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Groups > linux.debian.user > #244291 > unrolled thread

hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot

Started bygene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net>
First post2022-01-22 00:50 +0100
Last post2022-01-22 10:20 +0100
Articles 18 on this page of 78 — 16 participants

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  hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 00:50 +0100
    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot "Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@einval.com> - 2022-01-22 00:50 +0100
      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 01:30 +0100
        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2022-01-22 01:50 +0100
          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 03:40 +0100
            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 04:10 +0100
            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2022-01-22 04:50 +0100
              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 06:00 +0100
                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2022-01-22 08:10 +0100
                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 10:40 +0100
                    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2022-01-22 11:20 +0100
                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 13:20 +0100
                        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2022-01-23 09:10 +0100
                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-22 18:20 +0100
                        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 20:00 +0100
                          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2022-01-22 22:30 +0100
                            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-23 00:40 +0100
                              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2022-01-23 01:10 +0100
                                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-23 03:10 +0100
                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-23 03:30 +0100
                                    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2022-01-23 03:40 +0100
                          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-23 03:10 +0100
                            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2022-01-23 09:00 +0100
                              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2022-01-23 14:50 +0100
                                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2022-01-23 19:30 +0100
                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-23 20:00 +0100
                                    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-23 20:10 +0100
                                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2022-01-23 21:00 +0100
                                        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-24 00:50 +0100
                                          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2022-01-24 01:20 +0100
                                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2022-01-23 21:10 +0100
                                        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2022-01-23 21:20 +0100
                                          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-24 01:00 +0100
                                        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-24 17:40 +0100
                                          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-25 01:00 +0100
                                            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2022-01-25 09:40 +0100
                                              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-25 12:20 +0100
                                                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2022-01-25 13:10 +0100
                                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-25 17:30 +0100
                                                    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-25 18:00 +0100
                                              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-26 01:40 +0100
                                                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-26 03:30 +0100
                                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2022-01-26 05:20 +0100
                                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-26 05:40 +0100
                                                    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-26 11:20 +0100
                                                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-26 17:50 +0100
                                                        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2022-01-26 18:00 +0100
                                                          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2022-01-26 19:00 +0100
                                                            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-27 06:10 +0100
                                                          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-26 23:40 +0100
                                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2022-01-26 19:20 +0100
                                                    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2022-01-26 20:00 +0100
                                                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-26 16:40 +0100
                                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-26 16:50 +0100
                                                    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-26 16:50 +0100
                                                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-26 23:40 +0100
                                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-26 17:10 +0100
                                                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-26 17:50 +0100
                                                    Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-26 20:30 +0100
                                                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2022-01-26 20:50 +0100
                                                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Tixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk> - 2022-01-27 09:30 +0100
                                                        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2022-01-27 12:40 +0100
                                                        Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2022-01-27 15:10 +0100
                                      Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-23 22:50 +0100
                              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-23 17:00 +0100
                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2022-01-22 09:20 +0100
                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Lee <ler762@gmail.com> - 2022-01-23 03:00 +0100
                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-23 03:20 +0100
              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2022-01-22 08:00 +0100
            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-22 18:20 +0100
          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2022-01-22 07:50 +0100
            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2022-01-22 15:40 +0100
              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2022-01-22 17:10 +0100
              Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2022-01-22 23:30 +0100
                Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot "Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@einval.com> - 2022-01-23 00:00 +0100
                  Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot deloptes <emanoil.kotsev@deloptes.org> - 2022-01-23 09:00 +0100
          Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2022-01-22 10:10 +0100
            Re: hostname is being reset, killing net on reboot <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2022-01-22 10:20 +0100

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#244661

FromTixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk>
Date2022-01-27 09:30 +0100
Message-ID<DK8kh-5kZ-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244639
On Wed, 2022-01-26 at 19:26 +0000, Brian wrote:
> On Wed 26 Jan 2022 at 10:42:38 -0600, David Wright wrote:
> 
> [Snipping]
> 
> > I've worked this way for 15 years and, unlike Gene, I'm not having
> > to fight any battles over it. I'm sure mDNS is perfect for people
> > with different demands from mine.
> 
> My question was really directed at all users, particularly those who
> do not appreciate the existance or basic function of Avahi.

My experience of it was many years ago when first trying out Linux
seriously and I spotted it amongst the list of services that were
running. After googling the name and realising what it was I hurriedly
uninstalled it, because at that time the zero-conf stuff seemed to be
cropping up regularly in the IT news in a bad way, with malware
exploiting weaknesses in Window and routers implementation of it. I
also have a general aversion to computers tying to doing magic things
behind my back.

I can't see what the problem with DHCP is, if I want to have static IP
addresses or use names to identify machines on the network, I can take
a minute to add a line to dnsmasq.conf on my router. I know some people
say that DHCP is a single point of failure, or they don't want to run
extra hardware 24/7, but I would think most of us already have a router
providing internet access that can do DHCP. And if that fails, have a
spare (even if it's just an old device) that can be pressed into
immediate use. I for one consider internet access sufficiently
important to make fixing it a priority.

-- 
Tixy

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#244675

FromDan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org>
Date2022-01-27 12:40 +0100
Message-ID<DKbi9-7gI-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244661
Tixy wrote: 
> 
> I can't see what the problem with DHCP is, if I want to have static IP
> addresses or use names to identify machines on the network, I can take
> a minute to add a line to dnsmasq.conf on my router. I know some people
> say that DHCP is a single point of failure, or they don't want to run
> extra hardware 24/7, but I would think most of us already have a router
> providing internet access that can do DHCP. And if that fails, have a
> spare (even if it's just an old device) that can be pressed into
> immediate use. I for one consider internet access sufficiently
> important to make fixing it a priority.

I use ISC dhcpd on two machines at home: my firewall and my
server. The failover system took about twenty minutes of reading
to figure out.

Then the firewall has unbound and the server has bind; unbound
does caching and general name resolution, and looks at bind for
my local names.

This is more complicated than it needs to be but I wanted to
experiment.

-dsr-

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#244680

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2022-01-27 15:10 +0100
Message-ID<DKdDj-tb-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244661
On Thu 27 Jan 2022 at 08:21:49 +0000, Tixy wrote:

> On Wed, 2022-01-26 at 19:26 +0000, Brian wrote:
> > On Wed 26 Jan 2022 at 10:42:38 -0600, David Wright wrote:
> > 
> > [Snipping]
> > 
> > > I've worked this way for 15 years and, unlike Gene, I'm not having
> > > to fight any battles over it. I'm sure mDNS is perfect for people
> > > with different demands from mine.
> > 
> > My question was really directed at all users, particularly those who
> > do not appreciate the existance or basic function of Avahi.
> 
> My experience of it was many years ago when first trying out Linux
> seriously and I spotted it amongst the list of services that were
> running. After googling the name and realising what it was I hurriedly
> uninstalled it, because at that time the zero-conf stuff seemed to be
> cropping up regularly in the IT news in a bad way, with malware
> exploiting weaknesses in Window and routers implementation of it. I
> also have a general aversion to computers tying to doing magic things
> behind my back.

Three items to take into account:

 * Your machine will (AFAIK) only publish services you explicitly
   allow. For example, pulseaudio requires the installation of a
   specific module and cupsd rquires printer sharing to be explicitly
   enabled.

 * The services offered by other machines on the network need not be
   accessed.

 * It is assumed your machine is on a network that is regarded as
   trusted. Otherwise, why are you there?

-- 
Brian.

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#244455

Fromgene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net>
Date2022-01-23 22:50 +0100
Message-ID<DISUh-53U-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244437
On Sunday, January 23, 2022 2:09:27 PM EST Brian wrote:
> On Sun 23 Jan 2022 at 13:53:01 -0500, gene heskett wrote:
> > On Sunday, January 23, 2022 1:26:56 PM EST Felix Miata wrote:
> > > Greg Wooledge composed on 2022-01-23 08:42 (UTC-0500):
> > > > On Sun, Jan 23, 2022 at 08:50:56AM +0100, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> > > >> As far as I can tell (with my limited understanding of DNS) it
> > > >> only
> > > >> makes it easier to share /etc/hosts with no obvious downside.
> > > > 
> > > > If that actually works, that's great news for Gene.  It means he
> > > > can
> > > > duplicate a single /etc/hosts file across all systems without
> > > > needing
> > > > to bolt on a unique per-system header afterward.
> > > 
> > > I've been sharing the very same hosts file among all my PCs for
> > > well
> > > over a decade, probably closer to two.
> > 
> > And I have been for 2 decades and change as it once had an amiga as
> > one of its clients.
> 
> What advice would you give to a user regarding the benefits of a hosts
> file as opposed to more modern techniques?

Because every distro has their own way of arriving at a _usually_ works 
dhcp setup, the fixed rules for using a hosts file usually results in 
less need for esoteric knowledge of how a given distro does it, and a far 
more consistently working local net.  We've probably in excess of 60 
machines by now at the tv station I retired from in 2002, and a common 
hosts file similar to my own setup still works fine. The main diff is 
that we bought a block of 16 addresses from a registrar in about 1995, 
and only those machines are network allowed outside of the buildings 
network. Most are sales machines running winderz, so we have had our 
share of viri.  The heart of the system is linux, mostly centos, 
including the inhouse built videoservers, two of which can record 4 hidef 
channels each, while playing 4 other programs to air at the same time.

They Just Work, unlike commercial winderz stuff that BSODs every 3 hours.

dhcp is nice, when it works, but to me it needless complexity and yet 
anther point of failure.  For big systems, its ok, but for under 100 
machines, tain't needed. At about 50 machines, a full time tech is 
needed, if only to clean up the viri in the sales machines.  Gotta keep 
the cash cow fresh you know. ;o)

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#244426

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2022-01-23 17:00 +0100
Message-ID<DINrz-1L2-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244392
On Sun 23 Jan 2022 at 08:50:56 (+0100), Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> On Sb, 22 ian 22, 20:07:45, David Wright wrote:
> > 
> > Because the basic /etc/hosts file looks something like:
> > 
> >   127.0.0.1	localhost
> >   192.168.1.1	router.corp	router
> >   192.168.1.2	cascade.corp	cascade
> >   127.0.1.1	acer.corp	acer	# 192.168.1.10
> >   # The following lines are desirable for IPv6 capable hosts
> >   ::1     localhost ip6-localhost ip6-loopback
> >   ff02::1 ip6-allnodes
> >   ff02::2 ip6-allrouters
> > 
> > and the hostname, acer, will be different on each host.
> 
> Instead of listing the machine's name with 127.0.1.1 I'm using it's 
> actual IP (like the one you have in the comment). 
> 
> Any potential issues I should be aware of?

Yes, and ISTR its being discussed on d-u perhaps 20 years ago.
It means that software can get the hostname resolved to an IP
address a) before DNS is running, and b) before any interfaces
are configured, or when they fail to get configured at all.
Otherwise, you get a response to ping, say, like:
  ping: connect: Network is unreachable
instead of a response from the loopback address.

> As far as I can tell (with my limited understanding of DNS) it only 
> makes it easier to share /etc/hosts with no obvious downside.

The idea of the script is to make sharing it as trivial as using
scp directly. And if you use sneakernet to transfer the master
file and the script, the latter should still work, because Debian
sets up 127.0.1.1 at installation time.

Cheers,
David.

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#244308

FromAndrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com>
Date2022-01-22 09:20 +0100
Message-ID<DIjMR-Sd-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244299

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Vi, 21 ian 22, 23:51:20, gene heskett wrote:
> On Friday, January 21, 2022 10:46:35 PM EST Greg Wooledge wrote:

[lots of good stuff]

> This is all well and good, Greg, but it still does NOT give a clue what 
> todo when the system picks a fictitious route out of its rear.

In order to even try guessing you must tell us how did you ever 
configure the network on this machine.

Non-exhaustive list of possibilities:

    1. It was done automatically during installation
    2. It was configured manually by you during installation

    (if any of these please specify if you installed a Desktop 
    Environment at the same time)

    3. You edited some file after installation

    (please provide the full contents of it, preferably as attachment)

    4. You installed and configured some software (which one?)
    
    etc.


In any case, please provide:

A. The full contents of /etc/network/interfaces) and any file under 
/etc/network/interfaces.d/ (preferably attached)

B. The full outputs of 'networkctl' and 'nmcli'.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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#244379

FromLee <ler762@gmail.com>
Date2022-01-23 03:00 +0100
Message-ID<DIAkF-2cQ-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244299
Hi Gene,

On 1/21/22, gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:
>
> This is all well and good, Greg, but it still does NOT give a clue what
> todo when the system picks a fictitious route out of its rear.

Once you realize that that your machine getting a 169.254.x.x address
   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Link-local_address
almost certainly means that DHCP has failed, you have a pretty good
idea of where to start -  Why did my machine ask for a DHCP address?
Why didn't it get one?

As for avahi, my notes have
  disable multicast DNS (avahi-daemon)
  $ sudo systemctl disable avahi-daemon
but I have a DHCP and DNS server at home, so I'd rather have the
zero-conf stuff turned off.

Best Regards,
Lee

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#244385

Fromgene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net>
Date2022-01-23 03:20 +0100
Message-ID<DIAE1-2ys-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244379
On Saturday, January 22, 2022 8:52:24 PM EST Lee wrote:
> Hi Gene,
> 
> On 1/21/22, gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> wrote:
> > This is all well and good, Greg, but it still does NOT give a clue
> > what todo when the system picks a fictitious route out of its rear.
> Once you realize that that your machine getting a 169.254.x.x address
>    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Link-local_address
> almost certainly means that DHCP has failed, you have a pretty good
> idea of where to start -  Why did my machine ask for a DHCP address?
> Why didn't it get one?
> 
Because there is not a running server on my local net, its all in the 
hosts file, and changing the hostname torpedo's the hosts file lookups.

zero-conf stuff to me has never been anything but a headache.

> As for avahi, my notes have
>   disable multicast DNS (avahi-daemon)
>   $ sudo systemctl disable avahi-daemon
> but I have a DHCP and DNS server at home, so I'd rather have the
> zero-conf stuff turned off.
> 
> Best Regards,
> Lee

Avahi, now that I do have things working again, has been removed. 
Totally. 

Thanks Lee, take care and stay well.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#244301

From<tomas@tuxteam.de>
Date2022-01-22 08:00 +0100
Message-ID<DIixs-8oI-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244298

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 10:46:35PM -0500, Greg Wooledge wrote:

[...]

> Well, yes.  The "hostname" command sets the current hostname, which resides
> in memory only.  It has no permanent effect.
> 
> And it has nothing at all to do with IP addresses.  Or DNS.

[...]

> Routing has nothing to do with your system's hostname.  At all.

This is so important that it bears repeating. A couple of times :)

Hostname is a host's notion of its own host name. This can be different
from the name (or names) assigned to its IP addresses by the DNS. A
machine can have zero or IP addresses, and each of those can be known by
zero or more names in the DNS. Heck, several parts of a "split" DNS
world can disagree among them as to which names those IP addresses are
known by.

Of course, giving a host a name unrelated to (some of its) DNS names is
a bad idea in general, because it tends to confuse the heck out of
sysadmins (and in some case of applications: notably, SMTP servers
answer with "Hey, I'm patrick" (using the own hostname [1]): the server
at the other end will run away if it thinks it was talking to peter.

Cheers

[1] Unless you go to some lenghts to configure your SMTP server
    otherwise.

-- 
t

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#244342

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2022-01-22 18:20 +0100
Message-ID<DIsds-5Y4-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244296
On Fri 21 Jan 2022 at 21:34:35 (-0500), gene heskett wrote:

> My whole system here, 7 machines atm, has been as high as a dozen, is 
> dhcpd-less, all host name based with a common hosts file on all machines. 
> And until avahi sticks its camel nose in, it Just Works. So how do I get 
> rid of the 169.xx.xx.xx bs? Forever, with shoot to kill prejudice?

That's presumably a 169.254.n.n address, which AIUI the system will
create if DHCP fails to supply an address when asked.

I think your terminology is normally to "nuke" it rather than "shoot
to kill", but it shows that your approach is the wrong way round:
were your system set up correctly, it would never get created. The
idea is that if your system can't find its own address, then it gives
itself a random 169.254.n.n address so it can communicate with others
in the same boat.

I think we've been here before, as far back as March 2015, and usually
found some out-of-date, or RedHat¹, or just plain wrong entries in some
of your files when you've been persuaded to post them. As you claim
not to run DHCP, then it's particularly important that your
configuration is correct, and happens early enough.

¹ Yesterday, you wrote "And its Just Worked much like that way
  since redhat 5.0 in 1998."
  Sorry, but things have changed in the meantime.

Cheers,
David.

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#244300

From<tomas@tuxteam.de>
Date2022-01-22 07:50 +0100
Message-ID<DIinM-8ly-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244295

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 07:46:40PM -0500, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 07:27:11PM -0500, gene heskett wrote:
> > On Friday, January 21, 2022 6:45:52 PM EST Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:
> > > On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 06:42:38PM -0500, gene heskett wrote:
> > > > So how do I officially set the hostname so its reboot proof?
> > > 
> > > hostnamectl set hostname [foobar]
> 
> The standard Debian way is to put the desired hostname in /etc/hostname.
> 
> If I'm reading hostnamectl(1) correctly, the command you wanted should
> have a hyphen in it: hostnamectl set-hostname NEWNAME

Clarification: hostnamectl is from the systemd suite. For those using
another init system, put things directly in /etc/hostname.

Reading the source [1], `set-hostname' seems to be obsolete. The magic
word seems to be simply `hostname', these days, at least.

As far as I can see, after making sure the user hasn't made some error,
it passes the buck to some D-Bus service [2], which then does something.
Or not: I stopped my chase there.

For pedestrians (no D-Bus around here), writing to /etc/hostname is
still the way to go. Probably it'll work along with a systemd too.

Cheers

[1] https://sources.debian.org/src/systemd/250.3-1/src/hostname/hostnamectl.c/?hl=655#L655
[2] https://sources.debian.org/src/systemd/250.3-1/src/hostname/hostnamectl.c/?hl=655#L496

-- 
t

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#244330

FromCharles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com>
Date2022-01-22 15:40 +0100
Message-ID<DIpIB-4n8-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244300
On Sat, 22 Jan 2022 07:47:01 +0100
<tomas@tuxteam.de> wrote:

> Reading the source [1], `set-hostname' seems to be obsolete. The magic
> word seems to be simply `hostname', these days, at least.

Interesting.

I have systemd 247.3-6, as provided on Bullseye. The man page mentions
set-hostname only. Looking at your footnote (why do you put footnotes
in an email?), you are looking at a more recent version.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

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#244336

From<tomas@tuxteam.de>
Date2022-01-22 17:10 +0100
Message-ID<DIr7I-5ly-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244330

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 07:33:56AM -0700, Charles Curley wrote:
> On Sat, 22 Jan 2022 07:47:01 +0100
> <tomas@tuxteam.de> wrote:
> 
> > Reading the source [1], `set-hostname' seems to be obsolete. The magic
> > word seems to be simply `hostname', these days, at least.
> 
> Interesting.
> 
> I have systemd 247.3-6, as provided on Bullseye. The man page mentions
> set-hostname only. Looking at your footnote (why do you put footnotes
> in an email?),

Bad habits :)

> you are looking at a more recent version.

Quite possibly. I went with whatever version sources.debian.org threw at
me :-)

Cheers

> Does anybody read signatures any more?

I do. Sometimes.

Cheers
-- 
t

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#244360

Fromgene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net>
Date2022-01-22 23:30 +0100
Message-ID<DIx3s-oz-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244330
On Saturday, January 22, 2022 9:33:56 AM EST Charles Curley wrote:
> On Sat, 22 Jan 2022 07:47:01 +0100
> 
> <tomas@tuxteam.de> wrote:
> > Reading the source [1], `set-hostname' seems to be obsolete. The
> > magic
> > word seems to be simply `hostname', these days, at least.
> 
> Interesting.
> 
> I have systemd 247.3-6, as provided on Bullseye. The man page mentions
> set-hostname only. Looking at your footnote (why do you put footnotes
> in an email?), you are looking at a more recent version.

Same version here on amd64 according to synaptic. I have no clue what 
version is installed on the rpi4, but its raspi-os bullseye.
Logged into the pi, synaptic says 247.3-6 with a patch number appended on 
the rpi4.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#244364

From"Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@einval.com>
Date2022-01-23 00:00 +0100
Message-ID<DIxwt-y8-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244360
On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 05:20:49PM -0500, gene heskett wrote:
> On Saturday, January 22, 2022 9:33:56 AM EST Charles Curley wrote:
> > On Sat, 22 Jan 2022 07:47:01 +0100
> > 
> > <tomas@tuxteam.de> wrote:
> > > Reading the source [1], `set-hostname' seems to be obsolete. The
> > > magic
> > > word seems to be simply `hostname', these days, at least.
> > 
> > Interesting.
> > 
> > I have systemd 247.3-6, as provided on Bullseye. The man page mentions
> > set-hostname only. Looking at your footnote (why do you put footnotes
> > in an email?), you are looking at a more recent version.
> 
> Same version here on amd64 according to synaptic. I have no clue what 
> version is installed on the rpi4, but its raspi-os bullseye.
> Logged into the pi, synaptic says 247.3-6 with a patch number appended on 
> the rpi4.
> 
Hi Gene,

Yes - sorry, I was in a hurry and I goofed.

hostnamectl set-hostname [foobar] 

The hyphen is significant.

Raspberry Pi OS? You're more or less completely oon your own. 
Raspberry Pi OS is its own creature and I assume you're running the 32 bit
 version since the 64 bit version is still very beta.
 
Ask the Raspberry Pi Foundation. They do things differently there - 
as you're discovering. 

If you want to know how to run (fairly) 
vanilla Debian - but including the non-free raspberry pi firmware
and rpi-eeprom - it's possible using either Gunnar Wolf's images
or Pete Batard's version of UEFI for the Pi 4 and the Debian
arm64 ISO file. _That_ I can help you with.

All the very best, as ever

Andy Cater

> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> -- 
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>  - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>
> 
> 
> 

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#244393

Fromdeloptes <emanoil.kotsev@deloptes.org>
Date2022-01-23 09:00 +0100
Message-ID<DIFX5-5F9-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244364
Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:

> If you want to know how to run (fairly)
> vanilla Debian - but including the non-free raspberry pi firmware
> and rpi-eeprom - it's possible using either Gunnar Wolf's images
> or Pete Batard's version of UEFI for the Pi 4 and the Debian
> arm64 ISO file. _That_ I can help you with.

I use the RPi with Debian, but not after I adopted their kernel. So all that
was necessary to do is to copy the few packages.
I find this as good compromise

-- 
FCD6 3719 0FFB F1BF 38EA 4727 5348 5F1F DCFE BCB0

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#244311

FromCurt <curty@free.fr>
Date2022-01-22 10:10 +0100
Message-ID<DIkzg-1o2-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244295
On 2022-01-22, Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 07:27:11PM -0500, gene heskett wrote:
>> On Friday, January 21, 2022 6:45:52 PM EST Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:
>> > On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 06:42:38PM -0500, gene heskett wrote:
>> > > So how do I officially set the hostname so its reboot proof?
>> > 
>> > hostnamectl set hostname [foobar]
>
> The standard Debian way is to put the desired hostname in /etc/hostname.
>

What about updating /etc/hosts too?

 https://wiki.debian.org/Hostname

 Core networking
 Update /etc/hostname

 Update /etc/hosts, so local address(es) resolves with the new system
 name.
 
 Reload the network configuration...

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#244313

From<tomas@tuxteam.de>
Date2022-01-22 10:20 +0100
Message-ID<DIkIV-1rz-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#244311

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Sat, Jan 22, 2022 at 09:03:06AM -0000, Curt wrote:
> On 2022-01-22, Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> wrote:
> > On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 07:27:11PM -0500, gene heskett wrote:
> >> On Friday, January 21, 2022 6:45:52 PM EST Andrew M.A. Cater wrote:
> >> > On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 06:42:38PM -0500, gene heskett wrote:
> >> > > So how do I officially set the hostname so its reboot proof?
> >> > 
> >> > hostnamectl set hostname [foobar]
> >
> > The standard Debian way is to put the desired hostname in /etc/hostname.
> >
> 
> What about updating /etc/hosts too?
> 
>  https://wiki.debian.org/Hostname

Noooo!

;-)

Now we were getting across that the host name (as in /etc/hostname) has
nothing to do with name resolution (as in resolver, DNS) you come and
mess things up again ;-D

[note the smileys]

Seriously. Of course it is a good idea that name resolution (resolver)
can resolve the name set up in hostname. Ideally to an IP address
pointing to the host in question. Everything else would be... confusing.

But let Gene fix things in the IP layers first, get the host name set,
independently of that, and tackle name resolution after IP routing
works.

Cheers
-- 
t

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