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Groups > linux.debian.user > #275542 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2024-12-12 01:10 +0100 |
| Last post | 2024-12-12 14:10 +0100 |
| Articles | 11 — 8 participants |
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Re: Firefox alternatives? Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> - 2024-12-12 01:10 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> - 2024-12-12 01:40 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> - 2024-12-12 01:50 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? eben@gmx.us - 2024-12-12 02:00 +0100
1401, was Re: Firefox alternatives? "James H. H. Lampert" <jamesl@touchtonecorp.com> - 2024-12-12 02:40 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? Bret Busby <bret@busby.net> - 2024-12-12 09:20 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? jeremy ardley <jeremy.ardley@gmail.com> - 2024-12-12 10:00 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? "Roy J. Tellason, Sr." <roy@rtellason.com> - 2024-12-12 19:50 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? "Jeremy Nicoll" <jn.ml.dbi.73@letterboxes.org> - 2024-12-12 13:10 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? Bret Busby <bret@busby.net> - 2024-12-12 13:20 +0100
Re: Firefox alternatives? "Jeremy Nicoll" <jn.ml.dbi.73@letterboxes.org> - 2024-12-12 14:10 +0100
| From | Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 01:10 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: Firefox alternatives? |
| Message-ID | <JSEWd-ge9j-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
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I don't like to be that guy that says, "Works for me", but I don't notice problems with Firefox here. In fact, it's rock solid and I'm on 12.8 with all updates running GNOME. I have seen Chromium become quite sluggish when certain Web pages are loaded but this hasn't affected Firefox. I probably have over 200 tabs open in two windows and it runs for perhaps weeks at a time usually until another FF update or some other update that requires logging out or a restart comes along. I do have 16GB of RAMi and 16 GB of swap on an SSD. I routinely have multiple terminal windows open and multiple Libre Office Calc windows, and other apps running. This Core i5 just cruises along with its dual displays with all that going on. Have you tried clearing the browser cache? In times past that used to help a lot but even these days it's not something I do often. - Nate -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true." Web: https://www.n0nb.us Projects: https://github.com/N0NB GPG fingerprint: 82D6 4F6B 0E67 CD41 F689 BBA6 FB2C 5130 D55A 8819
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| From | Andy Smith <andy@strugglers.net> |
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| Date | 2024-12-12 01:40 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSFpg-geiC-5@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275542 |
Hi, On Wed, Dec 11, 2024 at 06:07:49PM -0600, Nate Bargmann wrote: > I don't like to be that guy that says, "Works for me", but I don't > notice problems with Firefox here. […] > I do have 16GB of RAM You have four times the RAM of the OP. 4G is incredibly marginal spec for a desktop 2024. You could try temporarily setting your kernel command line to have mem=4g and experience life that way for a couple of hours. My guess is it runs like a dog for you too. Thanks, Andy -- https://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting
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| From | Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 01:50 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSFyV-gelQ-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275544 |
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* On 2024 11 Dec 18:32 -0600, Andy Smith wrote: > Hi, > > On Wed, Dec 11, 2024 at 06:07:49PM -0600, Nate Bargmann wrote: > > I don't like to be that guy that says, "Works for me", but I don't > > notice problems with Firefox here. > > […] > > > I do have 16GB of RAM > > You have four times the RAM of the OP. 4G is incredibly marginal spec > for a desktop 2024. > > You could try temporarily setting your kernel command line to have > mem=4g and experience life that way for a couple of hours. My guess is > it runs like a dog for you too. I didn't read his RAM amount until later in the thread. I do have a Lenovo T410, Core i5 based, laptop that isn't new by any stretch with 8GB of RAM and equivalent swap on an SSD. I routinely have both Firefox and Chromium running on it along with GNU Cash and a terminal session. Sometimes another app or two and it perks right along. In fact, it has been so reliable for me that I replaced the original screen in it last week as it had been getting lines on it for some time. From reading the rest of the thread, IMO, the OP hasn't been running an ad blocker which is just simply a necessity these days. I suspect that even running uBlock Origin that the situation will improve. Another step that may help is running a lighter DE such as Xfce. - Nate -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true." Web: https://www.n0nb.us Projects: https://github.com/N0NB GPG fingerprint: 82D6 4F6B 0E67 CD41 F689 BBA6 FB2C 5130 D55A 8819
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| From | eben@gmx.us |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 02:00 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSFIB-geoV-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275545 |
On 12/11/24 19:42, Nate Bargmann wrote: > From reading the rest of the thread, IMO, the OP hasn't been running an > ad blocker which is just simply a necessity these days. I suspect that > even running uBlock Origin that the situation will improve. Another > step that may help is running a lighter DE such as Xfce. I also run Noscript, which occasionally requires a bit of fiddling to enable the minimal amount of JS to make the site functional. I also run Ghostery, but I don't think that's as useful.
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| From | "James H. H. Lampert" <jamesl@touchtonecorp.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 02:40 +0100 |
| Subject | 1401, was Re: Firefox alternatives? |
| Message-ID | <JSGlj-geQL-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275545 |
On 12/11/24 5:20 PM, Van Snyder wrote: > On Wed, 2024-12-11 at 18:42 -0600, Nate Bargmann wrote: >>> You have four times the RAM of the OP. 4G is incredibly marginal >> spec >>> for a desktop 2024. > > The first computer I was paid to write software for, in 1966, had 1,400 > 6-bit characters, not bytes, not kB, not MB, not GB. That's why IBM > called it the 1401. And the Computer History Museum in Mountain View, California has a restored 1401 that they power up twice a week for demonstrations. As well as a restored DEC PDP-1. Not PDP-11. Not PDP-10. PDP-1. Until I saw it demonstrated, I wasn't even aware that DEC had ever used magnetic core memory. That one is only powered up for demonstrations twice a month. -- James H. H. Lampert
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| From | Bret Busby <bret@busby.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 09:20 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSMAp-gkT8-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275545 |
On 12/12/24 09:20, Van Snyder wrote: > On Wed, 2024-12-11 at 18:42 -0600, Nate Bargmann wrote: >> > You have four times the RAM of the OP. 4G is incredibly marginal spec >> > for a desktop 2024. > > The first computer I was paid to write software for, in 1966, had 1,400 > 6-bit characters, not bytes, Wasn't that data type named EBCDIC, or something like that? I remember being taught about that, about 40 years ago, when we were taught about the character codes, including the ASCII character code, and IBM creating the first internet architecture, that I think was named SNA. DEC developed an internet architecture, that I think was named DNA, as opposed to DECnet, which was a DEC network architecture for creating DEC computers, like PDP-11's and VAX-11's, with each node, and the network server, running a DEC operating system. That was when an internet meant a computer network that connected computers using different physical architectures and brands of different operating systems; so, whilst VAX-11's running VAX-VMS could connect to PDP-11's running DEC operating systems, on a DECnet network, to connect DEC computers running DEC operating systems (such as RS-X or RSTS-e (operating systems that ran on PDP-11's), to connect them to an IBM mini or mainframe computer, required an internet (and, so, also, would connecting a VAX-11 running VAX-VMS, to a VAX-11 running BSD 4.2, I presume). But, whilst, as a user, I accessed a VAX-11 running VAX VMS, via DECnet, from a PDP-11 terminal on a PDP-11/44 running RSTS-e, as the FORTRAN-77 ran on the VAX (with the VAX-VMS providing the filename extension of version numbers), I was not aware of an internet at that time, connecting a VAX running BSD 4.2, to DEC computers running DEC operating systems, such as a VAX-11 running VAX-VMS. not kB, not MB, not GB. That's why IBM > called it the 1401. It was the first mass-produced computer. IBM sold > more than 28,000 of them. It was about the size of a four-drawer file > cabinet. The clock speed was 83 kHz (not MHz, not GHz). Later in the > year it was upgraded to 16K. That added a box about the size of two > side-by-side two-drawer file cabinets. I have a 63-phase FORTRAN II > compiler for it that runs in 8K. When they added a Tape controller, it > was another four-drawer file cabinet. Each drive was the size of a > fridge. The card reader and the printer were about the size of a spinet > piano. But we did all the company's accounting on it, and accounting for > about 1,000 customers nationwide on three others like it. The Computer > History Museum in Mountain View, CA, has two of them that work. It's > cool that they moved into an old SGI building at 1401 Shoreline Blvd. > > The last program I wrote before I retired was only about 300,000 lines, > but it kept a cluster with 384 cores and 24 GB per core busy for 15 > hours per day, on average, doing satellite instrument data analysis. > Processing some days' data took 37 hours. Needless to say, if my code > had had memory leaks, it wouldn't have run that long. My employer had > much nicer computers than mine. The little "supercomputer" fit in one 9U > rack panel, but I wouldn't be able to afford water cooling or the > electricity bill at home. In my earlier (but not the earliest) days of being taught computer science, another student showed me, on the balcony of his flat, in a block of flats, his PDP-11 that he had acquired, that he programmed in octal, for fun. I think that was in the 1980's. The first computer game that I played, was Star Trek, in 1978, on an IBM 1130 computer, at a university. I think the stack of cards, that had to be fed into the computer, to run the game, was a couple of feet high, and, the Klingon spaceships were the upper case 'X' characters that appeared on the screen. At that stage, the main enemies of the crew of the Enterprise, were the Klingons, and, they were not always "on the Starboard bow"". The game was single user, and, the computer (IBM 1130) was a single tasking computer. > > When they COVID-exiled me, they wouldn't let me have the nice 8-core i7 > with 32 GB that had been under my desk; they expected me to get by with > my home antique. I retired eighteen months later. > .. Bret Busby Armadale West Australia (UTC+0800) ..............
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| From | jeremy ardley <jeremy.ardley@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 10:00 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSNd7-glN4-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275561 |
On 12/12/24 16:18, Bret Busby wrote: >> >> The first computer I was paid to write software for, in 1966, had >> 1,400 6-bit characters, not bytes, > > Wasn't that data type named EBCDIC, or something like that? That would be 6 bit BCD - a precursor to EBCDIC which was an IBM 8 bit encoding most commonly implemented using 80 column punch cards An alternative format for 80 column punch card format was Burroughs BCDIC 5 bit Baudot was also common in the early years.
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| From | "Roy J. Tellason, Sr." <roy@rtellason.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 19:50 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSWq5-gsn1-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275561 |
On Thursday 12 December 2024 03:18:49 am Bret Busby wrote: > > The first computer I was paid to write software for, in 1966, had 1,400 > > 6-bit characters, not bytes, > > Wasn't that data type named EBCDIC, or something like that? No, that was an 8-bit code... -- Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and ablest -- form of life in this section of space, a critter that can be killed but can't be tamed. --Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters" - Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James M Dakin
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| From | "Jeremy Nicoll" <jn.ml.dbi.73@letterboxes.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 13:10 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSQb0-gowZ-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275545 |
On Thu, 12 Dec 2024, at 01:20, Van Snyder wrote: > On Wed, 2024-12-11 at 18:42 -0600, Nate Bargmann wrote: >> > You have four times the RAM of the OP. 4G is incredibly marginal >> spec >> > for a desktop 2024. > > The first computer I was paid to write software for, in 1966, had 1,400 > 6-bit characters... Yes, performance has moved on a lot... Does your version of Firefox have the task manager feature - here, (using FF 115.18.0esr on Windows) that's offered via the application hamburger menu (at extreme rhs of toolbar in my FF) - More tools - Task Manager ... and it runs in one tab a monitor tool showing memory & cpu consumption of each of the tabs that FF is processing. You might be able to judge better which of your tabs are the hogs, if you can run that. -- Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.
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| From | Bret Busby <bret@busby.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 13:20 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSQkF-goAZ-9@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275570 |
On 12/12/24 20:00, Jeremy Nicoll wrote: <snip> > > Does your version of Firefox have the task manager feature - here, (using > FF 115.18.0esr on Windows) that's offered via the application hamburger > menu (at extreme rhs of toolbar in my FF) - More tools - Task Manager > ... and it runs in one tab a monitor tool showing memory & cpu > consumption of each of the tabs that FF is processing. You might be able > to judge better which of your tabs are the hogs, if you can run that. > Thank you for that. I have not previously been aware of that. I am running a version of 133.0 (64-bit), and, the Task Manager is available via the hamburger, as you said More Tools -> Task manager. So, I can now, better monitor what Firefox is doing. May I have your permission to post your above paragraph to the Ubuntu users mailing list, where I had posted a query asking about Librewolf? Thank you in anticipation (that does not mean that I will repost, without your permission). .. Bret Busby Armadale West Australia (UTC+0800) ..............
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| From | "Jeremy Nicoll" <jn.ml.dbi.73@letterboxes.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2024-12-12 14:10 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <JSR73-gpeL-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #275571 |
On Thu, 12 Dec 2024, at 12:18, Bret Busby wrote: > On 12/12/24 20:00, Jeremy Nicoll wrote: >> Does your version of Firefox have the task manager feature... > > Thank you for that. I have not previously been aware of that. Each time Firefox updates itself (when I allow it to, that is) I use: Help - About Firefox - What's New to read what's changed. With the ESR version of course that's just security updates, but when I was still using a supported OS version [of WIndows], it was useful to see the details. The task manager option might have been described first in the subsidiary "Developer" what's new notes pages ... but the link was on the ordinary What's New page. The developer facilities are useful too for trying to work out why some pages behave so badly. -- Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.
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