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No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel?

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  No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel? Scott Denlinger <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 16:10 +0100
    Re: No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel? Scott Denlinger <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 16:10 +0100
      Re: No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel? Gilles Mocellin <gilles.mocellin@nuagelibre.org> - 2023-11-13 21:00 +0100
        Re: No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel? Scott Denlinger <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 12:50 +0100
        Re: No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel? Tixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk> - 2023-11-14 13:10 +0100
          Re: No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel? Scott Denlinger <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 16:20 +0100
            Re: No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel? Gilles Mocellin <gilles.mocellin@nuagelibre.org> - 2023-11-14 23:20 +0100

#263420 — No 6.5.10-4 realtime kernel?

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Does anyone know why there are no stock realtime kernels in trixie/sid? I
currently have 'linux-image-6.5.0-1-rt-amd64-unsigned' installed, but I
don't see any newer RT kernels available.

Scott Denlinger

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#263422

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Sorry, in Debian world I'm looking for 'linux-image-6.5.0-4-rt-[. . .]' but
it would be 6.5.10.

Scott Denlinger

On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 10:04 AM Scott Denlinger <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Does anyone know why there are no stock realtime kernels in trixie/sid? I
> currently have 'linux-image-6.5.0-1-rt-amd64-unsigned' installed, but I
> don't see any newer RT kernels available.
>
> Scott Denlinger
>

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#263503

Le dimanche 12 novembre 2023, 16:08:06 CET Scott Denlinger a écrit :
> Sorry, in Debian world I'm looking for 'linux-image-6.5.0-4-rt-[. . .]' but
> it would be 6.5.10.
> 
> Scott Denlinger
> 
> On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 10:04 AM Scott Denlinger
> <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Does anyone know why there are no stock realtime kernels in trixie/sid? I
> > currently have 'linux-image-6.5.0-1-rt-amd64-unsigned' installed, but I
> > don't see any newer RT kernels available.
> > 
> > Scott Denlinger

Hello, I also was looking for it, but I've seen that the standard kernel seems 
to have some preemptive patch (dynamic ?) :

So I think the kernel packagers think it's sufficient ?

❯ uname -a 
Linux guitare 6.5.0-4-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT_DYNAMIC Debian 6.5.10-1 
(2023-11-03) x86_64 GNU/Linux

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#263523

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Thank you, Gilles. I'll install it and see if it works for me. I'm curious
what the rtcqs script will tell me about it after I install it.

Scott Denlinger

On Mon, Nov 13, 2023, 9:31 PM Gilles Mocellin <
gilles.mocellin@nuagelibre.org> wrote:

> Le dimanche 12 novembre 2023, 16:08:06 CET Scott Denlinger a écrit :
> > Sorry, in Debian world I'm looking for 'linux-image-6.5.0-4-rt-[. . .]'
> but
> > it would be 6.5.10.
> >
> > Scott Denlinger
> >
> > On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 10:04 AM Scott Denlinger
> > <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > Does anyone know why there are no stock realtime kernels in
> trixie/sid? I
> > > currently have 'linux-image-6.5.0-1-rt-amd64-unsigned' installed, but I
> > > don't see any newer RT kernels available.
> > >
> > > Scott Denlinger
>
> Hello, I also was looking for it, but I've seen that the standard kernel
> seems
> to have some preemptive patch (dynamic ?) :
>
> So I think the kernel packagers think it's sufficient ?
>
> ❯ uname -a
> Linux guitare 6.5.0-4-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT_DYNAMIC Debian 6.5.10-1
> (2023-11-03) x86_64 GNU/Linux
>
>
>
>
>

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#263525

On Mon, 2023-11-13 at 20:45 +0100, Gilles Mocellin wrote:
> > On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 10:04 AM Scott Denlinger
> > <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > Does anyone know why there are no stock realtime kernels in trixie/sid? I
> > > currently have 'linux-image-6.5.0-1-rt-amd64-unsigned' installed, but I
> > > don't see any newer RT kernels available.
> > > 
> > > Scott Denlinger
> 
> Hello, I also was looking for it, but I've seen that the standard kernel seems 
> to have some preemptive patch (dynamic ?) :
> 
> So I think the kernel packagers think it's sufficient ?

Quoting a recent article from LWN [1]

   PREEMPT_DYNAMIC, was added to the 5.12 kernel by Michal Hocko in
   2021. It allows the preemption choice to be deferred until boot
   time, where any of the modes except PREEMPT_RT can be selected by
   the preempt= command-line parameter. PREEMPT_DYNAMIC allows
   distributors to ship a single kernel while letting users pick the
   preemption mode that works best for their workload. 

So if you specificity need a real-time kernel this won't give it to
you.

[1] https://lwn.net/Articles/944686/

-- 
Tixy

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#263530

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Thanks for the LWN reference. I think I missed that article. I plan to
install the newest kernel in Trixie, then run the rtcqs script (
https://codeberg.org/rtcqs/rtcqs) to see how it looks for audio processing.
Based on that, I may still try to install a fully preemptible kernel from
source.

Scott Denlinger


On Tue, Nov 14, 2023 at 7:00 AM Tixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk> wrote:

> On Mon, 2023-11-13 at 20:45 +0100, Gilles Mocellin wrote:
> > > On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 10:04 AM Scott Denlinger
> > > <scottdenlinger94@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > > Does anyone know why there are no stock realtime kernels in
> trixie/sid? I
> > > > currently have 'linux-image-6.5.0-1-rt-amd64-unsigned' installed,
> but I
> > > > don't see any newer RT kernels available.
> > > >
> > > > Scott Denlinger
> >
> > Hello, I also was looking for it, but I've seen that the standard kernel
> seems
> > to have some preemptive patch (dynamic ?) :
> >
> > So I think the kernel packagers think it's sufficient ?
>
> Quoting a recent article from LWN [1]
>
>    PREEMPT_DYNAMIC, was added to the 5.12 kernel by Michal Hocko in
>    2021. It allows the preemption choice to be deferred until boot
>    time, where any of the modes except PREEMPT_RT can be selected by
>    the preempt= command-line parameter. PREEMPT_DYNAMIC allows
>    distributors to ship a single kernel while letting users pick the
>    preemption mode that works best for their workload.
>
> So if you specificity need a real-time kernel this won't give it to
> you.
>
> [1] https://lwn.net/Articles/944686/
>
> --
> Tixy
>
>

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#263542

Le mardi 14 novembre 2023, 16:15:53 CET Scott Denlinger a écrit :
> Thanks for the LWN reference. I think I missed that article. I plan to
> install the newest kernel in Trixie, then run the rtcqs script (
> https://codeberg.org/rtcqs/rtcqs) to see how it looks for audio processing.
> Based on that, I may still try to install a fully preemptible kernel from
> source.
> 
> Scott Denlinger

On my PC, rtcqs shows me that the kernel is not Tickless (CONFIG_NO_HZ).

Tickless Kernel
===============
[ WARNING ] Tickless timer support is not not set. Try enabling tickless timer 
support (CONFIG_NO_HZ_IDLE, or CONFIG_NO_HZ in older kernels)

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