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Groups > linux.debian.user > #171052 > unrolled thread

Decentralized reliable instant messaging?

Started byStefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
First post2016-08-13 05:00 +0200
Last post2016-09-08 16:20 +0200
Articles 20 on this page of 114 — 28 participants

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Contents

  Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2016-08-13 05:00 +0200
    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Ben Finney <ben+debian@benfinney.id.au> - 2016-08-13 06:10 +0200
    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2016-08-15 14:40 +0200
      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@IRO.UMontreal.CA> - 2016-08-16 18:40 +0200
        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Henning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com> - 2016-08-16 22:20 +0200
        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? rhkramer@gmail.com - 2016-08-17 04:50 +0200
          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Ben Finney <ben+debian@benfinney.id.au> - 2016-08-17 05:30 +0200
            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? rhkramer@gmail.com - 2016-08-17 13:40 +0200
    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Darac Marjal <mailinglist@darac.org.uk> - 2016-08-15 16:30 +0200
    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Amir H. Firouzian" <firouziyan@gmail.com> - 2016-08-17 08:30 +0200
      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-17 20:00 +0200
      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@IRO.UMontreal.CA> - 2016-08-25 20:20 +0200
        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Amir H. Firouzian" <firouziyan@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 11:50 +0200
          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2016-08-30 15:30 +0200
            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 16:00 +0200
              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Henning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com> - 2016-08-30 16:10 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 16:10 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 20:30 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2016-08-30 17:00 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Dan Purgert <dan@djph.net> - 2016-08-30 17:50 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 18:20 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 18:40 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2016-08-30 23:40 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 19:50 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 20:40 +0200
                      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 21:30 +0200
                        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 23:10 +0200
                          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 23:30 +0200
                            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 01:50 +0200
                        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-31 00:30 +0200
                          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-31 01:40 +0200
                            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 02:00 +0200
                            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-31 22:10 +0200
                              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-09-01 12:10 +0200
                          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2016-08-31 16:20 +0200
                            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Mark Fletcher <mark27q1@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 16:50 +0200
                              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 17:40 +0200
                                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2016-08-31 17:40 +0200
                                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2016-08-31 20:10 +0200
                                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-09-01 22:30 +0200
                              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2016-08-31 18:10 +0200
                                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 18:20 +0200
                                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 18:40 +0200
                                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2016-08-31 18:50 +0200
                                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 20:20 +0200
                                      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2016-08-31 20:50 +0200
                                        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 23:10 +0200
                            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-31 21:30 +0200
                              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-09-01 20:50 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-31 21:40 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2016-08-30 18:50 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 20:00 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2016-08-30 21:50 +0200
                      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 23:50 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Henning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com> - 2016-08-30 21:10 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 21:50 +0200
                      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2016-08-30 22:30 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2016-08-30 22:10 +0200
              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Dan Purgert <dan@djph.net> - 2016-08-30 17:50 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 18:00 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 20:00 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 20:00 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 20:20 +0200
                      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-30 21:00 +0200
                        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 22:20 +0200
                        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 22:20 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-30 20:20 +0200
                      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 08:30 +0200
                        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2016-08-31 09:50 +0200
                          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? claude juif <claude.juif@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 11:00 +0200
                            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-31 14:40 +0200
                              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? claude juif <claude.juif@gmail.com> - 2016-09-01 10:40 +0200
                          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2016-09-01 21:20 +0200
                        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 11:50 +0200
              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2016-09-02 15:50 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2016-09-02 18:40 +0200
            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Amir H. Firouzian" <firouziyan@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 15:20 +0200
              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Henning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com> - 2016-08-31 15:50 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Amir H. Firouzian" <firouziyan@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 20:20 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Henning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com> - 2016-09-01 18:30 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Amir H. Firouzian" <firouziyan@gmail.com> - 2016-09-01 20:30 +0200
                      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Henning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com> - 2016-09-01 21:10 +0200
              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2016-08-31 16:00 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? claude juif <claude.juif@gmail.com> - 2016-09-01 10:30 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-09-01 16:00 +0200
              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-31 20:30 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Amir H. Firouzian" <firouziyan@gmail.com> - 2016-08-31 22:40 +0200
    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Ralph Katz <ralph.katz@rcn.com> - 2016-08-17 16:20 +0200
      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Darac Marjal <mailinglist@darac.org.uk> - 2016-08-17 16:50 +0200
        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Ralph Katz <ralph.katz@rcn.com> - 2016-08-17 18:50 +0200
          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2016-08-17 19:40 +0200
            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2016-08-17 20:30 +0200
              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-08-17 21:00 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2016-08-17 21:30 +0200
    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Byung-Hee HWANG (황병희)" <soyeomul@doraji.xyz> - 2016-09-01 17:10 +0200
      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@IRO.UMontreal.CA> - 2016-09-01 22:20 +0200
        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2016-09-02 07:50 +0200
          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Byung-Hee HWANG (황병희)" <soyeomul@doraji.xyz> - 2016-09-03 15:40 +0200
        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-09-02 11:50 +0200
        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Byung-Hee HWANG (황병희)" <soyeomul@doraji.xyz> - 2016-09-03 15:30 +0200
          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2016-09-07 15:20 +0200
            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Paul Johnson <baloo@ursamundi.org> - 2016-09-07 15:50 +0200
            Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? "Byung-Hee HWANG (황병희)" <soyeomul@doraji.xyz> - 2016-09-07 17:50 +0200
              Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2016-09-07 19:00 +0200
                Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Byung-Hee HWANG <soyeomul@doraji.xyz> - 2016-09-08 01:10 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2016-09-08 01:30 +0200
                  Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Michael Lange <klappnase@freenet.de> - 2016-09-08 02:00 +0200
                    Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Byung-Hee HWANG <soyeomul@doraji.xyz> - 2016-09-08 05:50 +0200
                      Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Ben Finney <ben+debian@benfinney.id.au> - 2016-09-08 06:30 +0200
                        Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Dan Purgert <dan@djph.net> - 2016-09-08 13:40 +0200
                          Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging? Darac Marjal <mailinglist@darac.org.uk> - 2016-09-08 13:50 +0200
                            GNU (was Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging?) "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2016-09-08 15:20 +0200
                              Re: GNU (was Re: Decentralized reliable instant messaging?) Cindy-Sue Causey <butterflybytes@gmail.com> - 2016-09-08 15:40 +0200
                                Re: GNU "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2016-09-08 16:20 +0200

Page 1 of 6  [1] 2 3 4 5 6  Next page →


#171052 — Decentralized reliable instant messaging?

FromStefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
Date2016-08-13 05:00 +0200
SubjectDecentralized reliable instant messaging?
Message-ID<s5xkZ-23B-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
when I'm back online.  ]

IIUC there is some XMPP features that allow such reliable delivery, but
it seems that it's not widely supported by clients.  What Debian
clients, using which protocols, can provide reliable instant messaging?


        Stefan


PS: Bonus points if that feature is also available on an Android
application that's Free Software.

[toc] | [next] | [standalone]


#171054

FromBen Finney <ben+debian@benfinney.id.au>
Date2016-08-13 06:10 +0200
Message-ID<s5yqJ-3rD-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171052
Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> writes:

> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
> when I'm back online.  ]

While still new, I see that Matrix <URL:https://matrix.org/> is a
decentralised communication platform which does what you describe and
more.

> PS: Bonus points if that feature is also available on an Android
> application that's Free Software.

The Vector client <URL:http://vector.im/> is a good-looking Matrix
client for web and mobile OSen.

Neither of them are packaged in Debian yet; please help if you can!
<URL:https://bugs.debian.org/830601>

-- 
 \     “For myself, I am an optimist — it does not seem to be much use |
  `\              being anything else.” —Winston Churchill, 1954-11-09 |
_o__)                                                                  |
Ben Finney

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#171100

FromGreg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org>
Date2016-08-15 14:40 +0200
Message-ID<s6plo-5AL-43@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171052
On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 10:49:59PM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote:
> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
> when I'm back online.  ]

I believe that's called "electronic mail" or "email".

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#171145

FromStefan Monnier <monnier@IRO.UMontreal.CA>
Date2016-08-16 18:40 +0200
Message-ID<s6Pzb-5pz-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171100
>> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
>> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
>> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
>> when I'm back online.  ]
> I believe that's called "electronic mail" or "email".

There's that, and there are SMS messages as well, indeed.
But email is a lot more heavyweight and drowned in spam (e.g. most
people don't get notified right away when they receive an email
message), and SMS is basically limited to cell-phone only (you can find
services that let you send SMS messages from something like a SIP
account, but I haven't found any corresponding service for the
reception of SMS messages, except some that just drop the SMS message
if the SIP delivery cannot be performed because you're not connected).


        Stefan

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#171149

FromHenning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com>
Date2016-08-16 22:20 +0200
Message-ID<s6T05-7HZ-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171145
On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 10:47:35AM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote:
> >> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
> >> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
> >> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
> >> when I'm back online.  ]
> > I believe that's called "electronic mail" or "email".
> 
> There's that, and there are SMS messages as well, indeed.
> But email is a lot more heavyweight and drowned in spam (e.g. most
> people don't get notified right away when they receive an email

I consider this an absolute pro not a con.
All os vendors seem that ADD is the way to go. Interrupting you with
benign nonsense every 10 seconds. No wonder that the average attention span
is ~ 2 seconds.

The only advantage of most messaging protocols is presence awareness.
In every other aspect e-mail is superior.

> message), and SMS is basically limited to cell-phone only (you can find
> services that let you send SMS messages from something like a SIP
> account, but I haven't found any corresponding service for the
> reception of SMS messages, except some that just drop the SMS message
> if the SIP delivery cannot be performed because you're not connected).
> 
> 
>         Stefan
> 


-H

-- 
Henning Follmann           | hfollmann@itcfollmann.com

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#171155

Fromrhkramer@gmail.com
Date2016-08-17 04:50 +0200
Message-ID<s6Z5v-3gS-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171145
On Tuesday, August 16, 2016 10:47:35 AM Stefan Monnier wrote:
> >> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
> >> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
> >> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
> >> when I'm back online.  ]
> > 
> > I believe that's called "electronic mail" or "email".
> 
> There's that, and there are SMS messages as well, indeed.
> But email is a lot more heavyweight and drowned in spam (e.g. most
> people don't get notified right away when they receive an email
> message), and SMS is basically limited to cell-phone only (you can find
> services that let you send SMS messages from something like a SIP
> account, but I haven't found any corresponding service for the
> reception of SMS messages, except some that just drop the SMS message
> if the SIP delivery cannot be performed because you're not connected).

Google Voice can send and receive text messages (to and from cell phones or 
other google voice users)--iiuc, those are SMS messages.  Currently I don't 
have anything set up to notify me, but I asume (I know) that can be done 
within a web browser.  

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#171156

FromBen Finney <ben+debian@benfinney.id.au>
Date2016-08-17 05:30 +0200
Message-ID<s6ZId-3Jv-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171155
rhkramer@gmail.com writes:

> On Tuesday, August 16, 2016 10:47:35 AM Stefan Monnier wrote:
> > >> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
> > >> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
> > >> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
> > >> when I'm back online.  ]
> > > 
> > > I believe that's called "electronic mail" or "email".
> > 
> > There's that, and there are SMS messages as well, indeed.

SMS probably does not count as a decentralised system in the sense the
original poster is seeking.

> Google Voice

Google's services are highly centralised to a single vendor.

-- 
 \       “Pray, v. To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in |
  `\     behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy.” —Ambrose |
_o__)                           Bierce, _The Devil's Dictionary_, 1906 |
Ben Finney

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#171165

Fromrhkramer@gmail.com
Date2016-08-17 13:40 +0200
Message-ID<s77mp-pk-15@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171156
On Tuesday, August 16, 2016 11:22:10 PM Ben Finney wrote:
> rhkramer@gmail.com writes:
> SMS probably does not count as a decentralised system in the sense the
> original poster is seeking.
> 
> > Google Voice
> 
> Google's services are highly centralised to a single vendor.

I am not sure what you mean in this context--I can send and receive text 
messages (and phone calls) to / from any other SMS / telephone service.  (And, 
using Google Mail, the same for emails.)

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#171107

FromDarac Marjal <mailinglist@darac.org.uk>
Date2016-08-15 16:30 +0200
Message-ID<s6r3Q-6HX-27@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171052

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Fri, Aug 12, 2016 at 10:49:59PM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote:
>I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
>...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
>connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
>when I'm back online.  ]
>
>IIUC there is some XMPP features that allow such reliable delivery, but
>it seems that it's not widely supported by clients.  What Debian
>clients, using which protocols, can provide reliable instant messaging?

I believe this is the "Message Carbons" feature (XEP-0280). This sends 
messages to all capable instances of a user. When combined with XEP-0160 
(Best Practices for Handling Offline Messages), all clients SHOULD be 
able to achieve a consistent view of a conversation, regardless of which 
client said what.

In terms of what supports this, I use Prosody (debian package: prosody) 
as my XMPP server, Gajim (debian package: gajim) as my desktop client 
(available on Debian and Windows) and Conversations (Market ID: 
eu.siacs.conversations) as my android client.

>
>
>        Stefan
>
>
>PS: Bonus points if that feature is also available on an Android
>application that's Free Software.
>

-- 
For more information, please reread.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#171158

From"Amir H. Firouzian" <firouziyan@gmail.com>
Date2016-08-17 08:30 +0200
Message-ID<s72wp-5Fb-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171052

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

I think you looking for TOX!
Visit TOX Project website:
https://tox.chat

On Sat, Aug 13, 2016 at 7:19 AM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
wrote:

> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
> when I'm back online.  ]
>
> IIUC there is some XMPP features that allow such reliable delivery, but
> it seems that it's not widely supported by clients.  What Debian
> clients, using which protocols, can provide reliable instant messaging?
>
>
>         Stefan
>
>
> PS: Bonus points if that feature is also available on an Android
> application that's Free Software.
>
>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#171196

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2016-08-17 20:00 +0200
Message-ID<s7di9-4hI-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171158
On Wed 17 Aug 2016 at 10:52:00 +0430, Amir H. Firouzian wrote:

> I think you looking for TOX!
> Visit TOX Project website:
> https://tox.chat

I'd not heard of this (why should I?). Is it regarded as a Skype
competitor (we could do with a free one)? Is it going anywhere?
And how does it perform technically?

(Bottom posting is preferred on -user if you reply).

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#171428

FromStefan Monnier <monnier@IRO.UMontreal.CA>
Date2016-08-25 20:20 +0200
Message-ID<sa7pT-4uc-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171158
> I think you looking for TOX!
> Visit TOX Project website:
> https://tox.chat

Thanks.  That does look promising (although I don't see any mention of
reliable delivery),


        Stefan


> On Sat, Aug 13, 2016 at 7:19 AM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
> wrote:

>> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
>> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
>> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
>> when I'm back online.  ]
>> 
>> IIUC there is some XMPP features that allow such reliable delivery, but
>> it seems that it's not widely supported by clients.  What Debian
>> clients, using which protocols, can provide reliable instant messaging?
>> 
>> 
>> Stefan
>> 
>> 
>> PS: Bonus points if that feature is also available on an Android
>> application that's Free Software.
>> 
>> 

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#171548

From"Amir H. Firouzian" <firouziyan@gmail.com>
Date2016-08-30 11:50 +0200
Message-ID<sbNQ5-32D-19@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171428

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

You can't have all the best together.
This mention in previous E-Mails as well. E.g: <20160817192400.GB9964@alum>

On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 6:00 PM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
wrote:

> > I think you looking for TOX!
> > Visit TOX Project website:
> > https://tox.chat
>
> Thanks.  That does look promising (although I don't see any mention of
> reliable delivery),
>
>
>         Stefan
>
>
> > On Sat, Aug 13, 2016 at 7:19 AM, Stefan Monnier <
> monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
> > wrote:
>
> >> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
> >> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
> >> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
> >> when I'm back online.  ]
> >>
> >> IIUC there is some XMPP features that allow such reliable delivery, but
> >> it seems that it's not widely supported by clients.  What Debian
> >> clients, using which protocols, can provide reliable instant messaging?
> >>
> >>
> >> Stefan
> >>
> >>
> >> PS: Bonus points if that feature is also available on an Android
> >> application that's Free Software.
> >>
> >>
>

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#171550

FromStefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
Date2016-08-30 15:30 +0200
Message-ID<sbRh0-5rv-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171548
> You can't have all the best together.

What does that mean, exactly?  Are you saying it doesn't have reliable
message delivery?  If so, that'd be a deal breaker for me.


        Stefan "shocked that anyone would want to design or use an
                unreliable messaging system"


> This mention in previous E-Mails as well. E.g: <20160817192400.GB9964@alum>

> On Thu, Aug 25, 2016 at 6:00 PM, Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
> wrote:

>> > I think you looking for TOX!
>> > Visit TOX Project website:
>> > https://tox.chat
>> 
>> Thanks.  That does look promising (although I don't see any mention of
>> reliable delivery),
>> 
>> 
>> Stefan
>> 
>> 
>> > On Sat, Aug 13, 2016 at 7:19 AM, Stefan Monnier <
>> monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> >> I'm looking for a decentralized instant message system (e.g. XMPP, SIP,
>> >> ...) where I can be sure that I receive all messages, even if I'm not
>> >> connected when the message is sent [ Obviously, I'll only receive them
>> >> when I'm back online.  ]
>> >>
>> >> IIUC there is some XMPP features that allow such reliable delivery, but
>> >> it seems that it's not widely supported by clients.  What Debian
>> >> clients, using which protocols, can provide reliable instant messaging?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Stefan
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> PS: Bonus points if that feature is also available on an Android
>> >> application that's Free Software.
>> >>
>> >>
>> 

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#171551

FromLisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com>
Date2016-08-30 16:00 +0200
Message-ID<sbRK1-5BB-13@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171550
On Tuesday 30 August 2016 14:05:36 Stefan Monnier wrote:
> "shocked that anyone would want to design or use an
>                 unreliable messaging system"

Email is getting less and less reliable, so have you given up using it?? :-(

Lisi

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#171552

FromHenning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com>
Date2016-08-30 16:10 +0200
Message-ID<sbRTI-5Ua-33@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171551
On Tue, Aug 30, 2016 at 02:52:14PM +0100, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> On Tuesday 30 August 2016 14:05:36 Stefan Monnier wrote:
> > "shocked that anyone would want to design or use an
> >                 unreliable messaging system"
> 
> Email is getting less and less reliable, so have you given up using it?? :-(
> 
> Lisi
> 

However, why email is still reliable, because a proper setup provides you
with a well defined error messages (in case it is not delivered).

The fact that a lot of mail ends up in places where they are never looked
at is a social issue not a technical one.

-H

-- 
Henning Follmann           | hfollmann@itcfollmann.com

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#171553

FromLisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com>
Date2016-08-30 16:10 +0200
Message-ID<sbRTI-5Ua-39@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171552
On Tuesday 30 August 2016 14:59:42 Henning Follmann wrote:
> However, why email is still reliable, because a proper setup provides you
> with a well defined error messages (in case it is not delivered).

We have different definitions of reliable!!  Being told a day or two later 
that your email didn't get there because .. is very little consolation, if 
you actually wanted it to get there, and that is only if the receiving SMTP 
server returns the email with an error message, and doesn't just drop it.

Lisi

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#171570

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2016-08-30 20:30 +0200
Message-ID<sbVXj-8sN-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171553
On Tue 30 Aug 2016 at 15:09:28 +0100, Lisi Reisz wrote:

> On Tuesday 30 August 2016 14:59:42 Henning Follmann wrote:
> > However, why email is still reliable, because a proper setup provides you
> > with a well defined error messages (in case it is not delivered).
> 
> We have different definitions of reliable!!  Being told a day or two later 
> that your email didn't get there because .. is very little consolation, if 
> you actually wanted it to get there, and that is only if the receiving SMTP 
> server returns the email with an error message, and doesn't just drop it.

You could send mail directly if you set up a mail server.

However, if you are bothered about the receiving SMTP server accepting
and dropping the message it wouldn't matter because you wouldn't get
any feedback. But you wouldn't get feedback using your ISP's smarthost.

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#171555

FromGene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net>
Date2016-08-30 17:00 +0200
Message-ID<sbSG5-6ew-29@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171552
On Tuesday 30 August 2016 09:59:42 Henning Follmann wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 30, 2016 at 02:52:14PM +0100, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> > On Tuesday 30 August 2016 14:05:36 Stefan Monnier wrote:
> > > "shocked that anyone would want to design or use an
> > >                 unreliable messaging system"
> >
> > Email is getting less and less reliable, so have you given up using
> > it?? :-(
> >
> > Lisi
>
> However, why email is still reliable, because a proper setup provides
> you with a well defined error messages (in case it is not delivered).
>
> The fact that a lot of mail ends up in places where they are never
> looked at is a social issue not a technical one.
>
> -H

True, Henning, but forced on us by the sheer volume of spam we need to 
protect ourselves from. But when some idiot sends me a 100% html 
message, with 3 or more url's buried in the html, with a Dear Friend 
greeting, he should NOT be amazed that it gets a 5+ rating from 
spamassassin, and sorted accordingly.

The offender of course is not subbed to any of these mailing lists, so 
he/she gets zero feedback and are too far away to hear my muttering 
about it, but I do business thru ebay with him, once in 10 years.

ebay themselves very carefully fine tunes their crap, always hitting 
exactly 5.0 from spamassassin. But you put up with that from ebay 
because they are the worlds defacto dept. store and have been for years 
despite Jeff B's best efforts at amazon.

Amazon costs too much, and has yet to meet the promised delivery date 
since I'm at least 150 miles from west bumf--- here in north central WV, 
USA.  Thats my choice, here I am often the big frog in this tiny puddle 
of a county seat village.  I have to admit I enjoy that. But it often 
means that my connection to the educated world looks a lot like a cat5 
cable. :)

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#171557

FromDan Purgert <dan@djph.net>
Date2016-08-30 17:50 +0200
Message-ID<sbTsu-6JN-33@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#171555
Gene Heskett wrote:
> ebay themselves very carefully fine tunes their crap, always hitting 
> exactly 5.0 from spamassassin. But you put up with that from ebay 
> because they are the worlds defacto dept. store and have been for years 
> despite Jeff B's best efforts at amazon.

5.0 gets sent to /dev/null here ... along with anything else above 4.4,
and that's only after they make it through the maze of greylist rules to
even get to spamassassin :)


-- 
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| 

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