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question regarding no space left on device message

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  question regarding no space left on device message Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2020-08-21 11:40 +0200
    Re: question regarding no space left on device message Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2020-08-21 12:40 +0200
      Re: question regarding no space left on device message Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2020-08-21 13:00 +0200
    Re: question regarding no space left on device message "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-08-21 12:50 +0200
      Re: question regarding no space left on device message "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-08-21 13:20 +0200
        Re: question regarding no space left on device message Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2020-08-21 13:30 +0200
          Re: question regarding no space left on device message Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2020-08-21 13:40 +0200
            Re: question regarding no space left on device message "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-08-21 14:00 +0200
              Re: question regarding no space left on device message Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com> - 2020-08-21 18:40 +0200
                Re: question regarding no space left on device message "Thomas Schmitt" <scdbackup@gmx.net> - 2020-08-21 19:30 +0200
    Re: question regarding no space left on device message David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2020-08-21 13:10 +0200

#226349 — question regarding no space left on device message

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Hi,

When I try installing some programs while running debian live from a usb, I
get a message saying that there is no space left on device.
I presume this means that the space allocated on the usb for debian is not
enough to install the program in question.
I am wondering if there is a way to attach another device so that this
problem can be overcome. I am wondering how to do tell debian system that
the externally attached memory device can be used to install programs.

Thank you

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#226351

On Fri 21 Aug 2020 at 12:35:02 +0300, Semih Ozlem wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> When I try installing some programs while running debian live from a usb, I
> get a message saying that there is no space left on device.
> I presume this means that the space allocated on the usb for debian is not
> enough to install the program in question.
> I am wondering if there is a way to attach another device so that this
> problem can be overcome. I am wondering how to do tell debian system that
> the externally attached memory device can be used to install programs.

I wonder whether Section 4.4.3 of the Release Notes helps?

-- 
Brian.

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#226353

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Hi Brian,

It helps partially, but I think (I have not yet tried it in a particular
case) the problem is not in var/cache/apt/archives ... Even if the
necessary packages are stored someplace else, if the system you are running
is low on space, then the system won't be able to complete the
installation, and give a no space left on device error.

Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>, 21 Ağu 2020 Cum, 13:33 tarihinde şunu yazdı:

> On Fri 21 Aug 2020 at 12:35:02 +0300, Semih Ozlem wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > When I try installing some programs while running debian live from a
> usb, I
> > get a message saying that there is no space left on device.
> > I presume this means that the space allocated on the usb for debian is
> not
> > enough to install the program in question.
> > I am wondering if there is a way to attach another device so that this
> > problem can be overcome. I am wondering how to do tell debian system that
> > the externally attached memory device can be used to install programs.
>
> I wonder whether Section 4.4.3 of the Release Notes helps?
>
> --
> Brian.
>
>

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#226352

Hi,

Semih Ozlem wrote:
> When I try installing some programs while running debian live from a usb, I
> get a message saying that there is no space left on device.
> I presume this means that the space allocated on the usb for debian is not
> enough to install the program in question.

More people could join the presumption tournament if you'd give more
tangible info:
- How much RAM has your computer ?
- URL of the ISO image ?
- Size of the USB stick ?
- How did the ISO get onto the USB stick ?
- Did you do more sysadmin work on the USB stick before booting it ?

In the most plain setting i would presume that Debian Live only uses
a RAM disk but no partitions of the USB stick. In this case you'd probably
get more wiggle room by using a computer with more RAM.

Adding storage devices, like a partition on the USB stick which uses the
remaining free space, might help too.
This is the topic of "Live with Persistence". (When googling, beware of
old descriptions.)


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#226355

Hi,

Semih Ozlem wrote:
> Hi Thomas,

(You need to reply to the list, not to my mail address directly.)


> the computer has 4gb RAM

This should suffice for a RAM based session.
But if you add large software packages, then 4 GB for everything will at
some point not be enough.


> https://cdimage.debian.org/mirror/cdimage/archive/10.3.0-live/amd64/iso-hybrid/

... and which of the .iso images exactly ?


> I burned the iso from a previous live usb

"Burn" is not really a technical term in repect to USB sticks.

So you did something to put the ISO onto the stick. What exactly ?


> I did not change anything on the usb stick other than installing it (only
> set up partitions before burning the iso so that a separate portion would
> remain to save files)

Well, some of the potential methods to put the ISO onto stick will as
first overwrite any previous partitioning. If you partitioning survived
unchenged, then your "burning" method probably unpacks to ISO in some way.

But you should really give more tangible info which could help to
reproduce your problems. Don't assume that we know what you do.


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#226356

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I used "dd if=isofilename of=devicename" and when using this command I use
a blank usb or one with a partition, and device name gets filled with the
partition that will be overwritten if anything was previously on it.

Thomas Schmitt <scdbackup@gmx.net>, 21 Ağu 2020 Cum, 14:14 tarihinde şunu
yazdı:

> Hi,
>
> Semih Ozlem wrote:
> > Hi Thomas,
>
> (You need to reply to the list, not to my mail address directly.)
>
>
> > the computer has 4gb RAM
>
> This should suffice for a RAM based session.
> But if you add large software packages, then 4 GB for everything will at
> some point not be enough.
>
>
> >
> https://cdimage.debian.org/mirror/cdimage/archive/10.3.0-live/amd64/iso-hybrid/
>
> ... and which of the .iso images exactly ?
>
>
> > I burned the iso from a previous live usb
>
> "Burn" is not really a technical term in repect to USB sticks.
>
> So you did something to put the ISO onto the stick. What exactly ?
>
>
> > I did not change anything on the usb stick other than installing it (only
> > set up partitions before burning the iso so that a separate portion would
> > remain to save files)
>
> Well, some of the potential methods to put the ISO onto stick will as
> first overwrite any previous partitioning. If you partitioning survived
> unchenged, then your "burning" method probably unpacks to ISO in some way.
>
> But you should really give more tangible info which could help to
> reproduce your problems. Don't assume that we know what you do.
>
>
> Have a nice day :)
>
> Thomas
>
>

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#226357

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Also if one creates a partition on some device, say /dev/sda becomes
/dev/sda1 /dev/sda2 /dev/sda3 after partitioning (which can be done with
gnome disk utility, or gparted, or from the command line, and I forget the
exact commands now probably "parted mkpart") then "dd if=isofilename.iso
of=/dev/sda1" is an instance of placing iso file onto a device that I use.
Someone one the list recommended additional options " dd if=isofilename
of=devicename obs=4M status=progress oflag=sync" so that the writing
process occurs at the right speed (obs option) and it displays progress
status, and I am not sure about the last option oflag=sync. but even
without these options the writing works. And if anyone has additional
comments to this, please enlighten us.

Semih Ozlem <semihozlemlinuxuser@gmail.com>, 21 Ağu 2020 Cum, 14:23
tarihinde şunu yazdı:

> I used "dd if=isofilename of=devicename" and when using this command I use
> a blank usb or one with a partition, and device name gets filled with the
> partition that will be overwritten if anything was previously on it.
>
> Thomas Schmitt <scdbackup@gmx.net>, 21 Ağu 2020 Cum, 14:14 tarihinde şunu
> yazdı:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Semih Ozlem wrote:
>> > Hi Thomas,
>>
>> (You need to reply to the list, not to my mail address directly.)
>>
>>
>> > the computer has 4gb RAM
>>
>> This should suffice for a RAM based session.
>> But if you add large software packages, then 4 GB for everything will at
>> some point not be enough.
>>
>>
>> >
>> https://cdimage.debian.org/mirror/cdimage/archive/10.3.0-live/amd64/iso-hybrid/
>>
>> ... and which of the .iso images exactly ?
>>
>>
>> > I burned the iso from a previous live usb
>>
>> "Burn" is not really a technical term in repect to USB sticks.
>>
>> So you did something to put the ISO onto the stick. What exactly ?
>>
>>
>> > I did not change anything on the usb stick other than installing it
>> (only
>> > set up partitions before burning the iso so that a separate portion
>> would
>> > remain to save files)
>>
>> Well, some of the potential methods to put the ISO onto stick will as
>> first overwrite any previous partitioning. If you partitioning survived
>> unchenged, then your "burning" method probably unpacks to ISO in some way.
>>
>> But you should really give more tangible info which could help to
>> reproduce your problems. Don't assume that we know what you do.
>>
>>
>> Have a nice day :)
>>
>> Thomas
>>
>>

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#226358

Hi,

Semih Ozlem wrote:
> I used "dd if=isofilename of=devicename"

So the partition table afterwards is the one which came with the ISO.
MBR based, but accompanied by an invalid GPT.

Further, this implies that your Live system is only running on RAM
and not using a writable system disk.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

You could add a data partition on the USB stick to store all extra
data there. But for that you would probably have to set up the partition
usage every time you start the system. (Mount partition, move data from
RAM disk to USB stick, install symbolic link from RAM disk to partition ...)

I would not strive for such a contraption, unless for the sake of art.


If i'd want to stay with a Live system, i'd use more RAM.
Else i would consider a normal installation, as mentioned by David
Christensen.

A compromise might be Knoppix, which is prepared to expand its data
partition up to the end of the UBS stick when it gets bootet from that
stick for the first time. (Put the ISO onto the stick like you did
with Debian Live.)
  http://ftp.uni-kl.de/pub/linux/knoppix-dvd/KNOPPIX_V8.6.1-2019-10-14-EN.iso
  http://ftp.uni-kl.de/pub/linux/knoppix-dvd/KNOPPIX_V8.6.1-2019-10-14-EN.iso.sha256.asc
Knoppix might be prepared to put all additionally installed .deb packages
onto the data partition. You'll have to try.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Also if one creates a partition on some device, say /dev/sda becomes
> /dev/sda1 /dev/sda2 /dev/sda3 after partitioning (which can be done with
> gnome disk utility, or gparted, or from the command line, and I forget the
> exact commands now probably "parted mkpart") then "dd if=isofilename.iso
> of=/dev/sda1" is an instance of placing iso file onto a device that I use.

That would be wrong, unless the stick is equipped with an own boot loader
which can chainload the ISO's boot loader from the partition. Something
like is described in
  https://www.pendrivelinux.com/boot-multiple-iso-from-usb-via-grub2-using-linux/#more-5352
You don't get that from partition editors.


> I am not sure about the last option oflag=sync

It causes the i/o system to take the data only as fast from dd as fast
as it can be written to the stick. No large buffering in RAM shall happen.
It's a good companion for status=progress in order to see steady and
realistic progress messages.


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#226367

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Hi Thomas,

Thank you for your email and recommendation. It seems that knoppix uses
less ram. However I do not know how to install new programs in knoppix
(still there is apt-get install as a command, but debian packages no longer
seem to work, and I do not know which packages work with knoppix system,
and I believe this is a forum on debian so I am not sure where to ask the
knoppix questions.) I also can not adjust screen brightness, and I had to
boot with secure boot disabled.
Thomas Schmitt <scdbackup@gmx.net>, 21 Ağu 2020 Cum, 14:56 tarihinde şunu
yazdı:

> Hi,
>
> Semih Ozlem wrote:
> > I used "dd if=isofilename of=devicename"
>
> So the partition table afterwards is the one which came with the ISO.
> MBR based, but accompanied by an invalid GPT.
>
> Further, this implies that your Live system is only running on RAM
> and not using a writable system disk.
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> You could add a data partition on the USB stick to store all extra
> data there. But for that you would probably have to set up the partition
> usage every time you start the system. (Mount partition, move data from
> RAM disk to USB stick, install symbolic link from RAM disk to partition
> ...)
>
> I would not strive for such a contraption, unless for the sake of art.
>
>
> If i'd want to stay with a Live system, i'd use more RAM.
> Else i would consider a normal installation, as mentioned by David
> Christensen.
>
> A compromise might be Knoppix, which is prepared to expand its data
> partition up to the end of the UBS stick when it gets bootet from that
> stick for the first time. (Put the ISO onto the stick like you did
> with Debian Live.)
>
> http://ftp.uni-kl.de/pub/linux/knoppix-dvd/KNOPPIX_V8.6.1-2019-10-14-EN.iso
>
> http://ftp.uni-kl.de/pub/linux/knoppix-dvd/KNOPPIX_V8.6.1-2019-10-14-EN.iso.sha256.asc
> Knoppix might be prepared to put all additionally installed .deb packages
> onto the data partition. You'll have to try.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > Also if one creates a partition on some device, say /dev/sda becomes
> > /dev/sda1 /dev/sda2 /dev/sda3 after partitioning (which can be done with
> > gnome disk utility, or gparted, or from the command line, and I forget
> the
> > exact commands now probably "parted mkpart") then "dd if=isofilename.iso
> > of=/dev/sda1" is an instance of placing iso file onto a device that I
> use.
>
> That would be wrong, unless the stick is equipped with an own boot loader
> which can chainload the ISO's boot loader from the partition. Something
> like is described in
>
> https://www.pendrivelinux.com/boot-multiple-iso-from-usb-via-grub2-using-linux/#more-5352
> You don't get that from partition editors.
>
>
> > I am not sure about the last option oflag=sync
>
> It causes the i/o system to take the data only as fast from dd as fast
> as it can be written to the stick. No large buffering in RAM shall happen.
> It's a good companion for status=progress in order to see steady and
> realistic progress messages.
>
>
> Have a nice day :)
>
> Thomas
>
>

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#226368

Hi,

Semih Ozlem wrote:
> However I do not know how to install new programs in knoppix
> (still there is apt-get install as a command, but debian packages
> no longer seem to work, and I do not know which packages work with
> knoppix system, [...]

  https://www.knopper.net/knoppix/knoppix861-en.html
says
  "Version 8.6.1 of KNOPPIX is based on → Debian/stable (buster), with
   some packages from Debian/testing and unstable (sid) for newer
   graphics drivers or desktop software packages. It uses Linux kernel
   5.3.5 and Xorg 7.7 (core 1.20.4) for supporting current computer
   hardware."

So a Debian mirror for current stable should be able to provide
compatible packages.


> I am not sure where to ask the knoppix questions.

Try debian-knoppix@lists.debian.org
  https://lists.debian.org/debian-knoppix/
or
  http://www.knoppix.net/forum/


Have a nice day :)

Thomas

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#226354

On 2020-08-21 02:35, Semih Ozlem wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> When I try installing some programs while running debian live from a usb, I
> get a message saying that there is no space left on device.
> I presume this means that the space allocated on the usb for debian is not
> enough to install the program in question.
> I am wondering if there is a way to attach another device so that this
> problem can be overcome. I am wondering how to do tell debian system that
> the externally attached memory device can be used to install programs.
> 
> Thank you

As others have mentioned, perhaps you want "persistence".  This allows 
you to use the free space on the USB device to save data and/or enhance 
the live OS.


That said, I prefer to do a full install onto a good USB 3.0 flash 
drive.  This allows me to customize the stick exactly how I want. 
Graphical desktop use can be choppy, due to a lack of a RAM cache, NCQ, 
etc., and other SSD/HDD performance features.  But, I find these very 
useful for portable maintenance and trouble-shooting.


I have used USB flash drives as system drives 24x7 in low-end servers. 
They worked.


I assume continuous frequent writes would rapidly consume the lifespan 
of a USB flash drive.  Some people use high-endurance SD cards and an 
SD-to-USB adapter in such use-cases.


Finally, there are very high-performance USB flash drives available with 
SSD controllers -- Corsair GTX, possibly others.  However, I expect they 
are optimized for large sequential I/O rather than the small random I/O 
that system drives experience.


David

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