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Groups > linux.debian.user > #162199 > unrolled thread

Putting It All On a Stick

Started bySteve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com>
First post2015-12-29 22:30 +0100
Last post2015-12-30 18:00 +0100
Articles 20 on this page of 68 — 12 participants

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Contents

  Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-29 22:30 +0100
    Re: Putting It All On a Stick "Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@galactic.demon.co.uk> - 2015-12-29 22:40 +0100
      Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 03:00 +0100
        Re: Putting It All On a Stick Rick Thomas <rbthomas@pobox.com> - 2015-12-30 05:40 +0100
          Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 15:00 +0100
        Re: Putting It All On a Stick <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2015-12-30 10:50 +0100
          Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 15:10 +0100
            Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-30 16:30 +0100
              Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-30 16:40 +0100
                Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 16:50 +0100
                  Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-30 19:50 +0100
              Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 16:40 +0100
                Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 18:30 +0100
                  Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 19:00 +0100
                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 19:20 +0100
                      Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 19:30 +0100
                        Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 20:00 +0100
                          Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 20:40 +0100
                            Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 20:50 +0100
                              Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-30 21:00 +0100
                            Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-30 20:50 +0100
                              Re: Putting It All On a Stick Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2015-12-30 21:40 +0100
                                Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-31 00:10 +0100
                                  Re: Putting It All On a Stick Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2015-12-31 10:30 +0100
                                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-31 11:30 +0100
                                      Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-31 16:30 +0100
                                        Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-31 17:10 +0100
                                          Re: Putting It All On a Stick Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-01-01 16:40 +0100
                            Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 21:30 +0100
                              Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-30 22:20 +0100
                                Re: Putting It All On a Stick "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2015-12-30 22:40 +0100
                                  Re: Putting It All On a Stick Rick Thomas <rbthomas@pobox.com> - 2015-12-31 02:20 +0100
                                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2015-12-31 10:20 +0100
                                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-31 16:50 +0100
                                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2016-01-01 15:20 +0100
                                  Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-31 16:30 +0100
                                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2015-12-31 16:50 +0100
                                      Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-31 17:10 +0100
                                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2015-12-31 17:30 +0100
                                      Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-31 18:00 +0100
                                        Re: Putting It All On a Stick "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2015-12-31 18:20 +0100
                                          Re: Putting It All On a Stick Eduard Bloch <edi@gmx.de> - 2015-12-31 19:20 +0100
                                            Re: Putting It All On a Stick John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2015-12-31 19:30 +0100
                                            Re: Putting It All On a Stick "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2016-01-01 11:40 +0100
                                        Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-31 18:30 +0100
                                        Re: Putting It All On a Stick <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2015-12-31 19:00 +0100
                                          Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-31 20:20 +0100
                                  Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-31 16:40 +0100
                                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-31 17:20 +0100
                                      Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-31 17:50 +0100
                                        Re: Putting It All On a Stick Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> - 2015-12-31 18:00 +0100
                                          Re: Putting It All On a Stick Rick Thomas <rbthomas@pobox.com> - 2016-01-02 22:00 +0100
                                      Re: Putting It All On a Stick "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2015-12-31 18:00 +0100
                                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-31 17:20 +0100
                  Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-30 20:40 +0100
                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 21:00 +0100
                      Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-31 00:10 +0100
                        Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-31 00:20 +0100
                          Re: Putting It All On a Stick Chris Bannister <cbannister@slingshot.co.nz> - 2016-01-01 16:20 +0100
                            Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-01-01 17:20 +0100
                              Re: Putting It All On a Stick Chris Bannister <cbannister@slingshot.co.nz> - 2016-01-06 15:00 +0100
                                Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2016-01-06 16:50 +0100
                                  Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2016-01-06 20:30 +0100
                    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Rick Thomas <rbthomas@pobox.com> - 2015-12-30 21:00 +0100
                      Re: Putting It All On a Stick Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2015-12-30 22:00 +0100
                Re: Putting It All On a Stick Lisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com> - 2015-12-30 19:50 +0100
            Re: Putting It All On a Stick <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2015-12-30 16:50 +0100
    Re: Putting It All On a Stick Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2015-12-30 18:00 +0100

Page 3 of 4 — ← Prev page 1 2 [3] 4  Next page →


#162391

From"Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net>
Date2015-12-31 18:20 +0100
Message-ID<qLP3l-7gO-19@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162384
Hi,

Steve Matzura wrote:
> The one thing I forgot is cp and dd are not the same.

I was surprised that cp onto block devices really works as
needed for this purpose.
You could also do
  cat debian-8.2.0-amd64-BD-1.iso >/dev/sdc

But for old unixers no other tool than dd comes to the mind.


> Now, does this mean I should run the ISO I made with Jigdo through
> isohybrid now that I have a running Linux system?

No. All is readily prepared by the debian-cd project.
Just copy the ISO plainly onto whole-disk device.

(If you can't get a large USB stick, try with DVD-1 or netinst CD.
 The boot sector and partition table stuff is the same.)


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#162400

FromEduard Bloch <edi@gmx.de>
Date2015-12-31 19:20 +0100
Message-ID<qLPZo-7SO-15@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162391
Hallo,
* Thomas Schmidt [Thu, Dec 31 2015, 06:11:39PM]:
> Hi,
> 
> Steve Matzura wrote:
> > The one thing I forgot is cp and dd are not the same.
> 
> I was surprised that cp onto block devices really works as
> needed for this purpose.
> You could also do
>   cat debian-8.2.0-amd64-BD-1.iso >/dev/sdc
> 
> But for old unixers no other tool than dd comes to the mind.

It's like duck typing: if it has syscalls like cp and uses them like cp
then it must be cp... at least something like that.

In the end, dd gives you more control (buffer sizes, IO synchronization
behavior for data/metadata) and it can print the status with SIGUSR1.

But for regular "push data around from FD to FD" job the only crucial
difference I remember is the nasty behavior of dd when a short read
occurres - aborting instead of retrying as cp does. Not sure whether
they changed the default mode to blocking mode nowadays.


Regards,
Eduard.

-- 
<towo> Du solltest wissen: Du bist hier im Internet. Da wird jede Deiner
	Aussagen so verdreht, dass man Dich in Grund und Boden flamen kann.

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#162402

FromJohn Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com>
Date2015-12-31 19:30 +0100
Message-ID<qLQ93-7VV-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162400
Eduard Bloch writes:
> I remember is the nasty behavior of dd when a short read occurres -
> aborting instead of retrying as cp does. Not sure whether they changed
> the default mode to blocking mode nowadays.

Use ddrescue.
-- 
John Hasler 
jhasler@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA

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#162420

From"Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net>
Date2016-01-01 11:40 +0100
Message-ID<qM5hM-1eu-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162400
Hi,

Eduard Bloch wrote:
> But for regular "push data around from FD to FD" job the only crucial
> difference I remember is the nasty behavior of dd when a short read
> occurres - aborting instead of retrying as cp does.

I saw it padding up short blocks and going on when i was
still on SuSE 10. This happened when reading from pipes with
slowly trickling data output.

Jessie's dd seems to be quite ok, though

  $ for i in 0 1 2 3 4 ; do echo bla ; sleep 1 ; done >fifo

and

  $ dd if=fifo bs=1024 >/tmp/dd_output
  0+5 records in
  0+5 records out
  20 bytes (20 B) copied, 5.00444 s, 0.0 kB/s

yields exactly 20 bytes in /tmp/dd_output. Not 5 KiB or 4 bytes.

(It seems not to block but rather read on after each of
 the 4-byte lines arrived. 5 reads. 20 bytes.)


The power of dd shows with commands like 

  dd if=/dev/zero conv=notrunc bs=1 seek=446 count=1 \
     of=debian-8.2.0-amd64-BD-1.iso

which zeros the "bootable/active" flag of MBR partition 1.


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#162393

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2015-12-31 18:30 +0100
Message-ID<qLPd0-7k7-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162384
On Thu 31 Dec 2015 at 11:55:08 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:

> Fascinating stuff. The one thing I forgot is cp and dd are not the
> same.

cp reads and writes file. dd reads and writes file. Why are they
basically not the same for the task of putting an isohybrid on a
USB stick?

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#162397

From<tomas@tuxteam.de>
Date2015-12-31 19:00 +0100
Message-ID<qLPG1-7w4-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162384
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 11:55:08AM -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
> Fascinating stuff. The one thing I forgot is cp and dd are not the
> same.

Well... if you cp the image to the _device file_ it amounts practically
to dd (but in dd you can set the block size and block count; I once
experimented with block size dd'ing to an USB stick and seem to remember
that there was a (speed-wise) "sweet spot" around 16K, but don't ask
me whether this was inherent in the USB stick or depended on whatever
other system parameters and planet alignments out there).

Cat is also good. Again, to the device file.

Make sure the "USB stick is not mounted" (in all three cases). Sometimes,
overly helpful systems will mount the thing as soon as you insert it [2].
Unmount it before.

Now when you cp the image file to the "mounted USB stick" [1] the result
will be much different and most probably not the desired one.

[1] Yeah, I know I'm fuzzing it. Precisely that would mean "cp the image
file to a mounted file system which resides in the USB stick (phew)"

[2] As long as there is a recognizable file system on it (see [1]).
Otherwise the helpful system might react somewhat confused.

Regards
- -- tomás
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PuMAnRFJrma+law/vRJfy5Rv3a++0P7p
=W/DA
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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#162406

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2015-12-31 20:20 +0100
Message-ID<qLQVr-8sN-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162397
On Thu 31 Dec 2015 at 18:19:26 +0100, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:

> On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 11:55:08AM -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
> > Fascinating stuff. The one thing I forgot is cp and dd are not the
> > same.
> 
> Well... if you cp the image to the _device file_ it amounts practically
> to dd (but in dd you can set the block size and block count; I once

cp and dd to and from a raw device file are identical. dd may be more
flexible with its parameters but as you say

> experimented with block size dd'ing to an USB stick and seem to remember
> that there was a (speed-wise) "sweet spot" around 16K, but don't ask
> me whether this was inherent in the USB stick or depended on whatever
> other system parameters and planet alignments out there).

its advantage is nebulous. Also, how significant are the advantages in
speed with an isohybrid image? A second or two perhaps on every 500M.

There is nothing wrong with using dd but its versatility doesn't get
employed for the simple job that cp and cat do equally as well.

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#162358

FromSteve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com>
Date2015-12-31 16:40 +0100
Message-ID<qLNux-6c7-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162316
For those who want to try this, the size of the Iso I got from the
Jigdo build far exceeds a 16GB stick. It's reported as 20.9GB. I
suppose I'll have to use one of my prized 32GB USB3 thumbdrives for
this test.

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#162370

FromSteve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com>
Date2015-12-31 17:20 +0100
Message-ID<qLO7f-6GS-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162358
How would I know for sure if it's ISO hybrid, and how would it fit on
a standard 16GB drive? Guess it wouldn't, unless there was a great
deal of extra space appended at the time the thing was created which
could be truncated/removed. Actually, I strongly suspect that's true
because  the temp file that was created as soon as the process started
was expanded to 20.9GB and never changed, so it's probably full of a
lot of 0's toward the end.

On Thu, 31 Dec 2015 16:12:44 +0000, you wrote:

>On Thu 31 Dec 2015 at 10:37:22 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
>
>Thanks for that; I was thinking of doing it. 21GB seems closer to 4 to
>55555 DVDs than 3.
>
>The image is should be an isohybrid one. Put it on a thumbdrive with
>cat, cp or dd. For example:
>
>cat ISO > /dev/sdX
>
>X is a, b, c etc. Obtain X from the output of dmesg.
>
>The USB device will be bootable.
>
>> For those who want to try this, the size of the Iso I got from the
>> Jigdo build far exceeds a 16GB stick. It's reported as 20.9GB. I
>> suppose I'll have to use one of my prized 32GB USB3 thumbdrives for
>> this test.
>> 
>

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#162381

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2015-12-31 17:50 +0100
Message-ID<qLOAh-6R3-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162370
On Thu 31 Dec 2015 at 11:17:59 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:

'fdisk -l /dev/sdX' will show a partition table (as described by Thomas
Schmitt). A 21GB image will not fit on a 16GM USB stick.


> How would I know for sure if it's ISO hybrid, and how would it fit on
> a standard 16GB drive? Guess it wouldn't, unless there was a great
> deal of extra space appended at the time the thing was created which
> could be truncated/removed. Actually, I strongly suspect that's true
> because  the temp file that was created as soon as the process started
> was expanded to 20.9GB and never changed, so it's probably full of a
> lot of 0's toward the end.
> 
> On Thu, 31 Dec 2015 16:12:44 +0000, you wrote:
> 
> >On Thu 31 Dec 2015 at 10:37:22 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
> >
> >Thanks for that; I was thinking of doing it. 21GB seems closer to 4 to
> >55555 DVDs than 3.
> >
> >The image is should be an isohybrid one. Put it on a thumbdrive with
> >cat, cp or dd. For example:
> >
> >cat ISO > /dev/sdX
> >
> >X is a, b, c etc. Obtain X from the output of dmesg.
> >
> >The USB device will be bootable.
> >
> >> For those who want to try this, the size of the Iso I got from the
> >> Jigdo build far exceeds a 16GB stick. It's reported as 20.9GB. I
> >> suppose I'll have to use one of my prized 32GB USB3 thumbdrives for
> >> this test.
> >> 
> >
> 

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#162385

FromSteve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com>
Date2015-12-31 18:00 +0100
Message-ID<qLOJY-6Ul-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162381
On Thu, 31 Dec 2015 16:47:43 +0000, Brian wrote:

>'fdisk -l /dev/sdX' will show a partition table (as described by Thomas
>Schmitt). A 21GB image will not fit on a 16GM USB stick.

Yes, the ISO is good. fdisk shows everything's fine. I'll have to try
this with one of my 32's just to see it work. If it does, I'll be
quite chuffed.

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#162503

FromRick Thomas <rbthomas@pobox.com>
Date2016-01-02 22:00 +0100
Message-ID<qMBrk-4rN-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162385
Looking at http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/weekly-builds/amd64/jigdo-dlbd/ it seems that the full set of software available from Debian for amd64 fits on two dual-layer Bluray disks.  According to Wikipedia a dlbd disk holds 50GB, so you may need a couple of 64GB Flash drives before you’re done.

Have fun!
Rick


On Dec 31, 2015, at 8:57 AM, Steve Matzura <sm@noisynotes.com> wrote:

> On Thu, 31 Dec 2015 16:47:43 +0000, Brian wrote:
> 
>> 'fdisk -l /dev/sdX' will show a partition table (as described by Thomas
>> Schmitt). A 21GB image will not fit on a 16GM USB stick.
> 
> Yes, the ISO is good. fdisk shows everything's fine. I'll have to try
> this with one of my 32's just to see it work. If it does, I'll be
> quite chuffed.
> 
> 

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#162386

From"Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net>
Date2015-12-31 18:00 +0100
Message-ID<qLOJZ-6Ul-23@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162370
Hi,

Steve Matzura wrote:
> How would I know for sure if it's ISO hybrid, 

A strong indication is the presence of partitions when inquired
by program fdisk.

  $ /sbin/fdisk -l debian-8.2.0-amd64-BD-1.iso
  ...
  debian-8.2.0-amd64-BD-1.iso1 *        0 43859651 ...
  ...

You may let xorriso report

  $ xorriso -indev debian-8.2.0-amd64-BD-1.iso -toc 2>&1 | \
    grep '^Boot record  :'

Depending on the version you will get

  Boot record  : El Torito , ISOLINUX boot image capable of isohybrid
or
  Boot record  : El Torito , ISOLINUX isohybrid MBR pointing to boot image
or
  Boot record  : El Torito , MBR isohybrid cyl-align-off GPT APM

The first message (from xorriso-1.2.2) indicates isohybrid only if
fdisk reports about partitions in the ISO.
The younger versions 1.3.2 (Debian stable) and 1.4.2 (Sid) can
tell without help by others.

xorriso-1.4.2 can list the whole boot equipment

  $ xorriso -indev debian-8.2.0-amd64-BD-1.iso \
    -report_system_area plain -report_el_torito plain

which will report
  ...
  Boot record  : El Torito , MBR isohybrid cyl-align-off GPT APM
  Media summary: 1 session, 10964913 data blocks, 20.9g data,  750g free
  Volume id    : 'Debian 8.2.0 amd64 1'
  System area options: 0x00000202
  System area summary: MBR isohybrid cyl-align-off GPT APM
  ISO image size/512 : 43859652
  Partition offset   : 0
  MBR heads per cyl  : 0
  MBR secs per head  : 0
  MBR partition table:   N Status  Type        Start       Blocks
  MBR partition      :   1   0x80  0x00            0     43859652
  MBR partition      :   2   0x00  0xef        75632          832
  MBR partition path :   2  /boot/grub/efi.img
  GPT                :   N  Info
  GPT disk GUID      :      e68c59d8e9e83949b42975afc9d12f0f
  GPT entry array    :      12  208  overlapping
  GPT lba range      :      64  43859598  43859651
  GPT partition name :   1  490053004f00480079006200720069006400
  GPT partname local :   1  ISOHybrid
  GPT partition GUID :   1  e68c59d8e9e83949b42b75afc9d12f0f
  GPT type GUID      :   1  a2a0d0ebe5b9334487c068b6b72699c7
  GPT partition flags:   1  0x1000000000000001
  GPT start and size :   1  0  43859596
  GPT partition name :   2  490053004f004800790062007200690064003100
  GPT partname local :   2  ISOHybrid1
  GPT partition GUID :   2  e68c59d8e9e83949b42a75afc9d12f0f
  GPT type GUID      :   2  a2a0d0ebe5b9334487c068b6b72699c7
  GPT partition flags:   2  0x1000000000000001
  GPT start and size :   2  75632  832
  GPT partition path :   2  /boot/grub/efi.img
  APM                :   N  Info
  APM block size     :      2048
  APM gap fillers    :      0
  APM partition name :   1  EFI
  APM partition type :   1  Apple_HFS
  APM start and size :   1  18908  208
  APM partition path :   1  /boot/grub/efi.img
  El Torito catalog  : 18907  1
  El Torito cat path : /isolinux/boot.cat
  El Torito images   :   N  Pltf  B   Emul  Ld_seg  Hdpt  Ldsiz         LBA
  El Torito boot img :   1  BIOS  y   none  0x0000  0x00      4       19116
  El Torito boot img :   2  UEFI  y   none  0x0000  0x00    832       18908
  El Torito img path :   1  /isolinux/isolinux.bin
  El Torito img opts :   1  boot-info-table isohybrid-suitable
  El Torito img path :   2  /boot/grub/efi.img


> and how would it fit on a standard 16GB drive?

It would not. If you cut of the tail you will get i/o errors when
files shall be read which are stored in the cut-off part.
The files are not sorted by importance or popularity in the ISO.


> I strongly suspect that's true
> because  the temp file that was created as soon as the process started
> was expanded to 20.9GB and never changed, so it's probably full of a
> lot of 0's toward the end.

No. It is packed full with compressed .deb files (and a few others).

In the beginning of Jigdo download the 20+ GB mainly consists of holes,
indeed. But the dowloading of .deb files fills each of the holes.

Jigdo = Jigsaw puzzle Download
The .template file is like the wooden frame for a kindergarten jigsaw toy.
The .deb files (and some others) are the wooden blocks which fit into
the holes.
The .jigdo file substitutes for the toddler's brain.
  http://lcdn.jigsawpuzzleshoppe.com/media/easyslide/wooden-jigsaw-puzzles.png


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#162372

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2015-12-31 17:20 +0100
Message-ID<qLO7f-6GS-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162358
On Thu 31 Dec 2015 at 10:37:22 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:

Thanks for that; I was thinking of doing it. 21GB seems closer to 4 to
55555 DVDs than 3.

The image is should be an isohybrid one. Put it on a thumbdrive with
cat, cp or dd. For example:

cat ISO > /dev/sdX

X is a, b, c etc. Obtain X from the output of dmesg.

The USB device will be bootable.

> For those who want to try this, the size of the Iso I got from the
> Jigdo build far exceeds a 16GB stick. It's reported as 20.9GB. I
> suppose I'll have to use one of my prized 32GB USB3 thumbdrives for
> this test.
> 

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#162288

FromLisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com>
Date2015-12-30 20:40 +0100
Message-ID<qLuLg-2lq-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162268
On Wednesday 30 December 2015 17:29:30 Brian wrote:
> On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 10:37:53 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
> > Can the net install run with speech? I didn't think it could.
>
> "Install with speech systhesis" is the last item in the installer menu.
>
> The only major difference between DVD-1 and the netinst ISO is the first
> gets packages from the DVD (if there is no mirror) whereas the second
> will get some of them from the net (a mirror is needed). I cannot see
> why using a netinst ISO is any better than DVD-1.

_Because_ the DVD1 gets its packages from the DVDs, so during installation 
they have to be there, or you have to interrupt the installation, edit the 
sources list, and continue choosing your software to complete the 
installation.  And the net-install CD gets its packages from the Internet and 
sets up your sources list to do the same, so you can complete your 
installation in one fell sweep.  Yes, you need an Internet connection so it 
is not suitable for all cases, but  an Internet connection does not appear to 
be the problem here.

Lisi

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#162297

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2015-12-30 21:00 +0100
Message-ID<qLv4B-2sX-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162288
On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 19:39:10 +0000, Lisi Reisz wrote:

> On Wednesday 30 December 2015 17:29:30 Brian wrote:
> > On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 10:37:53 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
> > > Can the net install run with speech? I didn't think it could.
> >
> > "Install with speech systhesis" is the last item in the installer menu.
> >
> > The only major difference between DVD-1 and the netinst ISO is the first
> > gets packages from the DVD (if there is no mirror) whereas the second
> > will get some of them from the net (a mirror is needed). I cannot see
> > why using a netinst ISO is any better than DVD-1.
> 
> _Because_ the DVD1 gets its packages from the DVDs, so during installation 
> they have to be there, or you have to interrupt the installation, edit the

Why shouldn't the packages be on on the DVD?
 
> sources list, and continue choosing your software to complete the 
> installation.  And the net-install CD gets its packages from the Internet and 
> sets up your sources list to do the same, so you can complete your 
> installation in one fell sweep.  Yes, you need an Internet connection so it 
> is not suitable for all cases, but  an Internet connection does not appear to 

I don't understand a word of this.

The installers on a netinst ISO and DVD-1 are basically identical.

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#162320

FromLisi Reisz <lisi.reisz@gmail.com>
Date2015-12-31 00:10 +0100
Message-ID<qLy2u-4yN-23@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162297
On Wednesday 30 December 2015 19:54:50 Brian wrote:
> On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 19:39:10 +0000, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> > On Wednesday 30 December 2015 17:29:30 Brian wrote:
> > > On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 10:37:53 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
> > > > Can the net install run with speech? I didn't think it could.
> > >
> > > "Install with speech systhesis" is the last item in the installer menu.
> > >
> > > The only major difference between DVD-1 and the netinst ISO is the
> > > first gets packages from the DVD (if there is no mirror) whereas the
> > > second will get some of them from the net (a mirror is needed). I
> > > cannot see why using a netinst ISO is any better than DVD-1.
> >
> > _Because_ the DVD1 gets its packages from the DVDs, so during
> > installation they have to be there, or you have to interrupt the
> > installation, edit the
>
> Why shouldn't the packages be on on the DVD?

If all available packages are on DVD1, why do the other DVDs exist?
>
> > sources list, and continue choosing your software to complete the
> > installation.  And the net-install CD gets its packages from the Internet
> > and sets up your sources list to do the same, so you can complete your
> > installation in one fell sweep.  Yes, you need an Internet connection so
> > it is not suitable for all cases, but  an Internet connection does not
> > appear to
>
> I don't understand a word of this.
>
> The installers on a netinst ISO and DVD-1 are basically identical.

The sources are different.

Lisi

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#162321

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2015-12-31 00:20 +0100
Message-ID<qLyc9-4C6-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162320
On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 23:01:43 +0000, Lisi Reisz wrote:

> On Wednesday 30 December 2015 19:54:50 Brian wrote:
> > On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 19:39:10 +0000, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> > > On Wednesday 30 December 2015 17:29:30 Brian wrote:
> > > > On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 10:37:53 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
> > > > > Can the net install run with speech? I didn't think it could.
> > > >
> > > > "Install with speech systhesis" is the last item in the installer menu.
> > > >
> > > > The only major difference between DVD-1 and the netinst ISO is the
> > > > first gets packages from the DVD (if there is no mirror) whereas the
> > > > second will get some of them from the net (a mirror is needed). I
> > > > cannot see why using a netinst ISO is any better than DVD-1.
> > >
> > > _Because_ the DVD1 gets its packages from the DVDs, so during
> > > installation they have to be there, or you have to interrupt the
> > > installation, edit the
> >
> > Why shouldn't the packages be on on the DVD?
> 
> If all available packages are on DVD1,

Nobody claimed they were.

>                                        why do the other DVDs exist?

It's coming up to to 2016; non-sequiturs are banned in that year,

> > > sources list, and continue choosing your software to complete the
> > > installation.  And the net-install CD gets its packages from the Internet
> > > and sets up your sources list to do the same, so you can complete your
> > > installation in one fell sweep.  Yes, you need an Internet connection so
> > > it is not suitable for all cases, but  an Internet connection does not
> > > appear to
> >
> > I don't understand a word of this.
> >
> > The installers on a netinst ISO and DVD-1 are basically identical.
> 
> The sources are different.

More nonsense.

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#162427

FromChris Bannister <cbannister@slingshot.co.nz>
Date2016-01-01 16:20 +0100
Message-ID<qM9EJ-45m-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162321
On Wed, Dec 30, 2015 at 11:15:03PM +0000, Brian wrote:
> On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 23:01:43 +0000, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> 
> > On Wednesday 30 December 2015 19:54:50 Brian wrote:
> > > On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 19:39:10 +0000, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> > > > On Wednesday 30 December 2015 17:29:30 Brian wrote:
> > > > > On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 10:37:53 -0500, Steve Matzura wrote:
> > > > > > Can the net install run with speech? I didn't think it could.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Install with speech systhesis" is the last item in the installer menu.
> > > > >
> > > > > The only major difference between DVD-1 and the netinst ISO is the
> > > > > first gets packages from the DVD (if there is no mirror) whereas the
> > > > > second will get some of them from the net (a mirror is needed). I
> > > > > cannot see why using a netinst ISO is any better than DVD-1.
> > > >
> > > > _Because_ the DVD1 gets its packages from the DVDs, so during
> > > > installation they have to be there, or you have to interrupt the
> > > > installation, edit the
> > >
> > > Why shouldn't the packages be on on the DVD?
> > 
> > If all available packages are on DVD1,
> 
> Nobody claimed they were.

Yeah, you did -- 'Why shouldn't the packages be on on the DVD?'

> >                                        why do the other DVDs exist?
> 
> It's coming up to to 2016; non-sequiturs are banned in that year,
> 
> > > > sources list, and continue choosing your software to complete the
> > > > installation.  And the net-install CD gets its packages from the Internet
> > > > and sets up your sources list to do the same, so you can complete your
> > > > installation in one fell sweep.  Yes, you need an Internet connection so
> > > > it is not suitable for all cases, but  an Internet connection does not
> > > > appear to
> > >
> > > I don't understand a word of this.
> > >
> > > The installers on a netinst ISO and DVD-1 are basically identical.
> > 
> > The sources are different.
> 
> More nonsense.

Huh? the sources list is different if you use DVD's than if you use a
debian mirror off the net. Even I, understood that much.

-- 
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people
who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the 
oppressing." --- Malcolm X

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#162432

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2016-01-01 17:20 +0100
Message-ID<qMaAO-4I2-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#162427
On Sat 02 Jan 2016 at 04:11:38 +1300, Chris Bannister wrote:

> On Wed, Dec 30, 2015 at 11:15:03PM +0000, Brian wrote:
> > On Wed 30 Dec 2015 at 23:01:43 +0000, Lisi Reisz wrote:
> > 
> > > The sources are different.
> > 
> > More nonsense.
> 
> Huh? the sources list is different if you use DVD's than if you use a
> debian mirror off the net. Even I, understood that much.

My claim is that the installers on a netinst ISO and DVD-1 are basically
identical (they do the same job), not that a netinst ISO and DVD-1 are
identical. That is because they are based on the same source.

Explaining what this "sources list" is might clarify things.

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