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Unattended upgrades. Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu.

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  Unattended upgrades.  Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu. Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-22 01:40 +0100
    Re: Unattended upgrades. Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu. didier gaumet <didier.gaumet@gmail.com> - 2017-03-22 08:50 +0100
      Re: Unattended upgrades. Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu. Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-23 02:10 +0100
        Re: Unattended upgrades. Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu. didier gaumet <didier.gaumet@gmail.com> - 2017-03-23 10:10 +0100
          Re: Unattended upgrades. Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 09:50 +0100
            Re: Unattended upgrades. didier gaumet <didier.gaumet@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 11:00 +0100
              Re: Unattended upgrades. Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 18:20 +0100
                Re: Unattended upgrades. Teemu Likonen <tlikonen@iki.fi> - 2017-03-24 18:40 +0100
                  Re: Unattended upgrades. Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 18:50 +0100
    Re: Unattended upgrades.  Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu. Teemu Likonen <tlikonen@iki.fi> - 2017-03-23 05:30 +0100
      Re: Unattended upgrades.  Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu. Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2017-03-24 09:50 +0100

#179135 — Unattended upgrades. Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu.

tl:dnr:
How do I get unattended upgrades a) to function and b) to tell me when it has 
upgraded something.

With Debian unattended-upgrades installed I can't make out form Adam whether 
they have run.  I have run:
# cd /var/log/unattended-upgrades/
# cat unattended-upgrades-shutdown.log
# cat unattended-upgrades.log
With  0 result.  (As above)

I have have run full-upgrade and looked for whether any security packages had 
not been installed:


Current status: 5 updates [+5], 29069 new [+68].
root@Eros:/home/lisi# aptitude full-upgrade
The following packages will be upgraded:
  imagemagick-6.q16 imagemagick-common libmagickcore-6.q16-2 
libmagickcore-6.q16-2-extra
  libmagickwand-6.q16-2
5 packages upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
Need to get 2,935 kB of archives. After unpacking 340 kB will be freed.
Do you want to continue? [Y/n/?]
Get: 1 http://security.debian.org/ jessie/updates/main libmagickwand-6.q16-2 
amd64 8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7 [407 kB]
Get: 2 http://security.debian.org/ jessie/updates/main libmagickcore-6.q16-2 
amd64 8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7 [1,694 kB]
Get: 3 http://security.debian.org/ jessie/updates/main imagemagick-common all 
8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7 [151 kB]
Get: 4 http://security.debian.org/ jessie/updates/main imagemagick-6.q16 amd64 
8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7 [510 kB]
Get: 5 http://security.debian.org/ jessie/updates/main 
libmagickcore-6.q16-2-extra amd64 8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7 [172 kB]
Fetched 2,935 kB in 1s (1,690 kB/s)
Reading changelogs...
apt-listchanges: Mailing lisi.reisz@gmail.com: apt-listchanges: changelogs for 
Eros
(Reading database ... 161857 files and directories currently installed.)
Preparing to 
unpack .../libmagickwand-6.q16-2_8%3a6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7_amd64.deb ...
Unpacking libmagickwand-6.q16-2:amd64 (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) over 
(8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u6) ...
Preparing to 
unpack .../libmagickcore-6.q16-2_8%3a6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7_amd64.deb ...
Unpacking libmagickcore-6.q16-2:amd64 (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) over 
(8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u6) ...
Preparing to unpack .../imagemagick-common_8%3a6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7_all.deb ...
Unpacking imagemagick-common (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) over 
(8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u6) ...
Preparing to unpack .../imagemagick-6.q16_8%3a6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7_amd64.deb ...
Unpacking imagemagick-6.q16 (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) over (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u6) ...
Preparing to 
unpack .../libmagickcore-6.q16-2-extra_8%3a6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7_amd64.deb ...
Unpacking libmagickcore-6.q16-2-extra:amd64 (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) over 
(8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u6) ...
Processing triggers for hicolor-icon-theme (0.13-1) ...
Processing triggers for desktop-file-utils (0.22-1) ...
Processing triggers for mime-support (3.58) ...
Setting up imagemagick-common (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) ...
Setting up libmagickcore-6.q16-2:amd64 (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) ...
Setting up libmagickwand-6.q16-2:amd64 (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) ...
Setting up imagemagick-6.q16 (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) ...
Setting up libmagickcore-6.q16-2-extra:amd64 (8:6.8.9.9-5+deb8u7) ...
Processing triggers for libc-bin (2.19-18+deb8u7) ...

Current status: 0 updates [-5].
root@Eros:/home/lisi# 

But unattended upgrades is installed:

root@Eros:/home/lisi# aptitude search unattended-upgrades
i   unattended-upgrades                            - automatic installation of 
security upgrades
root@Eros:/home/lisi#  

I have tried to see if a vim security patch had been installed after a vim 
security alert.  It had not.

So unattended upgrades would appear not to be working.  How do I get it 
working/configure it/ whatever.

How do I know when it is working and when it has upgraded something?

I set a configuration file up to email me, but not on this computer, and it 
hasn't done so.  Perhaps nothing has been upgraded.

Help!  Where now.

Lisi

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#179141 — Re: Unattended upgrades. Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu.

there is a doc in the Debian wiki:
https://wiki.debian.org/UnattendedUpgrades

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#179174 — Re: Unattended upgrades. Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu.

On Wednesday 22 March 2017 07:42:09 didier gaumet wrote:
> there is a doc in the Debian wiki:
> https://wiki.debian.org/UnattendedUpgrades

Thank you.  Yes, I have read and tried to follow it.  I quote:
---------
To install these packages, run the following command as root:

# apt-get install unattended-upgrades apt-listchanges
The default configuration file for the unattended-upgrades package is 
at /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades. The defaults will work fine, 
but you should read it and make changes as needed.

# editor /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades
---------

It clearly says that the defaults will work fine.  They don't.  They don't 
seem to work at all, in fact most of the files don't seem to be there. 

I have tried to read and follow the whole thing.  I have googled for other 
things.  I have got no-where.  So any more useful pointers would be greatly 
welcomed.

Lisi

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#179179 — Re: Unattended upgrades. Debian methods, please, not Ubuntu.

Le 23/03/2017 à 02:06, Lisi Reisz a écrit :
> 
> Thank you.  Yes, I have read and tried to follow it.  I quote:
> ---------
> To install these packages, run the following command as root:
> 
> # apt-get install unattended-upgrades apt-listchanges
> The default configuration file for the unattended-upgrades package is 
> at /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades. The defaults will work fine, 
> but you should read it and make changes as needed.
> 
> # editor /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades
> ---------
> 
> It clearly says that the defaults will work fine.  They don't.  They don't 
> seem to work at all, in fact most of the files don't seem to be there. 

I don't really understand: what files are not there that should be there?

> I have tried to read and follow the whole thing.  I have googled for other 
> things.  I have got no-where.  So any more useful pointers would be greatly 
> welcomed.

the part of the procedure you quoted is the installation of
unattended-upgrades: you can verify that unattended-upgrades is working
the way you want simply by running it as root in console. this part of
the procedure does not automatize anything, so if you do not run
yourself unattended-upgrades you may have the false impression that it
is not working.

did you follow the rest of the procedure, and which part, in order to
automatize the execution of unattended-upgrades? what is the content of
/etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades ?

also, I seem to remember that the default set-up for unattended-upgrades
is upgrading only security issues for the stable channel. If you want
something like proposed updates or follow testing or unstable channels,
you have to alter the default set-up

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#179236 — Re: Unattended upgrades.

Thank you for your further response.  I have tried to answer your questions, 
which will show you that I am completely at sea.

On Thursday 23 March 2017 09:03:01 didier gaumet wrote:
> Le 23/03/2017 à 02:06, Lisi Reisz a écrit :
> > Thank you.  Yes, I have read and tried to follow it.  I quote:
> > ---------
> > To install these packages, run the following command as root:
> >
> > # apt-get install unattended-upgrades apt-listchanges
> > The default configuration file for the unattended-upgrades package is
> > at /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades. The defaults will work
> > fine, but you should read it and make changes as needed.
> >
> > # editor /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades
> > ---------
> >
> > It clearly says that the defaults will work fine.  They don't.  They
> > don't seem to work at all, in fact most of the files don't seem to be
> > there.
>
> I don't really understand: what files are not there that should be there?

Let's start with the file you mention: /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades   
It isn't there.

> > I have tried to read and follow the whole thing.  I have googled for
> > other things.  I have got no-where.  So any more useful pointers would be
> > greatly welcomed.
>
> the part of the procedure you quoted is the installation of
> unattended-upgrades: you can verify that unattended-upgrades is working
> the way you want simply by running it as root in console.

lisi@Eros:~$ su
Password:
root@Eros:/home/lisi# unattended-upgrades
root@Eros:/home/lisi#

What has that done?  I can verify nothing because I can't see what it has or 
has not done.  It took a long while doing it, but appears to have dome 
nothing.

> this part of 
> the procedure does not automatize anything, so if you do not run
> yourself unattended-upgrades you may have the false impression that it
> is not working.

If I have to run it myself, then it isn't working.  The whole point, from my 
point of view, is for it to work unattended.

> did you follow the rest of the procedure, and which part, in order to
> automatize the execution of unattended-upgrades? what is the content of
> /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades ?

I have clearly completely misunderstood what unattended-upgrades is intended 
to do.  If it won't work automatically but requires me to run it, in what 
sense is it unattended?  It said that it runs by default.  I have obviously 
misunderstood what "run" means in this context.

As I said above, /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades doesn't exist.

> also, I seem to remember that the default set-up for unattended-upgrades
> is upgrading only security issues for the stable channel.

That is what I have been trying unsuccessfully to achieve.  If the defaults 
work fine, then what are they doing?  If I need to run it, in what way is it 
any different from or preferable to any other method of running upgrades?

> If you want 
> something like proposed updates or follow testing or unstable channels,
> you have to alter the default set-up

So, to summarise, it is my expectations that are at fault.  
Unattended-upgrades does not by default run unattended.  One has to set up a 
cron job or something.

Having been reading the file /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades, which 
does exist, I have come to the conclusion that sadly this is all well above 
my pay-grade anyway.

Lisi

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#179237 — Re: Unattended upgrades.

Le 24/03/2017 à 09:41, Lisi Reisz a écrit :
[...]
> Let's start with the file you mention: /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades   
> It isn't there.

the Debian wiki indicates that it has to be created, either by typing a
content in an editor or you can symply type as root:
# dpkg-reconfigure -plow unattended-upgrades

> lisi@Eros:~$ su
> Password:
> root@Eros:/home/lisi# unattended-upgrades
> root@Eros:/home/lisi#
>
> What has that done?  I can verify nothing because I can't see what it has or 
> has not done.  It took a long while doing it, but appears to have dome 
> nothing.

unattended-upgrades is not intended to be interactive (all benefit would
be lost), so it does not display anything.
if you want to observe how unattended-upgrades has run, you may examine
the content of:
/var/log/unattended-upgrades/unattended-upgrades.log
/var/log/unattended-upgrades/unattended-upgrades-dpkg.log

> If I have to run it myself, then it isn't working.  The whole point, from my 
> point of view, is for it to work unattended.

you do not have to run unattended-upgrades yourself: I was suggesting to
run unattended-upgrades yourself just un order to verify it runs when
called.

to work unattended, unattended-upgaded has:
- to be installed
- to be told what and how to upgrade (that is the role of
/etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades)
- to be told when to upgrade (that is the role of
/etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades), else it never runs.

> I have clearly completely misunderstood what unattended-upgrades is intended 
> to do.  If it won't work automatically but requires me to run it, in what 
> sense is it unattended?  It said that it runs by default.  I have obviously 
> misunderstood what "run" means in this context.
> 
> As I said above, /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades doesn't exist.
> 
> That is what I have been trying unsuccessfully to achieve.  If the defaults 
> work fine, then what are they doing?  If I need to run it, in what way is it 
> any different from or preferable to any other method of running upgrades?
> 
> So, to summarise, it is my expectations that are at fault.  
> Unattended-upgrades does not by default run unattended.  One has to set up a 
> cron job or something.
> 
> Having been reading the file /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades, which 
> does exist, I have come to the conclusion that sadly this is all well above 
> my pay-grade anyway.

I would summarize it differently: installing unattended-upgrades is not
sufficient, it has to be set-up and its default setup is valid for a
reasonable goal.

For basic needs (automatic upgrades of security fixes for the stable
channel of Debian):
# apt-get install unattended-upgrades
# dpkg-reconfigure -plow unattended-upgrades
is sufficient.
If you have different or mode elaborate needs, you have to fiddle with
the set-up.

There are other ways of getting automatic upgrades, the only one I have
tested is cron-apt and I reckon unattended-upgrades is probably simpler.

NOTE: It appears that upgrade-system is a package that could interest
you: having looked quickly at it (but having never tested it), it seems
to require no set-up, just to be installed, to automatically upgrade all
packages to their newest version available (do not forget to do an
apt-get purge unattended-upgrades, it would be cleaner that way).

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#179262 — Re: Unattended upgrades.

On Friday 24 March 2017 09:56:23 didier gaumet wrote:
> Le 24/03/2017 à 09:41, Lisi Reisz a écrit :
> [...]
>
> > Let's start with the file you mention:
> > /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades It isn't there.
>
> the Debian wiki indicates that it has to be created, either by typing a
> content in an editor or you can symply type as root:
> # dpkg-reconfigure -plow unattended-upgrades

This is what I had missed!  I have now run it.

> > lisi@Eros:~$ su
> > Password:
> > root@Eros:/home/lisi# unattended-upgrades
> > root@Eros:/home/lisi#
> >
> > What has that done?  I can verify nothing because I can't see what it has
> > or has not done.  It took a long while doing it, but appears to have dome
> > nothing.
>
> unattended-upgrades is not intended to be interactive (all benefit would
> be lost), so it does not display anything.
> if you want to observe how unattended-upgrades has run, you may examine
> the content of:
> /var/log/unattended-upgrades/unattended-upgrades.log
> /var/log/unattended-upgrades/unattended-upgrades-dpkg.log

This I had seen, but not "got" anywhere with them before.  Having run 
# dpkg-reconfigure -plow unattended-upgrades
unattended-upgrades.log exists and is not empty.
/var/log/unattended-upgrades/unattended-upgrades-dpkg.log
still does not exist, but it has clearly not yet been called for.  Hopefully 
it will tell me when unattended-upgrades has run.

> > If I have to run it myself, then it isn't working.  The whole point, from
> > my point of view, is for it to work unattended.
>
> you do not have to run unattended-upgrades yourself: I was suggesting to
> run unattended-upgrades yourself just un order to verify it runs when
> called.
>
> to work unattended, unattended-upgaded has:
> - to be installed
> - to be told what and how to upgrade (that is the role of
> /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades)
> - to be told when to upgrade (that is the role of
> /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades), else it never runs.
>
> > I have clearly completely misunderstood what unattended-upgrades is
> > intended to do.  If it won't work automatically but requires me to run
> > it, in what sense is it unattended?  It said that it runs by default.  I
> > have obviously misunderstood what "run" means in this context.
> >
> > As I said above, /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades doesn't exist.
> >
> > That is what I have been trying unsuccessfully to achieve.  If the
> > defaults work fine, then what are they doing?  If I need to run it, in
> > what way is it any different from or preferable to any other method of
> > running upgrades?
> >
> > So, to summarise, it is my expectations that are at fault.
> > Unattended-upgrades does not by default run unattended.  One has to set
> > up a cron job or something.
> >
> > Having been reading the file /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades,
> > which does exist, I have come to the conclusion that sadly this is all
> > well above my pay-grade anyway.
>
> I would summarize it differently: installing unattended-upgrades is not
> sufficient, it has to be set-up and its default setup is valid for a
> reasonable goal.

Yes.  Thank you.  I had not succeeded in setting it up.  let us hope that I 
have now.

> For basic needs (automatic upgrades of security fixes for the stable
> channel of Debian):
> # apt-get install unattended-upgrades
> # dpkg-reconfigure -plow unattended-upgrades
> is sufficient.

Fingers crossed, all is now well.  Thank you.

> If you have different or mode elaborate needs, you have to fiddle with
> the set-up.
>
> There are other ways of getting automatic upgrades, the only one I have
> tested is cron-apt and I reckon unattended-upgrades is probably simpler.

Thank you for your help.  Let us hope that all is now well!  I shall have to 
leave my desktop un-upgraded for a bit in order to see - I normally check for 
upgrades frequently.
>
> NOTE: It appears that upgrade-system is a package that could interest
> you: having looked quickly at it (but having never tested it), it seems
> to require no set-up, just to be installed, to automatically upgrade all
> packages to their newest version available (do not forget to do an
> apt-get purge unattended-upgrades, it would be cleaner that way).

No, this is the "Ubuntu way" that I specifically wanted to avoid.  When all 
updating is set up up to run automatically in this way.

I dislike any and all automatic upgrades.  I have no doubt that I could use 
them to get myself, or anyone else, in an infernal mess.  I have however got 
a particular problem at the moment, and after the discussion on the list 
about the fact that unattended-upgrades are now installed by default I felt 
that I should consider going that way.  I am putting it on my machine with 
trepidation and worry, but I must test it on myself first.

I want it because I have two clients 11 miles away and am partially sighted: 
i.e. 11 miles is a long way.  My husband has been seriously ill and I have 
been unable to go out far or for long. Teamviewer has taken a dive.  Getting 
at least security upgrades done has become urgent.  The clients cannot be 
persuaded to regard it as so!  (They could bring their computers to me.)  I 
would like, next time I get access, to set up both their computers to at 
least install important security upgrades automatically, for next time I 
can't get out, anyhow until I manage to set up remote access.  They have 
dynamic IP and a somewhat tricky ISP supplied router.  Again, I need access, 
and for more than a few minutes.

Lisi

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#179264 — Re: Unattended upgrades.

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

Lisi Reisz [2017-03-24 17:13:21Z] wrote:

> On Friday 24 March 2017 09:56:23 didier gaumet wrote:
>> # dpkg-reconfigure -plow unattended-upgrades
>
> This is what I had missed!  I have now run it.

The command creates file /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades:

    APT::Periodic::Update-Package-Lists "1";
    APT::Periodic::Unattended-Upgrade "1";

And that makes unattended-upgrade run daily. (As I wrote in my earlier
message.)

Actually it's the cron (Debian 8) or systemd unit
apt-daily.{timer,service} (Debian 9) that runs a script that in turn
will run unattended-upgrade if those APT::Periodic settings are set.

-- 
/// Teemu Likonen   - .-..   <https://keybase.io/tlikonen> //
// PGP: 4E10 55DC 84E9 DFF6 13D7 8557 719D 69D3 2453 9450 ///

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#179266 — Re: Unattended upgrades.

On Friday 24 March 2017 17:34:58 Teemu Likonen wrote:
> Lisi Reisz [2017-03-24 17:13:21Z] wrote:
> > On Friday 24 March 2017 09:56:23 didier gaumet wrote:
> >> # dpkg-reconfigure -plow unattended-upgrades
> >
> > This is what I had missed!  I have now run it.
>
> The command creates file /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20auto-upgrades:
>
>     APT::Periodic::Update-Package-Lists "1";
>     APT::Periodic::Unattended-Upgrade "1";
>
> And that makes unattended-upgrade run daily. (As I wrote in my earlier
> message.)
>
> Actually it's the cron (Debian 8) or systemd unit
> apt-daily.{timer,service} (Debian 9) that runs a script that in turn
> will run unattended-upgrade if those APT::Periodic settings are set.

Yes, thank you Teemu for your advice.

Lisi

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#179176

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

Lisi Reisz [2017-03-22 00:37:18Z] wrote:

> How do I get unattended upgrades a) to function and b) to tell me when
> it has upgraded something.

Probably you need to add the following lines in the top of
/etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades file (or some other file in
the same directory).

    APT::Periodic::Update-Package-Lists "1";
    APT::Periodic::Unattended-Upgrade "1";
    APT::Periodic::CleanInterval "1";

Systemd timer and service apt-daily.{timer,service} runs daily but if a
laptop is on battery power the service unit doesn't do anything. That's
easy to override on Debian 9 but requires an uglier hack on Debian 8.

-- 
/// Teemu Likonen   - .-..   <https://keybase.io/tlikonen> //
// PGP: 4E10 55DC 84E9 DFF6 13D7 8557 719D 69D3 2453 9450 ///

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#179235

On Thursday 23 March 2017 04:26:17 Teemu Likonen wrote:
> Lisi Reisz [2017-03-22 00:37:18Z] wrote:
> > How do I get unattended upgrades a) to function and b) to tell me when
> > it has upgraded something.
>
> Probably you need to add the following lines in the top of
> /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades file (or some other file in
> the same directory).
>
>     APT::Periodic::Update-Package-Lists "1";
>     APT::Periodic::Unattended-Upgrade "1";
>     APT::Periodic::CleanInterval "1";
>
> Systemd timer and service apt-daily.{timer,service} runs daily but if a
> laptop is on battery power the service unit doesn't do anything. That's
> easy to override on Debian 9 but requires an uglier hack on Debian 8.

Thank you, Teemu.  I haven't yet tried that, but intend doing so.  

Lisi

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