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User group "users"

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  User group "users" Steve Keller <keller.steve@gmx.de> - 2022-01-21 15:10 +0100
    Re: User group "users" Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> - 2022-01-21 16:10 +0100
      Re: User group "users" Jerome BENOIT <sphericaltriangle@rezozer.net> - 2022-01-21 16:30 +0100
        Re: User group "users" Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> - 2022-01-21 16:30 +0100
          Re: User group "users" Thomas Hochstein <thh@thh.name> - 2022-01-21 19:20 +0100
            Re: User group "users" Toni Mas Soler <antomassol@protonmail.com> - 2022-01-22 09:10 +0100
      Re: User group "users" Steve Keller <keller.steve@gmx.de> - 2022-01-21 16:30 +0100
        Re: User group "users" David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2022-01-21 17:30 +0100
    Re: User group "users" Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2022-01-21 18:40 +0100

#244267 — User group "users"

I see that on my Debian systems there is a user group "users" with GID 100,
but by default no user gets added to it.  So what is the purpose or reason
to have it?

>From old Unix installations I know the group "users" which every user was
a member of, by default.

Steve

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#244270

On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 02:49:09PM +0100, Steve Keller wrote:
> I see that on my Debian systems there is a user group "users" with GID 100,
> but by default no user gets added to it.  So what is the purpose or reason
> to have it?
> 
> >From old Unix installations I know the group "users" which every user was
> a member of, by default.
> 
New users have gid 100 set as their primary group by default.  So, new
users are members of the group without having to be added to the group
in /etc/groups.

Regards,

-Roberto

-- 
Roberto C. Sánchez

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#244272

On 21/01/2022 15:59, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 02:49:09PM +0100, Steve Keller wrote:
>> I see that on my Debian systems there is a user group "users" with GID 100,
>> but by default no user gets added to it.  So what is the purpose or reason
>> to have it?
>>
>> >From old Unix installations I know the group "users" which every user was
>> a member of, by default.
>>
> New users have gid 100 set as their primary group by default.  So, new
> users are members of the group without having to be added to the group
> in /etc/groups.

This might be specific to your installation.
Usually users have by default their own group.

Cheers,
Jerome


> 
> Regards,
> 
> -Roberto
> 

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#244273

On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 04:08:00PM +0100, Jerome BENOIT wrote:
> 
> 
> On 21/01/2022 15:59, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
> > On Fri, Jan 21, 2022 at 02:49:09PM +0100, Steve Keller wrote:
> > > I see that on my Debian systems there is a user group "users" with GID 100,
> > > but by default no user gets added to it.  So what is the purpose or reason
> > > to have it?
> > > 
> > > >From old Unix installations I know the group "users" which every user was
> > > a member of, by default.
> > > 
> > New users have gid 100 set as their primary group by default.  So, new
> > users are members of the group without having to be added to the group
> > in /etc/groups.
> 
> This might be specific to your installation.
> Usually users have by default their own group.
> 
Quite right.  It seems that I probably made that change a very long time
ago, long enough ago so that it just seemed like the standard
configuration to me.  Apologies for the misinformation.

Regards,

-Roberto

-- 
Roberto C. Sánchez

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#244286

Roberto C. Sánchez schrieb:

>>> New users have gid 100 set as their primary group by default.  So, new
>>> users are members of the group without having to be added to the group
>>> in /etc/groups.

That depends on your configuration.

| # /etc/adduser.conf: `adduser' configuration.
| # See adduser(8) and adduser.conf(5) for full documentation.
[...]
| # The USERGROUPS variable can be either "yes" or "no".  If "yes" each
| # created user will be given their own group to use as a default.  If
| # "no", each created user will be placed in the group whose gid is
| # USERS_GID (see below).
| USERGROUPS=yes
| 
| # If USERGROUPS is "no", then USERS_GID should be the GID of the group
| # `users' (or the equivalent group) on your system.
| USERS_GID=100

> Quite right.  It seems that I probably made that change a very long time
> ago, long enough ago so that it just seemed like the standard
> configuration to me.

>From <https://wiki.debian.org/UserPrivateGroups>:
|  Debian has been using (creating) user private groups by default almost
|  from the beginning. However, UPGs where not fully enabled on newly
|  installed systems since release 2.2., because the central umask
|  adjustment for UPGs, as configured in /etc/login.defs, was broken with
|  the inclusion of PAM. This feature was only reintroduced with
|  libpam-umask in release 6.0 (Squeeze). 

-thh

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#244307

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

Please, note that's my own criteria.
- Each new user must have their own group to prevent security issues.
- Most of users are per-app users, following (more or less Android methods). So only real (login) users are added manually in the GID=100. Thus they can share what they want only who then want with no acl complexity.

Toni Mas
GPG 3F42A21D84D7E950

Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.

‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐

El divendres, 21 de gener 2022 a les 18:51, Thomas Hochstein <thh@thh.name> va escriure:

> Roberto C. Sánchez schrieb:
> 

> > > > New users have gid 100 set as their primary group by default. So, new
> > > > 

> > > > users are members of the group without having to be added to the group
> > > > 

> > > > in /etc/groups.
> 

> That depends on your configuration.
> 

> | # /etc/adduser.conf: `adduser' configuration. | # See adduser(8) and adduser.conf(5) for full documentation. [...] | # The USERGROUPS variable can be either "yes" or "no". If "yes" each | # created user will be given their own group to use as a default. If | # "no", each created user will be placed in the group whose gid is | # USERS_GID (see below). | USERGROUPS=yes | | # If USERGROUPS is "no", then USERS_GID should be the GID of the group | #` users' (or the equivalent group) on your system.
> 

> | USERS_GID=100
> 

> > Quite right. It seems that I probably made that change a very long time
> > 

> > ago, long enough ago so that it just seemed like the standard
> > 

> > configuration to me.
> 

> > From https://wiki.debian.org/UserPrivateGroups:
> 

> | Debian has been using (creating) user private groups by default almost
> 

> | from the beginning. However, UPGs where not fully enabled on newly
> 

> | installed systems since release 2.2., because the central umask
> 

> | adjustment for UPGs, as configured in /etc/login.defs, was broken with
> 

> | the inclusion of PAM. This feature was only reintroduced with
> 

> | libpam-umask in release 6.0 (Squeeze).
> 

> -thh

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#244274

"Roberto C. Sánchez" <roberto@debian.org> wrote:

> New users have gid 100 set as their primary group by default.  So, new
> users are members of the group without having to be added to the group
> in /etc/groups.

Hmm, at least not on two Debian systems (stretch and bullseye), I have
running here:

# cat /etc/debian_version 
9.13
# useradd -c Foo foo
# id foo
uid=1021(foo) gid=1021(foo) groups=1021(foo)


# cat /etc/debian_version 
11.2
# useradd -c Foo foo
# id foo
uid=1020(foo) gid=1020(foo) groups=1020(foo)


Steve

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#244279

On Fri 21 Jan 2022 at 16:11:13 (+0100), Steve Keller wrote:
> "Roberto C. Sánchez" <roberto@debian.org> wrote:
> 
> > New users have gid 100 set as their primary group by default.  So, new
> > users are members of the group without having to be added to the group
> > in /etc/groups.
> 
> Hmm, at least not on two Debian systems (stretch and bullseye), I have
> running here:
> 
> # cat /etc/debian_version 
> 9.13
> # useradd -c Foo foo
> # id foo
> uid=1021(foo) gid=1021(foo) groups=1021(foo)
> 
> 
> # cat /etc/debian_version 
> 11.2
> # useradd -c Foo foo
> # id foo
> uid=1020(foo) gid=1020(foo) groups=1020(foo)

You're encouraged to use adduser rather than useradd. But in
both cases, what they do is configured with, respectively,
/etc/adduser.conf and /etc/default/useradd, q.v.

Cheers,
David.

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#244283

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Vi, 21 ian 22, 14:49:09, Steve Keller wrote:
> I see that on my Debian systems there is a user group "users" with GID 100,
> but by default no user gets added to it.  So what is the purpose or reason
> to have it?
> 
> >From old Unix installations I know the group "users" which every user was
> a member of, by default.
 
According to /usr/share/doc/base-passwd/users-and-groups.txt.gz

   users
          While Debian systems use the user-group system by
          default (each user has their own group), some prefer to
          use a more traditional group system. In that system,
          each user is a member of the 'users' group.


It's probably there to "reserve" GID 100 and preserve compatibility with 
other systems using this system.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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