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Buster no release file

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  Buster no release file kris <kris@dreamwaresystems.com> - 2021-07-11 00:30 +0200
    Re: Buster no release file Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-07-11 00:50 +0200
      Re: Buster no release file Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside <debian@polynamaude.com> - 2021-07-11 02:20 +0200
      Re: Buster no release file rhkramer@gmail.com - 2021-07-11 03:30 +0200
        Re: Buster no release file Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-07-11 03:50 +0200
          Re: Buster no release file Tixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk> - 2021-07-11 09:40 +0200
      Re: Buster no release file mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2021-07-11 11:20 +0200
        Cool down... [was: Buster no release file] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-11 13:10 +0200
          Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-11 14:40 +0200
            Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file] Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2021-07-11 18:40 +0200
              Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-11 20:30 +0200
                Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file] Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-07-11 20:50 +0200
                  Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-11 21:20 +0200
                  Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2021-07-11 22:10 +0200
                    Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] "Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@einval.com> - 2021-07-11 22:20 +0200
                    Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] ghe2001 <ghe2001@protonmail.com> - 2021-07-11 22:30 +0200
                      Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-11 22:40 +0200
                        Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] jeremy ardley <jeremy@ardley.org> - 2021-07-11 23:10 +0200
                          Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-12 09:50 +0200
                      Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Brian Thompson <brian@hashvault.io> - 2021-07-13 05:20 +0200
                        Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Steve McIntyre <steve@einval.com> - 2021-07-14 00:50 +0200
                          Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-14 09:00 +0200
                    Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside <debian@polynamaude.com> - 2021-07-11 23:00 +0200
                      Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-12 09:50 +0200
                        Re: Useless [Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]] Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside <debian@polynamaude.com> - 2021-07-12 10:20 +0200
                          Re: Useless [Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]] tomas@tuxteam.de - 2021-07-12 10:30 +0200
                          Re: Useless [Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]] rhkramer@gmail.com - 2021-07-12 13:00 +0200
                            Re: Useless [Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]] Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2021-07-12 13:00 +0200
                        Writing angry comments inside code and forgetting that opensource  means world will read you [ was : Offensive variable names [was: Cool down  ...]] Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside <debian@polynamaude.com> - 2021-07-12 10:20 +0200
                          Re: Writing angry comments inside code and forgetting that opensource means world will read you "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2021-07-12 11:40 +0200
                            Re: Writing angry comments inside code and forgetting that  opensource means world will read you Nicolas George <george@nsup.org> - 2021-07-12 12:00 +0200
                            Re: Writing angry comments inside code and forgetting that  opensource means world will read you Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2021-07-12 13:20 +0200
                      Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Alexandre Garreau <galex-713@galex-713.eu> - 2021-07-12 17:20 +0200
                        Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Brian Thompson <brian@hashvault.io> - 2021-07-13 05:30 +0200
                    Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2021-07-12 15:40 +0200
                      Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] "Kevin N." <kevin@notscheduled.eu> - 2021-07-12 16:50 +0200
                        Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Peter Ehlert <peter@sdi-baja.com> - 2021-07-12 17:50 +0200
                          Re: Offensive variable names "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2021-07-12 19:30 +0200
                        Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2021-07-12 18:50 +0200
                          Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] "James H. H. Lampert" <jamesl@touchtonecorp.com> - 2021-07-12 19:00 +0200
                            Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2021-07-12 23:30 +0200
                          Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] "Kevin N." <kevin@notscheduled.eu> - 2021-07-12 19:10 +0200
                        Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Brian Thompson <brian@hashvault.io> - 2021-07-12 19:30 +0200
                          Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...] Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2021-07-12 20:10 +0200
        Re: Buster no release file "Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@einval.com> - 2021-07-11 13:40 +0200
      Re: Buster no release file Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-07-11 20:10 +0200
        Re: Buster no release file Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-07-11 20:20 +0200
          Re: Buster no release file Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2021-07-11 21:00 +0200
            Re: Buster no release file <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-07-11 21:10 +0200
              Re: Buster no release file Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-07-12 18:00 +0200
      Re: Buster no release file Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-07-11 20:10 +0200
      Re: Buster no release file Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-07-12 10:20 +0200
        Re: Buster no release file Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2021-07-12 12:00 +0200
          Re: Buster no release file Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-07-12 13:10 +0200
      Wiki Debian "Release page" should have template (Was Re: Buster no  release file) Robbi Nespu <robbinespu@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 17:40 +0200
        Re: Wiki Debian "Release page" should have template (Was Re: Buster  no release file) Robbi Nespu <robbinespu@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 18:10 +0200

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#237179 — Buster no release file

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Long version of error message in activities software.
Unable to dowmload updates: Failed to update cache: E: the
repository /cdrom://Debian GNU/ Linux 10.10.0-Buster_-Official amd64 DVD
Binary-1 2021069-16:12 Buster Release does not have release file.  
I should note i have seperate swap var partitions.
etc/apt/source.list.d is empty. I have attached sources.list

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#237181

On Sat, Jul 10, 2021 at 03:28:27PM -0700, kris wrote:
> Long version of error message in activities software.
> Unable to dowmload updates: Failed to update cache: E: the
> repository /cdrom://Debian GNU/ Linux 10.10.0-Buster_-Official amd64 DVD
> Binary-1 2021069-16:12 Buster Release does not have release file.  

Unless you have a specific reason to keep trying to pull packages
from your DVD, you should probably just remove those lines, and replace
them with regular Internet sources.

> I should note i have seperate swap var partitions.

Irrelevant.

> etc/apt/source.list.d is empty. I have attached sources.list
> 

> # 
> 
> # deb cdrom:[Debian GNU/Linux 10.10.0 _Buster_ - Official amd64 DVD Binary-1 20210619-16:12]/ buster contrib main
> 
> deb cdrom:[Debian GNU/Linux 10.10.0 _Buster_ - Official amd64 DVD Binary-1 20210619-16:12]/ buster contrib main
> 
> deb cdrom:[Debian GNU/Linux 10.10.0 _Buster_ - Official amd64 DVD Binary-2 20210619-16:12]/ buster contrib main
> 
> deb http://security.debian.org/debian-security buster/updates main contrib
> deb-src http://security.debian.org/debian-security buster/updates main contrib

You've got an Internet source for the security updates, so if that's
going to work, you should be able to use an Internet source for the
regular packages as well.

Remove all of the cdrom: lines (unless, as I said, you *really* need
to use them for some reason, and have made arrangements for the DVD
to be mounted at need), and replace them with a standard buster source.

I was going to link you to the DebianBuster wiki page where I had put
the standard sources.list for buster, but it appears someone doesn't
want you to have that information.

https://wiki.debian.org/DebianBuster?action=diff&rev2=23&rev1=22

You can thank the person who goes by the name PaulWise for making your
Debian wiki a less informative and less useful place.

I *REALLY* and truly hate assholes like that.

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#237184

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Hi,

> I was going to link you to the DebianBuster wiki page where I had put
> the standard sources.list for buster, but it appears someone doesn't
> want you to have that information.
> 
> https://wiki.debian.org/DebianBuster?action=diff&rev2=23&rev1=22
> 
> You can thank the person who goes by the name PaulWise for making your
> Debian wiki a less informative and less useful place.
> 
> I *REALLY* and truly hate assholes like that.
> 

Those are the type of plague that give free software community a really
bad image. That kind of really stupid action of erasing others work only
because we are able to do so.

Wikipedia had the same problem and had to lock some pages.
That's a sad person to act this way.

At least we can still find what you wrote by looking thru revision but
we have to know there's something to look for.

-- 
Polyna-Maude R.-Summerside
-Be smart, Be wise, Support opensource development

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#237185

On Saturday, July 10, 2021 06:44:47 PM Greg Wooledge wrote:
> I was going to link you to the DebianBuster wiki page where I had put
> the standard sources.list for buster, but it appears someone doesn't
> want you to have that information.
> 
> https://wiki.debian.org/DebianBuster?action=diff&rev2=23&rev1=22
> 
> You can thank the person who goes by the name PaulWise for making your
> Debian wiki a less informative and less useful place.
> 
> I *REALLY* and truly hate assholes like that.

+1

Do you know him or have had any contact with him (other than by virtue of the 
change he made to the wiki)?

I mean, it seems like if there was a good reason to delete that information 
(which I can't imagine), he should have given a better explanation of why he 
was deleting it.

Aside: I meant to write to you some weeks ago to thank you for the information 
you maintain in your wiki.  Thank you!

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#237186

On Sat, Jul 10, 2021 at 09:25:51PM -0400, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> On Saturday, July 10, 2021 06:44:47 PM Greg Wooledge wrote:
> > I was going to link you to the DebianBuster wiki page where I had put
> > the standard sources.list for buster, but it appears someone doesn't
> > want you to have that information.
> > 
> > https://wiki.debian.org/DebianBuster?action=diff&rev2=23&rev1=22
> > 
> > You can thank the person who goes by the name PaulWise for making your
> > Debian wiki a less informative and less useful place.
> > 
> > I *REALLY* and truly hate assholes like that.
> 
> +1
> 
> Do you know him or have had any contact with him (other than by virtue of the 
> change he made to the wiki)?

No, I've never heard of him before.

> I mean, it seems like if there was a good reason to delete that information 
> (which I can't imagine), he should have given a better explanation of why he 
> was deleting it.

I've dealt with people like this in other communities.  Some people
seem to feel that a wiki has a fixed format, and that certain pages
should *only* contain certain pieces of information, in a certain format,
and that any deviation from this historical format must be stamped out.

I don't know where this mindset comes from, but I'd bet there are
multiple Debian wiki editors who hold it.  There's rarely just one.
There's typically a self-appointed cabal.

If you ever wonder why the Debian wiki will never match the Arch wiki in
terms of quality, people like this are a part of the reason.

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#237190

On Sat, 2021-07-10 at 21:40 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Sat, Jul 10, 2021 at 09:25:51PM -0400, rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Saturday, July 10, 2021 06:44:47 PM Greg Wooledge wrote:
> > > I was going to link you to the DebianBuster wiki page where I had put
> > > the standard sources.list for buster, but it appears someone doesn't
> > > want you to have that information.
> > > 
> > > https://wiki.debian.org/DebianBuster?action=diff&rev2=23&rev1=22
> > > 
> > > You can thank the person who goes by the name PaulWise for making your
> > > Debian wiki a less informative and less useful place.
> > > 
> > > I *REALLY* and truly hate assholes like that.
> > 
> > +1
> > 
> > Do you know him or have had any contact with him (other than by virtue of the 
> > change he made to the wiki)?
> 
> No, I've never heard of him before.

I've seen his name on various Debian lists and official contexts. If
you follow the link on the wiki diff [1] you'll see he's a Debian
project member and part of the wiki admin team.

[1] https://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise

If you look at the wiki page for GregWooledge there is no contact info
only a link to a page that starts with American political messages.

Fortunately, my first impressions of this Greg person were from
postings to this list, so to me he's this Bash expert and generally
technically sound guy who's worth listening to.

-- 
Tixy

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#237193

On 2021-07-10 23:44, Greg Wooledge wrote:

> I *REALLY* and truly hate assholes like that.
control freaks are the biggest problem facing society today.
mick
-- 
Key ID    4BFEBB31

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#237198 — Cool down... [was: Buster no release file]

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On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 10:18:37AM +0100, mick crane wrote:
> On 2021-07-10 23:44, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> 
> >I *REALLY* and truly hate assholes like that.
> control freaks are the biggest problem facing society today.

Now calling someone "asshole" in public is rather extreme; I can fully
understand Greg's anger, but still.

Mass-jumping on someone without having even tried to contact him (perhaps
it was a stupid misunderstanding, a brain fart, a fat finger or something
my fantasy fails to come up with right now)... well, I hope that's not
the style around here. Perhaps Twwatty or Fakebook (or whatsitiscalled)
provide that kind of thrill.

So please, pretty please: calm down :)

Cheers
 - t

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#237200 — Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file]

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On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 01:05:44PM +0100, mick crane wrote:
> On 2021-07-11 12:01, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:

[...]

> >So please, pretty please: calm down :)
> 
> You are correct, I have no idea of the individuals.

Thanks :)

> Guess I am overwhelmed by the turn society has taken.

Who is not. Life's always beeen outrageous (I'm an old guy, believe me :)

I think the art is to use that ourtrage to try to change things, instead
of slinging it at one's co-humans (who might themselves be outraged, but
from a different POV and thusly for different reasons). Not that *I*
manage as I wish I did...

> Next we will be banning variable names for being inappropriate.

I'm sure that happens somewhere, some time. OTOH, worse things happen,
too. Someone is being murdered right now. Kids are starving, deprived
of schooling, being abused of or forced to work. Lotsa things to do!

Cheers
 - t

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#237203 — Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file]

On Sunday 11 July 2021 08:29:52 tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:

> On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 01:05:44PM +0100, mick crane wrote:
> > On 2021-07-11 12:01, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> > >So please, pretty please: calm down :)
> >
> > You are correct, I have no idea of the individuals.
>
> Thanks :)
>
> > Guess I am overwhelmed by the turn society has taken.
>
> Who is not. Life's always beeen outrageous (I'm an old guy, believe me
> :)
>
> I think the art is to use that ourtrage to try to change things,
> instead of slinging it at one's co-humans (who might themselves be
> outraged, but from a different POV and thusly for different reasons).
> Not that *I* manage as I wish I did...

Me too Tomas, and I think I have at least a decade on you, if I don't get 
shot for refusing the shot, I'll be 87 in early October. I found a daily 
St. Johns Wort in my pilltainer helps to tame the raging bull in me. But 
not enough to make me take back what I didn't sell. :)

> > Next we will be banning variable names for being inappropriate.

Already happening, sorry to say.

> I'm sure that happens somewhere, some time. OTOH, worse things happen,
> too. Someone is being murdered right now. Kids are starving, deprived
> of schooling, being abused of or forced to work. Lotsa things to do!

Most of the above is mans own inhumanity to man, but being forced to work 
is not necessarily abuse, it was the rule in the house I grew up in with 
a stepfather, who was first an honest man and taught me by example in 
that dept, so one of the rules was I went to school or I got a job. I 
helped him build a house on a cut off corner of a field my grandfather 
gave us in the aftermath of WW_II in 1946, and at 12 years old, I wired 
that house for electricity.  And when I turned 21 and could, I thought 
enough of the man who raised me to change my name to match his. That is 
respect. And it didn't cost an arm and leg for the adoption papers which 
in Iowa, are a legal racket for the lawyers.

> Cheers

Back at-cha Tomas.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#237210 — Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file]

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On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 12:32:35PM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

[...]

> > > Next we will be banning variable names for being inappropriate.
> 
> Already happening, sorry to say.

Why sorry? That was the point of my "missive". There are much worse
things around us happening right now. Perhaps there /is/ a reason for
that variable change, after all. Argue with the folks proposing the
change (but be open and prepared to be convinced... otherwise you have
no right to expect convincing others ;-D

[...]

> Most of the above is mans own inhumanity to man [...]

> but being forced to work is not necessarily abuse [...]

I meant abuse *and* child labour; views on the latter change, as
everything else. Electrical code changes, too -- you can't wire
a house nowadays as if it were 1923. You might get in hot water
for that ;-)

P.S: You have over two decades on me, BTW :)

Cheers
 - t

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#237212 — Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file]

On Sun 11 Jul 2021 at 20:27:23 +0200, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:

> On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 12:32:35PM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
> > > > Next we will be banning variable names for being inappropriate.
> > 
> > Already happening, sorry to say.
> 
> Why sorry? That was the point of my "missive". There are much worse
> things around us happening right now. Perhaps there /is/ a reason for
> that variable change, after all. Argue with the folks proposing the
> change (but be open and prepared to be convinced... otherwise you have
> no right to expect convincing others ;-D

I'm lost. Variable change? A link from either of you, please.
> 
> [...]
> 
> > Most of the above is mans own inhumanity to man [...]
> 
> > but being forced to work is not necessarily abuse [...]
> 
> I meant abuse *and* child labour; views on the latter change, as
> everything else.

OK.

> Electrical code changes, too -- you can't wire
> a house nowadays as if it were 1923. You might get in hot water
> for that ;-)

Talk about a change of subject!

-- 
Brian.

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#237216 — Re: Cool down... [was: Buster no release file]

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On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 07:44:07PM +0100, Brian wrote:
> On Sun 11 Jul 2021 at 20:27:23 +0200, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
> 
> > On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 12:32:35PM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > 
> > [...]
> > 
> > > > > Next we will be banning variable names for being inappropriate.
> > > 
> > > Already happening, sorry to say.
> > 
> > Why sorry? [...]

> I'm lost. Variable change? A link from either of you, please.

The "master" and "slave" terms come to mind, see [1] for an example.
My take? I think it's irrelevant, but feel free to open a new thread
if you're (still) curious. But I don't think my take is that interesting,
anyway :)

> > Electrical code changes, too [...]

> Talk about a change of subject!

πάντα ρέι [1] ;-)

Cheers
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panta_rhei_(Heraclitus)
 - tomás

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#237217 — Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]

Hi,

Brian wrote:
> Variable change? A link from either of you, please.

After googling "offensive variable name" i got to:

  "Fix use of offensive word in kafka receiver factory_test"
  https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-collector/issues/2286

which led to

  "changed variable name in kafka receiver"
  https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-collector/pull/2288/files/c16ff3d61ac966534590585477934eddaeb6b129


Above Github issue indicates that there are blacklists maintained:

  "Automated security scanners flag the use of this variable name as
   a potentially offensive word"

But of course the use of a blacklist is a problem too:

  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacklist_%28computing%29#Controversy_over_use_of_the_term
  https://www.theregister.com/2019/09/03/chromium_microsoft_offensive/


Whatever, the use of controversial words in publicly visible code is not
an indication of a professional attitude. Overdoing juvenile enthusiasm
for provocation might lead to a result like with the "weboob" package which
got removed from Debian
  https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=907199


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#237218 — Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]

On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 10:05:39PM +0200, Thomas Schmitt wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Brian wrote:
> > Variable change? A link from either of you, please.
> 
> After googling "offensive variable name" i got to:
> 
>   "Fix use of offensive word in kafka receiver factory_test"
>   https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-collector/issues/2286
> 
> which led to
> 
>   "changed variable name in kafka receiver"
>   https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-collector/pull/2288/files/c16ff3d61ac966534590585477934eddaeb6b129
> 
> 
> Above Github issue indicates that there are blacklists maintained:
> 
>   "Automated security scanners flag the use of this variable name as
>    a potentially offensive word"
> 
> But of course the use of a blacklist is a problem too:
> 
>   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacklist_%28computing%29#Controversy_over_use_of_the_term
>   https://www.theregister.com/2019/09/03/chromium_microsoft_offensive/
> 

I've found deny_list and allow_list or similar to be quite useful.
Everything can go too far but actually sometimes things do end
up being more clear.

> 
> Whatever, the use of controversial words in publicly visible code is not
> an indication of a professional attitude. Overdoing juvenile enthusiasm
> for provocation might lead to a result like with the "weboob" package which
> got removed from Debian
>   https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=907199
> 
> 
> Have a nice day :)
> 

You too

Andy Cater
> Thomas
> 

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#237219 — Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]

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<IMHO>

Master/slave my be less than optimal when describing humans, but they're very useful when working with DNS.

And blacklist is useful in SMTP, among others.  IIRC, the word refers to voting in classical Athens, not humans.

Offensive terms should, of course, be removed from public discourse, but programmers are free to use any string they want to name a variable in their code -- especially when released compiled.

</IMHO>

--
Glenn English


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#237220 — Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]

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On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 08:25:22PM +0000, ghe2001 wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
> 
> <IMHO>
> 
> Master/slave my be less than optimal when describing humans, but they're very useful when working with DNS.
> 
> And blacklist is useful in SMTP, among others.  IIRC, the word refers to voting in classical Athens, not humans.
> 
> Offensive terms should, of course, be removed from public discourse, but programmers are free to use any string they want to name a variable in their code -- especially when released compiled.

The latter may be too simplistic if you're doing free software:
publishing the code becomes part of the game, and if you hope
that people from all over the world reads and enhances the source,
you're smack in the middle of public discourse.

Back to my preferred aphorism: "all generalisations suck" ;-)

Cheers
 - t

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#237222 — Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]

On 12/07/2021 4:32 am, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 08:25:22PM +0000, ghe2001 wrote:
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA256
>>
>> <IMHO>
>>
>> Master/slave my be less than optimal when describing humans, but they're very useful when working with DNS.
>>
>> And blacklist is useful in SMTP, among others.  IIRC, the word refers to voting in classical Athens, not humans.
>>
>> Offensive terms should, of course, be removed from public discourse, but programmers are free to use any string they want to name a variable in their code -- especially when released compiled.
> The latter may be too simplistic if you're doing free software:
> publishing the code becomes part of the game, and if you hope
> that people from all over the world reads and enhances the source,
> you're smack in the middle of public discourse.
>
> Back to my preferred aphorism: "all generalisations suck" ;-)
>
> Cheers
>   - t


You can also run into problems with different languages. For instance a 
Swedish developer would have no problem using terms fart, prick, and 
fack, but some English speakers might take offense. The are actually in 
English fast, small dot, and small compartment.

(WRT fart I used to do fartlek training for orienteering without major 
problems)

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#237228 — Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]

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On Mon, Jul 12, 2021 at 04:59:52AM +0800, jeremy ardley wrote:
> 
> On 12/07/2021 4:32 am, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:

[...]

> You can also run into problems with different languages. For
> instance a Swedish developer would have no problem using terms fart,
> prick, and fack, but some English speakers might take offense. The
> are actually in English fast, small dot, and small compartment.
> 
> (WRT fart I used to do fartlek training for orienteering without
> major problems)

Definitely. My take is that we are currently seeing "growing pains",
because "our" community used to be much more homogeneous. And I think,
in the long term, this is a Good Thing, if we all manage to be a bit
tolerant (tolerance is always an "outward motion", i.e. you start
always with yourself :)

Cheers
 - t

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#237282 — Re: Offensive variable names [was: Cool down ...]

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On Sun, Jul 11, 2021 at 08:25:22PM +0000, ghe2001 wrote:
>Master/slave my be less than optimal when describing humans, but they're very useful when working with DNS.
>
>And blacklist is useful in SMTP, among others.  IIRC, the word refers to voting in classical Athens, not humans.
>
>Offensive terms should, of course, be removed from public discourse, but programmers are free to use any string they want to name a variable in their code -- especially when released compiled.

^ This.  I concur 100%.  Politically correct language, or politics in
general, have no place in software.
-- 
Best regards,

Brian T

Coronavirus is a scam.
9/11 was an inside job.

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