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Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop

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  Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-09 18:00 +0200
    Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Julian Rüger <jr98@gmx.net> - 2017-05-09 19:00 +0200
      Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Julian Rüger <jr98@gmx.net> - 2017-05-09 19:10 +0200
        Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-10 15:20 +0200
    Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2017-05-09 19:00 +0200
      Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-09 21:10 +0200
        Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2017-05-09 21:50 +0200
        Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2017-05-10 01:50 +0200
        Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2017-05-10 02:50 +0200
          Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Johann Spies <johann.spies@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 08:20 +0200
            Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Jimmy Johnson <field.engineer@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 08:50 +0200
            Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2017-05-10 09:10 +0200
            Re: Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-10 15:30 +0200

#180888 — Using 2nd monitor with Stretch and MATE desktop

I have a Lenovo T510 laptop -- wide and short display.
When I chose a tri-focal readable font size it displays to few lines.
I purchased a use 17 inch VGA display.
The MATE built in "help" is not detailed enough.
I suspect the authors thought the configuration screen was intuitive.
It's *NOT*.
My web searches have turned up posts about external hardware I don't have.

I need basic instructions *WITH PICTURES*.
I want a full screen display on the laptop.
I want a blow-up of a portion of the display on the external display.
I know it's physically possible because I'm staring at it.
BUT can not predict what is displayed on external display.
Help please.

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#180892

Hi Richard!

First of all, sorry, no pictures.
An easy solution, without trying to achieve what you want on a low
level, is to use a screen magnifier such as xzoom.

1. Install the package "xzoom" (sudo apt-get install xzoom) or use the
package manager of your choice.
2. Open mate-display-properties.
3. Select your external monitor, uncheck "Same image in all monitors"
4. Click and drag your external monitor (light green box in the visual
representation for me) to the side of your laptop display (light red).
5. Check if the resolution is correct (choose highest possible for LCD,
for CRT try different ones until it looks good to you)
6. Click Apply, then Keep Settings.
7. Close mate-display-properties, open xzoom (press Alt+F2, enter
"xzoom" without quotes, hit enter key)
8. Drag the xzoom window to your external monitor, double click the
title bar to maximize it.
9. Click inside the xzoom window and drag the mouse to the area you want
to enlarge on your laptop screen.
10. Done


Best,
Julian


From the xzoom man page:

COMMANDS
       Once xzoom has started the user can enter  simple  commands  using  the
       keyboard.

       q    quit.

       +    increase magnification value by 1.

       -    decrease magnification value by 1.

       w    next + or - command only affect X magnification.

       h    next + or - command only affect Y magnification.

       x    mirror the display image horizontally.

       y    mirror the display image vertically.

       z    rotate the displayed image 90 degrees counter-clockwise.

       arrow keys
            scroll  the zoomed area 1 pixel in the direction of the arrow.  if
            the control key is pressed the zoomed area will scroll 10 pixels.

       d    sets the delay between frame updates.  Built-in  delays  are  200,
            100, 50, 10 and 0 ms.

       g    toggle grid on and off.

       Mouse buttons
            To set the location of the magnified are click the left mouse but‐
            ton inside xzoom's window  and  then  move  it  (keep  the  button
            pressed) to the place which you want to see magnified.

            Xzoom allow you to resize it's window at any time.

            When xzoom is iconified it simply waits to get deiconified.

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#180894

EDIT:

On a closer look, kmag seems much more intuitive than xzoom.

The other instructions still work, just replace xzoom with kmag.

In step 9, click the "Mouse" button in kmag's toolbar, to make it follow
your mouse cursor.

Does that work for you?

Best,
Julian

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#180911

On 05/09/2017 11:49 AM, Julian Rüger wrote:
>
> On a closer look, kmag seems much more intuitive than xzoom.
>
> The other instructions still work, just replace xzoom with kmag.
>
> In step 9, click the "Mouse" button in kmag's toolbar, to make it follow
> your mouse cursor.
>
> Does that work for you?

I didn't find xzoom what I was looking for.
kmag crashed on my system.
I gave fairly detailed error messages and recovery suggestions.
I decided to experiment with other suggestions in this thread.
Thanks.

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#180893

Richard Owlett composed on 2017-05-09 10:57 (UTC-0500):

> I have a Lenovo T510 laptop -- wide and short display.

Googling tells me it's a 1600x900 15.6" display. Is that what your is? If so,
it's native pixel density is 117 DPI.

> When I chose a tri-focal readable font size it displays to few lines.

Too few lines in what context? Where you chose size, did it provide a numerical
value for the selected size? If so, what is it?

> I purchased a use 17 inch VGA display.

Resolution of a VGA display is 640x480, which for 17" is a pixel density of 47
DPI, magnitudes different from your laptop display. Did you really mean a
display that connects via a 15 pin VGA connector? If so, what are its
specifications?

> The MATE built in "help" is not detailed enough.
> I suspect the authors thought the configuration screen was intuitive.
> It's *NOT*.
> My web searches have turned up posts about external hardware I don't have.

> I need basic instructions *WITH PICTURES*.
> I want a full screen display on the laptop.
> I want a blow-up of a portion of the display on the external display.

To get what I think you're asking for likely will require manual configuration
with scripted xrandr or /etc/X11/xorg.conf*.

> I know it's physically possible because I'm staring at it.
> BUT can not predict what is displayed on external display.
> Help please. 
Properly configured, what shows up on the external display should be controlled
by moving the mouse pointer toward the part of the laptop screen you wish to see
on the VGA screen.
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#180896

On 05/09/2017 11:57 AM, Felix Miata wrote:
> Richard Owlett composed on 2017-05-09 10:57 (UTC-0500):
> [snip]
>> I need basic instructions *WITH PICTURES*.
>> I want a full screen display on the laptop.
>> I want a blow-up of a portion of the display on the external display.
>
> To get what I think you're asking for likely will require manual
> configuration with scripted xrandr or /etc/X11/xorg.conf*.

I'm not afraid of the command line ;/

>
>> I know it's physically possible because I'm staring at it.
>> BUT can not predict what is displayed on external display.
>> Help please.
>>
> Properly configured, what shows up on the external display should be
> controlled by moving the mouse pointer toward the part of the laptop
> screen you wish to see on the VGA screen.
>

OK that tells me that what I want is possible.
It also suggests that what I want is a reasonable approximation of SOP.
When I adjust items in Systems->Preferences->Hardware->Displays the 
effects of my actions *DO NOT* make sense to me.
I need documentation of the "Monitor Preferences" menu *WITH PICTURES*.

Just for the record, in the early 60's I was a struggling engineering 
student considering changing my major. I consulted the university's 
"Testing and Guidance Center". By luck of the draw, I got the department 
head as my counselor. With the standard aptitude tests I scored so low 
on spatial relationships that I could not be found in the statistical 
mud when compared to engineering students. As he was department head, my 
counselor tossed in an extra verbal _aptitude_ test. Again compared to 
engineering students I was in statistical mud. This time I scored too 
high to be "normal". It was one of the highest he'd seen in years. It 
was a test of *reading* aptitude. As the head of the freshman English 
program would declare "Owlett can't write worth a d$@%*" ;}

Please point me to documentation I can use.
TIA

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#180897

Richard Owlett composed on 2017-05-09 13:59 (UTC-0500):

> Felix Miata wrote:

> I'm not afraid of the command line ;/
...
>> Properly configured, what shows up on the external display should be
>> controlled by moving the mouse pointer toward the part of the laptop
>> screen you wish to see on the VGA screen.
...
> OK that tells me that what I want is possible.
> It also suggests that what I want is a reasonable approximation of SOP.
> When I adjust items in Systems->Preferences->Hardware->Displays the 
> effects of my actions *DO NOT* make sense to me.
> I need documentation of the "Monitor Preferences" menu *WITH PICTURES*.

I won't be providing any assistance including pictures before I can create what
you want locally, but I won't be creating locally without possession of basic
specifications of your '17 inch VGA display' device. Is it an LCD/LED? A CRT? Is
it limited to VGA mode (640x480)? Is its native mode 1280x1024 (common among 17"
LCDs)? Is VGA mode 640x480 what you wish used (lower DPI aka display density =
bigger images and text)?

A look at Xorg.0.log would help identify display specifications if a simpler set
cannot be located. Better here than Xorg.0.log would be output from 'xrandr -q'.
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#180900

On Tue, 09 May 2017, Richard Owlett wrote:
> On 05/09/2017 11:57 AM, Felix Miata wrote:
> I'm not afraid of the command line ;/

...


> counselor. With the standard aptitude tests I scored so low on spatial
> relationships that I could not be found in the statistical mud when compared

...

> an extra verbal _aptitude_ test. Again compared to engineering students I
> was in statistical mud. This time I scored too high to be "normal". It was

Well, extremely high verbal aptitude does not always mean extremely high
reading/writing aptitude, but it most often does, so maybe you would be
better off skipping the GUI?

I had a step-by-step large email written that took half an hour to
write, but something in my custom 4.4 kernel is highly alergic to
playing with xrandr and crashed the box hard while I was trying to test
the commands.  Then it took one full hour to undo the damage.

Therefore, I will make into a barebones email.  It has just a few key
points for you to look into and see if it looks like it could help you,
as apparently the gnome/kde GUIs to setup multi-monitor were not of much
help.


first: get to know the xrandr command.  And its manpage.

xrandr is the utility that does everything behind the scenes, to the
point that kde actually builds a xrandr line and adds it to a config
file somewhere when you use its GUI.  Gnome likely does something to the
same effect.

Just calling "xrandr" with no options will output the current state.
Useful information there will be the name of your "outputs", and their
geometry specification (more on this later).


Play with xrandr using its "simple mode", like this:

1st try:
xrandr --output <one of the outputs> --same-as <a different output> --auto

** now move the mouse to all edges: very left, very right, up, down.  If
it disappears, move it back in the opposite direction.

The command will "clone" one view port/output over the other, showing
the same area of the screen/canvas.  What it really did was to place the
two view ports at the same point of the screen, so they show the same
thing.

(screen: the video memory area where things happen.  output/view port:
something that shows a section of the screen, when connected to display
hardware).

Then, play with changing "--same-as" to:

--right-of
--left-of
--above
--below

e.g.:

xrandr --output <port where your left monitor is attached>
       --left-of <port where your right monitor is attached> --auto

(all in one line).

At each step, play with the mouse like I said.  That ought to get you up
to speed.

After each step, run "xrandr" without options, and look at the geometry
of each output (the thing that looks like 1280x1024+1280+0, or
1280x1024+0+0, etc).  It means:
<SIZE_X>x<SIZE_Y>+<POSITION_TOP_LEFT_CORNER_X>+<POSITION_TOP_LEFT_CORNER_Y>

relative to the top-left corner of the screen.

xrandr can do a lot more, such as rotating the viewport (useful if your
monitor has a pivot base that allows these piece of crap widescreen
displays to work as a long vertical page -- great for writing text and
code), etc.

Good luck...

-- 
  Henrique Holschuh

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#180901

Richard Owlett composed on 2017-05-09 13:59 (UTC-0500):
...
> I need documentation of the "Monitor Preferences" menu *WITH PICTURES*.
>... 
One picture.

After an xrandr man page refresh, using the following in a startup script:

	xrandr --fb 1920x1200
	xrandr --dpi 120 --output DVI-I-1 --mode 1920x1200
	xrandr --output VGA-1 --pos 0x0 --mode 640x480 --panning \
		1920x1200+0+0/1920x1200+0+0/64/64/64/64

I got

	http://fm.no-ip.com/SS/Xorg/magnifiedDual-1575.jpg

using Stretch, but with TDE instead of Mate.
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#180904

On 10 May 2017 at 02:42, Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Richard Owlett composed on 2017-05-09 13:59 (UTC-0500):
> ...
>> I need documentation of the "Monitor Preferences" menu *WITH PICTURES*.
>>...
> One picture.
>
> After an xrandr man page refresh, using the following in a startup script:
>
>         xrandr --fb 1920x1200
>         xrandr --dpi 120 --output DVI-I-1 --mode 1920x1200
>         xrandr --output VGA-1 --pos 0x0 --mode 640x480 --panning \
>                 1920x1200+0+0/1920x1200+0+0/64/64/64/64

arandr is a graphical frontend to xrandr.

Johann


-- 
Because experiencing your loyal love is better than life itself,
my lips will praise you.  (Psalm 63:3)

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#180905

On 05/09/2017 11:15 PM, Johann Spies wrote:

> arandr is a graphical frontend to xrandr.
>
> Johann

Yep!
-- 
Jimmy Johnson

Debian Sid/Testing - Plasma 5.8.6 - Intel I5-3320M - EXT4 at sda8
Registered Linux User #380263

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#180906

Johann Spies composed on 2017-05-10 08:15 (UTC+0200):

> Felix Miata wrote:

>> After an xrandr man page refresh, using the following in a startup script:
...
>>         xrandr --fb 1920x1200
>>         xrandr --dpi 120 --output DVI-I-1 --mode 1920x1200
>>         xrandr --output VGA-1 --pos 0x0 --mode 640x480 --panning \
>>                 1920x1200+0+0/1920x1200+0+0/64/64/64/64
...
> arandr is a graphical frontend to xrandr.

IIUC:

Adding arandr-0.1.9 here installed 10 packages (24MB) (on Stretch) and NAICT
works on a per user per DE/WM basis. Using xrandr "directly" (via text editor
and script) means both that discrete tweaks with a text editor are not obscured
in (one or more)(hidden) location(s) (deep?) in $HOME, and can be applied
globally, rather than needed by *each* user for *each* DE. Its man page is quite
terse, describing only two options not counting showversion and help.

All correct?
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#180912

On 05/10/2017 01:15 AM, Johann Spies wrote:
>
> arandr is a graphical frontend to xrandr.
>

Having started to read the man page for xrandr I launched arandr. A few 
minutes of experimentation got me a quite usable interim solution to an 
immediate problem - legibly displaying mariadb documentation.

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