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Can't use mc's editor

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  Can't use mc's editor gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-03-20 19:00 +0100
    Re: Can't use mc's editor Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2022-03-20 20:30 +0100
      Re: Can't use mc's editor gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-03-20 21:20 +0100
      Re: Can't use mc's editor Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2022-03-21 21:20 +0100
        Re: Can't use mc's editor Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> - 2022-03-22 01:40 +0100
          Re: Can't use mc's editor David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-03-22 03:00 +0100
            Re: Can't use mc's editor Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> - 2022-03-22 10:20 +0100
    Re: Can't use mc's editor Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> - 2022-03-21 18:40 +0100
      Re: Can't use mc's editor Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2022-03-21 19:10 +0100
        Re: Can't use mc's editor gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-03-21 22:30 +0100
          Re: Can't use mc's editor Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2022-03-21 23:10 +0100
            Re: Can't use mc's editor gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-03-22 03:00 +0100
          Re: Can't use mc's editor mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2022-03-21 23:30 +0100
        Re: Can't use mc's editor David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-03-22 03:00 +0100
          Re: Can't use mc's editor Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2022-03-22 03:50 +0100
            Re: Can't use mc's editor David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-03-22 05:10 +0100
              Re: Can't use mc's editor Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2022-03-22 05:30 +0100
                Re: Can't use mc's editor Nate Bargmann <n0nb@n0nb.us> - 2022-03-22 10:20 +0100
                  Re: Can't use mc's editor David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-03-25 03:20 +0100

#246492 — Can't use mc's editor

Greetings all;

The colors used by mc's editor are making the editor impossible to use as 
they can't be used by someone with good color vision even, they are all 
so alike.

Where can I change mc's default editor to something as clear and easy to 
use as geany? Seems to me that used to be a menu choice, but thats not 
findable when the menus except for the click on it character are all 
solid 100% bright blue and cannot be read by human eyes.

Thanks all. 

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

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#246493

On Sun, 20 Mar 2022 13:53:52 -0400
gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:

> Greetings all;
> 
> The colors used by mc's editor are making the editor impossible to use as 
> they can't be used by someone with good color vision even, they are all 
> so alike.
> 
> Where can I change mc's default editor to something as clear and easy to 
> use as geany? Seems to me that used to be a menu choice, but thats not 
> findable when the menus except for the click on it character are all 
> solid 100% bright blue and cannot be read by human eyes.

There are two questions here:

1) How can mc's colors be changed?

Answer: via environment variables or the configuration file
(~/.config/mc/ini) - see the "Colors" section of the mc manpage.

2) How can mc's default editor be changed?

Answer: via mc.ext (copy /etc/mc/mc.ext to ~/.config/mc/mc.ext and edit
the copied version)

Celejar

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#246494

On Sunday, 20 March 2022 15:25:02 EDT Celejar wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Mar 2022 13:53:52 -0400
> 
> gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:
> > Greetings all;
> > 
> > The colors used by mc's editor are making the editor impossible to
> > use as they can't be used by someone with good color vision even,
> > they are all so alike.
> > 
> > Where can I change mc's default editor to something as clear and easy
> > to use as geany? Seems to me that used to be a menu choice, but
> > thats not findable when the menus except for the click on it
> > character are all solid 100% bright blue and cannot be read by human
> > eyes.
> 
> There are two questions here:
> 
> 1) How can mc's colors be changed?
> 
> Answer: via environment variables or the configuration file
> (~/.config/mc/ini) - see the "Colors" section of the mc manpage.
> 
> 2) How can mc's default editor be changed?
> 
> Answer: via mc.ext (copy /etc/mc/mc.ext to ~/.config/mc/mc.ext and edit
> the copied version)
> 
> Celejar
> 
Sounds great, Calejar, I'll give it a try.  Thank you, take care and stay 
well.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

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#246513

On Sun, 20 Mar 2022 15:25:02 -0400
Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 20 Mar 2022 13:53:52 -0400
> gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:
> 
> > Greetings all;
> > 
> > The colors used by mc's editor are making the editor impossible to
> > use as they can't be used by someone with good color vision even,
> > they are all so alike.
> > 
> > Where can I change mc's default editor to something as clear and
> > easy to use as geany? Seems to me that used to be a menu choice,
> > but thats not findable when the menus except for the click on it
> > character are all solid 100% bright blue and cannot be read by
> > human eyes.  
> 
> There are two questions here:
> 
> 1) How can mc's colors be changed?
> 
> Answer: via environment variables or the configuration file
> (~/.config/mc/ini) - see the "Colors" section of the mc manpage.

And a nasty job that is. And you *still* can't change the dark brown of
programming comments to something readable on a dark background.

> 
> 2) How can mc's default editor be changed?
> 
> Answer: via mc.ext (copy /etc/mc/mc.ext to ~/.config/mc/mc.ext and
> edit the copied version)
> 

Also:
"Run MC as usual. On the command line right above the bottom row of menu
selections type select-editor. This should open a menu with a list of
all of your installed editors. This is working for me on all my current
linux machines."
https://askubuntu.com/questions/16776/how-to-switch-the-editor-in-mc-midnight-commander-from-nano-to-mcedit

I think you're fairly limited in choices by default. I have a couple of
other small text-mode editors installed, and mc can't see them.

Probably best try nano unless you're particularly keen on vim. Don't
forget that geany is a GUI IDE, whereas mc is a ncurses application.

-- 
Joe

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#246518

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* On 2022 21 Mar 15:19 -0500, Joe wrote:
> Probably best try nano unless you're particularly keen on vim. Don't
> forget that geany is a GUI IDE, whereas mc is a ncurses application.

Actually, mc and mcedit are linked to libslang, not ncurses.  Visually
it's not much difference but otherwise a world of difference, mostly to
developers.

One thing that really helped me when working with mcedit is to have this
snippet in my ~/.bashrc:

# Modify Midnight Commander editor background color
export MC_COLOR_TABLE="$MC_COLOR_TABLE:\
editnormal=lightgray,black:\
editbold=yellow,black:\
editmarked=black,cyan"

There may be more parameters available and it has been many years since
I found that somewhere on the 'Net and I failed to note the source.

- Nate

-- 
"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
possible worlds.  The pessimist fears this is true."
Web: https://www.n0nb.us
Projects: https://github.com/N0NB
GPG fingerprint: 82D6 4F6B 0E67 CD41 F689 BBA6 FB2C 5130 D55A 8819

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#246520

On Mon 21 Mar 2022 at 19:34:46 (-0500), Nate Bargmann wrote:
> * On 2022 21 Mar 15:19 -0500, Joe wrote:
> > Probably best try nano unless you're particularly keen on vim. Don't
> > forget that geany is a GUI IDE, whereas mc is a ncurses application.
> 
> Actually, mc and mcedit are linked to libslang, not ncurses.  Visually
> it's not much difference but otherwise a world of difference, mostly to
> developers.
> 
> One thing that really helped me when working with mcedit is to have this
> snippet in my ~/.bashrc:
> 
> # Modify Midnight Commander editor background color
> export MC_COLOR_TABLE="$MC_COLOR_TABLE:\
> editnormal=lightgray,black:\
> editbold=yellow,black:\
> editmarked=black,cyan"
> 
> There may be more parameters available and it has been many years since
> I found that somewhere on the 'Net and I failed to note the source.

man mc ?

Cheers,
David.

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#246530

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* On 2022 21 Mar 20:56 -0500, David Wright wrote:
> On Mon 21 Mar 2022 at 19:34:46 (-0500), Nate Bargmann wrote:
> > * On 2022 21 Mar 15:19 -0500, Joe wrote:
> > > Probably best try nano unless you're particularly keen on vim. Don't
> > > forget that geany is a GUI IDE, whereas mc is a ncurses application.
> > 
> > Actually, mc and mcedit are linked to libslang, not ncurses.  Visually
> > it's not much difference but otherwise a world of difference, mostly to
> > developers.
> > 
> > One thing that really helped me when working with mcedit is to have this
> > snippet in my ~/.bashrc:
> > 
> > # Modify Midnight Commander editor background color
> > export MC_COLOR_TABLE="$MC_COLOR_TABLE:\
> > editnormal=lightgray,black:\
> > editbold=yellow,black:\
> > editmarked=black,cyan"
> > 
> > There may be more parameters available and it has been many years since
> > I found that somewhere on the 'Net and I failed to note the source.
> 
> man mc ?

Indeed, there is an entire section called "Colors" and lists the
keywords for the editor as:

Editor colors are: editnormal, editbold, editmarked, editwhitespace, editlinestate

I probably got the color snippet from mcedit(1) and its COLORS section
which looks suspiciously the same and only contains three of the five
keywords.

I'm not completely ignorant of man pages, having authored a few!  ;-)  I
suppose it just slipped my mind when I typed that mail.

- Nate

-- 
"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
possible worlds.  The pessimist fears this is true."
Web: https://www.n0nb.us
Projects: https://github.com/N0NB
GPG fingerprint: 82D6 4F6B 0E67 CD41 F689 BBA6 FB2C 5130 D55A 8819

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#246510

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In the configuration dialog there is the option to use the internal
editor.  Make sure that option is not selected.

On Debian systems you should get prompted for which editor to use by the
select-editor script.  In my case I chose vim.basic.  This avoids
tinkering with mc's config files directly which can only be done if all
instances of mc are closed.

- Nate

-- 
"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
possible worlds.  The pessimist fears this is true."
Web: https://www.n0nb.us
Projects: https://github.com/N0NB
GPG fingerprint: 82D6 4F6B 0E67 CD41 F689 BBA6 FB2C 5130 D55A 8819

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#246511

Nate Bargmann composed on 2022-03-21 12:35 (UTC-0500):

> tinkering with mc's config files directly which can only be done if all
> instances of mc are closed.

Not IME, at least for ini and hotlist, the former which I change nearly as often
with mcedit as I do via menu. Hotlist I only do with mcedit.

Mcedit is giving me no trouble. I use most than once a day most days.
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is, like religion,
	based on faith, not based on science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata

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#246514

On Monday, 21 March 2022 16:46:01 EDT mick crane wrote:
> On 2022-03-21 18:08, Felix Miata wrote:
> > Nate Bargmann composed on 2022-03-21 12:35 (UTC-0500):
> >> tinkering with mc's config files directly which can only be done if
> >> all
> >> instances of mc are closed.
> > 
> > Not IME, at least for ini and hotlist, the former which I change
> > nearly as often
> > with mcedit as I do via menu. Hotlist I only do with mcedit.
> > 
> > Mcedit is giving me no trouble. I use most than once a day most days.
> 
> I don't *think* I changed mc's configuration for editor, maybe changed
> system default somehow.
> 
> mick
> --
> Key ID    4BFEBB31
> 
> .
And whatever I do to it, has zero effect.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

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#246516

gene heskett composed on 2022-03-21 17:26 (UTC-0400):

> whatever I do to it, has zero effect.

IIUC, and assuming standard file/directory permissions, if all instances of MC are
closed, and its ini file is then removed, every setting (except for panels
configuration? and hotlist), gets reverted to default on next startup.

Long long ago, MC user settings were in ~/.mc/. Now they are in ~/.config/mc/. For
old users you still have you might want to eradicate any ~/.mc/ directories. My
~/.config/mc/ is a symlink to ~/.mc/.

My main user's MC ini file was last written 8 years ago.
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is, like religion,
	based on faith, not based on science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata

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#246521

On Monday, 21 March 2022 18:07:28 EDT Felix Miata wrote:
> gene heskett composed on 2022-03-21 17:26 (UTC-0400):
> > whatever I do to it, has zero effect.
> 
> IIUC, and assuming standard file/directory permissions, if all
> instances of MC are closed, and its ini file is then removed, every
> setting (except for panels configuration? and hotlist), gets reverted
> to default on next startup.
> 
> Long long ago, MC user settings were in ~/.mc/. Now they are in
> ~/.config/mc/. For old users you still have you might want to
> eradicate any ~/.mc/ directories. My ~/.config/mc/ is a symlink to
> ~/.mc/.
> 
> My main user's MC ini file was last written 8 years ago.
> --
> Evolution as taught in public schools is, like religion,
> 	based on faith, not based on science.
> 
>  Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!
> 
> Felix Miata
> 
Noted, thanks Felix. But it doesn't change a whit when I set the kde5 
colors to something a little easier on these ancient eyes. I went looking 
for something that if I print a msg from kmail, the whole header was 
white text on an ounce of black toner. Obviously that had to be fixed. :)

Thanks Felix, take care and stay well.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

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#246517

On 2022-03-21 21:26, gene heskett wrote:
> On Monday, 21 March 2022 16:46:01 EDT mick crane wrote:
>> On 2022-03-21 18:08, Felix Miata wrote:
>> > Nate Bargmann composed on 2022-03-21 12:35 (UTC-0500):
>> >> tinkering with mc's config files directly which can only be done if
>> >> all
>> >> instances of mc are closed.
>> >
>> > Not IME, at least for ini and hotlist, the former which I change
>> > nearly as often
>> > with mcedit as I do via menu. Hotlist I only do with mcedit.
>> >
>> > Mcedit is giving me no trouble. I use most than once a day most days.
>> 
>> I don't *think* I changed mc's configuration for editor, maybe changed
>> system default somehow.
>> 
>> mick
>> --
>> Key ID    4BFEBB31
>> 
>> .
> And whatever I do to it, has zero effect.

I know I've changed default editor for affect in mc from vi to nano but 
no idea how, maybe you can change it in ~/.profile

> Cheers, Gene Heskett.

-- 
Key ID    4BFEBB31

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#246522

On Mon 21 Mar 2022 at 14:08:14 (-0400), Felix Miata wrote:
> Nate Bargmann composed on 2022-03-21 12:35 (UTC-0500):
> 
> > tinkering with mc's config files directly which can only be done if all
> > instances of mc are closed.
> 
> Not IME, at least for ini and hotlist, the former which I change nearly as often
> with mcedit as I do via menu. Hotlist I only do with mcedit.

My recollection is that when you close mc, it writes back the current
settings to the ini file, which is why I keep mine readonly.

With multiple instances of mc running, one might get Nate's impression
above, unless any changes intended to be persistent are made in the
instance that's closed last.

> Mcedit is giving me no trouble. I use most than once a day most days.

I find the 4[Edit] key more useful as an extra alternative to 3[View]
and [Return] in choosing the Edit/View/Open scripts to run from mc.ext,
eg a different application, or windowed/fullscreen, or view metadata
rather than the file, etc.

If you want to edit the currently selected file, is there any major
disadvantage in simply typing   edit %p   in mc's command line?
There's one obvious advantage: you can type the name of any editor,
rather than being restricted to the list given by select-editor
(see Joe's post).

Cheers,
David.

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#246523

David Wright composed on 2022-03-21 20:55 (UTC-0500):

> On Mon 21 Mar 2022 at 14:08:14 (-0400), Felix Miata wrote:

>> Nate Bargmann composed on 2022-03-21 12:35 (UTC-0500):

>> > tinkering with mc's config files directly which can only be done if all
>> > instances of mc are closed.

>> Not IME, at least for ini and hotlist, the former which I change nearly as often
>> with mcedit as I do via menu. Hotlist I only do with mcedit.

> My recollection is that when you close mc, it writes back the current
> settings to the ini file, which is why I keep mine readonly.
Felix Miata composed on 2022-03-21 18:07 (UTC-0400):

> My main user's MC ini file was last written 8 years ago.

And, it's not immutable. On a second PC I have running Bookworm ATM, the last
write date on its MC ini is 9 days short of 5 years ago.
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is, like religion,
	based on faith, not based on science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata

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#246525

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On Mon 21 Mar 2022 at 22:43:50 (-0400), Felix Miata wrote:
> David Wright composed on 2022-03-21 20:55 (UTC-0500):
> > On Mon 21 Mar 2022 at 14:08:14 (-0400), Felix Miata wrote:
> >> Nate Bargmann composed on 2022-03-21 12:35 (UTC-0500):
> 
> >> > tinkering with mc's config files directly which can only be done if all
> >> > instances of mc are closed.
> 
> >> Not IME, at least for ini and hotlist, the former which I change nearly as often
> >> with mcedit as I do via menu. Hotlist I only do with mcedit.
> 
> > My recollection is that when you close mc, it writes back the current
> > settings to the ini file, which is why I keep mine readonly.
> Felix Miata composed on 2022-03-21 18:07 (UTC-0400):
> 
> > My main user's MC ini file was last written 8 years ago.
> 
> And, it's not immutable. On a second PC I have running Bookworm ATM, the last
> write date on its MC ini is 9 days short of 5 years ago.

But you also wrote:

> IIUC, and assuming standard file/directory permissions, if all instances of MC are
> closed, and its ini file is then removed, every setting (except for panels
> configuration? and hotlist), gets reverted to default on next startup.

I've attached the result of that reversion (from buster). The critical
line is, of course, line 4. I assume that, like me, a long time ago,
you altered it to auto_save_setup=false.

The default lines safe_delete=false and safe_overwrite=false are so
dangerous that I don't rely just on line 4, but make ini readonly too.

I keep my panels configuration readonly too (actually a symlink to a
default-panels.ini or a single panelled my-panels.ini) to prevent
accidents, though auto_save_setup_panels=false is the default anyway.

Cheers,
David.

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#246526

David Wright composed on 2022-03-21 23:07 (UTC-0500):

> Felix Miata wrote:

>> IIUC, and assuming standard file/directory permissions, if all instances of MC are
>> closed, and its ini file is then removed, every setting (except for panels
>> configuration? and hotlist), gets reverted to default on next startup.

> I've attached the result of that reversion (from buster). The critical
> line is, of course, line 4. I assume that, like me, a long time ago,
> you altered it to auto_save_setup=false.
	
Actually the first thing I do with any new instance of MC is set the right panel
listing to long. I follow that with F9, Options, Configuration, where Auto save
setup gets deselected, among other changes. :)
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools is, like religion,
	based on faith, not based on science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata

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#246531

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* On 2022 21 Mar 23:30 -0500, Felix Miata wrote:
> David Wright composed on 2022-03-21 23:07 (UTC-0500):
> 
> > Felix Miata wrote:
> 
> >> IIUC, and assuming standard file/directory permissions, if all instances of MC are
> >> closed, and its ini file is then removed, every setting (except for panels
> >> configuration? and hotlist), gets reverted to default on next startup.
> 
> > I've attached the result of that reversion (from buster). The critical
> > line is, of course, line 4. I assume that, like me, a long time ago,
> > you altered it to auto_save_setup=false.
> 	
> Actually the first thing I do with any new instance of MC is set the right panel
> listing to long. I follow that with F9, Options, Configuration, where Auto save
> setup gets deselected, among other changes. :)

And I have Autosave selected in all my installations of mc so IME, the
last one to close writes the file.  It's not unusual for me to have half
a dozen instances of mc running at once!  Sometimes I find I had two or
three running in the same terminal session.  Oh dear...

- Nate

-- 
"The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all
possible worlds.  The pessimist fears this is true."
Web: https://www.n0nb.us
Projects: https://github.com/N0NB
GPG fingerprint: 82D6 4F6B 0E67 CD41 F689 BBA6 FB2C 5130 D55A 8819

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#246611

On Tue 22 Mar 2022 at 04:17:37 (-0500), Nate Bargmann wrote:
> * On 2022 21 Mar 23:30 -0500, Felix Miata wrote:
> > David Wright composed on 2022-03-21 23:07 (UTC-0500):
> > > Felix Miata wrote:
> > 
> > >> IIUC, and assuming standard file/directory permissions, if all instances of MC are
> > >> closed, and its ini file is then removed, every setting (except for panels
> > >> configuration? and hotlist), gets reverted to default on next startup.
> > 
> > > I've attached the result of that reversion (from buster). The critical
> > > line is, of course, line 4. I assume that, like me, a long time ago,
> > > you altered it to auto_save_setup=false.
> > 	
> > Actually the first thing I do with any new instance of MC is set the right panel
> > listing to long. I follow that with F9, Options, Configuration, where Auto save
> > setup gets deselected, among other changes. :)
> 
> And I have Autosave selected in all my installations of mc so IME, the
> last one to close writes the file.  It's not unusual for me to have half
> a dozen instances of mc running at once!  Sometimes I find I had two or
> three running in the same terminal session.  Oh dear...

Somewhat like myself, then, except that I feel no need for regret.
AIUI, mc was developed in a world where we worked in one console
session on one machine, and there are a number of features to support
this style of working.

I've never made use of mcedit, history, hotlist, etc, nor do I save
their configuration state (or use -P) when closing. Instead of using
such "bookmark" concepts, I just leave the "book" open on the "desk"
while I turn to or open another one.

So typically I will have several mc instances on the local machine,
± instances over ssh on other machines, and occasional instances
with a different machine in the left panel. They're colour-coded
by host, with another colour reserved for mixed machine sessions.
As I see it, it's a natural consequence of working across 20
virtual desktops.

Sanity is preserved by having every mc session start in /one/ fixed
configuration state, in one of three layouts:

Invocation         Left Panel           Right Panel

$ mc [dir]     ‖   ${1:-$PWD}       |     $HOME      ‖
or
$ mc1 [dir]    ‖             ${1:-$HOME}             ‖
or
$ mc-foo       ‖   sh://foo/$HOME   |     $HOME      ‖

Cheers,
David.

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