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Groups > linux.debian.user > #180712 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Ashok Inder <ashoka.inder.dev@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2017-05-05 11:00 +0200 |
| Last post | 2017-05-05 15:20 +0200 |
| Articles | 10 — 8 participants |
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Installation Input required Ashok Inder <ashoka.inder.dev@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 11:00 +0200
Re: Installation Input required <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2017-05-05 11:20 +0200
Re: Installation Input required Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> - 2017-05-05 20:50 +0200
Re: Installation Input required "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2017-05-05 11:50 +0200
Re: Installation Input required Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-05 15:20 +0200
Re: Installation Input required Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> - 2017-05-05 16:10 +0200
Re: Installation Input required "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2017-05-05 16:20 +0200
Re: Installation Input required David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-05-05 17:50 +0200
Re: Installation Input required Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2017-05-05 19:50 +0200
Re: Installation Input required Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-05 15:20 +0200
| From | Ashok Inder <ashoka.inder.dev@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 11:00 +0200 |
| Subject | Installation Input required |
| Message-ID | <tDHfH-7Oz-13@gated-at.bofh.it> |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
Hi, Fairly new to Debian environment. I downloaded the 3 DVD (debian-8.7.1-amd64-DVD-1.iso, debian-8.7.1-amd64-DVD-2.iso, debian-8.7.1-amd64-DVD-3.iso). The reason for downloading all setup were: 1) Speed internet available in my office and allowed to download and take it on usb flash drive. 2) Slow speed net in home (were I'm supposed to install debian) and hence no netinst iso. 3) Setup would have all software that I would need, and a good probability that some would have been on DVD2 or DVD3. This would have ensured that I never had to use apt-get update && apt-get upgrade During the entire setup screen, the debian installer did not asked me for the 2nd or 3rd DVD. Also many a places its mentioned that the DVD is a set of 12 DVD but I only found 3 set DVD. Support pages mention that installer will ask for other part of the DVD as an option. It never asked, only driver cd/dvd was asked. Just wondering that did I missed something? Also I installed with Sudo option (no root account), will this be of any disadvantage at anytime in future over Sudo considering I'm not a power user. Regards, Ashok Kumar
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| From | <tomas@tuxteam.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 11:20 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDHz3-8aB-7@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180712 |
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Fri, May 05, 2017 at 02:26:44PM +0530, Ashok Inder wrote: > Hi, [...] > During the entire setup screen, the debian installer did not asked me > for the 2nd or 3rd DVD. Also many a places its mentioned that the DVD is > a set of 12 DVD but I only found 3 set DVD. > > Support pages mention that installer will ask for other part of the DVD > as an option. It never asked, only driver cd/dvd was asked. > > Just wondering that did I missed something? I don't know for sure, but I think this is a testament to the CD team: they work very hard to have the most-used things in the first DVD. Seems to have worked, kudos to them :-) > Also I installed with Sudo option (no root account), will this be of any > disadvantage at anytime in future over Sudo considering I'm not a power > user. There is just one downside I know of: if the system panics on boot, e.g. because it can't mount the root file system (say, because it's corrupted), it will ask you for the root password before giving you a root shell, for you to analyse and possibly fix the situation. I've been in that position once, having drunk the Kool Aid to the bottom of the glass. Very frustrating, believe me :) I'm still a fan of sudo, but have learnt since then to leave a bit in the glass and actually have a root password. Nothing, of course, which can't be fixed by having around a rescue disk. Cheers - -- tomás -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAlkMQtEACgkQBcgs9XrR2kaRKwCfeYQg29vP7sFUcPcr5GzV+qGJ tiQAn2n6s6y3tXT5JY2oOKuMSJWsonak =IGrO -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
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| From | Pascal Hambourg <pascal@plouf.fr.eu.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 20:50 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDQsH-5uu-51@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180714 |
Le 05/05/2017 à 11:16, tomas@tuxteam.de a écrit : > > On Fri, May 05, 2017 at 02:26:44PM +0530, Ashok Inder wrote: > >> During the entire setup screen, the debian installer did not asked me >> for the 2nd or 3rd DVD. Also many a places its mentioned that the DVD is >> a set of 12 DVD but I only found 3 set DVD. >> >> Support pages mention that installer will ask for other part of the DVD >> as an option. It never asked, only driver cd/dvd was asked. >> >> Just wondering that did I missed something? The Debian installer does not know how many CDs or DVD there are nor what they contain. I remember that, after scanning the first installation disk, the Debian installer used to ask whether I wanted to scan other disks. I have not seen that option for a long time. Maybe it is available only when booting from a real optical disk instead of a USB drive. >> Also I installed with Sudo option (no root account), will this be of any >> disadvantage at anytime in future over Sudo considering I'm not a power >> user. Yes. It will be a disadvantage if you need to log in directly as root to fix things when log in as a normal user does not work any more (e.g. /home filesystem full or mounted read-only or could not be mounted, or corrupted user profile). > There is just one downside I know of: if the system panics on boot, > e.g. because it can't mount the root file system (say, because it's > corrupted), it will ask you for the root password before giving you > a root shell Of course not. If the initramfs cannot mount the root filesystem, it cannot read /etc/shadow and check the root password. It just drops a root shell. The root password is asked when booting in emergency mode, either when selecting a "rescue" entry in the boot loader or when something went wrong during the init phase, e.g. a filesystem listed in /etc/fstab could not be mounted.
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| From | "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 11:50 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDI27-8l5-21@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180712 |
Hi, Ashok Inder wrote: > During the entire setup screen, the debian installer did not asked me > for the 2nd or 3rd DVD. Can it be you only asked for installing stuff which is on DVD 1 ? If the lack of requesting other DVDs led to a system which does not contain what you asked for, then this would be a topic for the debian-cd list. If all seems well, then you probably only needed DVD 1. > Also many a places its mentioned that the DVD is > a set of 12 DVD but I only found 3 set DVD. This question was asked often enough to cause the existence of https://www.debian.org/CD/faq/#not-all-images which says "We don't store/serve the full set of ISO images for all architectures, to reduce the amount of space taken up on the mirrors. You can use the jigdo tool to recreate the missing ISO images instead." The advantage of Jigdo for the DVD mirror servers is that the bulk of data can be fetched from Debian servers which provide packages. Jigdo loads a compressed ISO image with lots of holes and then loads all the package files which fit exactly into the holes. Here is a nice illustration from the times when disc images were still made of wood ;-) https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/e7/22/0c/e7220c2e4ed04fbd2d2e233e1b7cb90f.jpg Have a nice day :) Thomas
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| From | Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 15:20 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDLjj-2bY-7@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180717 |
On 05/05/2017 04:49 AM, Thomas Schmitt wrote: > [snip] > This question was asked often enough to cause the existence of > https://www.debian.org/CD/faq/#not-all-images > which says > "We don't store/serve the full set of ISO images for all > architectures, to reduce the amount of space taken up on the mirrors. > You can use the jigdo tool to recreate the missing ISO images > instead." > > > The advantage of Jigdo for the DVD mirror servers is that the bulk > of data can be fetched from Debian servers which provide packages. > Jigdo loads a compressed ISO image with lots of holes and then loads > all the package files which fit exactly into the holes. That eases problems for Debian servers, I don't see an advantage to me.
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| From | Henrique de Moraes Holschuh <hmh@debian.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 16:10 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDM5I-2OG-21@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180724 |
On Fri, 05 May 2017, Richard Owlett wrote: > >The advantage of Jigdo for the DVD mirror servers is that the bulk > >of data can be fetched from Debian servers which provide packages. > >Jigdo loads a compressed ISO image with lots of holes and then loads > >all the package files which fit exactly into the holes. > > That eases problems for Debian servers, I don't see an advantage to me. Correct when your issue is low-bandwidth or bandwidth cap. Jigdo cannot help, there... but a direct image download wouldn't, either: buying a DVD/BD set makes more sense. Jigdo is indeed a direct advantage for the Debian mirror network, and an indirect advantage to users that would download the image sets from the mirrors: we would [likely] not be able to provide the larger images *at all* nowadays on most mirrors. Jigdo solves that *important* issue. Jigdo can also be a direct advantage (as in: it will be much faster) for an user that has a close (or even local) mirror that does not carry the full DVD/BD images, though: it will download >95% of the data from the close mirror, and rsync whatever is missing from the (relatively few) mirrors that have the full images. Evidently, when the mirror closer to you also happens to mirror the full DVD/BD images, downloading those directly makes sense. -- Henrique Holschuh
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| From | "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 16:20 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDMfn-2S6-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180724 |
Hi, i wrote: > > The advantage of Jigdo for the DVD mirror servers is that the bulk > > of data can be fetched from Debian servers which provide packages. Richard Owlett wrote: > That eases problems for Debian servers, I don't see an advantage to me. The advantage for those who need them is that there are full DVD sets for free. Which other distro still offers this ? One may question the ergonomic quality of a set of 13 DVDs as on: https://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/8.7.1/amd64/jigdo-dvd/ But for example volume 1 of the 3 ISOs on https://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/8.7.1/amd64/jigdo-bd/ gives you the equivalent of 5 DVDs on one medium. To be put on BD medium or on e.g. a 32 GB USB stick. Have a nice day :) Thomas
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| From | David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 17:50 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDNEt-3DR-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180724 |
On Fri 05 May 2017 at 08:17:34 (-0500), Richard Owlett wrote: > On 05/05/2017 04:49 AM, Thomas Schmitt wrote: > >[snip] > >This question was asked often enough to cause the existence of > > https://www.debian.org/CD/faq/#not-all-images > >which says > > "We don't store/serve the full set of ISO images for all > >architectures, to reduce the amount of space taken up on the mirrors. > >You can use the jigdo tool to recreate the missing ISO images > >instead." > > > > > >The advantage of Jigdo for the DVD mirror servers is that the bulk > >of data can be fetched from Debian servers which provide packages. > >Jigdo loads a compressed ISO image with lots of holes and then loads > >all the package files which fit exactly into the holes. > > That eases problems for Debian servers, I don't see an advantage to me. That's because you're only thinking about your own space/bandwidth consumption. However, if there are fewer servers, then those ones will be busier, and download speeds suffer. On dial-up, you pay for that speed reduction. In fact, when I used dial-up at home, there were sites (like washington.edu, remember Pine?) where it was worth telephoning my office machine (on broadband) to start downloads there, then telephoning an hour later and transferring the downloaded files (if they were ready) directly from office to home, with no pausing. This was faster/cheaper than using the ISP to download those files directly across the Atlantic. Cheers, David.
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| From | Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 19:50 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDPwC-4T3-5@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180724 |
> That eases problems for Debian servers, I don't see an advantage to me.
Given that there is an advantage (for Debian servers), the question
isn't if there's an advantage to you, but instead if there's
a *dis*advantage to you (or others).
Stefan
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| From | Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-05-05 15:20 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <tDLjj-2bY-13@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #180712 |
On 05/05/2017 03:56 AM, Ashok Inder wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Fairly new to Debian environment. I downloaded the 3 DVD
> (debian-8.7.1-amd64-DVD-1.iso, debian-8.7.1-amd64-DVD-2.iso,
> debian-8.7.1-amd64-DVD-3.iso). The reason for downloading all setup were:
> 1) Speed internet available in my office and allowed to download and
> take it on usb flash drive.
> 2) Slow speed net in home (were I'm supposed to install debian) and
> hence no netinst iso.
> [SNIP]
I was on dialup when first installing Squeeze. I found {and still find}
it convenient to purchase complete DVD sets
(https://www.debian.org/CD/vendors/). My vendor charges $35 for the 13
DVD set and $3 for a single CD/DVD {Live CDs, utility discs, etc}. I now
have high speed access but with a minimal data cap.
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