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Groups > linux.debian.user > #231950 > unrolled thread

is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk

Started bySemih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com>
First post2021-02-22 21:10 +0100
Last post2021-02-27 09:30 +0100
Articles 4 on this page of 44 — 18 participants

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  is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems  and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-22 21:10 +0100
    Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2021-02-22 21:30 +0100
      Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-22 22:00 +0100
        Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-02-22 22:20 +0100
          Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-22 22:40 +0100
            Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk "Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@einval.com> - 2021-02-22 23:20 +0100
            Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk David <bouncingcats@gmail.com> - 2021-02-22 23:20 +0100
              Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-23 00:10 +0100
                Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk David <bouncingcats@gmail.com> - 2021-02-23 00:20 +0100
                Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk "James H. H. Lampert" <jamesl@touchtonecorp.com> - 2021-02-23 17:20 +0100
                Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Nicholas Geovanis <nickgeovanis@gmail.com> - 2021-02-23 17:20 +0100
                  Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk rhkramer@gmail.com - 2021-02-23 17:40 +0100
                    Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Nicholas Geovanis <nickgeovanis@gmail.com> - 2021-02-23 18:00 +0100
                    Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2021-02-23 18:20 +0100
            Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2021-02-23 09:30 +0100
              Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-02-25 15:50 +0100
                Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-02-25 16:00 +0100
                Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk IL Ka <kazakevichilya@gmail.com> - 2021-02-25 16:00 +0100
                  Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-02-25 16:20 +0100
                    Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk IL Ka <kazakevichilya@gmail.com> - 2021-02-25 16:30 +0100
                      Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2021-02-25 16:50 +0100
                        Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-02-25 17:00 +0100
                          Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2021-02-25 17:10 +0100
                        Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk IL Ka <kazakevichilya@gmail.com> - 2021-02-25 17:00 +0100
                      Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2021-02-25 16:50 +0100
    Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2021-02-23 04:10 +0100
      Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk martin f krafft <madduck@debian.org> - 2021-02-23 11:40 +0100
        Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-26 07:00 +0100
          Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2021-02-26 08:00 +0100
            Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-26 08:40 +0100
              Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-02-26 13:30 +0100
          Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk David <bouncingcats@gmail.com> - 2021-02-26 11:00 +0100
            Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2021-02-26 18:30 +0100
              Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Greg Wooledge <greg@wooledge.org> - 2021-02-26 18:50 +0100
                Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-27 09:40 +0100
                  Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-27 09:40 +0100
                    About keeping a Debian installation happy [was: is it possible to  add a secondary disk to an existing debian] systems and install programs to  the secondary disk <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2021-02-27 10:20 +0100
                  Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2021-02-27 10:10 +0100
                    Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-27 13:30 +0100
                      Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2021-02-27 13:30 +0100
                        Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk "Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@einval.com> - 2021-02-27 14:50 +0100
                      Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2021-02-27 15:20 +0100
                      Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2021-03-01 01:40 +0100
          Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian  systems and install programs to the secondary disk martin f krafft <madduck@debian.org> - 2021-02-27 09:30 +0100

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#232186 — Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk

From"Andrew M.A. Cater" <amacater@einval.com>
Date2021-02-27 14:50 +0100
SubjectRe: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk
Message-ID<BN88N-5BR-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#232184
On Sat, Feb 27, 2021 at 03:22:08PM +0300, Semih Ozlem wrote:
> One potential extra information that could be relevant is that I did use
> the flash drives in a university network, and using shared wifi in a hostel
> and before in a public library.
> 

That's probably irrelevant: flash drives can and do fail with the occasional 
missing write under heavy load. Are these USB3?

Essentially, installing a Linux system to them is more intense than just 
copying files, even large files. There's an amount of indexing, finding files
and so on that isn't there in copying say, a DVD sized image across.

There's a subtle difference between a cheap 16G USB stick and one of the large
high capacity USB sticks from a major manufacturer that might cost ten times
as much. Also, USB connected devices are different: I'd feel happier, for 
example, installing Debian to an SSD in a good caddy connected via a short
USB3 cable I trust :)

> Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com>, 27 Şub 2021 Cmt, 15:19
> tarihinde şunu yazdı:
> 
> > Should I then be suspicious of a possible attack on the system in case the
> > system fails, if both debian and ubuntu are fairly stable? The usb flash
> > drives themselves are still functional in the sense that I can view the
> > files in them after plugging them in. I backed up the data on them. But
> > when I try to boot from 64 gb usb flash disks (one with ubuntu 18 04 the
> > other debian 10 point something installed on them) the boot process does
> > not complete and the login screen does not appear. The two recovery modes
> > (I guess those are the snapshots no?) do not finish booting either.
> >

18.04 is now old: try 20.04 :) Similarly, use the latest Debian image you
can find on cdimage.debian.org or mirrors. The latest is 10.8 - 10.9 will be
along eventually.

> > Joe <joe@jretrading.com>, 27 Şub 2021 Cmt, 12:02 tarihinde şunu yazdı:
> >
> >> On Sat, 27 Feb 2021 11:30:08 +0300
> >> Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> > Sorry I can not read emails very often. No I am not new to linux I
> >> > have been using it for the past 6 or 7 years starting mostly with
> >> > ubuntu. I had CENTOS and Ubuntu and debian installed on some machines
> >> > before.  Most of them stopped functioning. Some of them in less than
> >> > six months.
> >>

What are you _doing_ to them? That's unusual in any event. Are you in an area
subject to power cuts? Were you using significantly old hardware / hardware
built from discarded PCs?

> >> OK, that simply should not happen. I don't know if either Centos or
> >> Ubuntu can do in-place version upgrades, but if not, they should
> >> certainly run from release to unsupported status. My current server
> >> installation is a new one, but previously it ran through several
> >> Debian stable version upgrades and many years, and a couple of changes
> >> of hardware. There is such a thing as software rot, and it certainly
> >> affects applications, but the OS of Debian stable should run pretty much
> >> forever.
> >> >
> >> > I am new to the debian users group, because I found out that a user
> >> > group existed much later. During this time I had a lot of issues with
> >> > computers. The new computer that I got, originally the store claimed
> >> > that the insurance on my machine would be invalidated if I installed
> >> > another operation system on the machine.
> >> >
> >> > The reason for hesitating to install debian right now is simply that
> >> > the machines may become unusable again, and the invested time and
> >> > machinepower to installing a machine may end up being wasted. The
> >> > other reason was the claim that insurance may become invalid which
> >> > later turned out not to be so, but only after asking the company that
> >> > sells the computer several times.
> >>
> >> No software carries any kind of warranty, not even the famous Windows,
> >> but the warranty should certainly cover the hardware if it isn't
> >> physically abused. Software warranty service is pretty much limited to
> >> reinstalling Windows with loss of all data and applications, which any
> >> user can do themselves.
> >>

In your position, if the machine does not carry all your vital data - I might
consider making the machine dual boot Debian and Windows.

Before I did that: I'd use Windows tools to list everything possible about
the system and write it down on a piece of paper - including whether it's 
booting from UEFI, what the video information is, disk size and so on.

I'd also boot the machine from a piece of Debian live media - check lsusb, 
lspci, any dmesg messages about missing firmware - again, write it down.

Use the tools from Microsoft to get hold of a copy of the latest Windows 
install media and use those tools to write it to a USB stick. Keep that 
somewhere in case you _ever_ need to reinstall Windows :) Then check back
into the list and I'll talk you through installation if you wish.

One thing that is important: always resize disks first with Windows tools
before installing any other OS.

> >> > The third reason is I simply do not
> >> > at the moment have the time to backup the existing hard drive before
> >> > installing a new operating system on it, and also that should it
> >> > become unusable or stop functioning (I had debian installed on a usb
> >> > 64 gb of size that stopped booting)..
> >>
> >> Ah, USB sticks *do* stop working or lose bits without warning. Well, so
> >> do spinning hard drives, but not usually in less than about five years,
> >> often much longer.
> >> >
> >> > Yes I did figure out that it was lvm2 package that was needed, and
> >> > lvs is actually one of the internal commands for lvm2 as well so it
> >> > could be run from the console lvm2 prodives. I am looking into the
> >> > option of using lvm.
> >>
> >> That's fairly painless to use, as Debian will set it up during the OS
> >> installation. To be honest, I've had it installed for many years, and
> >> only occasionally used it. Drives are now large enough that I don't
> >> outgrow them in the lifetime of the hardware. In addition to adding
> >> and removing drives, LVM does allow online backups, if you've left
> >> enough unused space. Read about snapshots.
> >>
> >> --
> >> Joe
> >>
> >>

Write yourself a list of things you want to do with the machine. Accept that
it might be ten items long - then accept that it might take a while to do the
first thing on the list which is to install Debian :) 

If you've installed Ubuntu a few times, the Debian install is not unfamiliar. 
If you've only ever used the graphical installer, I would suggest that you 
choose the expert option (under Advanced options) because this will ask _all_ 
the questions.

If your Windows machine functionality is business critical/vital to your life,
I'd suggest practising the install a couple of times on a spare machine if you
can get one rather than destroying everything accidentally and blaming the 
list for telling you to do it :)

All the very best, as ever,

Andy C.

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#232187 — Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk

FromJoe <joe@jretrading.com>
Date2021-02-27 15:20 +0100
SubjectRe: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk
Message-ID<BN8BQ-60V-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#232183
On Sat, 27 Feb 2021 15:19:39 +0300
Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> wrote:

> Should I then be suspicious of a possible attack on the system in
> case the system fails, if both debian and ubuntu are fairly stable?
> The usb flash drives themselves are still functional in the sense
> that I can view the files in them after plugging them in. I backed up
> the data on them. But when I try to boot from 64 gb usb flash disks
> (one with ubuntu 18 04 the other debian 10 point something installed
> on them) the boot process does not complete and the login screen does
> not appear. The two recovery modes (I guess those are the snapshots
> no?) do not finish booting either.
> 

There are parts of the system that aren't files, that you're not
checking. Grub writes a bootloader to the MBR of a normal drive, but a
USB stick may not have a partition structure, in which case the
bootloader will be written to the start of the drive. If this gets
damaged, you can use a low-level disc utility to copy it out and check
it, but the easier way is to boot from a rescue USB stick, then try to
chroot into the faulty OS and update grub from there, which will
rewrite the bootloader.

The recovery mode is grub itself plus a number of utilities and
drivers. From here, you can generally find drives and partitions, mount
partitions and edit files if you can see what's wrong. It sounds like
the early booting part of grub is itself damaged in your case.

And no, LVM snapshots are nothing to do with boot or recovery
processes, they are a means of freezing the files of an installed
operating system so that a proper backup can be made while still
allowing the system to run. Changes to files are stored in a buffer
area, and read from there, then when the backup is finished the
snapshot can be closed and the file changes will be merged back to the
real file locations. The system will obviously run more slowly while
the snapshot is open, but that may be far better than shutting it down
for an offline backup.

If you try to make an online backup without using this method, some
files will change during the backup, meaning that the set of files that
are written to the backup may not be consistent enough to run properly
as a complete system. Certainly database daemons must be stopped, as
well as anything else outside the core OS that makes persistent changes
to files (e.g. a mail server). Most changing files are temporary, so it
is often possible to get away with an online backup without a snapshot,
particularly if you only ever need to restore single files or
directories. Cloning a full working OS is generally best done offline,
unless you have LVM plus space for the buffer.

-- 
Joe

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#232220 — Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2021-03-01 01:40 +0100
SubjectRe: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk
Message-ID<BNELn-8pe-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#232183
On Sat 27 Feb 2021 at 15:19:39 (+0300), Semih Ozlem wrote:
> Joe, 27 Şub 2021 Cmt, 12:02 tarihinde şunu yazdı:
> > On Sat, 27 Feb 2021 11:30:08 +0300 Semih Ozlem wrote:
> >
> > > Sorry I can not read emails very often. No I am not new to linux I
> > > have been using it for the past 6 or 7 years starting mostly with
> > > ubuntu. I had CENTOS and Ubuntu and debian installed on some machines
> > > before.  Most of them stopped functioning. Some of them in less than
> > > six months.

I think you need to elaborate on "stopped functioning". Were they
dead, like the system I turned on this evening? The only thing that
worked was the power pass-through to the monitor. No fans, no lights.
But as the PSU is 21 years old, it's no surprise really.

Or did your POST work, but then they did nothing after that?
Or perhaps they said there was no operation system?

All these faults, so far, have nothing to do with CENTOS or Ubuntu,
which haven't even started to be loaded yet.

> > OK, that simply should not happen. I don't know if either Centos or
> > Ubuntu can do in-place version upgrades, but if not, they should
> > certainly run from release to unsupported status. My current server
> > installation is a new one, but previously it ran through several
> > Debian stable version upgrades and many years, and a couple of changes
> > of hardware. There is such a thing as software rot, and it certainly
> > affects applications, but the OS of Debian stable should run pretty much
> > forever.
> > >
> > > I am new to the debian users group, because I found out that a user
> > > group existed much later. During this time I had a lot of issues with
> > > computers. The new computer that I got, originally the store claimed
> > > that the insurance on my machine would be invalidated if I installed
> > > another operation system on the machine.
> > >
> > > The reason for hesitating to install debian right now is simply that
> > > the machines may become unusable again, and the invested time and
> > > machinepower to installing a machine may end up being wasted. The
> > > other reason was the claim that insurance may become invalid which
> > > later turned out not to be so, but only after asking the company that
> > > sells the computer several times.
> >
> > No software carries any kind of warranty, not even the famous Windows,
> > but the warranty should certainly cover the hardware if it isn't
> > physically abused. Software warranty service is pretty much limited to
> > reinstalling Windows with loss of all data and applications, which any
> > user can do themselves.
> >
> > > The third reason is I simply do not
> > > at the moment have the time to backup the existing hard drive before
> > > installing a new operating system on it, and also that should it
> > > become unusable or stop functioning (I had debian installed on a usb
> > > 64 gb of size that stopped booting)..
> >
> > Ah, USB sticks *do* stop working or lose bits without warning. Well, so
> > do spinning hard drives, but not usually in less than about five years,
> > often much longer.
> > >
> > > Yes I did figure out that it was lvm2 package that was needed, and
> > > lvs is actually one of the internal commands for lvm2 as well so it
> > > could be run from the console lvm2 prodives. I am looking into the
> > > option of using lvm.
> >
> > That's fairly painless to use, as Debian will set it up during the OS
> > installation. To be honest, I've had it installed for many years, and
> > only occasionally used it. Drives are now large enough that I don't
> > outgrow them in the lifetime of the hardware. In addition to adding
> > and removing drives, LVM does allow online backups, if you've left
> > enough unused space. Read about snapshots.
> >
> Should I then be suspicious of a possible attack on the system in case the
> system fails, if both debian and ubuntu are fairly stable? The usb flash
> drives themselves are still functional in the sense that I can view the
> files in them after plugging them in. I backed up the data on them.

Hmm, I would treat anything copied off those sticks as suspect, not
because of any sort of attack, but just corruption by the stick.

> But
> when I try to boot from 64 gb usb flash disks (one with ubuntu 18 04 the
> other debian 10 point something installed on them) the boot process does
> not complete and the login screen does not appear.

I wouldn't have the patience to wait for a graphical login. A console
login and startx might be preferable, so that you get faster feedback
on whether booting is working. Add "systemd.show_status=true" to the
kernel line is grub.cfg too.

> The two recovery modes
> (I guess those are the snapshots no?) do not finish booting either.

I'm not sure why *two* recovery modes, but a freshly installed
system typically has one kernel: recovery mode is just the
kernel parameter "single". (You might have two if you installed
from out-of-date media, leading to an immediate upgrade during
installation.)

Anyway, USB sticks. Last week I installed buster onto an 8GB stick
to evaluate a laptop with windows on it. The installation went fine,
and the next day I booted it up to install a load more packages
onto it. Apt-get kept complaining about files with no newline at
the end, so I closed down, and mounted the stick on my desktop.
Several of the meant-to-be-text files in /var/lib/dpkg/info/ were
just binary garbage. Later, I thought I'd look for any errors reported
during installation in the installer's syslog, but the stick now
wouldn't even mount: the partition table was corrupt, so I had to
copy the GPT backup table onto the main table with gdisk.

This evening I tried to boot an old laptop with the official buster
installer on a stick. I couldn't get the BIOS to see the stick
(in order to promote it above the hard drive in boot order). I tried
booting using another stick for doing the promotion, and then
swapping to the real one, but that just complained of "no operating
system". So then I had the bright idea of plugging in a 10-year old
Trust hub (£8 at Asda), and putting the stick in that, and, sure
enough, it booted up. So persistence pays.

Cheers,
David.

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#232175 — Re: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk

Frommartin f krafft <madduck@debian.org>
Date2021-02-27 09:30 +0100
SubjectRe: is it possible to add a secondary disk to an existing debian systems and install programs to the secondary disk
Message-ID<BN397-2K3-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#232135

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

Regarding the following, written by "Semih Ozlem" on 2021-02-26 at 08:54 Uhr +0300:
>lvs is in which package?

If it's not installed on your system (the package being `lvm2`), 
then my suggested fix won't work for you anyway, since your system 
isn't set up to use Logical Volume Management.

-- 
  .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
   `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
  
"cs class at 8:30am. ugly. if you can wake up early enough to get
  good grades here, you need to develop hacker habits..."
                                      -- jeff bailey on #debian-devel

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