Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]
Groups > linux.debian.user > #235507 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2021-05-25 19:30 +0200 |
| Last post | 2021-06-04 11:10 +0200 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 78 — 17 participants |
Back to article view | Back to linux.debian.user
How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-25 19:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Kenneth Parker <sea7kenp@gmail.com> - 2021-05-25 21:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-25 22:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-05-25 23:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-25 23:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Keith Bainbridge <keithrbaugroups@gmail.com> - 2021-05-26 01:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Jeremy Ardley <jeremy@ardley.org> - 2021-05-26 04:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-26 05:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-26 03:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Keith Bainbridge <keithrbaugroups@gmail.com> - 2021-05-26 06:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? l0f4r0@tuta.io - 2021-05-26 14:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-27 08:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? l0f4r0@tuta.io - 2021-05-27 22:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-28 02:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-05-29 08:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-29 19:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-05-30 09:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? l0f4r0@tuta.io - 2021-05-28 13:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-05-28 14:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-28 20:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-05-28 21:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-29 01:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-05-29 09:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? l0f4r0@tuta.io - 2021-05-29 11:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-30 13:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-05-30 15:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2021-05-30 15:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2021-05-30 17:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? l0f4r0@tuta.io - 2021-06-02 09:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-02 13:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? l0f4r0@tuta.io - 2021-06-02 13:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-02 18:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2021-06-02 18:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-06-02 19:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Linux-Fan <Ma_Sys.ma@web.de> - 2021-06-02 21:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-06-02 21:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-03 21:20 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-06-03 04:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-04 02:20 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? "Thomas D. Dean" <tomdean@wavecable.com> - 2021-06-04 04:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-04 08:20 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? "Thomas D. Dean" <tomdean@wavecable.com> - 2021-06-04 12:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-04 12:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2021-06-04 17:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-06-04 14:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside <debian@polynamaude.com> - 2021-06-04 14:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2021-06-04 17:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2021-06-04 15:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-04 19:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-03 04:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-05-29 15:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-30 12:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-30 13:20 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-05-30 13:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-30 13:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-28 20:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? l0f4r0@tuta.io - 2021-05-28 14:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-29 01:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-01 19:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2021-06-01 20:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2021-06-01 20:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-01 19:20 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2021-06-01 20:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-01 13:20 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> - 2021-06-01 15:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2021-06-01 15:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2021-05-25 21:20 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-25 23:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2021-05-25 23:40 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-25 23:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Tom Browder <tom.browder@gmail.com> - 2021-06-02 22:00 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? l0f4r0@tuta.io - 2021-06-02 22:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-03 21:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-03 03:50 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Tom Browder <tom.browder@gmail.com> - 2021-06-03 22:20 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-06-03 22:30 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-06-04 02:10 +0200
Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-04 11:10 +0200
Page 3 of 4 — ← Prev page 1 2 [3] 4 Next page →
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 08:20 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Cmblv-31u-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235865 |
Hi Thomas Thank you for your help and time. I really appreciate it. > Sent: Friday, June 04, 2021 at 10:23 AM > From: "Thomas D. Dean" <tomdean@wavecable.com> > To: debian-user@lists.debian.org > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > > I have the same problem. OK, but do you use Ubuntu or Debian or both? > > I saw this in: https://askubuntu.com/questions/1038923 > > sudo systemctl disable apt-daily.service > sudo systemctl disable apt-daily.timer > > sudo systemctl disable apt-daily-upgrade.timer > sudo systemctl disable apt-daily-upgrade.service > A poster named l0f4r0@tuta.io replied to me via this mailing list yesterday and below is what he wrote (verbatim): "Cannot remember if you have Gnome installed but you should have a look at https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/594287, especially ALL the associated comments (click on "Show 7 more comments")." When I did a *fresh* minimal install of Debian about two years ago, I didn't install the whole Gnome DE. Instead, I installed the following packages: xorg gnome-core gnome-tweak-tool synaptic file-roller gedit A few days ago, after reading replies from some posters, I purged the package called unattended-upgrades. I don't know how and when it was installed in the first place. You see, about two years I chose the option Expert Install (without GUI) and during the installation process, I chose the option to not install updates automatically. After reading what was written in the page (https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/594287), I disabled the package called PackageKit today. Only time will tell if said step works. By the way, does Ubuntu use the full or stripped-down version of Gnome Desktop Environment? *fresh* = not upgraded from Debian Stretch
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | "Thomas D. Dean" <tomdean@wavecable.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 12:10 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CmeW5-5fy-7@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235866 |
On 6/3/21 11:15 PM, Stella Ashburne wrote: > Hi Thomas > > Thank you for your help and time. I really appreciate it. > >> Sent: Friday, June 04, 2021 at 10:23 AM >> From: "Thomas D. Dean" <tomdean@wavecable.com> >> To: debian-user@lists.debian.org >> Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? >> >> I have the same problem. > > OK, but do you use Ubuntu or Debian or both? >> >> I saw this in: https://askubuntu.com/questions/1038923 >> >> sudo systemctl disable apt-daily.service >> sudo systemctl disable apt-daily.timer >> >> sudo systemctl disable apt-daily-upgrade.timer >> sudo systemctl disable apt-daily-upgrade.service >> > A poster named l0f4r0@tuta.io replied to me via this mailing list yesterday and below is what he wrote (verbatim): > > "Cannot remember if you have Gnome installed but you should have a look at https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/594287, especially ALL the associated comments (click on "Show 7 more comments")." > > When I did a *fresh* minimal install of Debian about two years ago, I didn't install the whole Gnome DE. Instead, I installed the following packages: xorg gnome-core gnome-tweak-tool synaptic file-roller gedit > > A few days ago, after reading replies from some posters, I purged the package called unattended-upgrades. I don't know how and when it was installed in the first place. You see, about two years I chose the option Expert Install (without GUI) and during the installation process, I chose the option to not install updates automatically. > > After reading what was written in the page (https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/594287), I disabled the package called PackageKit today. Only time will tell if said step works. > > By the way, does Ubuntu use the full or stripped-down version of Gnome Desktop Environment? > > *fresh* = not upgraded from Debian Stretch > I use Ubuntu. I removed the ubuntu desktop and installed vanilla gnome. Google: 'Converting Ubuntu 20.04 LTS to Vanilla Gnome3' After I disabled timers, I rebooted. apt-update && apt-upgrade. After that I had one popup that said I had upgrades pending. The apt timer was set to expire in 3 hours...
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 12:50 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CmfyO-5vq-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235869 |
Hi Thomas > Sent: Friday, June 04, 2021 at 6:02 PM > From: "Thomas D. Dean" <tomdean@wavecable.com> > To: debian-user@lists.debian.org > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > > I use Ubuntu. I removed the ubuntu desktop and installed vanilla gnome. > Google: > 'Converting Ubuntu 20.04 LTS to Vanilla Gnome3' According to the website "The 8 Best Ubuntu Desktop Environments (20.04 Focal Fossa Linux)" [https://linuxconfig.org/the-8-best-ubuntu-desktop-environments-20-04-focal-fossa-linux], Ubuntu 20.04 LTS comes with the default Gnome 3.36 desktop. > > After I disabled timers, I rebooted. apt-update && apt-upgrade. After > that I had one popup that said I had upgrades pending. The apt timer > was set to expire in 3 hours... See...you'd an automatic download of updates.....
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 17:40 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Cmk5r-8fA-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235870 |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
On Fri 04 Jun 2021 at 12:40:26 (+0200), Stella Ashburne wrote: > > Sent: Friday, June 04, 2021 at 6:02 PM > > From: "Thomas D. Dean" <tomdean@wavecable.com> > > > > I use Ubuntu. I removed the ubuntu desktop and installed vanilla gnome. > > Google: > > 'Converting Ubuntu 20.04 LTS to Vanilla Gnome3' > > According to the website "The 8 Best Ubuntu Desktop Environments (20.04 Focal Fossa Linux)" [https://linuxconfig.org/the-8-best-ubuntu-desktop-environments-20-04-focal-fossa-linux], Ubuntu 20.04 LTS comes with the default Gnome 3.36 desktop. > > > > After I disabled timers, I rebooted. apt-update && apt-upgrade. After > > that I had one popup that said I had upgrades pending. The apt timer > > was set to expire in 3 hours... > > See...you'd an automatic download of updates..... Here are a few files with which you might compare your own versions while you look for clues. This system has no DE installed and, unusually for me, it has no cron job to update/upgrade the system. It's been languishing for nearly a fortnight while I was on holiday, and apt has shown no signs of stirring, even though I know from my master system that yelp should be demanding a dist-upgrade (for new packages). Like you, I selected no-unattended-security-upgrades during installation, but I may have packages that you lack (like, say, apt-file) which will put extra lines in the configuration. The cron job that's missing from this machine is # check for updated packages and provoke an email if any are in the cache 0 */3 * * * apt-get -qq update && apt-get -qq -d upgrade && find /var/cache/apt/archives/ -name '*deb' which, of course, does exactly what you're trying to avoid! (For the guardians of Debian bandwidth: all my systems proxy off apt-cacher-ng running on the system I'm typing on.) Cheers, David.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 14:00 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CmgEx-6aP-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235862 |
On Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 02:15:24AM +0200, Stella Ashburne wrote:
> Output of systemctl list-timers | grep apt
>
> Thu 2021-06-03 20:29:30 GMT 9h left Thu 2021-06-03 09:18:00 GMT 1h 17min ago apt-daily.timer apt-daily.service
> Fri 2021-06-04 06:51:16 GMT 20h left Thu 2021-06-03 09:18:00 GMT 1h 17min ago apt-daily-upgrade.timer apt-daily-upgrade.service
Yes, you posted this already.
The point wasn't for you to copy and paste the output here and wait
for someone to hand-hold you through the next step. The point was
for you to read and understand the output yourself.
You've got these two systemd timers. Now you have their names, and you
know when they last triggered, and when they will trigger in the future.
Given their names (and the fact of their *existence*) you can investigate
further and learn what they do.
You could also correlate the time that the timer last triggered against
the time that the packages were downloaded, to confirm causality. If
you've waited too long, and the downloads actually occurred in a previous
cycle, then consider using "journalctl -u unitname" to get the full logs
from that unit.
Here are some more hints:
1) You can use "systemctl cat" followed by a unit name to get a dump of
the "unit file" (which may not be a single file) which defines that
unit.
2) Prior messages in this thread contain analysis of some of these
systemd units and the Debian tools that they call upon.
2a) The Debian tools that these units call have configuration files
which control what they do. Documentation is sketchy, but most
of these tools are scripts, so you can read the scripts. That's
part of the analysis that's already been done which you seem
to have skipped over.
3) Calling "systemctl disable" only works for *services*, and all it
does is remove them from the list of services that get launched at
boot time. It does nothing for units that are triggered by other
means than booting.
4) Calling "systemctl mask" will completely remove *all* possibility of
a unit being invoked, by booting, or by socket trigger, or being
called by some other unit, etc.
5) If journalctl isn't showing you logs from before your last reboot,
it's possible that you haven't enabled the persistent journal yet.
The persistent journal wasn't the default in Debian prior to (I think)
bullseye, which of course is not released yet.
To enable the persistent journal, see systemd-journald(8). There is
a simple two-line recipe in there.
6) Nobody knows what the fuck GNOME does. If GNOME's doing something
that you dislike, well, uh... that's unfortunate. But there's a
reason most of us don't run it. Several reasons, in fact.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside <debian@polynamaude.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 14:40 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Cmhhg-6Cc-7@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235871 |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
Hi, On 2021-06-04 7:59 a.m., Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 02:15:24AM +0200, Stella Ashburne wrote: >> Output of systemctl list-timers | grep apt >> >> Thu 2021-06-03 20:29:30 GMT 9h left Thu 2021-06-03 09:18:00 GMT 1h 17min ago apt-daily.timer apt-daily.service >> Fri 2021-06-04 06:51:16 GMT 20h left Thu 2021-06-03 09:18:00 GMT 1h 17min ago apt-daily-upgrade.timer apt-daily-upgrade.service > > Yes, you posted this already. > > The point wasn't for you to copy and paste the output here and wait > for someone to hand-hold you through the next step. The point was > for you to read and understand the output yourself. > > You've got these two systemd timers. Now you have their names, and you > know when they last triggered, and when they will trigger in the future. > > Given their names (and the fact of their *existence*) you can investigate > further and learn what they do. > > You could also correlate the time that the timer last triggered against > the time that the packages were downloaded, to confirm causality. If > you've waited too long, and the downloads actually occurred in a previous > cycle, then consider using "journalctl -u unitname" to get the full logs > from that unit. > > Here are some more hints: > > 1) You can use "systemctl cat" followed by a unit name to get a dump of > the "unit file" (which may not be a single file) which defines that > unit. > > 2) Prior messages in this thread contain analysis of some of these > systemd units and the Debian tools that they call upon. > > 2a) The Debian tools that these units call have configuration files > which control what they do. Documentation is sketchy, but most > of these tools are scripts, so you can read the scripts. That's > part of the analysis that's already been done which you seem > to have skipped over. > > 3) Calling "systemctl disable" only works for *services*, and all it > does is remove them from the list of services that get launched at > boot time. It does nothing for units that are triggered by other > means than booting. > > 4) Calling "systemctl mask" will completely remove *all* possibility of > a unit being invoked, by booting, or by socket trigger, or being > called by some other unit, etc. > > 5) If journalctl isn't showing you logs from before your last reboot, > it's possible that you haven't enabled the persistent journal yet. > The persistent journal wasn't the default in Debian prior to (I think) > bullseye, which of course is not released yet. > > To enable the persistent journal, see systemd-journald(8). There is > a simple two-line recipe in there. > > 6) Nobody knows what the fuck GNOME does. If GNOME's doing something > that you dislike, well, uh... that's unfortunate. But there's a > reason most of us don't run it. Several reasons, in fact. > No one asked you for opinion regarding a particular desktop environment or if it's a good choice to run it or not. Those type of comment are at least useless at most unproductive. Yes there's people who know what GNOME does and how it's done, there's even people who look into the source code... And people who investigated GNOME the same way you tell this guy to investigate some actions of the timers... GNOME is part of the Debian distribution so this type of opinionated answer shall not arrive. This seem as sterile discussion as talking to some hard head politician... And it goes nowhere... -- Polyna-Maude R.-Summerside -Be smart, Be wise, Support opensource development
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 17:40 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Cmk5s-8fA-11@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235876 |
On Fri 04 Jun 2021 at 08:35:38 (-0400), Polyna-Maude Racicot-Summerside wrote: > On 2021-06-04 7:59 a.m., Greg Wooledge wrote: > > On Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 02:15:24AM +0200, Stella Ashburne wrote: > >> Output of systemctl list-timers | grep apt > >> > >> Thu 2021-06-03 20:29:30 GMT 9h left Thu 2021-06-03 09:18:00 GMT 1h 17min ago apt-daily.timer apt-daily.service > >> Fri 2021-06-04 06:51:16 GMT 20h left Thu 2021-06-03 09:18:00 GMT 1h 17min ago apt-daily-upgrade.timer apt-daily-upgrade.service > > > > Yes, you posted this already. > > > > The point wasn't for you to copy and paste the output here and wait > > for someone to hand-hold you through the next step. The point was > > for you to read and understand the output yourself. > > > > You've got these two systemd timers. Now you have their names, and you > > know when they last triggered, and when they will trigger in the future. > > > > Given their names (and the fact of their *existence*) you can investigate > > further and learn what they do. > > > > You could also correlate the time that the timer last triggered against > > the time that the packages were downloaded, to confirm causality. If > > you've waited too long, and the downloads actually occurred in a previous > > cycle, then consider using "journalctl -u unitname" to get the full logs > > from that unit. > > > > Here are some more hints: > > > > 1) You can use "systemctl cat" followed by a unit name to get a dump of > > the "unit file" (which may not be a single file) which defines that > > unit. > > > > 2) Prior messages in this thread contain analysis of some of these > > systemd units and the Debian tools that they call upon. > > > > 2a) The Debian tools that these units call have configuration files > > which control what they do. Documentation is sketchy, but most > > of these tools are scripts, so you can read the scripts. That's > > part of the analysis that's already been done which you seem > > to have skipped over. > > > > 3) Calling "systemctl disable" only works for *services*, and all it > > does is remove them from the list of services that get launched at > > boot time. It does nothing for units that are triggered by other > > means than booting. > > > > 4) Calling "systemctl mask" will completely remove *all* possibility of > > a unit being invoked, by booting, or by socket trigger, or being > > called by some other unit, etc. > > > > 5) If journalctl isn't showing you logs from before your last reboot, > > it's possible that you haven't enabled the persistent journal yet. > > The persistent journal wasn't the default in Debian prior to (I think) > > bullseye, which of course is not released yet. > > > > To enable the persistent journal, see systemd-journald(8). There is > > a simple two-line recipe in there. > > > > 6) Nobody knows what the fuck GNOME does. If GNOME's doing something > > that you dislike, well, uh... that's unfortunate. But there's a > > reason most of us don't run it. Several reasons, in fact. > > No one asked you for opinion regarding a particular desktop environment > or if it's a good choice to run it or not. Those type of comment are at > least useless at most unproductive. Actually, I find candid opinions posted here about software to be useful. Many times I have written "I don't know anything about DEs as I don't run one", but I don't expect my opinion to carry any weight here. > Yes there's people who know what GNOME does and how it's done, there's > even people who look into the source code... And people who investigated > GNOME the same way you tell this guy to investigate some actions of the > timers... Nobody here is censoring them. But my impression is that we don't hear from them very often. > GNOME is part of the Debian distribution so this type of opinionated > answer shall not arrive. This seem as sterile discussion as talking to > some hard head politician... And it goes nowhere... So I guess this means that around 58000 pieces of software should be protected from having opinions passed on them. It hasn't worked out so well for systemd. Someone recently argued that respect for people here had to be earned (I'm not sure how). I'd argue rather that it's their opinions that have to earn respect, by being evaluated in the context of their other contributions. We can then all make our own individual judgements. Cheers, David.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Reco <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 15:30 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Cmi3E-76E-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235871 |
Hi. On Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 07:59:31AM -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote: > On Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 02:15:24AM +0200, Stella Ashburne wrote: > > Output of systemctl list-timers | grep apt > > > > Thu 2021-06-03 20:29:30 GMT 9h left Thu 2021-06-03 09:18:00 GMT 1h 17min ago apt-daily.timer apt-daily.service > > Fri 2021-06-04 06:51:16 GMT 20h left Thu 2021-06-03 09:18:00 GMT 1h 17min ago apt-daily-upgrade.timer apt-daily-upgrade.service > > Yes, you posted this already. > > The point wasn't for you to copy and paste the output here and wait > for someone to hand-hold you through the next step. The point was > for you to read and understand the output yourself. I'd like to add here that: - apt-daily is written to respect APT::Periodic::* settings, and you have those unset. - in this very thread a possibility of a custom cron job that download updates was excluded. - therefore it's simply wrong to include in the result of "systemctl list-timers" only "apt" timers and exclude everything else, since your problem can lie in those excluded timers. > 3) Calling "systemctl disable" only works for *services*, That not how it works, actually. systemctl disable can be used to disable any timer, but you have to specify it explicitly. I.e. systemctl disable apt-daily.timer Running "systemctl disable" on a service that's called by timer should do nothing indeed. Reco
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-04 19:40 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CmlXz-T6-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235882 |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
On Vi, 04 iun 21, 16:24:32, Reco wrote: > Hi. > > On Fri, Jun 04, 2021 at 07:59:31AM -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote: > > > 3) Calling "systemctl disable" only works for *services*, > > That not how it works, actually. > systemctl disable can be used to disable any timer, but you have to > specify it explicitly. I.e. > > systemctl disable apt-daily.timer > > Running "systemctl disable" on a service that's called by timer should > do nothing indeed. Agreed. On the other hand disabling the systemd timer might not have the desired effect if an equivalent cron job exists as well and cron is installed (by default it is). Side note: cron jobs that have an equivalent systemd timer should check if running under systemd and do nothing. On my system /etc/cron.daily/apt-compat does contain such a check, but maybe I missed some other cron job that might be invoked, I've lost track of what else was mentioned in the thread. Kind regards, Andrei -- http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-03 04:00 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <ClKOl-3rX-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235805 |
Hi Reco Thanks for your help and time. I really appreciate it. > Sent: Thursday, June 03, 2021 at 12:33 AM > From: "Reco" <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> > To: debian-user@lists.debian.org > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > > The most important parts of "systemctl list-timers" (your problem > considered) are UNIT and ACTIVATES columns, and your result lacks them > for some reason. > What does "your result lacks them for some reason" mean? Could you elaborate it please? Stella
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-05-29 15:00 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Ck6Jj-1rG-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235641 |
On Sat, May 29, 2021 at 09:49:06AM +0300, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > In the case of configuration files (basically everything that is under > /etc and a few other places) it can cause unexpected or even unsafe > behaviour as the software might revert to built-in defaults that could > be wrong for your system. Also worth noting: if you remove a conffile and then think "Oops, I didn't mean to do that, let me reinstall the package to get it back", you will be surprised. The conffile will not be replaced. Your action of deleting the conffile while retaining the package is explicitly noted by the package manager, and respected as a conscious choice. If you want to replace a deleted conffile, you may either *purge* the package and then reinstall it, or use the --force-confmiss flag to dpkg. On Sat, May 29, 2021 at 10:06:09AM +0300, Andrei POPESCU wrote: > APT (the software package) doesn't autoremove packages, though it might > suggest you to do that when you use the 'apt' command. > > aptitude in its default configuration will do so on every occasion, so > you might want to avoid using it for package installs, removals, etc. tasksel will also perform an autoremove for you without asking you. It was after this happened to me that I investigated how to disable apt's autoremove feature. See also <https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=868892>.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-05-30 12:50 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Ckrb3-5bS-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235646 |
Hi Greg, > Sent: Saturday, May 29, 2021 at 8:58 PM > From: "Greg Wooledge" <greg@wooledge.org> > To: debian-user@lists.debian.org > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > > tasksel will also perform an autoremove for you without asking you. > It was after this happened to me that I investigated how to disable > apt's autoremove feature. > Thanks for your observation about tasksel and autoremove. About the only time that I encountered tasksel was during the installation of Debian. Since you mentioned tasksel in your reply, how do you invoke tasksel? Do you just type tasksel in a terminal?
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-05-30 13:20 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CkrE6-5AO-5@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235670 |
Hi > Sent: Sunday, May 30, 2021 at 7:00 PM > From: tomas@tuxteam.de > To: "Stella Ashburne" <rewefie@gmx.com> > Cc: "Greg Wooledge" <greg@wooledge.org>, debian-user@lists.debian.org > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > > Not Greg here, but... yes, you can do that. And there's even a man > page :) Thanks for your reply. Best wishes.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | <tomas@tuxteam.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-05-30 13:10 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Ckrup-5xE-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235670 |
[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw
On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 12:45:13PM +0200, Stella Ashburne wrote: [...] > Thanks for your observation about tasksel and autoremove. > > About the only time that I encountered tasksel was during the installation of Debian. > > Since you mentioned tasksel in your reply, how do you invoke tasksel? Do you just type tasksel in a terminal? Not Greg here, but... yes, you can do that. And there's even a man page :) Cheers - t
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-05-30 13:00 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CkrkJ-5f6-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235641 |
Hi Andrei > Sent: Saturday, May 29, 2021 at 3:06 PM > From: "Andrei POPESCU" <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> > To: debian-user@lists.debian.org > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > > aptitude was deprecated for some very specific uses only (in particular > dist-upgrades), not because it couldn't do them, but because APT found > better solutions. It also didn't help that development of aptitude was > stopped for a while. Yeah, I remember somewhat clearly that someone in www.reddit.com/r/debian advised me to use "sudo apt upgrade" instead of aptitude because with the former, I can see the green-colored progress bar during the installation of packages. > > In this particular case, apt doesn't have a 'why' command, hence the > suggestion to use aptitude instead. > Thanks for your advice and time. I really appreciate it. Best regards.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-05-28 20:30 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CjPp8-7Xl-5@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235608 |
Hello, > Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 at 7:43 PM > From: l0f4r0@tuta.io > To: "Debian User" <debian-user@lists.debian.org> > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > > > unattended-upgrades is not installed by default, so you installed that package at some point because you were interested in applying upgrades automatically. I'm sorry but your understanding is incorrect. I'm sure I've never installed it at any point in the course of using Debisn. I remember very clearly that when I first installed Debian on my machine, I did specify that I didn't want automatic upgrades. > Now, you are not interested anymore. So you have chosen to delete the configuration file /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades and disabled the systemd service unattended-upgrades. I've never wanted upgrades/updates to be automatic. > No I don't have it, it's installed with the optional package "unattended-upgrades". I'm very certain that I didn't install the package "unattended-upgrades". My knowledge of computing and Debian is elementary so much so that I'd never install packages that seem weird or alien to me. > > Strictly speaking, /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades is a file, not a package. > A package is a combination of files provided for your Debian distribution. > I just wanted to make sure you didn't talk about removing the "unattended-upgrades" package. Thanks for your explanation. > > By the way, I think you should not have deleted that file. That's somewhat dirty. I still have that file because I'd moved it to my removable backup drive. Should I restore it? What do you think? > If you want to make a pause with a package, just stop it and disable it (or tweak the configuration file so there is no real action processed). Just so you know, my knowledge of Debian and computing is basic/elementary (meaning, I don't know how to tweak configuration files...). > > If you are sure not to use some optional package, then remove or even purge it. You suggest that I purge the optional package "unattended-upgrades".... What happens if that package is a dependency of some other packages? What commands can I type to show that the package "unattended=upgrades" is or isn't a dependency of some other packages? Thanks for your help and time. I really appreciate it. Best regards.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | l0f4r0@tuta.io |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-05-28 14:10 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CjJtn-4rI-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235594 |
28 mai 2021, 13:43 de l0f4r0@tuta.io: > I think you won't update/upgrade automatically anymore (by the way you say you haven't noticed this behavior so far), but time will confirm. > Correction: I meant if you still have updates/upgrades, then it shouldn't be because of package unattended-upgrades. So you would have to dig somewhere else... l0f4r0
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-05-29 01:40 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <CjUf8-2kG-1@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235611 |
Hi Thanks for your help and time. I really appreciate it. > Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 at 8:05 PM > From: l0f4r0@tuta.io > To: "Debian User" <debian-user@lists.debian.org> > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > > Correction: I meant if you still have updates/upgrades, then it shouldn't be because of package unattended-upgrades. So you would have to dig somewhere else... Oh my God, are you telling me that we are not done with this "whatever thing you may call it"? I thought I could close this matter......lol Based on your vast experience of using Linux in general and Debian in particular, can you think of any other packages or files that could download software and security updates silently in the background? Best regards.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-01 19:30 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <Clgnf-2eX-3@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235611 |
Hi > Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2021 at 9:39 PM > From: "Reco" <recoverym4n@enotuniq.net> > To: debian-user@lists.debian.org > Subject: Re: How do I permanently disable unattended downloads of software/security updates? > As you can see from the screenshot, my OS has surreptitiously downloaded software/security updates without my manual intervention. This behavior is not what I like and it's the subject of my original post. > > The devil is in the details, as they say. > "sudo apt upgrade" shows that it does not need to download anything, > because: > > > > username@localhost:~$ sudo apt upgrade > ... > > > Need to get 0 B/20.2 MB of archives. > Exactly. The notification about software updates being available was the first thing that popped up on my OS (see screenshot: https://ibb.co/5xP7r5t). This was confirmed by the message "Need to get 0 B/20.2 MB of archives". > I'm curious what will be shown in this configuration by: > > apt-config dump | grep Periodic > One kind person has already asked me for the output of apt-config dump | grep -i APT::Periodic Below is the output of the above command: APT::Periodic ""; APT::Periodic::Download-Upgradeable-Packages "0"; APT::Periodic::Unattended-Upgrade "0";
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-06-01 20:00 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <ClgQi-2om-5@gated-at.bofh.it> |
| In reply to | #235765 |
Stella Ashburne wrote: > As you can see from the screenshot, my OS has surreptitiously downloaded software/security updates without my manual intervention. This behavior is not what I like and it's the subject of my original post. > > > > > The devil is in the details, as they say. > > "sudo apt upgrade" shows that it does not need to download anything, > > because: > > > > > > username@localhost:~$ sudo apt upgrade > > ... > > > > Need to get 0 B/20.2 MB of archives. > > > Exactly. The notification about software updates being available was the first thing that popped up on my OS (see screenshot: https://ibb.co/5xP7r5t). This was confirmed by the message "Need to get 0 B/20.2 MB of archives". > > > I'm curious what will be shown in this configuration by: > > > > apt-config dump | grep Periodic > > > One kind person has already asked me for the output of > > apt-config dump | grep -i APT::Periodic > > Below is the output of the above command: > > APT::Periodic ""; > APT::Periodic::Download-Upgradeable-Packages "0"; > APT::Periodic::Unattended-Upgrade "0"; This really looks like something being done by your desktop system rather than at the OS level. Fire up dconf-editor, look at org.gnome.software, and see if "download-updates" is checked. If so, uncheck it. -dsr-
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
Page 3 of 4 — ← Prev page 1 2 [3] 4 Next page →
Back to top | Article view | linux.debian.user
csiph-web