DVD 1 should give you Gnome without needing any external package sources. <snip> >The hard part is determining whether the firmware is needed to >function, or to allow enhanced function. I get a firmware notice for >my network card, but it works without it, albeit more slowly than >with it. It's very difficult to know. There can be lots of variations on the hardware that's shipped. Some variants need firmware, some don't; some will be faster with firmware added as it will turn on hardware acceleration features. And some crappy vendors give no way at all for software to know which variant you have. :-/ -- Steve McIntyre, Cambridge, UK. steve@einval.com < liw> everything I know about UK hotels I learned from "Fawlty Towers"
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
Page 5 of 6 — ← Prev page 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 Next page →
Back to top | Article view | linux.debian.user
csiph-web