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Groups > linux.debian.user > #223656 > unrolled thread

technical terms overhaul

Started byEike Lantzsch <zp6cge@gmx.net>
First post2020-06-19 21:20 +0200
Last post2020-06-21 23:10 +0200
Articles 20 on this page of 108 — 42 participants

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  technical terms overhaul Eike Lantzsch <zp6cge@gmx.net> - 2020-06-19 21:20 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2020-06-19 21:40 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-06-19 21:50 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2020-06-19 22:00 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-06-19 22:10 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul ghe2001 <ghe2001@protonmail.com> - 2020-06-19 22:20 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-06-19 22:20 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2020-06-19 22:20 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> - 2020-06-20 02:40 +0200
                Re: technical terms overhaul Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-06-20 05:00 +0200
                  Re: technical terms overhaul ghe2001 <ghe2001@protonmail.com> - 2020-06-20 05:30 +0200
                  Re: technical terms overhaul Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2020-06-20 06:20 +0200
                  Re: technical terms overhaul Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> - 2020-06-20 09:30 +0200
                    Re: technical terms overhaul Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-06-20 16:00 +0200
                      Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 16:40 +0200
                      Re: technical terms overhaul Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> - 2020-06-20 21:10 +0200
                    Re: technical terms overhaul Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2020-06-20 18:00 +0200
                      Re: technical terms overhaul Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2020-06-22 15:50 +0200
                        Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-22 19:20 +0200
                          Re: technical terms overhaul Paul Johnson <baloo@ursamundi.org> - 2020-06-22 19:30 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2020-06-19 23:50 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 18:10 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2020-06-19 23:50 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-06-19 22:40 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul davidson <davidson@freevolt.org> - 2020-06-19 23:50 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2020-06-20 03:40 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul riveravaldez <riveravaldezmail@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 00:00 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2020-06-20 12:00 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-06-20 14:10 +0200
                Re: technical terms overhaul Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2020-06-20 15:30 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul Gene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2020-06-20 00:00 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2020-06-20 00:50 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 05:50 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> - 2020-06-21 07:00 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 07:50 +0200
                Re: technical terms overhaul Stephan Seitz <stse+debian@rootsland.net> - 2020-06-21 12:20 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul fmneto@gmail.com - 2020-06-19 21:50 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul Marco Möller <talby@debianlists.mobilxpress.net> - 2020-06-19 22:30 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul Doug <dmcgarrett@optonline.net> - 2020-06-19 23:10 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul elvis <elvis@dogonfire.com> - 2020-06-20 16:10 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-06-20 18:10 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul Paul Johnson <baloo@ursamundi.org> - 2020-06-19 22:40 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul Eike Lantzsch <zp6cge@gmx.net> - 2020-06-20 01:10 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul Larry Martell <larry.martell@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 01:30 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul Nicholas Geovanis <nickgeovanis@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 01:40 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Larry Martell <larry.martell@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 01:40 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2020-06-20 03:40 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 13:30 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2020-06-20 14:00 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 17:00 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul Default User <hunguponcontent@gmail.com> - 2020-06-19 23:40 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul Andrea Borgia <andrea@borgia.bo.it> - 2020-06-20 11:30 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul davidson <davidson@freevolt.org> - 2020-06-19 23:50 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul rhkramer@gmail.com - 2020-06-20 01:10 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul Eike Lantzsch <zp6cge@gmx.net> - 2020-06-20 01:20 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul davidson <davidson@freevolt.org> - 2020-06-20 03:20 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul davidson@freevolt.org - 2020-06-20 04:00 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-06-20 03:10 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@transient.nz> - 2020-06-20 03:30 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul elvis <elvis@dogonfire.com> - 2020-06-20 16:10 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 19:40 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2020-06-20 20:20 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 22:30 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-06-20 20:50 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 22:40 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-06-20 23:20 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 23:30 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul Celejar <celejar@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 05:40 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-06-21 08:20 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul Leslie Rhorer <lesrhorer@att.net> - 2020-06-21 09:40 +0200
                Re: technical terms overhaul "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-06-21 11:10 +0200
                  Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 11:40 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2020-06-20 21:00 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul Francisco Mariano Neto <fmneto@usp.br> - 2020-06-20 21:40 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 22:50 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul Brad Rogers <brad@fineby.me.uk> - 2020-06-20 21:40 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 23:00 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Brad Rogers <brad@fineby.me.uk> - 2020-06-21 08:00 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 08:40 +0200
                Re: technical terms overhaul Brad Rogers <brad@fineby.me.uk> - 2020-06-21 19:50 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 22:10 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul Weaver <weaver@riseup.net> - 2020-06-20 22:20 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-20 23:00 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Andrei POPESCU <andreimpopescu@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 07:50 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul rhkramer@gmail.com - 2020-06-21 17:40 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul Rob van der Putten <rob@sput.nl> - 2020-06-21 12:20 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul Eike Lantzsch <zp6cge@gmx.net> - 2020-06-21 13:30 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 14:00 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2020-06-21 14:20 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-06-21 16:50 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul Jude DaShiell <jdashiel@panix.com> - 2020-06-21 17:50 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-06-21 16:20 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 19:00 +0200
              Re: technical terms overhaul The Wanderer <wanderer@fastmail.fm> - 2020-06-21 19:10 +0200
                Re: technical terms overhaul Peter Ehlert <peter@sdi-baja.com> - 2020-06-21 20:30 +0200
                  Re: technical terms overhaul "James H. H. Lampert" <jamesl@touchtonecorp.com> - 2020-06-21 21:00 +0200
                    Re: technical terms overhaul Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2020-06-21 22:50 +0200
                    Re: technical terms overhaul Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> - 2020-06-21 23:30 +0200
                      Re: technical terms overhaul davidson <davidson@freevolt.org> - 2020-06-21 23:30 +0200
                        Re: technical terms overhaul davidson@freevolt.org - 2020-06-21 23:40 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2020-06-21 19:30 +0200
            Re: technical terms overhaul nemo <moelmoel2714@gmail.com> - 2020-06-23 22:50 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2020-06-21 15:10 +0200
          Re: technical terms overhaul davidson <davidson@freevolt.org> - 2020-06-21 18:00 +0200
    Re: technical terms overhaul mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 21:30 +0200
      Re: technical terms overhaul John Hasler <jhasler@newsguy.com> - 2020-06-21 22:30 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul davidson <davidson@freevolt.org> - 2020-06-21 23:00 +0200
        Re: technical terms overhaul mick crane <mick.crane@gmail.com> - 2020-06-21 23:10 +0200

Page 1 of 6  [1] 2 3 4 5 6  Next page →


#223656 — technical terms overhaul

FromEike Lantzsch <zp6cge@gmx.net>
Date2020-06-19 21:20 +0200
Subjecttechnical terms overhaul
Message-ID<AjuIp-6Dq-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
On the danger of starting a flame war ...
thinking about the article by Gunnar Wolf on Planet Debian

instead of "whitelist" and "blacklist" I would like to propose the terms:
"allowlist" and "rejectlist"
instead of (for example on disk drives) "master" and "slave" I like to propose
the terms:
"lead" and "lag" which are e.g. used when electrically managing two pumps
working on the same hydraulic circuit.

What do you think?

All the best
Eike
--
Eike Lantzsch ZP6CGE

Paradox: Getting live-updates about fatalities

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#223658

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2020-06-19 21:40 +0200
Message-ID<Ajv1L-6JY-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223656
On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote:

> What do you think?

If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link?

-- 
Brian.

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#223660

FromGreg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org>
Date2020-06-19 21:50 +0200
Message-ID<Ajvbr-6Pb-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223658
On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote:
> On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote:
> 
> > What do you think?
> 
> If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link?

If Eike is trying to start a social movement, this is... well, it's
something.  But you'll need much broader exposure and more voices to
join yours, if you hope to prevail.

Think Twitter, Youtube, Facebook.  Not (just) debian-user@lists.debian.org.

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#223662

FromBrian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Date2020-06-19 22:00 +0200
Message-ID<Ajvl8-6Sx-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223660
On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:42:11 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote:

> On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote:
> > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote:
> > 
> > > What do you think?
> > 
> > If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link?
> 
> If Eike is trying to start a social movement, this is... well, it's
> something.  But you'll need much broader exposure and more voices to
> join yours, if you hope to prevail.

Perhaps my question was too simple. I do not hope to prevail, just
obtain clarification. But maybe "you" does not mean "me".

-- 
Brian.

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#223663

FromGreg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org>
Date2020-06-19 22:10 +0200
Message-ID<AjvuN-7b5-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223662
On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:56:06PM +0100, Brian wrote:
> On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:42:11 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> 
> > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote:
> > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote:
> > > 
> > > > What do you think?
> > > 
> > > If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link?
> > 
> > If Eike is trying to start a social movement, this is... well, it's
> > something.  But you'll need much broader exposure and more voices to
> > join yours, if you hope to prevail.
> 
> Perhaps my question was too simple. I do not hope to prevail, just
> obtain clarification. But maybe "you" does not mean "me".

True.  I got lazy, and mixed together sentences that are addressing
both people in the cited material.  Also, I didn't want to get into
the whole gendered pronoun issue.  Not in such a short email.

P.S. I'd consider "goodlist" and "badlist" as replacement terms.  They're
short, both in terms of syllables and characters.  Even shorter than the
originals!  That's a good thing.  "Allowlist" and "rejectlist" both add
a syllable, and the latter also adds characters.

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#223665

Fromghe2001 <ghe2001@protonmail.com>
Date2020-06-19 22:20 +0200
Message-ID<AjvEt-7eq-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223663
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Alist and Flist?

--
Glenn English
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#223666

FromGreg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org>
Date2020-06-19 22:20 +0200
Message-ID<AjvEt-7eq-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223665
On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:09:36PM +0000, ghe2001 wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
> 
> Alist and Flist?

"A-list" already has a different meaning.  (I've also heard "B-list" in
that same context.)

"A" and "F" as antonyms is too US-centric as well.  Other school systems
do not use that particular grading scheme, so it won't work world-wide.

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#223667

FromDavid Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk>
Date2020-06-19 22:20 +0200
Message-ID<AjvEt-7eq-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223663
On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 16:03:24 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:56:06PM +0100, Brian wrote:
> > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:42:11 -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> > > On Fri, Jun 19, 2020 at 08:37:51PM +0100, Brian wrote:
> > > > On Fri 19 Jun 2020 at 15:14:26 -0400, Eike Lantzsch wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > > What do you think?
> > > > 
> > > > If we knew what you were talking about it would help. Link?
> > > 
> > > If Eike is trying to start a social movement, this is... well, it's
> > > something.  But you'll need much broader exposure and more voices to
> > > join yours, if you hope to prevail.
> > 
> > Perhaps my question was too simple. I do not hope to prevail, just
> > obtain clarification. But maybe "you" does not mean "me".
> 
> True.  I got lazy, and mixed together sentences that are addressing
> both people in the cited material.  Also, I didn't want to get into
> the whole gendered pronoun issue.  Not in such a short email.
> 
> P.S. I'd consider "goodlist" and "badlist" as replacement terms.  They're
> short, both in terms of syllables and characters.  Even shorter than the
> originals!  That's a good thing.  "Allowlist" and "rejectlist" both add
> a syllable, and the latter also adds characters.

Passlist and faillist, perhaps? Pass list already exists as a two word
phrase, so people are used to saying it.

Cheers,
David.

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#223693

FromWeaver <weaver@riseup.net>
Date2020-06-20 02:40 +0200
Message-ID<AjzI5-15C-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223667
On 20-06-2020 06:14, David Wright wrote:

> Passlist and faillist, perhaps? Pass list already exists as a two word
> phrase, so people are used to saying it.

Oh, I don't know.
This introduces judgement and the concept of failure.
This could negatively impact on any number of personalities.
(tongue in cheek)

I think it's possible to get too politically correct.
Why are we attaching a concept like skin colour to list names as a
serious proposition?
White and black are fine unless you see something wrong in them.
In which case a session of introspection may be in order.

-- 
`Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false,
and by the rulers as useful'.

— Lucius Annæus Seneca.

Terrorism, the new religion.

Registered Linux User: 554515

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#223704

FromDan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org>
Date2020-06-20 05:00 +0200
Message-ID<AjBTz-2pS-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223693
Weaver wrote: 
> 
> I think it's possible to get too politically correct.

Try this phrase:

"I think it's possible to get too polite."

I suppose that's true -- if your object is to insult someone.

> Why are we attaching a concept like skin colour to list names as a
> serious proposition?

Exactly. Since it doesn't matter to you, why not be polite?

-dsr-

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#223705

Fromghe2001 <ghe2001@protonmail.com>
Date2020-06-20 05:30 +0200
Message-ID<AjCmB-2Oh-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223704
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

How about yesList, noList? Or for fans off Cisco IOS ACLs, permitList, denyList? With short aliases ylist, nlist or plist, dlist -- all blessed in an RFC so everybody but Microsoft will include them in their configuration language?

--
Glenn English
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#223706

FromGene Heskett <gheskett@shentel.net>
Date2020-06-20 06:20 +0200
Message-ID<AjD8Z-3j0-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223704
On Friday 19 June 2020 22:57:44 Dan Ritter wrote:

> Weaver wrote:
> > I think it's possible to get too politically correct.
>
> Try this phrase:
>
> "I think it's possible to get too polite."
>
> I suppose that's true -- if your object is to insult someone.
>
> > Why are we attaching a concept like skin colour to list names as a
> > serious proposition?
>
> Exactly. Since it doesn't matter to you, why not be polite?
>
> -dsr-

Chuckle, plays on words.  We had for decades, a senator who was so good 
at telling folks to go to hell in flowery well decorated language, that 
they looked forward to the trip.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>

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#223708

FromWeaver <weaver@riseup.net>
Date2020-06-20 09:30 +0200
Message-ID<AjG6S-53a-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223704
On 20-06-2020 12:57, Dan Ritter wrote:
> Weaver wrote: 
>>
>> I think it's possible to get too politically correct.
> 
> Try this phrase:
> 
> "I think it's possible to get too polite."

No, there's no value in twisting words.
The wrong connotation gets promoted.

 
> I suppose that's true -- if your object is to insult someone.

No insult was intended or implied.
You prefer to see it way.

 
>> Why are we attaching a concept like skin colour to list names as a
>> serious proposition?
> 
> Exactly. Since it doesn't matter to you, why not be polite?


See how you've created a straw man to tear down by adjusting the
terminology?
Obviously it does or I wouldn't have posted.
I always ask questions and never impose my standards on others.
See the difference?

-- 
`Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false,
and by the rulers as useful'.

— Lucius Annæus Seneca.

Terrorism, the new religion.

Registered Linux User: 554515

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#223724

FromDan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org>
Date2020-06-20 16:00 +0200
Message-ID<AjMch-8m-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223708
Weaver wrote: 
> On 20-06-2020 12:57, Dan Ritter wrote:
> > Weaver wrote: 
> >>
> >> I think it's possible to get too politically correct.
> > 
> > Try this phrase:
> > 
> > "I think it's possible to get too polite."
> 
> No, there's no value in twisting words.
> The wrong connotation gets promoted.

I have yet to see a use of the term "political correctness" in
modern speech -- say, since 1990 -- that did not mean "people
are being polite and I don't want them to be polite".

I'm open to correction if you have real-world examples.

> No insult was intended or implied.
> You prefer to see it way.

My ancestors were enslaved. If you didn't intend an insult,
you were not communicating clearly. 

> >> Why are we attaching a concept like skin colour to list names as a
> >> serious proposition?
> > 
> > Exactly. Since it doesn't matter to you, why not be polite?
> 
> 
> See how you've created a straw man to tear down by adjusting the
> terminology?
> Obviously it does or I wouldn't have posted.
> I always ask questions and never impose my standards on others.
> See the difference?

I know what sea-lioning is.

https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/sea-lioning


-dsr-

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#223730

Fromdeloptes <deloptes@gmail.com>
Date2020-06-20 16:40 +0200
Message-ID<AjMOZ-AC-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223724
Dan Ritter wrote:

> I have yet to see a use of the term "political correctness" in
> modern speech -- say, since 1990 -- that did not mean "people
> are being polite and I don't want them to be polite".
> 
> I'm open to correction if you have real-world examples.

It is all about dictatorship - when there are no logical arguments - this is
the way to impose their censorship upon you.

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#223754

FromWeaver <weaver@riseup.net>
Date2020-06-20 21:10 +0200
Message-ID<AjR2h-3ed-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223724
On 20-06-2020 23:57, Dan Ritter wrote:
> Weaver wrote: 
>> On 20-06-2020 12:57, Dan Ritter wrote:
>> > Weaver wrote:
>> >>
>> >> I think it's possible to get too politically correct.
>> >
>> > Try this phrase:
>> >
>> > "I think it's possible to get too polite."
>>
>> No, there's no value in twisting words.
>> The wrong connotation gets promoted.
> 
> I have yet to see a use of the term "political correctness" in
> modern speech -- say, since 1990 -- that did not mean "people
> are being polite and I don't want them to be polite".
> 
> I'm open to correction if you have real-world examples.

Perhaps it's just your perception that needs adjusting?

 
>> No insult was intended or implied.
>> You prefer to see it way.
> 
> My ancestors were enslaved. If you didn't intend an insult,
> you were not communicating clearly.

Yes, it's your perception, alright!
I've been exposed to what is referred `politely' as `reverse-rascism'
It's not a one way street.
 
 
>> >> Why are we attaching a concept like skin colour to list names as a
>> >> serious proposition?
>> >
>> > Exactly. Since it doesn't matter to you, why not be polite?
>>
>>
>> See how you've created a straw man to tear down by adjusting the
>> terminology?
>> Obviously it does or I wouldn't have posted.
>> I always ask questions and never impose my standards on others.
>> See the difference?
> 
> I know what sea-lioning is.
> 
> https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/sea-lioning

No, you didn't see the difference.
Stop imposing your standards on others.
There it is, stated directly.
Now try to deal with it.

Your whole twisting of technical terminologies to assume personal
offence is adequate statement of your own problem.
When pointed out, a mature human being does something about it, not
simply transfer the load onto others.

-- 
`Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false,
and by the rulers as useful'.

— Lucius Annæus Seneca.

Terrorism, the new religion.

Registered Linux User: 554515

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#223740

FromMiles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net>
Date2020-06-20 18:00 +0200
Message-ID<AjO4p-1fQ-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223708

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

Edwin Land once said: "/Politeness is the slow poison of collaboration." 
/I've generally found that to be quite true.  (Then again, I'm a New 
York Jew - brusqueness and argumentativeness are my bywords.)

Re. whitelist/blacklist:  IMO, on the one hand the really direct tie 
between good/bad and white/black is kind of stark.  On the other hand, 
where does this end?  Stop using "whiteout" to describe blizzard 
conditions (and perhaps only use it to refer to correcting fluid)?  Stop 
using "blackout" power outages? Stop using "white" to denote the sum of 
all colors, and "black" to denote the absence (or vice versa, if we're 
talking paint)?

Seems like just another case where we can let arguments over politically 
correct word usage, get in the way of actual communication & getting 
work done.

Solve the problem of establishing a good set of gender-neutral pronouns, 
for English, (and maybe declarations in other languages) - then let's 
come back and debate colors.  Meanwhile, life's too short for this.

Miles Fidelman

On 6/20/20 3:25 AM, Weaver wrote:
> On 20-06-2020 12:57, Dan Ritter wrote:
>> Weaver wrote:
>>> I think it's possible to get too politically correct.
>> Try this phrase:
>>
>> "I think it's possible to get too polite."
> No, there's no value in twisting words.
> The wrong connotation gets promoted.
>
>   
>> I suppose that's true -- if your object is to insult someone.
> No insult was intended or implied.
> You prefer to see it way.
>
>   
>>> Why are we attaching a concept like skin colour to list names as a
>>> serious proposition?
>> Exactly. Since it doesn't matter to you, why not be polite?
>
> See how you've created a straw man to tear down by adjusting the
> terminology?
> Obviously it does or I wouldn't have posted.
> I always ask questions and never impose my standards on others.
> See the difference?
>
-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown

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#223881

FromMiles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net>
Date2020-06-22 15:50 +0200
Message-ID<AkuZI-21F-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223740
On 6/22/20 5:59 AM, Will Mengarini wrote:
> * Miles Fidelman <mfidelman@meetinghouse.net> [20-06/20=Sa 11:58 -0400]:
>> Solve the problem of establishing a good set of gender-neutral
>> pronouns, for English, (and maybe declarations in other
>> languages) - then let's come back and debate colors.
> Here you go:
>    co    cos     cos     coself    co's
>    she   her     hers    herself   she's
>    he    his     his     himself   he's
>    it    its     its     itself    it's
> See <https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/co#English>.
>
> The "co/cos/coself/co's" pronouns were first introduced in 1970 in
> the U.S commune named "Twin Oaks", which was founded in 1967.  It was
> modeled on the community described in B.F Skinner's /Walden Two/;
> see <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twin_Oaks_Community,_Virginia>.
>
> They're in both Wiktionary and Wikipedia:
>    en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:English_third-person_singular_pronouns
>    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender-specific_and_gender-neutral_pronouns

It's only a good solution if people actually adopt and use them. 
They/them/their has caught on, but it's kind of hard to differentiate 
singular/plural when you use them to be gender neutral.

Miles


-- 
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.  .... Yogi Berra

Theory is when you know everything but nothing works.
Practice is when everything works but no one knows why.
In our lab, theory and practice are combined:
nothing works and no one knows why.  ... unknown

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#223889

Fromdeloptes <deloptes@gmail.com>
Date2020-06-22 19:20 +0200
Message-ID<AkygW-48B-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223881
Miles Fidelman wrote:

> It's only a good solution if people actually adopt and use them.
> They/them/their has caught on, but it's kind of hard to differentiate
> singular/plural when you use them to be gender neutral.

No people will not adopt them because it is against the law of economy in
speech. I'll bet my head on it, but in 100y it will be all forgotten. In
fact it is already dead, only many people has still to realize it
(especially in the west). Stop wasting your and others time. There are more
important problem on this earth.

regards

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#223890

FromPaul Johnson <baloo@ursamundi.org>
Date2020-06-22 19:30 +0200
Message-ID<AkyqC-4bO-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
In reply to#223889

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 12:14 PM deloptes <deloptes@gmail.com> wrote:

> Miles Fidelman wrote:
>
> > It's only a good solution if people actually adopt and use them.
> > They/them/their has caught on, but it's kind of hard to differentiate
> > singular/plural when you use them to be gender neutral.
>
> No people will not adopt them because it is against the law of economy in
> speech. I'll bet my head on it, but in 100y it will be all forgotten. In
> fact it is already dead, only many people has still to realize it
> (especially in the west). Stop wasting your and others time. There are more
> important problem on this earth.
>

Not sure someone who is clearly bigoted against the LGBT community gets to
have a say on this issue.  Go back to the past where you belong.

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