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new harddrive degraded speed

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  new harddrive degraded speed brainfart@posteo.net - 2021-01-21 00:30 +0100
    Re: new harddrive degraded speed deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2021-01-21 01:20 +0100
      Re: new harddrive degraded speed brainfart@posteo.net - 2021-01-21 01:40 +0100
        Re: new harddrive degraded speed "Alexander V. Makartsev" <avbetev@gmail.com> - 2021-01-21 19:00 +0100
    Re: new harddrive degraded speed Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2021-01-21 01:40 +0100
    Re: new harddrive degraded speed Felix Miata <mrmazda@earthlink.net> - 2021-01-21 01:50 +0100
      Re: new harddrive degraded speed brainfart@posteo.net - 2021-01-21 02:20 +0100
        Re: new harddrive degraded speed Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2021-01-21 02:30 +0100
          Re: new harddrive degraded speed brainfart@posteo.net - 2021-01-21 03:20 +0100
    Re: new harddrive degraded speed Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2021-01-21 06:50 +0100
      Re: new harddrive degraded speed Mark Allums <maa@allums.com> - 2021-01-21 17:40 +0100
        Re: new harddrive degraded speed Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2021-01-21 18:10 +0100
          Re: new harddrive degraded speed Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-01-21 19:50 +0100
            Re: new harddrive degraded speed brainfart@posteo.net - 2021-01-21 20:20 +0100
              Re: new harddrive degraded speed Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-01-21 20:40 +0100
          Re: new harddrive degraded speed Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2021-01-21 22:20 +0100
    Re: new harddrive degraded speed David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2021-01-21 22:10 +0100
      Re: new harddrive degraded speed basti <mailinglist@unix-solution.de> - 2021-01-21 22:40 +0100

#230900 — new harddrive degraded speed

i bought a new harddrive
western digital red plus 6tb

=== START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
Model Family:     Western Digital Red
Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
Serial Number:    WD-WX62D60C9L6X
LU WWN Device Id: 5 0014ee 212e6b9ad
Firmware Version: 82.00A82
User Capacity:    6,001,175,126,016 bytes [6.00 TB]
Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
Rotation Rate:    5700 rpm
Device is:        In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ACS-3 T13/2161-D revision 3b
SATA Version is:  SATA 3.1, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 3.0 Gb/s)
Local Time is:    Wed Jan 20 17:12:52 2021 CST
SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
SMART support is: Enabled

why is the speed 3.0 gbs
i have 4 other drive i have tested with this device and they all  use 
6.0 gbs

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#230901

brainfart@posteo.net wrote:

> why is the speed 3.0 gbs
> i have 4 other drive i have tested with this device and they all  use
> 6.0 gbs

check cables, connectors and controller - here 2TB WD20EFRX is on LSI that
supports only SATA 2

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#230904

On 2021-01-20 06:17 PM, deloptes wrote:
> brainfart@posteo.net wrote:
> 
>> why is the speed 3.0 gbs
>> i have 4 other drive i have tested with this device and they all  use
>> 6.0 gbs
> 
> check cables, connectors and controller - here 2TB WD20EFRX is on LSI 
> that
> supports only SATA 2

this device is a odroid hc4
it supports all my other drives a 6.0 gbs
i used a sata to usb adapter to connect this drive to my pc and it 
connects at 6.0 gbs

=== START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
Model Family:     Western Digital Red
Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
Serial Number:    WD-WX62D60C9L6X
LU WWN Device Id: 5 0014ee 212e6b9ad
Firmware Version: 82.00A82
User Capacity:    6,001,175,126,016 bytes [6.00 TB]
Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
Rotation Rate:    5700 rpm
Device is:        In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ACS-3 T13/2161-D revision 3b
SATA Version is:  SATA 3.1, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 6.0 Gb/s)
Local Time is:    Wed Jan 20 18:26:13 2021 CST
SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
SMART support is: Enabled


i guess i'm asking what decides how a device is going to connect
is there a database of devices that the kernel uses
i should say on my pc - 4.19.0-12-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.19.152-1 
(2020-10-18) x86_64
and the hc4 - 4.9.236-arm64 #1 SMP PREEMPT Sun Dec 20 21:57:12 CET 2020 
aarch64

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#230929

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On 21.01.2021 05:36, brainfart@posteo.net wrote:
>
> i guess i'm asking what decides how a device is going to connect
>
Both host controller and device controller are negotiating for a highest 
possible bandwidth.
If a host controller supports speeds up to 3.0Gb only, then device 
controller will operate at 3.0Gb, and it doesn't matter if the device 
supports faster speeds.

Usually, SATA connectors on motherboards are separated by capability and 
could be marked by different colors. Some of them support up to 3.0Gb 
only and others support up to 6.0Gb.
Read a manual for your motherboard to find out, if there are any 6.0Gb 
connectors and where are they located.


-- 
With kindest regards, Alexander.

⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Debian - The universal operating system
⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ https://www.debian.org
⠈⠳⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀

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#230903

brainfart@posteo.net wrote: 
> i bought a new harddrive
> western digital red plus 6tb
> 
> === START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
> Model Family:     Western Digital Red
> Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
> Serial Number:    WD-WX62D60C9L6X
> LU WWN Device Id: 5 0014ee 212e6b9ad
> Firmware Version: 82.00A82
> User Capacity:    6,001,175,126,016 bytes [6.00 TB]
> Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
> Rotation Rate:    5700 rpm
> Device is:        In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
> ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ACS-3 T13/2161-D revision 3b
> SATA Version is:  SATA 3.1, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 3.0 Gb/s)
> Local Time is:    Wed Jan 20 17:12:52 2021 CST
> SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
> SMART support is: Enabled
> 
> why is the speed 3.0 gbs
> i have 4 other drive i have tested with this device and they all  use 6.0
> gbs

That's not the speed, that's the negotiated transfer rate.

Since the drive can't read or write more than 130MB/s anyway -- about 1/3
of the interface speed -- the drive is probably not actually affected.

Also, note that it uses 4096 byte sectors but pretends that they
are 512.

Possible reasons for negotiating 3Gb/s vs 6Gb/s: bad cable, or
cable making tenuous contact, is the number one suspect.

-dsr-

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#230905

brainfart@posteo.net composed on 2021-01-20 17:21 (UTC-0600):

> i bought a new harddrive
> western digital red plus 6tb
...
> Model Family:     Western Digital Red
> Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
...
> why is the speed 3.0 gbs
> i have 4 other drive i have tested with this device and they all  use 
> 6.0 gbs

Have you tried other SATA cables, or switching the ones you have installed among
the drives?

How do 'hdparm -t' tests compare between it and your others?
-- 
Evolution as taught in public schools, like religion,
	is based on faith, not on science.

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

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#230907

On 2021-01-20 06:44 PM, Felix Miata wrote:
> brainfart@posteo.net composed on 2021-01-20 17:21 (UTC-0600):
> 
>> i bought a new harddrive
>> western digital red plus 6tb
> ...
>> Model Family:     Western Digital Red
>> Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
> ...
>> why is the speed 3.0 gbs
>> i have 4 other drive i have tested with this device and they all  use
>> 6.0 gbs
> 
> Have you tried other SATA cables, or switching the ones you have 
> installed among
> the drives?
> 
> How do 'hdparm -t' tests compare between it and your others?

this hc4 is a toaster device
no cables
on hc4

6tb drive at 3.0 gbs
  root@hc4:~# hdparm -t /dev/sda

/dev/sda:
  Timing buffered disk reads: 406 MB in  3.01 seconds = 134.83 MB/sec


2tb drive at 6.0 gbs
root@hc4:~# hdparm -t /dev/sdb

/dev/sdb:
  Timing buffered disk reads: 436 MB in  3.00 seconds = 145.27 MB/sec

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#230908

brainfart@posteo.net wrote: 
> 
> 6tb drive at 3.0 gbs
>  root@hc4:~# hdparm -t /dev/sda
> 
> /dev/sda:
>  Timing buffered disk reads: 406 MB in  3.01 seconds = 134.83 MB/sec
> 
> 
> 2tb drive at 6.0 gbs
> root@hc4:~# hdparm -t /dev/sdb
> 
> /dev/sdb:
>  Timing buffered disk reads: 436 MB in  3.00 seconds = 145.27 MB/sec

Both of these are substantially under 3Gb/s. The fact is, not
only do different spinning disks read and write data at
different rates, the rates change across the same disk.

For what it's worth, the WD Red 6TB disk you've got is a
notoriously slow drive, for a CMR. It has a fairly high latency
and runs at 5700RPM. It's entirely likely that your 2TB disk is
actually faster.

You're not likely to notice the 10MB/s difference in actual
usage, though. It will be dominated by seek times for
interactive usage, and humans are bad at paying attention to
longer times without a clock in front of them.

-dsr-

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#230909

On 2021-01-20 07:26 PM, Dan Ritter wrote:
> brainfart@posteo.net wrote:
>> 
>> 6tb drive at 3.0 gbs
>>  root@hc4:~# hdparm -t /dev/sda
>> 
>> /dev/sda:
>>  Timing buffered disk reads: 406 MB in  3.01 seconds = 134.83 MB/sec
>> 
>> 
>> 2tb drive at 6.0 gbs
>> root@hc4:~# hdparm -t /dev/sdb
>> 
>> /dev/sdb:
>>  Timing buffered disk reads: 436 MB in  3.00 seconds = 145.27 MB/sec
> 
> Both of these are substantially under 3Gb/s. The fact is, not
> only do different spinning disks read and write data at
> different rates, the rates change across the same disk.
> 
> For what it's worth, the WD Red 6TB disk you've got is a
> notoriously slow drive, for a CMR. It has a fairly high latency
> and runs at 5700RPM. It's entirely likely that your 2TB disk is
> actually faster.
> 
> You're not likely to notice the 10MB/s difference in actual
> usage, though. It will be dominated by seek times for
> interactive usage, and humans are bad at paying attention to
> longer times without a clock in front of them.
> 
> -dsr-

it's just curiosity
i haven't perused kernel code in many years
being retired i guess i have the time to scratch an itch :)
thanks

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#230913

> i bought a new harddrive
> western digital red plus 6tb
>
> === START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
> Model Family:     Western Digital Red
> Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
> Serial Number:    WD-WX62D60C9L6X
> LU WWN Device Id: 5 0014ee 212e6b9ad
> Firmware Version: 82.00A82
> User Capacity:    6,001,175,126,016 bytes [6.00 TB]
> Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
> Rotation Rate:    5700 rpm
> Device is:        In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
> ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ACS-3 T13/2161-D revision 3b
> SATA Version is:  SATA 3.1, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 3.0 Gb/s)
> Local Time is:    Wed Jan 20 17:12:52 2021 CST
> SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
> SMART support is: Enabled
>
> why is the speed 3.0 gbs i have 4 other drive i have tested with this
> device and they all  use 6.0 gbs

I can't tell you why, but I'd recommend you look at

    dmesg | grep -i ata

It might give you some clues,


        Stefan

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#230926

On 1/20/21 11:41 PM, Stefan Monnier wrote:
>> i bought a new harddrive
>> western digital red plus 6tb
>>
>> === START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
>> Model Family:     Western Digital Red
>> Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
>> Serial Number:    WD-WX62D60C9L6X
>> LU WWN Device Id: 5 0014ee 212e6b9ad
>> Firmware Version: 82.00A82
>> User Capacity:    6,001,175,126,016 bytes [6.00 TB]
>> Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
>> Rotation Rate:    5700 rpm
>> Device is:        In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
>> ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ACS-3 T13/2161-D revision 3b
>> SATA Version is:  SATA 3.1, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 3.0 Gb/s)
>> Local Time is:    Wed Jan 20 17:12:52 2021 CST
>> SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
>> SMART support is: Enabled
>>
>> why is the speed 3.0 gbs i have 4 other drive i have tested with this
>> device and they all  use 6.0 gbs
> I can't tell you why, but I'd recommend you look at
>
>      dmesg | grep -i ata
>
> It might give you some clues,
>
>
>          Stefan
>
Is it an SMR drive?  Interface speed may not be too critical if it is.


Mark

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#230927

Mark Allums wrote: 
> Is it an SMR drive?  Interface speed may not be too critical if it is.

WD says it is a CMR drive, and that they are separating the Red
designations to make it clear to consumers which are SMR and
which are CMR because people don't like buying SMR by accident,
which surprises WD for some reason.

In any case, the drive can't saturate 3 or 6 Gb/s, and would
probably not be noticeably different with a SATA-1 1.5Gb/s
connection. 135 MB/s seems to be a normal transfer rate for it.

-dsr-

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#230932

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Jo, 21 ian 21, 12:09:12, Dan Ritter wrote:
> Mark Allums wrote: 
> > Is it an SMR drive?  Interface speed may not be too critical if it is.
> 
> WD says it is a CMR drive, and that they are separating the Red
> designations to make it clear to consumers which are SMR and
> which are CMR because people don't like buying SMR by accident,
> which surprises WD for some reason.

According to [1] the newer WD Red drives are SMR, the CMR drives are now 
the Red Pro series.

[1] https://www.truenas.com/community/resources/list-of-known-smr-drives.141/
 
Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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#230936

On 2021-01-21 12:44 PM, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> On Jo, 21 ian 21, 12:09:12, Dan Ritter wrote:
>> Mark Allums wrote:
>> > Is it an SMR drive?  Interface speed may not be too critical if it is.
>> 
>> WD says it is a CMR drive, and that they are separating the Red
>> designations to make it clear to consumers which are SMR and
>> which are CMR because people don't like buying SMR by accident,
>> which surprises WD for some reason.
> 
> According to [1] the newer WD Red drives are SMR, the CMR drives are 
> now
> the Red Pro series.
> 
> [1] 
> https://www.truenas.com/community/resources/list-of-known-smr-drives.141/

what i have is wd red plus

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#230939

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Jo, 21 ian 21, 13:12:38, brainfart@posteo.net wrote:
> 
> 
> On 2021-01-21 12:44 PM, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> > On Jo, 21 ian 21, 12:09:12, Dan Ritter wrote:
> > > Mark Allums wrote:
> > > > Is it an SMR drive?  Interface speed may not be too critical if it is.
> > > 
> > > WD says it is a CMR drive, and that they are separating the Red
> > > designations to make it clear to consumers which are SMR and
> > > which are CMR because people don't like buying SMR by accident,
> > > which surprises WD for some reason.
> > 
> > According to [1] the newer WD Red drives are SMR, the CMR drives are now
> > the Red Pro series.
> > 
> > [1]
> > https://www.truenas.com/community/resources/list-of-known-smr-drives.141/
> 
> what i have is wd red plus

The 5TB EFRX is WD Red though.
 
Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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#230946

>> Is it an SMR drive?  Interface speed may not be too critical if it is.
>
> WD says it is a CMR drive, and that they are separating the Red
> designations to make it clear to consumers which are SMR and
> which are CMR because people don't like buying SMR by accident,
> which surprises WD for some reason.

In any case, we're talking about the speed of the SATA connection, which
seems unrelated to CMR-vs-SMR, especially since AFAIK the slowness of
SMR only affects writes.


        Stefan

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#230944

On 2021-01-20 15:21, brainfart@posteo.net wrote:
> i bought a new harddrive
> western digital red plus 6tb
> 
> === START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
> Model Family:     Western Digital Red
> Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
> Serial Number:    WD-WX62D60C9L6X
> LU WWN Device Id: 5 0014ee 212e6b9ad
> Firmware Version: 82.00A82
> User Capacity:    6,001,175,126,016 bytes [6.00 TB]
> Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
> Rotation Rate:    5700 rpm
> Device is:        In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
> ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ACS-3 T13/2161-D revision 3b
> SATA Version is:  SATA 3.1, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 3.0 Gb/s)
> Local Time is:    Wed Jan 20 17:12:52 2021 CST
> SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
> SMART support is: Enabled
> 
> why is the speed 3.0 gbs
> i have 4 other drive i have tested with this device and they all  use 
> 6.0 gbs
> 

On 2021-01-20 16:36, brainfart@posteo.net wrote:
 > this device is a odroid hc4
 > it supports all my other drives a 6.0 gbs
 > i used a sata to usb adapter to connect this drive to my pc and it
 > connects at 6.0 gbs

 > i guess i'm asking what decides how a device is going to connect
 > is there a database of devices that the kernel uses
 > i should say on my pc - 4.19.0-12-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.19.152-1
 > (2020-10-18) x86_64
 > and the hc4 - 4.9.236-arm64 #1 SMP PREEMPT Sun Dec 20 21:57:12 CET 2020
 > aarch64

STFW 'odroid hc4':

     https://ameridroid.com/products/odroid-hc4


The drive firmware and computer kernel negotiate the speed via device 
drivers and interface chips.


Everything has tolerances.  Sometimes, two devices can be within 
tolerances individually when connected to a test stand, but go out of 
tolerance(s) when connected to each other.  I've seen this with memory 
modules and motherboards.


As another reader suggested, look for error messages in dmesg(1) and/or 
/var/log.  Post anything interesting.


Does the drive connect at 3 Gbps in both bays?


Do you have another identical drive and/or NAS that you can use for A/B 
testing?


Can you return the drive or the NAS?


David

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#230951

Am 21.01.21 um 22:01 schrieb David Christensen:
> On 2021-01-20 15:21, brainfart@posteo.net wrote:
>> i bought a new harddrive
>> western digital red plus 6tb
>>
>> === START OF INFORMATION SECTION ===
>> Model Family:     Western Digital Red
>> Device Model:     WDC WD60EFRX-68L0BN1
>> Serial Number:    WD-WX62D60C9L6X
>> LU WWN Device Id: 5 0014ee 212e6b9ad
>> Firmware Version: 82.00A82
>> User Capacity:    6,001,175,126,016 bytes [6.00 TB]
>> Sector Sizes:     512 bytes logical, 4096 bytes physical
>> Rotation Rate:    5700 rpm
>> Device is:        In smartctl database [for details use: -P show]
>> ATA Version is:   ACS-2, ACS-3 T13/2161-D revision 3b
>> SATA Version is:  SATA 3.1, 6.0 Gb/s (current: 3.0 Gb/s)
>> Local Time is:    Wed Jan 20 17:12:52 2021 CST
>> SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability.
>> SMART support is: Enabled
>>
>> why is the speed 3.0 gbs
>> i have 4 other drive i have tested with this device and they all  use
>> 6.0 gbs
>>

3.0 gbs is round about 300 MB/s,  WD60EFRX is much slower ... don't pull
out your hair

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