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thunderbird

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  thunderbird fxkl47BF <fxkl47BF@protonmail.com> - 2021-05-30 20:30 +0200
    Re: thunderbird Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> - 2021-05-30 22:00 +0200
    Re: thunderbird Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2021-05-30 21:50 +0200
      Re: thunderbird Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2021-05-30 23:20 +0200
        Re: thunderbird James Wallen <jpwallen@comcast.net> - 2021-05-30 23:50 +0200
      Re: thunderbird James Wallen <jpwallen@comcast.net> - 2021-05-30 23:00 +0200
        Re: thunderbird rust <rustbuckett@pm.me> - 2021-05-31 02:30 +0200
          Re: thunderbird James Wallen <jpwallen@comcast.net> - 2021-05-31 03:00 +0200
            Re: thunderbird The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2021-05-31 12:00 +0200
              Re: thunderbird rust <rustbuckett@pm.me> - 2021-05-31 14:10 +0200
                Re: thunderbird didier gaumet <didier.gaumet@gmail.com> - 2021-05-31 15:10 +0200
                  Re: thunderbird Erwan David <erwan@rail.eu.org> - 2021-05-31 15:20 +0200
                    Re: thunderbird rust <rustbuckett@pm.me> - 2021-06-02 00:50 +0200
                  Re: thunderbird The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2021-05-31 15:30 +0200
              Re: thunderbird James Wallen <jpwallen@comcast.net> - 2021-05-31 17:30 +0200
            Re: thunderbird rust <rustbuckett@pm.me> - 2021-05-31 14:00 +0200
      Re: thunderbird <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-05-30 23:00 +0200
    Re: thunderbird Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2021-05-30 22:10 +0200
      Re: thunderbird Doug McGarrett <dmcgarrett@optonline.net> - 2021-05-30 22:50 +0200
        Re: thunderbird Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> - 2021-05-30 23:00 +0200
          Re: thunderbird Charlie <taoquester@gmail.com> - 2021-05-31 01:00 +0200
        Re: thunderbird Frank McCormick <debianlist@videotron.ca> - 2021-05-31 01:20 +0200
    Re: thunderbird Bret Busby <bret@busby.net> - 2021-05-30 22:30 +0200
      Re: thunderbird ghe2001 <ghe2001@protonmail.com> - 2021-05-30 23:00 +0200
        Re: thunderbird <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-05-31 08:50 +0200
          Re: thunderbird Marco Möller <talby@debianlists.mobilxpress.net> - 2021-05-31 10:40 +0200
            Re: thunderbird <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-05-31 11:20 +0200
              Re: thunderbird Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2021-05-31 16:10 +0200
                Re: thunderbird Marco Möller <talby@debianlists.mobilxpress.net> - 2021-05-31 17:40 +0200
                  Matrix (was Re: thunderbird) The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2021-05-31 18:00 +0200
                  Re: thunderbird <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-05-31 18:00 +0200
                    Re: thunderbird Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2021-05-31 19:00 +0200
                    Re: thunderbird Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-01 09:50 +0200
          Re: thunderbird rust <rustbuckett@pm.me> - 2021-05-31 14:10 +0200
          Re: thunderbird Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-06-01 10:20 +0200
            Re: thunderbird Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> - 2021-06-01 10:30 +0200
      Re: thunderbird Bret Busby <bret@busby.net> - 2021-05-30 23:10 +0200
      Re: thunderbird Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2021-05-30 23:30 +0200
    Re: thunderbird Marco Möller <talby@debianlists.mobilxpress.net> - 2021-05-31 01:20 +0200
      Re: thunderbird Marco Möller <talby@debianlists.mobilxpress.net> - 2021-05-31 10:00 +0200
    Re: thunderbird rust <rustbuckett@pm.me> - 2021-05-31 02:30 +0200
    Re: thunderbird Stella Ashburne <rewefie@gmx.com> - 2021-05-31 03:10 +0200

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#235679 — thunderbird

for a few decades i have used pine/alpine.
i'm considering a new mail application.
there are more out there than you can shake a stick at.
what are your thoughts of thunderbird.

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#235680

On 31-05-2021 05:48, Dan Ritter wrote:
> fxkl47BF wrote: 
>> for a few decades i have used pine/alpine.
>> i'm considering a new mail application.
>> there are more out there than you can shake a stick at.
>> what are your thoughts of thunderbird.
> 
> It's very popular with people who need to point-and-click at
> everything.
> 
> If you are willing to invest an hour or two into learning it, 
> mutt is the best mail user agent available, especially when you
> have local mail storage and can install one of the mail search
> companions, plus a filtering system like courier's mailfilter.

A vote for ClawsMail, with all installed options.
I threw Thunderbird away for it.
Cheers!

Harry
-- 
‘The issues are too important to be left for the voters’. 
― Henry Kissinger

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#235681

fxkl47BF wrote: 
> for a few decades i have used pine/alpine.
> i'm considering a new mail application.
> there are more out there than you can shake a stick at.
> what are your thoughts of thunderbird.

It's very popular with people who need to point-and-click at
everything.

If you are willing to invest an hour or two into learning it, 
mutt is the best mail user agent available, especially when you
have local mail storage and can install one of the mail search
companions, plus a filtering system like courier's mailfilter.

-dsr-

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#235688

On Sun, 30 May 2021 16:56:17 -0400
James Wallen <jpwallen@comcast.net> wrote:

> If I could find a text / TUI mode calendar to work with mutt I'd 
> certainly like to switch.

Take a look at claws-mail's calendar plug-in. Not text, but it might
let you use claws-mail.

-- 
Does anybody read signatures any more?

https://charlescurley.com
https://charlescurley.com/blog/

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#235694

On 5/30/21 5:18 PM, Charles Curley wrote:
> On Sun, 30 May 2021 16:56:17 -0400
> James Wallen <jpwallen@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
>> If I could find a text / TUI mode calendar to work with mutt I'd
>> certainly like to switch.
> 
> Take a look at claws-mail's calendar plug-in. Not text, but it might
> let you use claws-mail.
> 
Thanks! I should have looked a bit more carefully when I thought of 
claws-mail. I'm beginning to get the idea that claws-mail works best if 
you install every associated package. That's not something I normally do 
when testing new (to me) packages, but I guess it's what works best with 
claws-mail. On my system the mouse is used almost exclusively for 
aisleriot and mahjongg.

I'm particularly fond of software that lets me keep my hands on the 
keyboard. I use window tiling features under Xfce4 and a suite of 
software that lets me largely avoid the mouse. I'll give claws-mail a try.

JPW

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#235689

On 5/30/21 3:48 PM, Dan Ritter wrote:
> fxkl47BF wrote:
>> for a few decades i have used pine/alpine.
>> i'm considering a new mail application.
>> there are more out there than you can shake a stick at.
>> what are your thoughts of thunderbird.
> 
> It's very popular with people who need to point-and-click at
> everything.
> 
> If you are willing to invest an hour or two into learning it,
> mutt is the best mail user agent available, especially when you
> have local mail storage and can install one of the mail search
> companions, plus a filtering system like courier's mailfilter.
> 
> -dsr-
> 

I'd prefer to use a client like mutt, but I've resorted to using 
Thunderbird because I find the integrated calendar to be useful.

Incidentally, I can use all of Thunderbird's mail functions from the 
keyboard. But I do have to use the mouse almost exclusively for 
controlling the calendar, which has actually got worse about this issue 
in the most recent versions.

If I could find a text / TUI mode calendar to work with mutt I'd 
certainly like to switch.

JPW

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#235699

On 5/30/21 9:00 PM, James Wallen wrote:
> 
> If I could find a text / TUI mode calendar to work with mutt I'd 
> certainly like to switch.
> 
> JPW

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "work with mutt", but khalendar is 
pretty cool.

-- 
rust

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#235703

On 5/30/21 8:03 PM, rust wrote:
> On 5/30/21 9:00 PM, James Wallen wrote:
>>
>> If I could find a text / TUI mode calendar to work with mutt I'd 
>> certainly like to switch.
>>
>> JPW
> 
> I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "work with mutt", but khalendar is 
> pretty cool.
> 
I'm unable to locate "khalendar" in the repositories. I can't even find 
mention of it in general search engines. Is there a home url for it? 
Does the "k" at the beginning of the name indicate that it is part of kde?

Thunderbird and its calendar (derived from Lightning) are nicely 
integrated, with the exception of the calendar requiring a lot of 
mousing around to use it. You can send and receive invitations or 
assignments for appointments / events / tasks.

JPW

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#235731

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On 2021-05-30 at 20:59, James Wallen wrote:
> 
> On 5/30/21 8:03 PM, rust wrote:
>> On 5/30/21 9:00 PM, James Wallen wrote:
>> 
>>> If I could find a text / TUI mode calendar to work with mutt I'd
>>>  certainly like to switch.

>> I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "work with mutt", but
>> khalendar is pretty cool.
> 
> I'm unable to locate "khalendar" in the repositories. I can't even
> find mention of it in general search engines. Is there a home url for
> it? Does the "k" at the beginning of the name indicate that it is
> part of kde?

I had the same problem, but a bit of guesswork involving 'apt-cache
search alendar' led me to the package 'khal', which looks like probably
what was being referenced.

> Thunderbird and its calendar (derived from Lightning) are nicely
> integrated, with the exception of the calendar requiring a lot of
> mousing around to use it. You can send and receive invitations or
> assignments for appointments / events / tasks.

I'm sure it's nice, but I don't use it myself (despite being a
longstanding user of Thunderbird), specifically because it is
integrated; I want a standalone calendar tool, and in fact I found
Sunbird (which I understand to be the ancestor of Lightning) almost
ideal, back before the ability to build that separately was dropped.

-- 
   The Wanderer

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all
progress depends on the unreasonable man.         -- George Bernard Shaw

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#235733

On 5/31/21 10:00 AM, The Wanderer wrote:
> 
> I had the same problem, but a bit of guesswork involving 'apt-cache
> search alendar' led me to the package 'khal', which looks like probably
> what was being referenced.
> 

That's the one! Sorry. I should have checked.

> 
> I'm sure it's nice, but I don't use it myself (despite being a
> longstanding user of Thunderbird), specifically because it is
> integrated; I want a standalone calendar tool, and in fact I found
> Sunbird (which I understand to be the ancestor of Lightning) almost
> ideal, back before the ability to build that separately was dropped.
> 

Sunbird huh? I'll have to take a look. Part of what led me (back) to
Thunderbird was the calendar. There are surprisingly few standalone,
graphical calendars that are still being developed for linux.

-- 
rust

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#235736

Le 31/05/2021 à 13:45, rust a écrit :

> Sunbird huh? I'll have to take a look. Part of what led me (back) to
> Thunderbird was the calendar. There are surprisingly few standalone,
> graphical calendars that are still being developed for linux.

I think Sunbird has not been developped for 10 years

One can found several standalone GUI calendar/agenda debian packages: 
agenda.app (gnustep), orage (xfce), korganizer (KDE), gnome-calendar 
(gnome). The KDE and Gnome ones being more full-featured.

Gsimplecal is a simple calendar without the ability to handle events or 
meetings, I suppose.

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#235737

Le 31/05/2021 à 15:03, didier gaumet a écrit :
> Le 31/05/2021 à 13:45, rust a écrit :
> 
>> Sunbird huh? I'll have to take a look. Part of what led me (back) to
>> Thunderbird was the calendar. There are surprisingly few standalone,
>> graphical calendars that are still being developed for linux.
> 
> I think Sunbird has not been developped for 10 years
> 
> One can found several standalone GUI calendar/agenda debian packages: 
> agenda.app (gnustep), orage (xfce), korganizer (KDE), gnome-calendar 
> (gnome). The KDE and Gnome ones being more full-featured.
> 
> Gsimplecal is a simple calendar without the ability to handle events or 
> meetings, I suppose.
> 
> 
> 

I do not know for Gnome claendar, but KDE calendar is not what I would 
call standalone. It is a module of KDEPin and in some cases (eg with 
office 365 connector) you cannot synchronize calendar without 
synchronizing mail.

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#235793

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On 5/31/21 1:20 PM, Erwan David wrote:
> Le 31/05/2021 à 15:03, didier gaumet a écrit :
>> Le 31/05/2021 à 13:45, rust a écrit :
>>
>>> Sunbird huh? I'll have to take a look. Part of what led me (back) to
>>> Thunderbird was the calendar. There are surprisingly few standalone,
>>> graphical calendars that are still being developed for linux.
>>
>> I think Sunbird has not been developped for 10 years
>>
>> One can found several standalone GUI calendar/agenda debian packages:
>> agenda.app (gnustep), orage (xfce), korganizer (KDE), gnome-calendar
>> (gnome). The KDE and Gnome ones being more full-featured.
>>
>> Gsimplecal is a simple calendar without the ability to handle events
>> or meetings, I suppose.
>>
>>
>>
> 
> I do not know for Gnome claendar, but KDE calendar is not what I would
> call standalone. It is a module of KDEPin and in some cases (eg with
> office 365 connector) you cannot synchronize calendar without
> synchronizing mail.

I wouldn't consider Gnome Calendar standalone either. It requires
Gnome-Passkey and/or Gnome Online Accounts. If you're just wanting to
install a calendar independent of desktop environment, Gnome Calendar
doesn't meet that requirement.

-- 
rust

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#235738

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On 2021-05-31 at 09:03, didier gaumet wrote:

> Le 31/05/2021 à 13:45, rust a écrit :
> 
>> Sunbird huh? I'll have to take a look. Part of what led me (back)
>> to Thunderbird was the calendar. There are surprisingly few
>> standalone, graphical calendars that are still being developed for
>> linux.
> 
> I think Sunbird has not been developped for 10 years

Beyond that: it's been dropped from the (Mozilla) source repositories
that once held it, and if you go back to the commit before it was
dropped, the resulting state is not buildable in a modern environment.
(IIRC from when I tried it, in an attempt to resurrect the standalone
program, the problem is the interdependency of different parts of that
tree and build system.)

My understanding is that it was dropped after its codebase was forked
into the form of the Lightning extension, but last I checked that
extension and its descendants came with the downside of being integrated
into Thunderbird, and specifically with the downside of appearing not as
a separate window but as a tab; I do not want a tab bar in my mail
client, period, so the fact that I can't use the calendar without having
one visible makes that line of descent a nonstarter for me.

I still have a Sunbird Portable install on one of my Windows computers
at work (albeit one which is now dead because the PSU failed), but have
never had a similarly good standalone calendar in a Linux environment.

-- 
   The Wanderer

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all
progress depends on the unreasonable man.         -- George Bernard Shaw

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#235748

On 5/31/21 5:55 AM, The Wanderer wrote:
> On 2021-05-30 at 20:59, James Wallen wrote:
>>
>> On 5/30/21 8:03 PM, rust wrote:
>>> On 5/30/21 9:00 PM, James Wallen wrote:
>>>
>>>> If I could find a text / TUI mode calendar to work with mutt I'd
>>>>   certainly like to switch.
> 
>>> I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "work with mutt", but
>>> khalendar is pretty cool.
>>
>> I'm unable to locate "khalendar" in the repositories. I can't even
>> find mention of it in general search engines. Is there a home url for
>> it? Does the "k" at the beginning of the name indicate that it is
>> part of kde?
> 
> I had the same problem, but a bit of guesswork involving 'apt-cache
> search alendar' led me to the package 'khal', which looks like probably
> what was being referenced.
> 

Thanks. For some reason it didn't occur to me in this instance to search 
for a part of the name I was given. I did try several altered spellings, 
but I kept on including the front of the word.

>> Thunderbird and its calendar (derived from Lightning) are nicely
>> integrated, with the exception of the calendar requiring a lot of
>> mousing around to use it. You can send and receive invitations or
>> assignments for appointments / events / tasks.
> 
> I'm sure it's nice, but I don't use it myself (despite being a
> longstanding user of Thunderbird), specifically because it is
> integrated; I want a standalone calendar tool, and in fact I found
> Sunbird (which I understand to be the ancestor of Lightning) almost
> ideal, back before the ability to build that separately was dropped.
> 

Yes, I used to use Sunbird.

The PIM was an important piece of software, but it seems to have gone 
the way of the dinosaur -- probably because of smart phones??? I don't 
own a smart phone. For my tastes and purposes smart phones just don't work.

Thank you for helping find khal, and please let us know if you find a 
really nice stand-alone calendar -- because that would work nicely for 
me if I switch to mutt or neomutt.

JPW

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#235732

On 5/31/21 1:00 AM, James Wallen wrote:

> I'm unable to locate "khalendar" in the repositories. I can't even find
> mention of it in general search engines. Is there a home url for it?
> Does the "k" at the beginning of the name indicate that it is part of kde?
> 


My mistake. It's just 'khal'

-- 
rust

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#235690

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On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 03:48:31PM -0400, Dan Ritter wrote:
> fxkl47BF wrote: 
> > for a few decades i have used pine/alpine.
> > i'm considering a new mail application.
> > there are more out there than you can shake a stick at.
> > what are your thoughts of thunderbird.
> 
> It's very popular with people who need to point-and-click at
> everything.
> 
> If you are willing to invest an hour or two into learning it, 
> mutt is the best mail user agent available [...]

If you liked (al)pine, you'll feel right at home with mutt.

Cheers
 - t

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#235682

On Sun, 30 May 2021 18:29:11 +0000
fxkl47BF <fxkl47BF@protonmail.com> wrote:

> for a few decades i have used pine/alpine.
> i'm considering a new mail application.
> there are more out there than you can shake a stick at.
> what are your thoughts of thunderbird.
> 

A bit slow and heavy for my liking. I used to use it, then switched to
Claws-Mail, which is faster and seems to do what I need.

-- 
Joe

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#235685

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On 5/30/21 4:04 PM, Joe wrote:
> On Sun, 30 May 2021 18:29:11 +0000
> fxkl47BF <fxkl47BF@protonmail.com> wrote:
>
>> for a few decades i have used pine/alpine.
>> i'm considering a new mail application.
>> there are more out there than you can shake a stick at.
>> what are your thoughts of thunderbird.
>>
> A bit slow and heavy for my liking. I used to use it, then switched to
> Claws-Mail, which is faster and seems to do what I need.
>
Thunderbird will find all the esoteric locations, etc. that email
systems need to function. Claws mail does not. If I knew how
to find the necessary information, I would try claws mail.
--doug

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#235686

On 31-05-2021 06:24, Doug McGarrett wrote:
> On 5/30/21 4:04 PM, Joe wrote:
> 
>> On Sun, 30 May 2021 18:29:11 +0000
>> fxkl47BF <fxkl47BF@protonmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> for a few decades i have used pine/alpine.
>>> i'm considering a new mail application.
>>> there are more out there than you can shake a stick at.
>>> what are your thoughts of thunderbird.
>>
>> A bit slow and heavy for my liking. I used to use it, then switched
>> to
>> Claws-Mail, which is faster and seems to do what I need.
>  Thunderbird will find all the esoteric locations, etc. that email
> systems need to function. Claws mail does not. If I knew how
> to find the necessary information, I would try claws mail.
> --doug

I run a small business with ClawsMail and it answers all requirements.
I find the problems others experience with it are associated with not
being familiar with the various installable options.
File transfer?
No problem!
And the calendar/appointments set up is excellent.
Cheers!

Harry.
-- 
‘The issues are too important to be left for the voters’. 
― Henry Kissinger

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