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Replacement Email Client

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  Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 01:10 +0200
    Re: Replacement Email Client Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-10-25 01:40 +0200
      Re: Replacement Email Client Ed <ed-debian@s5h.net> - 2020-10-25 09:00 +0100
        Re: Replacement Email Client Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-10-25 15:10 +0100
          Re: Replacement Email Client Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-10-25 15:20 +0100
        Re: Replacement Email Client David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2020-10-25 15:20 +0100
    Re: Replacement Email Client Leslie Rhorer <lesrhorer@att.net> - 2020-10-25 02:00 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 18:30 +0100
    Re: Replacement Email Client Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2020-10-25 03:00 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client Keith Bainbridge <ke1thozgroups@gmx.com> - 2020-10-25 07:30 +0100
        Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 16:00 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 18:30 +0100
    Re: Replacement Email Client Mark Allums <maa@allums.com> - 2020-10-25 04:40 +0100
    Re: Replacement Email Client Oliver Schoede <oliver.schode@online.de> - 2020-10-25 06:00 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 18:30 +0100
    Re: Replacement Email Client Teemu Likonen <tlikonen@iki.fi> - 2020-10-25 06:30 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-10-25 14:40 +0100
        Re: Replacement Email Client <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2020-10-25 15:00 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 18:40 +0100
        Re: Replacement Email Client John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-10-25 20:10 +0100
          Re: Replacement Email Client Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2020-10-25 21:20 +0100
            Re: Replacement Email Client "Jeremy Nicoll" <jn.ml.dbn.25@letterboxes.org> - 2020-10-25 21:40 +0100
              Re: Replacement Email Client Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2020-10-25 22:10 +0100
          Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-26 01:30 +0100
            Re: Replacement Email Client Carl Fink <carlf@panix.com> - 2020-10-26 01:50 +0100
              Re: Replacement Email Client John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-10-26 02:20 +0100
                Re: Replacement Email Client Carl Fink <carlf@panix.com> - 2020-10-26 02:50 +0100
                  Re: Replacement Email Client Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-10-26 03:00 +0100
                    Re: Replacement Email Client Michael <ml@hemathor.de> - 2020-10-26 12:40 +0100
                      Re: Replacement Email Client Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-10-26 13:00 +0100
                        Re: Replacement Email Client Michael <ml@hemathor.de> - 2020-10-26 13:10 +0100
                        Re: Replacement Email Client Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2020-10-26 15:10 +0100
                          Re: Replacement Email Client Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-10-26 15:20 +0100
                            Re: Replacement Email Client Linux-Fan <Ma_Sys.ma@web.de> - 2020-10-26 15:30 +0100
                            Re: Replacement Email Client Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2020-10-26 21:50 +0100
                              Re: Replacement Email Client Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-10-26 22:00 +0100
                              Re: Replacement Email Client David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2020-10-26 22:10 +0100
                          Re: Replacement Email Client "Jeremy Nicoll" <jn.ml.dbn.25@letterboxes.org> - 2020-10-26 15:30 +0100
                            Re: Replacement Email Client Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2020-10-26 16:30 +0100
                    Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-26 23:50 +0100
                      Re: Replacement Email Client <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2020-10-27 09:20 +0100
                        Re: Replacement Email Client Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-10-27 12:50 +0100
              Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-26 23:20 +0100
                Re: Replacement Email Client Carl Fink <carlf@panix.com> - 2020-10-27 02:30 +0100
                  Re: Replacement Email Client Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2020-10-27 10:00 +0100
                  Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-27 21:50 +0100
                    Re: Replacement Email Client Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-10-27 22:10 +0100
                      Re: Replacement Email Client "Jeremy Nicoll" <jn.ml.dbn.25@letterboxes.org> - 2020-10-27 23:30 +0100
                        Re: Replacement Email Client David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2020-10-28 05:10 +0100
                          Re: Replacement Email Client "Jeremy Nicoll" <jn.ml.dbn.25@letterboxes.org> - 2020-10-28 13:50 +0100
                            Re: Replacement Email Client David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2020-10-29 18:40 +0100
                        Re: Replacement Email Client Eric S Fraga <e.fraga@ucl.ac.uk> - 2020-11-03 10:00 +0100
                    Re: Replacement Email Client conover@rahul.net (John Conover) - 2020-10-28 00:20 +0100
                      Re: Replacement Email Client <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2020-10-28 09:40 +0100
                        Free-services lead to increased RAM and CPU requirements (was: Re: Replacement Email Client) rhkramer@gmail.com - 2020-10-28 12:20 +0100
                          Re: Free-services lead to increased RAM and CPU requirements (was:  Re: Replacement Email Client) Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2020-10-28 12:50 +0100
                          Re: Free-services lead to increased RAM and CPU requirements John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-10-28 14:30 +0100
                            Re: Free-services lead to increased RAM and CPU requirements Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2020-10-28 16:00 +0100
                              Re: Free-services lead to increased RAM and CPU requirements John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-10-28 16:40 +0100
                        Re: Replacement Email Client Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2020-10-28 13:30 +0100
                          Re: Replacement Email Client John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-10-28 14:40 +0100
                Re: Replacement Email Client Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-10-27 12:50 +0100
                  Re: Replacement Email Client Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2020-10-27 17:10 +0100
                  Re: Replacement Email Client Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2020-10-27 17:20 +0100
                    Re: Replacement Email Client John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-10-27 17:40 +0100
                    Re: Replacement Email Client rhkramer@gmail.com - 2020-10-27 20:30 +0100
                      Re: Replacement Email Client Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2020-10-27 22:40 +0100
            Re: Replacement Email Client conover@rahul.net (John Conover) - 2020-10-26 06:00 +0100
        Re: Replacement Email Client Eric S Fraga <e.fraga@ucl.ac.uk> - 2020-10-27 14:00 +0100
    Re: Replacement Email Client ghe2001 <ghe2001@pm.me> - 2020-10-25 07:00 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2020-10-25 09:10 +0100
        Re: Replacement Email Client grumpy@mailfence.com - 2020-10-25 11:50 +0100
          Re: Replacement Email Client Kenneth Parker <sea7kenp@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 12:00 +0100
            Re: Replacement Email Client Teemu Likonen <tlikonen@iki.fi> - 2020-10-25 12:10 +0100
              Re: Replacement Email Client Kenneth Parker <sea7kenp@gmail.com> - 2020-10-28 05:50 +0100
    Re: Replacement Email Client didier gaumet <didier.gaumet@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 10:20 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client ed <ed-debian@s5h.net> - 2020-10-25 12:20 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 19:00 +0100
        Re: Replacement Email Client didier gaumet <didier.gaumet@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 20:10 +0100
          Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-26 01:10 +0100
            Re: Replacement Email Client mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2020-10-26 06:50 +0100
            Re: Replacement Email Client <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2020-10-26 10:50 +0100
    Re: Replacement Email Client Michael <ml@hemathor.de> - 2020-10-25 13:20 +0100
      Re: Replacement Email Client Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2020-10-25 19:10 +0100

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#228355

Joe writes:
> But I don't think we're alone. I think many Windows users also stop
> seeing ads after a while, and the bottom line is that Net adverts
> don't really work. I think it was P&G proved that a year or two ago,
> pulling most of their 'digital' advertising and seeing no significant
> drop in sales. When enough large businesses realise that Net
> advertising isn't cost-effective, that many of their 'clicks' are
> fake, we will see a reduction in it.

Might happen.

> What funds the Net after that, I don't know.

Well, we *could* actually *pay* for the services we need.  I pay Newsguy
for handling my email and consequently when something goes wrong I can
communicate with them and they take action.  There are also many forums
run by volunteers and paid for by donations.

And there is Usenet...

Unfortunately, over time I am being pushed more and more to the
reluctant conclusion that most people, no matter how much they piss and
moan, actually *like* centralization.

-- 
John Hasler 
jhasler@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA

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#228285

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 03:16:21PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> The ones I respond to are known to me and are legit --
> organizations, businesses, government agencies, etc. -- that I do
> business with.  To respond, I must switch to a web browser, login to
> my email account (like gmail), find that particular email, and
> enter the requested data either by keyboard, drop-down menu, buttons,
> etc., then SUBMIT it.  This happens all within the email. I never get
> forwarded to another web site. I always stay on the web mail page.

If you don't get a new page, then it was not a vanilla HTML form
submission.  Those *always* give you a new page, as defined by the
form's action field.  That's why people stopped using them.[1]

What you're describing sounds more like a Javascript button made to look
like a form submission.  Those can do *anything*.

[1]I used to read slashdot regularly, and on slashdot, the front page
had a bunch of news stories and a poll.  The poll was written as a
vanilla HTML form.  If you participated in the poll, it would send you
to a new instance of the home page, because a form *must* load a new
page.  Doing that would lose my place, showing a new set of stories,
even if I hadn't finished reading the ones on the previous instance.

At some point I wished fervently for the option to middle-click the
form submit button to open the form's action page in a new tab/window.
That never happened, obviously because web browser developers do not
have the same priorities that I have.  They've proven that many times.

Eventually it became a moot point, because I stopped reading slashdot,
and because web page designers have stopped using HTML forms.  They're
just too limiting.  It's all custom Javascript stuff now.

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#228307

On Tue, 27 Oct 2020 07:43:43 -0400
Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> wrote:

> On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 03:16:21PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> > The ones I respond to are known to me and are legit --
> > organizations, businesses, government agencies, etc. -- that I do
> > business with.  To respond, I must switch to a web browser, login to
> > my email account (like gmail), find that particular email, and
> > enter the requested data either by keyboard, drop-down menu,
> > buttons, etc., then SUBMIT it.  This happens all within the email.
> > I never get forwarded to another web site. I always stay on the web
> > mail page.  
> 
> If you don't get a new page, then it was not a vanilla HTML form
> submission.  Those *always* give you a new page, as defined by the
> form's action field.  That's why people stopped using them.[1]
> 
> What you're describing sounds more like a Javascript button made to
> look like a form submission.  Those can do *anything*.
> 
> [1]I used to read slashdot regularly, and on slashdot, the front page
> had a bunch of news stories and a poll.  The poll was written as a
> vanilla HTML form.  If you participated in the poll, it would send you
> to a new instance of the home page, because a form *must* load a new
> page.  Doing that would lose my place, showing a new set of stories,
> even if I hadn't finished reading the ones on the previous instance.
> 
> At some point I wished fervently for the option to middle-click the
> form submit button to open the form's action page in a new tab/window.
> That never happened, obviously because web browser developers do not
> have the same priorities that I have.  They've proven that many times.
> 
> Eventually it became a moot point, because I stopped reading slashdot,
> and because web page designers have stopped using HTML forms.  They're
> just too limiting.  It's all custom Javascript stuff now.
> 

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#228308

On Tue, 27 Oct 2020 07:43:43 -0400
Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> wrote:

>
> 
> [1]I used to read slashdot regularly, and on slashdot, the front page
> had a bunch of news stories and a poll.  The poll was written as a
> vanilla HTML form.  If you participated in the poll, it would send you
> to a new instance of the home page, because a form *must* load a new
> page.  Doing that would lose my place, showing a new set of stories,
> even if I hadn't finished reading the ones on the previous instance.
>
It doesn't have to be like that. Nearly all of my web applications just
use the one page, though of course it does have to be reloaded after a
submit. Anything I want to be persistent, I need to arrange through
hidden controls, appearing as parameters in the reloaded page. If
someone is showing you a large number of random entries on a page, then
of course it may be too much trouble to do this, but it is certainly
possible.

I do use the very occasional smidgen of JS to replace things that have
been left out of HTML, such as making a radio button group invoke a
submit when changed, but on the whole I believe client-side scripting
to be the work of the devil. 

-- 
Joe

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#228309

Greg Wooledge wrote:
> [1]I used to read slashdot regularly, and on slashdot, the front page
> had a bunch of news stories and a poll.  The poll was written as a
> vanilla HTML form.  If you participated in the poll, it would send you
> to a new instance of the home page, because a form *must* load a new
> page.  Doing that would lose my place, showing a new set of stories,
> even if I hadn't finished reading the ones on the previous instance.

In Firefox hold down <Ctrl> while clicking the button and the new page
will open in a new tab.
-- 
John Hasler 
jhasler@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA

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#228323

On Tuesday, October 27, 2020 12:15:46 PM Joe wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Oct 2020 07:43:43 -0400
> 
> Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> wrote:
> > [1]I used to read slashdot regularly, and on slashdot, the front page
> > had a bunch of news stories and a poll.  The poll was written as a
> > vanilla HTML form.  If you participated in the poll, it would send you
> > to a new instance of the home page, because a form *must* load a new
> > page.  Doing that would lose my place, showing a new set of stories,
> > even if I hadn't finished reading the ones on the previous instance.
> 
> It doesn't have to be like that. Nearly all of my web applications just
> use the one page, though of course it does have to be reloaded after a
> submit. Anything I want to be persistent, I need to arrange through
> hidden controls, appearing as parameters in the reloaded page. If
> someone is showing you a large number of random entries on a page, then
> of course it may be too much trouble to do this, but it is certainly
> possible.

Is what you describe doing something you do on a web page or in an email?



> 
> I do use the very occasional smidgen of JS to replace things that have
> been left out of HTML, such as making a radio button group invoke a
> submit when changed, but on the whole I believe client-side scripting
> to be the work of the devil.

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#228332

On Tue, 27 Oct 2020 15:23:11 -0400
rhkramer@gmail.com wrote:

> On Tuesday, October 27, 2020 12:15:46 PM Joe wrote:
> > On Tue, 27 Oct 2020 07:43:43 -0400
> > 
> > Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> wrote:  
> > > [1]I used to read slashdot regularly, and on slashdot, the front
> > > page had a bunch of news stories and a poll.  The poll was
> > > written as a vanilla HTML form.  If you participated in the poll,
> > > it would send you to a new instance of the home page, because a
> > > form *must* load a new page.  Doing that would lose my place,
> > > showing a new set of stories, even if I hadn't finished reading
> > > the ones on the previous instance.  
> > 
> > It doesn't have to be like that. Nearly all of my web applications
> > just use the one page, though of course it does have to be reloaded
> > after a submit. Anything I want to be persistent, I need to arrange
> > through hidden controls, appearing as parameters in the reloaded
> > page. If someone is showing you a large number of random entries on
> > a page, then of course it may be too much trouble to do this, but
> > it is certainly possible.  
> 
> Is what you describe doing something you do on a web page or in an
> email?

A web page, for my own use only. I don't send HTML email. No, it's off
the original topic a bit, but that looks unlikely to have a satisfactory
answer.

I'd be horrified at the idea of a new, full HTML/JS renderer being
embedded in an email client. It takes years to work the worst of the
security bugs out of a purpose-built web browser, which is one of the
most complex pieces of everyday software around.

-- 
Joe

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#228231

Patrick Bartek writes:
> On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 14:07:00 -0500
> John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> wrote:
> 
> > Patrick Bartek writes:
> > > But I need to view the entire email: images, graphics, etc. and be
> > > able to interact with all the links, etc. and not just view them.
> > > Want to get away from having to login to the mail account with a
> > > browser to do so.  So, EMACS won't work for me.  
> > 
> > Log in to what mail account?  Gnus calls the browser and passes the
> > HTML attachment to it.  No logging in involved.
> 
> I'm not referring to viewing HTML emails.  I already can do that in
> Claws-Mail using its Dillo plugin. I'm talking about filling in forms,
> etc. that are part of the HTML email and sending just the data without
> "replying" in the normal sense.  This is beyond Claws' and Dillo's
> capabilities.  I have to use a real browser, log into that particular
> web mail account (like gmail), click on that particular email, etc. to
> do so.
> 
> I'm getting the sense that I may not be able to find a client that can
> do that.
>

I'm just guessing, but Thunderbird's Preferences->General "Files &
Attachments" section should read something like "https Use Google
Chrome (default)", or whatever.

Mine does, and an HTML email calls chrome as a separate process with
the HTML email, (I did not attempt a reply after editing.)

My wife's Thunderbird has nothing in the Content Type section of
"Files & Attachments", and does not call chrome for the same email,
(and I could not find any way of making changes there, and
antagonizing Google didn't yield a way to do it, either-anyone know?)

Maybe ~/.mailcap, (and refresh via update-mime --local)?

Or maybe something in /etc/alternatives/*.

Or maybe some other riddle.

    John

-- 

John Conover, conover@rahul.net, http://www.johncon.com/

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#228289

On Sunday, 25 Oct 2020 at 10:36, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 07:19:28 +0200
> Teemu Likonen <tlikonen@iki.fi> wrote:
>> GNU Emacs mail clients "Gnus" and "Notmuch Emacs" automatically render
>> HTML mail nicely as plain text. User can can also open HTML and other
>> MIME parts in external viewer like web browser.
>> 
>
> I can already view the text of HTML emails with Claws-Mail.  But I need
> to view the entire email: images, graphics, etc. and be able to interact
> with all the links, etc. and not just view them.  Want to get away from
> having to login to the mail account with a browser to do so.  So, EMACS
> won't work for me.

The emacs gnus HTML support is not just for viewing: you can interact as
well.  I do receive HTML emails, unfortunately, and can process most if
not all of them within Emacs.  But I've never received one with an
embedded form to submit (I wouldn't respond to such in any case).

-- 
Eric S Fraga via Emacs 28.0.50 & org 9.4 on Debian bullseye/sid

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#228179

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Hash: SHA256



‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
On Saturday, October 24, 2020 11:04 PM, Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> wrote:

> Any suggestions?

Have you looked at protonmail.com?  Encrypted all over the place.  Web based, though.

It's a great replacement for gmail :-)

--
Glenn English
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#228182

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

[...]

> > Any suggestions?
> 
> Have you looked at protonmail.com?  Encrypted all over the place.  Web based, though.

Original poster was asking for a client, not for a service.

Much less for a commercial service.

And he clearly stated *not* web based.

Cheers
 - t

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#228192

On Sun, 25 Oct 2020, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:

> Any suggestions?

alpine

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#228193

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Sun, Oct 25, 2020, 6:40 AM <grumpy@mailfence.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 25 Oct 2020, tomas@tuxteam.de wrote:
>
> > Any suggestions?
>
> alpine
>

+1

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#228194

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

* 2020-10-25 06:51:36-04, Kenneth Parker wrote:

> On Sun, Oct 25, 2020, 6:40 AM <grumpy@mailfence.com> wrote:
>> alpine

> +1

It would be useful to add some information how the suggested client
(Alpine) serves the purpose that was asked by the original poster.

-- 
/// Teemu Likonen - .-.. https://www.iki.fi/tlikonen/
// OpenPGP: 4E1055DC84E9DFF613D78557719D69D324539450

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#228340

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Sun, Oct 25, 2020 at 7:00 AM Teemu Likonen <tlikonen@iki.fi> wrote:

> * 2020-10-25 06:51:36-04, Kenneth Parker wrote:
>
> > On Sun, Oct 25, 2020, 6:40 AM <grumpy@mailfence.com> wrote:
> >> alpine
>
> > +1
>
> It would be useful to add some information how the suggested client
> (Alpine) serves the purpose that was asked by the original poster.
>

Fair Enough (and sorry it took me so long.  The system I use alpine on is
remote, and not easily reached through my Android Phone.

When I bring up an email, it shows me a summary of the email structure.
Its default is to show the rendered html part, but the option can be
changed,  here is a short excerpt (

||  Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2018 12:55:31 -0400
||  From: "redacted@gmail.com [hercules-os380]" <
hercules-os380@yahoogroups.com>
||  To: hercules-os380@yahoogroups.com
||  Subject: Re: [hercules-os380] b8000
||  Parts/Attachments:
||    1   OK      38 lines  Text
||    2 Shown    496 lines  Text
||  ----------------------------------------
||
||
||
||  On 27 June 2018 at 03:53, 'Redacted redacted@gmail.com wrote:
||
||  >> Hercules is already doing exactly that. How far away is it from
being a
||  >> debugger?
||  >>
||  >> > MVSDDT uses (E)STAE; while the error path for 0Cx conditions is
||  >> > longer, it probably makes the code cleaner.
||  >>
[snip rest.  It was html, properly rendered to text]

But now, if I use the h command (for Full Headers), I get Full email
Headers, and then the html source of this email! (h again toggles back).

I believe the original poster was interested in html forms.  If in the
email itself, you get the Source of the Form Itself.  If it's in a link,
you see the link with the usual html "a" element.  (afraid to copy it here,
lest gmail Executes it!)

I will try to be more specific in the future.  ;-)

Kenneth Parker

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#228187

Le dimanche 25 octobre 2020 à 01:10:06 UTC+2, Patrick Bartek a écrit :
> Hi! All, 
> 
> Looking for recommendations for a lightweight email client that will 
> handle HTML as well as plain text to replace Claws-Mail. Have been 
> using Claws-Mail for years and before it Sylpheed. Claws used to have 
> a basic HTML plugin renderer which was sufficient, but latest version 
> does not. 

It seems that in the past, Debian provided the claws-mail-fancy-plugin package (a GTK2 HTML viewer).
That is no longer the case but Debian is now providing  the claws-mail-dillo-viewer (a Dillo HTML viewer), and in addition to this, from Bulleye on, will be providing the claws-mail-litehtml-viewer package (a HTML viewer based on the litehml library).
 https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=all&section=all&arch=any&searchon=all&keywords=claws+html

So, apparently, you do not need to replace claws-mail

[...]
> Both Thunderbird and Balsa have been rejected as T'bird is a behemoth 
> and no longer in development; and with Balsa, I don't want to have to 
> deal with GNOME-systemd, etc. dependencies. (I don't run GNOME anyway, 
> only a window manager Openbox, and use sysvinit and not systemd as 
> init.) 
[...]

- As others have already stated, Thunderbird is still in development
- I somewhat doubt installing Balsa will draw on any real Gnome or Systemd stuff
 https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=all&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=balsa

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#228195

On 2020-10-25 01:51-0700, didier gaumet wrote:
> It seems that in the past, Debian provided the claws-mail-fancy-plugin 
> package (a GTK2 HTML viewer).
> That is no longer the case but Debian is now providing  the claws-mail-dillo-viewer (a Dillo HTML viewer), and in addition to this, from Bulleye on, will be providing the claws-mail-litehtml-viewer package (a HTML viewer based on the litehml library).
>  https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=all&section=all&arch=any&searchon=all&keywords=claws+html

Sylpheed/Claws is very good. I did like the way that part of the mail 
could be selected for quoting with the mouse before pressing reply.

I stopped using Claws in favour of mutt some time back as text only mail 
reduced the visible spam, and most spam mail has some image content. 
Valid mail seems to have a good text/plain part, and those that don't 
tend to be readable with a lynx mailcap.

There's also a larger attack surface, if that bothers, with all the 
additional code required for page rendering. The next thing after 
needing to view mail that is HTML based is requiring something that can 
do javascript for some reason for modern web 2.0 compatibility. Heading 
down that route is moving the minimum communication requirements further 
away from people who are visually impaired. There will come a day when 
my eyes start fail me.

This is a preference though, if a GUI reader is required, Sylpheed 
variants seem good.

Ed

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#228209

On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 01:51:43 -0700 (PDT)
didier gaumet <didier.gaumet@gmail.com> wrote:

> Le dimanche 25 octobre 2020 à 01:10:06 UTC+2, Patrick Bartek a écrit :
> > Hi! All, 
> > 
> > Looking for recommendations for a lightweight email client that
> > will handle HTML as well as plain text to replace Claws-Mail. Have
> > been using Claws-Mail for years and before it Sylpheed. Claws used
> > to have a basic HTML plugin renderer which was sufficient, but
> > latest version does not.   
> 
> It seems that in the past, Debian provided the
> claws-mail-fancy-plugin package (a GTK2 HTML viewer). That is no
> longer the case but Debian is now providing  the
> claws-mail-dillo-viewer (a Dillo HTML viewer), and in addition to

Already have Dillo set up, but I need more than a viewer.  I want a
client that handles HTML as well as plain text emails, so I don't have
to login into the mail account via a browser to interact with the email.


> this, from Bulleye on, will be providing the
> claws-mail-litehtml-viewer package (a HTML viewer based on the
> litehml library).
> https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=all&section=all&arch=any&searchon=all&keywords=claws+html
> 
> So, apparently, you do not need to replace claws-mail

Probably, I do.  Just a viewer plugin is insufficient.  Been using
viewers for years.  Time to move on.  Or, maybe, an interactive HTML
interpreter plugin?

> [...]
> > Both Thunderbird and Balsa have been rejected as T'bird is a
> > behemoth and no longer in development; and with Balsa, I don't want
> > to have to deal with GNOME-systemd, etc. dependencies. (I don't run
> > GNOME anyway, only a window manager Openbox, and use sysvinit and
> > not systemd as init.)   
> [...]
> 
> - As others have already stated, Thunderbird is still in development
> - I somewhat doubt installing Balsa will draw on any real Gnome or
> Systemd stuff
> https://packages.debian.org/search?suite=all&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=balsa

I installed Balsa in Devuan Beowulf which I'm testing, and it only
installed a few libraries.  Don't know if the same is true with Buster.
I'm still evaluating it. No opinion as yet. Wasn't able to get it to
receive mails, but could send. Probably an erroneous setting somewhere.
It was late.

Thanks for your input.

B

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#228212

Le dimanche 25 octobre 2020 à 19:00:08 UTC+1, Patrick Bartek a écrit :

> Already have Dillo set up, but I need more than a viewer. I want a 
> client that handles HTML as well as plain text emails, so I don't have 
> to login into the mail account via a browser to interact with the email.

I just tested the dillo plugin: I do not know if it is sufficient for your usage but after setting the plugin up, I was able to click on the links into the emails and most (not all) images were displayed

[...]
> I installed Balsa in Devuan Beowulf which I'm testing, and it only 
> installed a few libraries. Don't know if the same is true with Buster. 
> I'm still evaluating it. No opinion as yet. Wasn't able to get it to 
> receive mails, but could send. Probably an erroneous setting somewhere. 
> It was late. 

Just tested Balsa here (Buster+Gnome): I could read my emails but HTML was not rendered

If Claws HTML  rendering with the Dillo plugin is not satisfying enough for you, I fear you will need a heavy client like Thunderbird, Evolution or Kmail...

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#228225

On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 11:42:20 -0700 (PDT)
didier gaumet <didier.gaumet@gmail.com> wrote:

> Le dimanche 25 octobre 2020 à 19:00:08 UTC+1, Patrick Bartek a écrit :
> 
> > Already have Dillo set up, but I need more than a viewer. I want a 
> > client that handles HTML as well as plain text emails, so I don't
> > have to login into the mail account via a browser to interact with
> > the email.  
> 
> I just tested the dillo plugin: I do not know if it is sufficient for
> your usage but after setting the plugin up, I was able to click on
> the links into the emails and most (not all) images were displayed

I have Dillo configured NOT to show images initially. Do that for
security. Reloading page usually brings them up. It will follow some
links to other pages, but for viewing purposes only. One cannot
interact and transmit data as I need to.  I have to use a real browser
for that. And that means logging in through the browser to that
particular email account.

> [...]
> > I installed Balsa in Devuan Beowulf which I'm testing, and it only 
> > installed a few libraries. Don't know if the same is true with
> > Buster. I'm still evaluating it. No opinion as yet. Wasn't able to
> > get it to receive mails, but could send. Probably an erroneous
> > setting somewhere. It was late.   
> 
> Just tested Balsa here (Buster+Gnome): I could read my emails but
> HTML was not rendered

Probably a missed setting somewhere.  But the more I look at Balsa, the
more I think it's just, for all practical purposes, a clone of
Claws-Mail.  I could be wrong.  We'll see.  Installing it for the third
try after purging it twice.

> If Claws HTML  rendering with the Dillo plugin is not satisfying
> enough for you, I fear you will need a heavy client like Thunderbird,
> Evolution or Kmail...

Oh, I hope not!!

B 

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